Linux-Advocacy Digest #757, Volume #29 Fri, 20 Oct 00 06:13:04 EDT
Contents:
Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux? (Trevor Brown)
Run for the hills! (Pete Goodwin)
Re: Real Linux Advocacy (2:1)
Re: who's WHINING dipshit! (2:1)
Re: Ms employees begging for food (Nick Condon)
Re: KDE starting to stress out a little? ("David Brown")
Re: Which database server? MySQL, Interbase or PostGres? ("David Brown")
Re: Astroturfing (2:1)
Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux? (2:1)
Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux? (2:1)
Re: Pros and Cons of MS Windows Dominated World? ("David Brown")
Re: A classic example of unfriendly Linux ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Trevor Brown)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux?
Date: 20 Oct 2000 07:59:50 GMT
If you are coming over from a Windows background, you will like StarOffice
5.2. It even is present both in Windows and Linux environments (how's
that for compatibility?). The commands used are very similar to Word, and
the output is compatible with Word. You can't beat the price for
StarOffice (at $0)!
Basically, StarOffice is a good "replacement" for Word... until you have
the time to learn more UNIX-typed approaches to word processing. LaTeX is
mentioned, and there are a lot of similar programs that are all based on
the Markup Language approach. You are probably familiar with HTML. Well,
the resulting file is a simple text file with character sequences
interpreted as the formatting. Remember all those "useless" commands in
MS-DOS like fc? Those are copied over from UNIX, and are designed to work
with text-only files. So when you use the Markup Language approach, all
these text-manipulation commands are available to you (and they are very
fast in executing), including grep.
When you are very familiar with Windows, and just getting started with
Linux, you will find that any cross-platform programs, including
StarOffice 5.2 and WordPerfect Office 2000, are nice to use. But you need
to keep learning the stuff you don't know about already, like LaTeX, and
bash, and linuxconf (these are only examples).
--
Trevor
------------------------------
From: Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Run for the hills!
Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 08:06:51 GMT
Oh my, I have my first "Linux appliance".
It's a featureless grey box, built by Thompson with a couple of lights
on the front, an IR receiver, a whole host of connectors on the rear (no
less than _three_ SCART, an IR cable, UHF in/out, audio, serial and
phone line), a large hard disk inside... and... gasp... it's running
Linux!
Of course, I couldn't tell if it is Linux or Windows or whatever from
the screens it produces. TiVo presents me with pleasant and fairly
friendly menus to navigate on a restful cloudy background (Hey! Didn't
Windows 95 have clouds?).
Here in the UK TiVo has appeared without any kind of advertising so far.
In the shop I bought it they told me I was their first customer. Judging
by the "The lines are busy, please try later" message my phone kept
playing the TiVo lines were flooded last night!
--
---
Pete
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
------------------------------
From: 2:1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Real Linux Advocacy
Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 11:13:55 +0100
James E. Freedle II wrote:
>
> I have been wondering, why use Linux? Of the several Linux distributions
> that I have tried, none of them equaled Windows on my computer. At most the
> functionality was close to DOS 5.0 and Windows for Workgroups 3.11. And do
> not say stability, because Windows is perfectly stable even when I tax it
> the most.
A new troll!
Allow me to welcome you to cola.
-Ed
--
Konrad Zuse should recognised. He built the first | Edward Rosten
binary digital computer (Z1, with floating point) the | Engineer
first general purpose computer (the Z3) and the first | u98ejr@
commercial one (Z4). | eng.ox.ac.uk
------------------------------
From: 2:1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: who's WHINING dipshit!
Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 11:24:56 +0100
> And to top it off I believe X makes you log off and back on just to change
> the screen resolution. Windows doesn't.
Well, you believe completely wrong.
crtl+alt+'+'
Switches to the next enables resolution.
ctrl+alt+'-'
switches to the previousle enabled resolution
So to top it all, unless you're adding a driver that can't be compiled
as a kernel module, you have to reboot. And that'r rare.
-Ed
--
Konrad Zuse should recognised. He built the first | Edward Rosten
binary digital computer (Z1, with floating point) the | Engineer
first general purpose computer (the Z3) and the first | u98ejr@
commercial one (Z4). | eng.ox.ac.uk
------------------------------
From: Nick Condon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Ms employees begging for food
Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 09:37:07 +0100
"R.E.Ballard ( Rex Ballard )" wrote:
> Mike Byrns <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Sure. Reinvent the wheel every time.
>
> Actually, you have to reinvent the wheel when the only wheel in
> existence is copyrighted, trademarked, and protected by nondisclosure
> agreements indended to have the very IDEA of the wheel protected by
> "trade secret" laws.
>
> It's OpenSource that lets you start with your choice of 8 different
> types of wheel, along with reccomendations as to which is best for
> which type of road, and then lets you move on to your choice of 5
> different engines, 9 different upholstry types, 5 cab types, and
> your choice of "economy", "luxury", "sporty", or "rugged" suspension
> systems.
>
> It will take about 2 hours to build your car, but you can either wait,
> spend some time looking at which stereo you'd like to have installed,
> and review which of the warrantee options you'd like, from the 50,000
> major repair option (cheap but full of exclusions and waiting periods)
> to the 200,000 mile full service renewable agreement where they pick up
> the car, perform all maintainance, and have it back to your door before
> you need the car, as often as needed and on a regular periodic basis.
>
> The car analogy is good since most Windows users don't have much
> experience with Linux and UNIX infrastructure.
It's an excellent analogy and first-rate article. I hope it's not patented,
because I'm going to keep it. :-)
------------------------------
From: "David Brown" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: KDE starting to stress out a little?
Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 10:35:07 +0200
Aaron R. Kulkis wrote in message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
>Kobus wrote:
>>
>> "Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
>> > --
>> > Aaron R. Kulkis
>> > Unix Systems Engineer
>> > ICQ # 3056642
>> >
>> >
>> http://directedfire.com/greatgungiveaway/directedfire.referrer.fcgi?2632
>> >
>> > H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
>> > premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
>> > you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
>> > you are lazy, stupid people"
>> >
>> > I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
>> > challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
>> > between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
>> > Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
>> >
>> > J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
>> > The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
>> > also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
>> >
>> > A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
>> >
>> > B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
>> > method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
>> > direction that she doesn't like.
>> >
>> > C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
>> >
>> > D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
>> > ...despite (D) above.
>> >
>> > E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
>> > her behavior improves.
>> >
>> > F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues
>> against
>> > adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
>> >
>> > G: Knackos...you're a retard.
>>
>> Reading your sig, I assume that you're not familiar with the usenet
>> rules?
>> Your sig should be about 5 lines long, not 36........
>
>A full YEAR of my .sig on my postings is less than the typical
>SINGLE jpeg, so fuck off and die, ok.
>
>
>>
>> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
>> Before you buy.
>
>
>--
>Aaron R. Kulkis
>Unix Systems Engineer
>ICQ # 3056642
>
>http://directedfire.com/greatgungiveaway/directedfire.referrer.fcgi?2632
>
>
>H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
> premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
> you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
> you are lazy, stupid people"
>
>I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
> challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
> between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
> Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
>
>J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
> The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
> also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
>
>A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
>
>B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
> method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
> direction that she doesn't like.
>
>C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
>
>D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
> ...despite (D) above.
>
>E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
> her behavior improves.
>
>F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
> adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
>
>G: Knackos...you're a retard.
If you can read this line, you will understand why any sort of signatures
are a bad idea, especially long ones. I don't care how long it takes my
machine to download a message, but I do care how long it takes me to read
the new stuff in a reply. If I have to scroll through hundreds of lines of
your signature quoted and re-quoted, just to spot a couple of comments in
the middle, then I am not going to bother. Far too many people (as I did
intentionally here) simply quote the entire text of a posting and add
comments at the bottom. Since nobody has the slightest interest in what you
think of Jet Silverman and your other ramblings, you are just wasting
everybodies time either reading or deleting your signature. Keep it short,
and, more importantly, keep it interesting!
------------------------------
From: "David Brown" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Which database server? MySQL, Interbase or PostGres?
Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 10:40:47 +0200
Interbase was originally a commercial product. At some point, Borland took
it over and built strong support for it into Delphi and C++ Builder
(especially the enterprise versions of these tools). When they made a Linux
port for it, they first gave it out free (as in money), and then with
version 6 they open-sourced the whole thing for all platforms (Win32 and
lots of unices).
mlw wrote in message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
>David Brown wrote:
>>
>> We are putting together a web application which makes use of a database.
>> The prototype is running on WinNT, using Apache, Interbase and PHP4 for
>> scripting. The finished system will almost certainly be running Linux (I
>> might consider FreeBSD, but I am more familiar with Linux). As far as I
>> know, there are three free database servers for Linux (and NT - it is
very
>> helpful that both Linux and NT ports are available): MySQL, Interbase and
>> PostGres. I choose Interbase first as I am also using Delphi, so I had
an
>> old version on the PC already.
>>
>> Are there any particular benifits and disadvantages of these three
DBMS's?
>> Are there any others available that I should consider? Money is
definitely
>> an issue, so I would prefer to avoid a commercial package unless there
are
>> overwhelming reasons. The application is unlikely to have to deal with
many
>> simultaneous users for reading, and only ever one user at a time for
>> updating the data, but some of the pages will involve extracting and
>> analysing large quantities of data.
>>
>> Thanks for any suggestions!
>
>
>I don't know much about Interbase, what is it?
>
>I have had some experience with MySQL and PostgreSQL. I would use
>Postgres. A lot of people use MySQL and love it, but while I would not
>call myself a SQL expert, I have always hit a limitation with MySQL that
>has forced me to use something else. I don't even bother with MySQL
>anymore.
>
>Postgres is plenty fast when indexes are applied only when needed.
>Postgres also has functions, triggers, transations, and state integrity
>during operations. 7.x is pretty darn fast these days too.
>
>
>--
>http://www.mohawksoft.com
------------------------------
From: 2:1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Astroturfing
Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 11:35:58 +0100
> > You are truly stupid.
>
> Ah yes, the baseless ad hominem attacks. If you think I am so stupid,
> please provide numbers (with URLs) of why you believe that the 810
> and its derivitives are NOT common among corporate offices in America?
You are incapable of realising that `more than anyone else' does not
mean most.
> Can't? Thought so. Pot -> Kettle black.
WTF is the thing with the pot?
> > If dell supply 10% of all office PCs,
>
> They supply far more than that. I will not quote the rest of your
> statement because it is based on grossly false assumptions.
There qwas an if there, you fool. It was not saying anything about dell.
Any you're not supplying links or satistics because you don't have any.
You are playing games to avoid coming up with hard facts.
> <SNIP: 2:1's ignorant rantings and grossly false statements with
> no bearing on reality>
> >
> > Secondly, the 810 chipset is not the 815. they are different, and you
> > have no evidence suggesting that the bug applies to that too (I don't
> > know if it does).
>
> Please show me where Linux can affirmatively detect the exact amount
> of RAM on a PC with an 815 chipset.
I repeat. I do not know the behaviour of the 815. Neither do you.
However, you refuse to give evidence supporting your claim. I will back
down on this if you give evidence. Remember, you need evidence to back
up a claim. You have none. You don't even have personal experience to go
on (or you would have said so by now).
>
> What? You can't? That's right, because it exhibts similar behavior.
>
> > And, yes please, please explain why water is wet. I'd be interested in a
> > good explanation.
>
> Ah... I knew you didn't understand. This explains many of your otherwise
> horribly ignorant posts!
As it happens, I know what makes water `wet', to some depth (there are
always assumptions which you are not able to explain without having more
expertese). Read The Ghosts Post for a good explanation.
I should have said 'I'd be interested in a good explanation from you',
since I don't think you're capable of stringing two words of reasoning
together.
So far, you have prooven my assertion
-Ed
--
Konrad Zuse should recognised. He built the first | Edward Rosten
binary digital computer (Z1, with floating point) the | Engineer
first general purpose computer (the Z3) and the first | u98ejr@
commercial one (Z4). | eng.ox.ac.uk
------------------------------
From: 2:1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux?
Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 11:44:30 +0100
Haoyu Meng wrote:
>
> U need to read a whole book to understand how to use Latex. I am in the business
> of writing books using computers. I don't want to have to learn programming to
> do that.
Use LyX. No book required.
-Ed
--
Konrad Zuse should recognised. He built the first | Edward Rosten
binary digital computer (Z1, with floating point) the | Engineer
first general purpose computer (the Z3) and the first | u98ejr@
commercial one (Z4). | eng.ox.ac.uk
------------------------------
From: 2:1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: Is there a MS Word (or substitute) for Linux?
Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 11:53:08 +0100
> I AM learning to deal with lyx and pybliographer because of the
> bibliography app integration - in my work, this is a MUST. The
> main problem with it is that its output (lyx and latex) is not
> accepted by any of the scientific journals to which I could
> conceivably publish. They all accept word, wordperfect, wordstar,
> pdf. SOME accept simple ascii text, which lyx/latex can handle,
> but not a single one will accept latex or lyx format documents.
lxy/latex can make PDF documents. Try pdflatex. This isn't the best
solution, since it doesn't deal with postscript images. The best method
is to latex the file, use dvips to make a ps file with embedded images,
then ps2pdf to make a pdf doc. I think there is a pslatex to avoid the
first step.
-Ed
--
Konrad Zuse should recognised. He built the first | Edward Rosten
binary digital computer (Z1, with floating point) the | Engineer
first general purpose computer (the Z3) and the first | u98ejr@
commercial one (Z4). | eng.ox.ac.uk
------------------------------
From: "David Brown" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.unix.advocacy
Subject: Re: Pros and Cons of MS Windows Dominated World?
Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 11:22:53 +0200
Bruce Schuck wrote in message ...
>
>>
>> #1. Microsoft has a competitive advantage over others in the
applications
>> market.
>
>Yes. For the most part their Office Applications are better.
That's always a matter of opinion, of course. The point is that their
monopoly position gives them a strong marketing and sales advantage
regardless of any other pros and cons of MS software vs. other software
(whether it be price, speed, reliability, functionality, ease-of-use, or
whatever).
>
>> #2. A Major security risk on the internet.
>
>Well ... the biggest hack on the Internet was the Unix worm.
What is "the Unix worm" ?
>And most people
>spend their time trying to break into Linux boxes because they are easiest
>to get into out of the box.
A poorly configured Linux machine is easier to break into than a
well-configured NT server. However, a well confingured Linux box is far
harder to hack than any NT/w2k box (other flavours of Windows cannot be
well-configured from a security perspective).
>
>In fact, if you read about most hacks they have to do with Perl shopping
>cart applications.
Perl is a language - Perl shopping cart applications are programs written in
that language. If these have security holes, then that is the fault of the
shopping cart programmers - the OS can do nothing to stop them. And exactly
the same situation will apply if the Perl scripts are running on a NT box
(Perl is available for a wide range of systems - you cannot easily tell if
the shopping cart is on Linux, NT, or anything else).
I think the original author was suggesting things along the lines of the
fact that virtually every virus ever created has been for MS systems, and
now the vast majority take advantage of the inherint lack of security in MS
office and IE. It is a simple matter to write a web page which asks the
dancing paperclip on a visitor's machine to delete some critical files.
>
>> #3. Closed Source.
>
>See #2. Open source means the source code is available for all hackers to
>peruse. Scary.
It has nothing to do with #2 - people cannot see the source of Perl scripts
unless the server is mis-configured or the scripts are badly flawed.
Open source means that people can find the flaws, and either fix them or
tell people about them so that others fix the flaws. The majority of
"security announcements" for open source products are fixes for potential
holes that are found and patched long before anyone has found a way to
exploit them.
Closed source means that only MS sees the flaws - if they ever bother to
look. You only know there is a problem once someone has found and exploited
the flaw, and then you have to wait for MS to produce a fix (sometimes
taking a year to do so). It also means that MS can put whatever they want
in the code, such as backdoor keys. Scary.
>
>> #4. Non-GPL licensed code!
GPL is only one of many suitable licences - lets not get obsessive about the
GPL. A large portion of the code on a typical Linux box is not GPL'ed -
xfree86, apache, kde, and other packages have other open-source licences, as
do other systems like FreeBSD.
>
>Yes. They believe in free enterprise, not free software. It's amazing how
>many people are short sighted enough to give away their time so Linus
>Torvald can make money off of Transmeta Linux.
Someone seems to have misunderstood things a little. First, Linus does not
make significant profits from Linux (maybe he has a few shares in Red Hat,
or something). He does not sell Linux. Secondly, there is no Transmeta
Linux (perhaps there should be, but that is another matter entirely).
Transmeta's chips run x86 code, be in Linux or anything else. Linus makes
money by doing his job at Transmeta, like most other employees around the
world.
>
>> Because it's copy-righted code,
The original poster is a little mixed up here - GPL'ed code *is*
copyrighted. Other than that, the comments are valid.
>> companies like Hewlett Packard and IBM are not very likely
>> to dump their brains into a Microsoft Kernel. The GPL guarantees
>> everybody equal and unrestricted access to the code.
>> Microsoft has 37,000 paid employee's versus Linux's 200,000
>> free lancing, free contributing programmer/analysts.
>> By using Microsoft you will be guaranteed the HIND END
>> of technology. You will always be running on obsolete hardware
>> as they simply can't keep up with the needed coding changes.
>> Microsoft can't compete with Linux - example in the IA64 project
>> where HP donates code to GNU/LINUX IA64 to put it over a
>> year ahead of Microsoft in getting a ready OS. Linux is ready
>> for IA64 right now - see redhat ftp site! Microsoft will not
>> be ready until late next year!
>
>Thats ok. Even HP has lately admitted IA-64 is a prototype and will never
>actually be in production of any scale.
>
>Who wants a 750mhz box with 128k cache when they can buy 1500mhz SMP AMD
>boxes by Christmas and Hammer boxes at 2ghz next year?
It is interesting that you mention the AMD SledgeHammer - a chip that Linux
will fully support in all its 64-bit glory when it comes out (simulation and
testing is going on now), whereas MS has no plans to support it at all. And
as for SMP - going the Windows route, you have to buy the expensive w2k
server to take advantage of two processors, whereas Linux supports SMP on
every system.
For a long time, Linux has been following Windows in hardware support
because manufacturers did not see it as a major market, and in user
interfaces because there were few non-expert users. But things have
changed. Which OS was the first to support IDE66 and IDE100, for example?
Not Windoze, but Linux. Which UIs support advanced theming? Serveral wm's,
and especially KDE and Gnome, have supported theming for a long time. MS is
trying to catch up with themes for the windmill media player.
>
>> #5. The cost. At Microsoft's current rate of inflation, by 2005 the
>> cost of the Microsoft operating system will be over $1,000 a copy.
>
>Hmmm. Linux people have math problems.Besides, I see Red Hat plans to sell
>people Red Hat subscriptions that will make it more expense than Win2k.
With Linux, you can pay for what you get (support, installation help,
printed manuals, etc.), or you can get most of it free. Even if you buy a
Linux distribution, you can still install it on as many machines as you
want. You have zero cost for client access to a server, unlike MS.
>
>> And at that time, the US court system will break Microsoft into
>> two separate companies, one the OS company and one the
applications
>> company. This will cause you to have to BUY your Microsoft
>> Operating system rather than just have it handed to you on your
new
>PC.
>
>Well, I wouldn't bet real money a Microsoft breakup.
It may fall apart by itself before that time comes.
>
>> #6. The upgrade problem. In not one instance, since the inception of
the
>> company has Microsoft recommended you stick with last OS's
>> applications
>> when you upgrade your OS.
>
>Everything ran pretty good on Win2K when I upgraded without changing any
>applications at all.
Experiances vary widly on that.
>
>In fact, a lot of games that wouldn't work on NT now work just fine on
>Win2k.
>
>I know you are just envious of the fact that Microsft plans to unfork
>Windows with Whistler while people twiddle their thmbs waiting for the 2.4
>kernel to come out knowing full wwll that forking in Samba and other
>applications is inevitable.
MS have planned to "unfork" Windows for 8 years, so don't hold your breath.
The dozen versions of windows that are currently in common use have huge
differences and compatibility problems.
And as everyone says, 2.4 will be ready when it is ready, unlike MS
releases.
>
>Say ... has Linus ever admitted how much stock he owns in Transmeta? ANn
how
Transmeta is a hardware company which makes CPUs.
>much money you've made him by working on Transmeta Linux for free? Suckers.
>
Has BG ever admitted how much money you've made him by paying his inflated
prices?
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: A classic example of unfriendly Linux
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 10:07:04 GMT
Try clicking on the help icon in BlackIce.. Duhhhh!
IPChains/masquerading/forwarding and all of the other hostile Linux
firewall scripts DO have online help I assume?
claire
On Fri, 20 Oct 2000 03:04:48 GMT, "Les Mikesell"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> IceCap is not a firewall. It is a tool that allows central management
>> of BlackIce. And like the Linonuts love to say when the weekly dirty
>> laundry list appears from the various security groups "there are
>> patches to plug the hole".
>>
>> next.
>>
>> claire
>
>But you still haven't explained how you came by this obscure bit of
>knowledge. I thought you were suggesting that following the simple
>instructions that come with a Linux distribution is somehow difficult
>and this was supposed to be easier.
>
> Les Mikesell
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
------------------------------
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