Linux-Advocacy Digest #923, Volume #31 Sat, 3 Feb 01 00:13:05 EST
Contents:
Re: NTFS Limitations (Was: RE: Red hat becoming illegal?) ("Ayende Rahien")
Re: Linux is a fad? ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Linux is a fad? ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Suggestions (SERIOUS ones please) requested ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Suggestions (SERIOUS ones please) requested (Mark Styles)
Re: Linux is a fad? (J Sloan)
Re: More Mandrake Fun :( (J Sloan)
Re: Suggestions (SERIOUS ones please) requested (J Sloan)
Re: NTFS Limitations (Was: RE: Red hat becoming illegal?) ("Kenn Guilstorf")
Re: Suggestions (SERIOUS ones please) requested ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Linux is a fad? (J Sloan)
Re: Linux is a fad? ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: More Mandrake Fun :( ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: More Mandrake Fun :( (Mark Styles)
Re: More Mandrake Fun :( ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: NTFS Limitations (Was: RE: Red hat becoming illegal?)
Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 06:26:19 +0200
"Chris Ahlstrom" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Ayende Rahien wrote:
> >
> > Here is another one in IE.
> > Sometimes you want to build granular security for sites.
> > For example, I want to let microsoft.com to use javascript because the
site
> > is much harder to work with otherwise and I trust that they wouldn't
abuse
> > javascript too much[1].
>
> I've seen the most consistent collection of Javascript errors from
> Microsoft sites.
But you won't see alert messages in endless loop, you won't see new window
bomb, etc.
That was my point.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Linux is a fad?
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:38:14 GMT
On Fri, 02 Feb 2001 23:23:05 -0500, mlw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>I seldom see any dusty boxes. What are dusty are old versions of things. Just
>like the old versions of Windows programs.
Baloney.
I was just at MEI yesterday buying CDR's for free ($15.00 with $15.00
rebate)
And I saw boxes of SuSE 6.4.
Redhat 6.2
Caldera 2.2.
And even some antique versions of FreeBSD.
They even had BEOS!!
All were dusty and looked like they had not been touched in weeks.
This was in NY BTW.
>> Try to NOT buy a USB device and see what happens.
>> For better or worse USB is the new standard.
>> Of course like with most standards, Linux need not apply.
>
>Like?
A printer.
A scanner.
A camera.
>As well as 98, 98se, ME, NT, 2k.
Nope.
Managed quite well in fact.
>This is flat out a lie. IE crashes all the time. Yes Netscape crashes, but not
>nearly as often as IE 5.
Not on my system it doesn't.
>Have you ever seen the people that can't format a floppy in Windows? So what.
>There are people that need help doing the simplest of things everywhere. Your
>statement is irrelevant.
Sure I have, but floppies are dead so it is a moot point.
I have yet to see a person who could not slip in an AOL or Earthlink
CD and connect to the net.
If you think these bozo's are going to be able to use Linsux you are
out of your mind.
>For you maybe.
I'm on Wall Street 3 times a week doing business and Linux is nowhere
to be seen on the desktop. In a server closet maybe, but on the
desktop, no way.
>I would bet there is a very, very, small percent of hardware out there that
>works on 95,98, ME, NT, 2K and not on Linux. I would bet there is more hardware
>that works with Linux than NT.
If you want to go back to 1981 I'm sure you are right.
Linux is perfect for legacy systems.
Most people have moved beyond those however.
>About the 2.4 kernel, maybe, at least it has a virtually infinite MTTF (limited
>by hardware) where as 2K is 120 days. lol.
That remains to be proven.
>> And how many Linux desktops, excepting you of course?
>
>About as many as there are Macintoshes.
You didn't answer the question.
>
>About as many as there are Macintoshes.
And again.
>About as many, if not more, than the number of Macintoshes.
Again.
>Lemmings follow the masses in a mindless parade. Smart people follow sensible
>standards, the dumb people follow the stupid ones.
No we use what everyone else is using.
See how far you get designing an automobile that uses bolts that are
completely non-standard and then expect the rest of the world to make
wrenches to fit your car.
Flatfish
Why do they call it a flatfish?
Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Linux is a fad?
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:42:45 GMT
On Fri, 02 Feb 2001 23:31:16 +0500, "Gary Hallock"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Really? All the time? 24 hours a day, 7 days a week all year round?
>Where do you find time to post here?
I'm not a slave to a mega corporation like you.
BTW I hope you were rated a 1 because 10 percent VPP isn't too good
considering what you could have made working for a company that
appreciated your talents Gary.
I also have a number of juicy tidbits about Freeway, but I won't post
them here.
Email me for details.
Flatfish
Why do they call it a flatfish?
Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Suggestions (SERIOUS ones please) requested
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:44:46 GMT
On 3 Feb 2001 04:34:11 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (.) wrote:
>Oh really? I have a windowsME book at work that is all of 700 pages
>long. I guess that much is really nessesary to understand that
>incredibly complex operating system.
It figures.
Only an idiot like you would need a book to figure out how to install
Windows.
I'll bet you're the only asshole who bought a copy.
Flatfish
Why do they call it a flatfish?
Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
From: Mark Styles <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Suggestions (SERIOUS ones please) requested
Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 23:47:41 -0500
On Sat, 03 Feb 2001 03:24:23 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>On Fri, 02 Feb 2001 22:04:25 -0500, Mark Styles <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>wrote:
>
>>Install linux with full networking support on your server
>
>Good luck.
With a distro CD it's a piece of cake, my installation was done within
an hour.
>See above.
>>Configure Samba to be your win domain server, and your Win PCs to
>>recognize that as their server.
>
>That's about a month's worth of reading How-To's and webpages to make
>it all work, especially if you have a combination of Win9x and Win2k
>PC's.
Took me an afternoon, and the only trouble I had was the encrypted
password problem, but that was easily solved.
You seem to think it's a bad thing to read documentation and learn
about what you're using, I just hope you never take up any safety
critical occupations or hobbies. If you were a pilot I don't think I'd
want to fly with you.
------------------------------
From: J Sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux is a fad?
Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:50:15 GMT
Keep in mind that flatfish makes this stuff up as he goes along.
He is frantic with rage and confusion, it's killing him that Linux
is doing so well - why he gives a damn I'll never know, if it's
windows that turns him on, why doesn't he just go play with
windows and leave Linux alone?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> On Fri, 02 Feb 2001 23:23:05 -0500, mlw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >I seldom see any dusty boxes. What are dusty are old versions of things. Just
> >like the old versions of Windows programs.
>
> Baloney.
> I was just at MEI yesterday buying CDR's for free ($15.00 with $15.00
> rebate)
> And I saw boxes of SuSE 6.4.
> Redhat 6.2
> Caldera 2.2.
> And even some antique versions of FreeBSD.
> They even had BEOS!!
>
> All were dusty and looked like they had not been touched in weeks.
> This was in NY BTW.
>
> >> Try to NOT buy a USB device and see what happens.
> >> For better or worse USB is the new standard.
> >> Of course like with most standards, Linux need not apply.
> >
> >Like?
>
> A printer.
> A scanner.
> A camera.
>
> >As well as 98, 98se, ME, NT, 2k.
>
> Nope.
> Managed quite well in fact.
>
> >This is flat out a lie. IE crashes all the time. Yes Netscape crashes, but not
> >nearly as often as IE 5.
> Not on my system it doesn't.
>
> >Have you ever seen the people that can't format a floppy in Windows? So what.
> >There are people that need help doing the simplest of things everywhere. Your
> >statement is irrelevant.
>
> Sure I have, but floppies are dead so it is a moot point.
> I have yet to see a person who could not slip in an AOL or Earthlink
> CD and connect to the net.
>
> If you think these bozo's are going to be able to use Linsux you are
> out of your mind.
>
> >For you maybe.
>
> I'm on Wall Street 3 times a week doing business and Linux is nowhere
> to be seen on the desktop. In a server closet maybe, but on the
> desktop, no way.
>
> >I would bet there is a very, very, small percent of hardware out there that
> >works on 95,98, ME, NT, 2K and not on Linux. I would bet there is more hardware
> >that works with Linux than NT.
> If you want to go back to 1981 I'm sure you are right.
> Linux is perfect for legacy systems.
> Most people have moved beyond those however.
>
> >About the 2.4 kernel, maybe, at least it has a virtually infinite MTTF (limited
> >by hardware) where as 2K is 120 days. lol.
>
> That remains to be proven.
>
> >> And how many Linux desktops, excepting you of course?
> >
> >About as many as there are Macintoshes.
>
> You didn't answer the question.
>
> >
> >About as many as there are Macintoshes.
>
> And again.
>
> >About as many, if not more, than the number of Macintoshes.
>
> Again.
>
> >Lemmings follow the masses in a mindless parade. Smart people follow sensible
> >standards, the dumb people follow the stupid ones.
>
> No we use what everyone else is using.
>
> See how far you get designing an automobile that uses bolts that are
> completely non-standard and then expect the rest of the world to make
> wrenches to fit your car.
>
> Flatfish
> Why do they call it a flatfish?
> Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
From: J Sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: More Mandrake Fun :(
Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:52:29 GMT
Keep in mind that flatfish makes this stuff up as he goes along.
Pete and he are a tag team now -
It's really sad, this whole linux thing is eating him up inside,
he's just sick with rage and grief - although it's anybody's
guess what his motivation is...
jjs
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> So today I go to shut down Mandrake 7.2 and it won't shut down
> properly. It goes through the menues of turning things off but then
> just goes back to the KDM login screen which blinks for a second or 2
> and then it tries to start the X-Server, which blinks a couple of
> times and it goes through the same routine, over and over and over
> again.
> Can't kill the X-server via key presses.
> Can't login to another terminal.
> Ctrl-Alt-Del does not work.
> BRS time.
>
> Next boot up entire file system is scrambled and after 5 hours of
> churning still has not produced a working system.
>
> I'm going to let it churn over night and see what happens but I don't
> expect much.
>
> Great system this Linux.
> Great system indeed.
> Great system NOT!!!!
>
> And before you tell me that Mandrake is NOT Linux, to me it IS Linux
> because that is the distribution that I bought.
>
> Flatfish
> Why do they call it a flatfish?
> Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
From: J Sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Suggestions (SERIOUS ones please) requested
Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:54:08 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> On Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:00:22 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> >For a good book on the subject, I recommend Rich Sharp's "Special
> >Edition: Using Samba". Published by MacMillan, available online thru
> >B&N or Amazon. This one's quite current, and a good companion to the
> >other publications in MacMillan-Que's "Special Edition" series.
>
> Oh dear me, and I was told setting up Samba via SWAT was so easy.
> Can't be that an entire library of books has to be written to use it.
So, try swat and answer your own question.
jjs
------------------------------
From: "Kenn Guilstorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: NTFS Limitations (Was: RE: Red hat becoming illegal?)
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 23:59:46 -0500
There is no file or directory level disk quota'ing in Win2k. It's partition
or nothing. Sure, you can play tricks with the directory, but it's still
all or nothing. There were, and are, many good products which allow you to
break disk quota'ing down to the directory level (in some cases, file
level -- though I've found the two that I've tested put undue stress on the
server). Microsoft made a good initial stab at disk quotas. I believe they
may do even better in the future. For now, though, the Win2k disk quota
system leaves more than a little to be desired.
"Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:95e4rj$id5$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:ga2e59.bj6.ln@gd2zzx...
> > In article <95dhe6$afh$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> > "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > "Kenn Guilstorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > news:2Tpe6.5100$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > >>
> > >> Even now, the disk quota system used in Win2k is rudimentary, at
best.
> > >
> > > How & Why?
> >
> > Here's one reason:
>
> <snip DoS attack on 2K>
>
> That is a bug, though.
> That doesn't explain why he think that 2K's qouta is rudimentary
>
>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Suggestions (SERIOUS ones please) requested
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:56:00 GMT
On Fri, 02 Feb 2001 23:47:41 -0500, Mark Styles <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>You seem to think it's a bad thing to read documentation and learn
>about what you're using, I just hope you never take up any safety
>critical occupations or hobbies. If you were a pilot I don't think I'd
>want to fly with you.
If I was flying a plane no, but in using a pc I prefer to concentrate
on applications instead of spending weeks trying to figure out what
should be easy.
Windows makes things easy and Linsux does not.
BTW my dad was a pilot for Pan-Am and then Delta up until last year
when he retired.
He thinks Linux sucks as well.
Flatfish
Why do they call it a flatfish?
Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
From: J Sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux is a fad?
Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:57:34 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> On 3 Feb 2001 04:04:11 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (David
> Steinberg) wrote:
>
> >
> >Your definition of "standard" is "whatever Microsoft is doing this
> >week." Real standards, including USB, are supported by Linux.
>
> No.
>
> I can take my USB scanner, printer and camera and move them from my
> Windows PC right over to my iMac and they work fine.
>
> They don't, however work under Linux.
I think I'll get a usb scanner this weekend and
hook it up to my main Linux system. If flatfish
claims it doesn't work under Linux, that's just
about convinces me that it will work just fine.
You see, flatfish doesn't understand what he's
doing or why. He's beside himself with rage
over the fact that Linux is gaining in popularity,
that no matter how frantically he fuds, people
are ignoring him and trying Linux - and liking
it a lot.
jjs
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Linux is a fad?
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:58:14 GMT
On Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:50:15 GMT, J Sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Keep in mind that flatfish makes this stuff up as he goes along.
>
>He is frantic with rage and confusion, it's killing him that Linux
>is doing so well - why he gives a damn I'll never know, if it's
>windows that turns him on, why doesn't he just go play with
>windows and leave Linux alone?
You are a poor Linvocate if that's the best you can come up with.
Go to mei and take a look for yourself.
Talk to the sales people, who are quite often nice looking females
(but I guess you know little about that).
Debate a point instead of copping out.
Flatfish
Why do they call it a flatfish?
Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: More Mandrake Fun :(
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:58:46 GMT
On Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:52:29 GMT, J Sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Keep in mind that flatfish makes this stuff up as he goes along.
>Pete and he are a tag team now -
>
>It's really sad, this whole linux thing is eating him up inside,
>he's just sick with rage and grief - although it's anybody's
>guess what his motivation is...
Boy you are a lazy Penguinista.
Flatfish
Why do they call it a flatfish?
Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
From: Mark Styles <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: More Mandrake Fun :(
Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 23:54:35 -0500
On Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:25:15 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>So today I go to shut down Mandrake 7.2 and it won't shut down
>properly. It goes through the menues of turning things off but then
>just goes back to the KDM login screen which blinks for a second or 2
>and then it tries to start the X-Server, which blinks a couple of
>times and it goes through the same routine, over and over and over
>again.
>Can't kill the X-server via key presses.
>Can't login to another terminal.
>Ctrl-Alt-Del does not work.
>BRS time.
So today I went to start up my windows palm pilot software, and it
crashed straight away. I tried again and explorer crashed.
Ctrl-alt-del worked a few times, but Windows would not shut down. In
the end it hung completely.
BRS time.
>Next boot up entire file system is scrambled and after 5 hours of
>churning still has not produced a working system.
Next boot up, Windows took an age to scandisk, and I had corrupted
files. When it finally got into Windows, it told me I had a registry
error and had to reboot again. Three reboots later it finally seemed
to be ok, until about an hour later when Windows hung again.
>Great system this Windows.
>Great system indeed.
>Great system NOT!!!!
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: More Mandrake Fun :(
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 05:07:09 GMT
Difference my experience is real and yours is imagined or you would
have posted it here earlier in glee.
On Fri, 02 Feb 2001 23:54:35 -0500, Mark Styles <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>On Sat, 03 Feb 2001 04:25:15 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>>So today I go to shut down Mandrake 7.2 and it won't shut down
>>properly. It goes through the menues of turning things off but then
>>just goes back to the KDM login screen which blinks for a second or 2
>>and then it tries to start the X-Server, which blinks a couple of
>>times and it goes through the same routine, over and over and over
>>again.
>>Can't kill the X-server via key presses.
>>Can't login to another terminal.
>>Ctrl-Alt-Del does not work.
>>BRS time.
>
>So today I went to start up my windows palm pilot software, and it
>crashed straight away. I tried again and explorer crashed.
>Ctrl-alt-del worked a few times, but Windows would not shut down. In
>the end it hung completely.
>BRS time.
>
>>Next boot up entire file system is scrambled and after 5 hours of
>>churning still has not produced a working system.
>
>Next boot up, Windows took an age to scandisk, and I had corrupted
>files. When it finally got into Windows, it told me I had a registry
>error and had to reboot again. Three reboots later it finally seemed
>to be ok, until about an hour later when Windows hung again.
>
>>Great system this Windows.
>>Great system indeed.
>>Great system NOT!!!!
Flatfish
Why do they call it a flatfish?
Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
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