Linux-Advocacy Digest #407, Volume #34 Thu, 10 May 01 21:13:03 EDT
Contents:
Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft! (GreyCloud)
Re: No More Linux! (Dave Martel)
Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft! (GreyCloud)
Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft! (GreyCloud)
Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software (Jay Maynard)
Re: No More Linux! (Terry Porter)
Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft! (GreyCloud)
Re: No More Linux! (Donn Miller)
Re: No More Linux! (Donn Miller)
Re: No More Linux! (Donn Miller)
Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft! (GreyCloud)
Re: Linux has one chance left......... (Terry Porter)
Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft! (GreyCloud)
Re: the Boom, Boom department (Darren Wyn Rees)
Re: How to hack with a crash, another Microsoft "feature" (Charles Lyttle)
Re: bank switches from using NT 4 ("Jan Johanson")
Re: bank switches from using NT 4 ("Jan Johanson")
Re: bank switches from using NT 4 ("Jan Johanson")
Re: the Boom, Boom department (Darren Wyn Rees)
Re: bank switches from using NT 4 ("Jan Johanson")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft!
Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 17:07:07 -0700
Greg Cox wrote:
>
> In article <9defd0$o2k$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> >
> > "Peter Köhlmann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > Daniel Johnson wrote:
> >
> > > > If this is it, then I may say that seems pretty
> > > > unfair to DOS. :D
> > > >
> > > It certainly *is* an API, albeit a quite primitive one.
> > > Nonetheless, all basic stuff for an DOS-API is there.
> > > It just happens that it is more geared towards assembly language.
> >
>
> Of course it's an API. It's the official interface provided by the OS
> for applications to request services from it. How more basic can you
> get?
>
> > I think that this is mainly because at the time, most to all of MS
> > applications were written in assembly.
>
> Actually, most of Microsoft's applications were written in C and
> compiled into a custom p-code. They then profiled the app and, where
> needed to up the performence, either replaced entire procedures with
> assembly or did in-line assembly.
>
> >
> > > But this is part of DOS´s heritage, beeing basically a rewrite of CP/M
> > > with the odd part of Unix thrown in.
> > > In CP/M for example most things were called via RST´s, which is the same
> > > thing for an 8080 than the INTx for the 80x86. Note that the INT of 80x86
> > > has *nothing* to do with *hardware* - interrupt, these two a only closely
> > > related.
> >
> > *only* *closely* related?
> > Strange choice of words, isn't it?
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
During the DOS days the interrupts weren't called APIs...
--
V
------------------------------
From: Dave Martel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: No More Linux!
Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 17:58:04 -0600
On Thu, 10 May 2001 17:45:26 -0500, "Charles Kerr"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Dave Martel"
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> PAN's really screwed up anyway. Nothing major, just a lot of unfinished
>> little stuff that gets on my nerves. Some of the other newsreaders
>> would be OK if Agent hadn't spoiled me. As a matter of principle I like
>> to keep Windows software off my *nix machines, but I'm going to have to
>> make an exception for Agent.
>
>It'll take a lot longer for those unfinished little things to get
>finished if the developers don't know what itches you're wanting
>scratched.
Most are so obvious I'd be very surprised if they're not already
listed for attention after the major work is out of the way. I was
getting quite a few segfaults last night and this morning but didn't
file any bug reports on them because I don't know my way around
FreeBSD yet and thought it may just be newbie error in configuring the
system.
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft!
Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 17:11:11 -0700
"T. Max Devlin" wrote:
>
> Said Daniel Johnson in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Thu, 10 May 2001
> >"GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> Daniel Johnson wrote:
> >> >
> >> > What, in your view, is an API then?
> >> >
> >> > In Win32 an API?
> >> > Is POSIX?
> >> > Is the Macintosh Toolbox?
> >> >
> >> > Why are thse APIs and that int 21h
> >> > foolishness not an API?
> >>
> >> int 21h is not an API, it is a low-level DOS interrupt routine.
> >
> >You aren't being clear. Is the int 21h thing not
> >an API because it is:
> >
> >1. low level
> >
> >If this is it, then it seems like there's overlap
> >between the stuff DOS does and the stuff
> >Win32 does, so either parts of this DOS thing
> >are APIs, or parts of Win32 are not.
> >
> >2. DOS
> >
> >If this is it, then I may say that seems pretty
> >unfair to DOS. :D
> >
> >3. an interrupt
> >
> >If this is it, then the Macintosh Toolbox is
> >not at API on 680x0 Macintoshes, where
> >it is always a bunch of interrupts. But on
> >PowerPC machintoshes it *is* an API,
> >because there it is a bunch of shared libraries,
> >like Windows has.
> >
> >I don't find any of these criteria particularly
> >satisfying.
>
> Welcome to the fascinating world of abstraction. Ever read Plato,
> Daniel? That's what you're trying, known as the Socratic or Platonic
> method; through this means it is possible to "prove" that nothing
> "exists". Ever heard the term "post-modern bullshit"? That's what
> you've got there.
>
> Words don't "meet criteria", they "have meaning", or they do not. The
> term API does not have sufficient meaning when applied to what is more
> properly referred to as a routine. It is indeed what is on the other
> side of the interface, not the side of the "Application" (a term that is
> far broader than this limited context indicates), which determines if
> the programmatic interface is merely a low-level routine or a low-level
> API. DOS's int 21 does not at all rise to that sufficient level of
> usefulness to merit the practical term "API", while Linux's use of
> interrupts for system calls (?) apparently does. Perhaps if DOS were
> POSIX compliant, or even *comparable* with POSIX in the view of a
> competent engineer, you might have a point. But it doesn't, and so you
> don't.
>
> It is neither accurate, nor consistent, nor practical, to call int 21h
> an "API", and that is why it is not, in rather absolute terms, an API.
>
> --
> T. Max Devlin
> *** The best way to convince another is
> to state your case moderately and
> accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
A superb job! As I've pointed out earlier, in the DOS days the
interrupt routines were just that... interrupts. No where in the IBM
technical reference manual are any words "API" found.
--
V
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft!
Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 17:13:38 -0700
Edward Rosten wrote:
>
> >>What, in your view, is an API then?
> >
> > Documentation on the function calls used by a library.
>
> If you look at the name of API (ie application program interface) then
> the INT system on DOS is definitely an interface used by application
> functions.
>
> So where does the assembler INT instruction become an API?
>
> How about when its used from the QuickBasic int() function?
>
> -Ed
>
>
> --
> You can't go wrong with psycho-rats.
>
> u 9 8 e j r (at) e c s . o x . a c . u k
Its starting to look like MS has been busy changing the semantics again.
Its like taking a an old gray mare and painting it to look new again.
--
V
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jay Maynard)
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Richard Stallman what a tosser, and lies about free software
Date: 11 May 2001 00:10:09 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Wed, 09 May 2001 14:59:44 GMT, T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>>I base my position on the advice of a friend who's a practicing copyright
>>attorney. I have no idea where you fished your opinions out of.
>The writings of judges, mostly. Believe it or not, judges are known to
>disagree with practicing attorneys. (!)
Citations, please. Your spoutings are too far out in left field for me to
take this claim at face value.
>Yes, that was the point I was trying to address. Do you honestly think
>this makes sense, that a corporation can claim that they "lost" millions
>of dollars in revenue because someone posted a song on Napster?
Whether or not I think it makes sense is immaterial. It is what will be used
in court, until someone manages to change the law either by getting Congress
to change it or by getting the Supreme Court to rule the way you're arguing.
It is, therefore, what a prudent person will assume the law governing his
actions is.
>Shouldn't the fact that they are obviously gouging the public (are you
>saying the technology that made it possible to share a single copy of a
>song with millions of people for very very little cost somehow didn't
>cause the price of a copy of a song to drop several orders of
>magnitude?) indicate that songs should be worth what people are willing
>to pay for them, regardless of how much the profiteers might demand for
>'legal' copies? People who download music from Napster are obviously
>not willing to pay for those songs. The supposition that they "would
>have" purchased a full-price copy is, frankly, ludicrous.
So? Until people quit paying $16.95 for a CD, that's what a CD's worth of
songs is worth. Under the current definition of copyright, those who are
using Napster to obtain copies of music they do not already own are
stealing. If you don't like that, your options are to either live with it or
to get the law changed. Arguing that the law isn't what the law really is is
simply leading people down the garden path.
>So I say, since a company cannot PROVE that they 'lost' any revenues,
>the value of the song on Napster is closer to zero than it is to the
>millions the company would claim, and certainly below $1000, unless the
>guy who ripped it had to pay $1000 to get it to begin with.
A court will disagree with this argument very, very quickly.
>Please, don't expect me to be shocked or concerned if a copyright lawyer
>would disagree with this position. Du-uh.
Quite frankly, I believe his expertise in the area. I don't believe you
*have* any expertise in *any* area. You claim not to be concerned with
Usenet credibility. Why, then, should anyone believe you?
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Terry Porter)
Subject: Re: No More Linux!
Reply-To: No-Spam
Date: 11 May 2001 00:17:55 GMT
On Thu, 10 May 2001 11:52:27 -0500,
Erik Funkenbusch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> On Thu, 10 May 2001 02:56:40 +0700, "Dave Martel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >I decided to become a FreeBSD snob instead. <g>
>>
>>
>> Talk to me I'm listening :)
>>
>> What will FreeBSD do for me (as a desktop non programmer user) that
>> Linux can't?
>
> Well, it will keep you from pulling out your hair :)
>
> FreeBSD is a bit more technical in many areas than Linux, but it seems a lot
> more logically laid out and and easier to find things.
I feel this way, re Linux vs Windows.
> The FreeBSD Handbook
> is a marvelous place to find information, compared to the three billion
> How-To's of linux.
Is the FreeBSD Handbook available on line as the Linux How-To's are ?
>
>
>
--
Kind Regards
Terry
--
**** ****
My Desktop is powered by GNU/Linux.
1972 Kawa Mach3, 1974 Kawa Z1B, .. 15 more road bikes..
Current Ride ... a 94 Blade
Free Micro burner: http://jsno.downunder.net.au/terry/
** Registration Number: 103931, http://counter.li.org **
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft!
Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 17:21:53 -0700
"T. Max Devlin" wrote:
>
> Said Ayende Rahien in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Thu, 10 May 2001
> >"Tom Wilson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >news:xEtK6.83$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >>
> >> "Ayende Rahien" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >
> >> > > Tell us then of *your* criteria a body of functions must meet to be
> >> > > classified as such...
> >> >
> >> > I asked him that before, couple of times, so far he refused to answer.
> >>
> >> I simply take him at his word that he's not a programmer when these little
> >> asides occur. I enjoy the arguments, though.
> >>
> >> Oh what the hell, what's *your* definitive opinion, as a programmer, as to
> >> 21h calls?
> >
> >That I'm glad to get rid of them :-)
> >
> >Seriously, though, I think that it's a primitive API.
>
> Is there some taxonomy of APIs within the engineering community which I
> am unaware of? If not, you're just begging the question, I think.
>
> Which is fine, as long as you say "I do not think it is really an API,
> although it is a primitive form of API". At least then we know the
> metaphysical ground you are standing on; where API's "in the wild" can
> be captured and domesticated and categorized.
>
> Let me ask you something; did anyone ever call DOS interrupts "an API"
> at the time DOS was prevalent? Or is this just hindsight that enables
> you to ascertain the morphology of APIs?
>
> --
> T. Max Devlin
> *** The best way to convince another is
> to state your case moderately and
> accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
I've looked all over my documentation sets from MS dating back to 1987.
No such wording back then about APIs. I'm beginning to thing MS has
been re-painting their old horse a new color is all. Somehow, the
semantics are being changed.
--
V
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 20:22:39 -0400
From: Donn Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: No More Linux!
"." wrote:
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > What will FreeBSD do for me (as a desktop non programmer user) that
> > Linux can't?
>
> For you? Nothing. It has less sound apps and xwindows crashes exactly as
> much, you goddamned moron.
Well, one thing he might like is the /usr/ports thingie. That way, he
doesn't have to go searching all over creation for package/port
dependencies. Or am I thinking about Pete Goodwin?
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
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======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 20:23:51 -0400
From: Donn Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: No More Linux!
Terry Porter wrote:
> Is the FreeBSD Handbook available on line as the Linux How-To's are ?
Yep! It's all under http://www.freebsd.org/, under "Documentation" The
FAQ is also searchable, I believe.
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 20:27:10 -0400
From: Donn Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: No More Linux!
Lloyd wrote:
> Lets not forget CVSUP or the ports collection. =)
When I first install FreeBSD, the first thing I install is the
statically-linked cvsup binary from ports. After updating my ports tree
with cvsup, I then uninstall cvsup-bin, and re-install cvsup from
ports. Takes up quite a bit of disk space with all the modula-3 libs,
but then again, the very latest version of cvsup is available only in
the source-code version.
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft!
Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 17:28:21 -0700
Daniel Johnson wrote:
>
> "Rick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Daniel Johnson wrote:
> > > > I know that, but in the real world, the computer you're on may have no
> > > > access to the printer yo want to use.
> > >
> > > In the real world, the computer you are on may not have
> > > GhostScript installed, either.
> >
> > If you are producing Postcript files, you'd better have a Postscript
> > interpreter, either in software (Ghostscript) or hardware (a postscript
> > printer)
>
> It would certainly be inconvenient not to.
>
> Nevertheless, PostScript is not always available, any
> more than networked printers are.
>
> [snip]
> > > I don't think any of this affects the point I was
> > > trying to make, though. Windows, Microsoft's
> > > fervent hopes aside, isn't the best tool for
> > > every possible role. It dominates the business
> > > desktop because it's the best tool to build apps
> > > for that desktop.
> >
> > Windows dominstaes the market because of Microsoft's anti-competitve
> > practices.
>
> Wishfull thinking. You don't want to admit that
> your favorite platform- MacOS for you, isn't it?-
> is not up to par.
>
> [snip]
> > > One might prefer .GIF, actually. :D
> > >
> > > It may not be very good, but it's surely
> > > more portable.
> >
> > PDF?
>
> Programs than can print GIFs are more
> common than those that can print PDFs, no?
Maybe, maybe not. I prefer a program that can print the IRS PDF
formats.
At least for business purposes I do... don't know about GIFs tho.
--
V
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Terry Porter)
Subject: Re: Linux has one chance left.........
Reply-To: No-Spam
Date: 11 May 2001 00:27:43 GMT
On Thu, 10 May 2001 18:35:52 +0100,
Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
>
>> I use it. It sucks. 'Nuf said.
>
> Linux. I use it. It sucks. 'nuf said.
All operating systems suck, but for me,
*Linux sucks the least*.
--
Kind Regards
Terry
--
**** ****
My Desktop is powered by GNU/Linux.
1972 Kawa Mach3, 1974 Kawa Z1B, .. 15 more road bikes..
Current Ride ... a 94 Blade
Free Micro burner: http://jsno.downunder.net.au/terry/
** Registration Number: 103931, http://counter.li.org **
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft!
Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 17:31:37 -0700
Daniel Johnson wrote:
>
> "Rick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Daniel Johnson wrote:
> [snip]
> > > You don't want to admit that
> > > your favorite platform- MacOS for you, isn't it?-
> > > is not up to par.
> >
> > Compared to what?
>
> Windows.
>
> > I use both Mac and Linux (PPC and Intel) becasue i
> > want to. If had the choice at work, I'd wipe the HD of every Windows
> > machine at work.
>
> I know; but your personal preferences are not
> what matters. Windows is a development
> platform, and it is the developers preferences
> that makes all the difference in the end.
>
> [snip]
> > > Programs than can print GIFs are more
> > > common than those that can print PDFs, no?
> >
> > I dunno. You thnk you know everything. You tell us. Oh, are you saying
> > GIF is better and more portable than PDF?
>
> Better no. More portable, yes.
Which one is which? I will say that PDF is more portable than GIF.
After all, Adobe Acrobat is found on almost all platforms, and PDF is
the output.
--
V
------------------------------
From: Darren Wyn Rees <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: the Boom, Boom department
Date: Fri, 11 May 2001 01:31:53 +0100
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Ian Davey) wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> in comp.os.linux.advocacy :
>>Many Linux advocates find it difficult to concede the fact that Linux
>>is not a gaming OS.
>
>You still haven't defined gaming OS.
Umm... an OS with which one can play games. [1]
>An OS on which you can play Tribes 2,
>Quake 1, 2 & 3, Myth 2, Heroes of Might and Magic III, Soldier of Fortune,
>etc. would seemingly qualify. There aren't as many games as Windows
>(naturally) but you can hardly deny their existence.
Yes of course.
I don't deny that Linux has precious few games available.
[1] Of course, the premise being, there are games available.
--
"S+M is outta the question, have you got a better suggestion
I'm fed up of waving my right hand" - rat salad www.ratsalad.co.uk
------------------------------
From: Charles Lyttle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: How to hack with a crash, another Microsoft "feature"
Date: Fri, 11 May 2001 00:33:10 GMT
Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>
> "T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Said GreyCloud in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Mon, 07 May 2001 20:25:59
> > [...]
> > >Lets put it this way... if Eric used a 4-bit key and did everything he
> > >says he would do, NSA would have it deciphered in less than a minute.
> >
> > The NSA? Sure, 'less than a minute' is accurate, but 'a few
> > milliseconds' is more precise.
>
> Sure. If you are so confident, i'll give you an encoded bit of data. I'll
> give you a week to figure out what it is. It uses a 1 bit key, and the keys
> value is 1.
>
> The encoded data is (just the one line, not including carriage return):
>
> 2jhGj yD<qY wDgil j0soh kVuAy.
Linux beats MSwin dowst ohell.
>
> Hell, I'll even give you hints when you need them. Here's the first, it's
> plain text words, but the values are not in ASCII.
>
> So, show me how simple it is to crack. Hell, after a week, I'll even tell
> you what the clear text is, and let's see if you can figure out a way to
> recreate a second encoded text that is encoded using the exact same
> algorithm. I'll bet you can't.
--
Russ Lyttle
"World Domination through Penguin Power"
The Universal Automotive Testset Project at
<http://home.earthlink.net/~lyttlec>
------------------------------
From: "Jan Johanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: bank switches from using NT 4
Date: 10 May 2001 19:36:07 -0500
"Les Mikesell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:lsqK6.13574$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> "Jan Johanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:3afa1214$0$78374$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> > >
> > > But I own my vehicle outright. It's all mine and it won't refuse to
> run
> > if
> > > I make improvements to it.
> > >
> >
> > So don't buy licensed software who's terms you don't agree with. Simple.
> >
>
> That would be a reasonable statement in a legally competitive
> environment where the user would have a choice about the
> matter. We all know that doesn't exist.
Unless you live in an alternate reality from the one the rest of us live
in - you have more than a few choices.
Use Linux if you don't like the licensing deals other software offer. Then
again even Linux has the GPL but apparentely communism is prefered over
capitalism with that bunch...
------------------------------
From: "Jan Johanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: bank switches from using NT 4
Date: 10 May 2001 19:36:13 -0500
"GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Jan Johanson wrote:
> >
> > "Chad Everett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > On 9 May 2001 00:43:02 -0500, Jan Johanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >Your car has unique ID numbers etched into 100 locations, all
recorded in
> > a
> > > >corporate database and shared with the police and other dealers - you
> > don't
> > > >have a choice. That doesn't bother you? Seen any black helicopters
> > lately?
> > > >
> > >
> > > But I own my vehicle outright. It's all mine and it won't refuse to
run
> > if
> > > I make improvements to it.
> > >
> >
> > So don't buy licensed software who's terms you don't agree with. Simple.
>
> I don't.
Good for you! There, not much of a monopoly MS has got there now is it?
------------------------------
From: "Jan Johanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: bank switches from using NT 4
Date: 10 May 2001 19:38:09 -0500
"GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Jan Johanson wrote:
> >
> > "Chad Everett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > On 9 May 2001 00:43:02 -0500, Jan Johanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >Your car has unique ID numbers etched into 100 locations, all
recorded in
> > a
> > > >corporate database and shared with the police and other dealers - you
> > don't
> > > >have a choice. That doesn't bother you? Seen any black helicopters
> > lately?
> > > >
> > >
> > > But I own my vehicle outright. It's all mine and it won't refuse to
run
> > if
> > > I make improvements to it.
> > >
> >
> > And you'll void your warranty. But a car isn't software and this
software is
> > licensed not sold. Trying leasing that car and see what happens when you
> > decide to swap out the motor and change in the interior...
>
> At least when I buy some Linux distro I own it outright. No licenses
> akin to the likes of MS at least.
You think you can do whatever you'd like with that Linux setup eh?
OK, change something.
Try to keep it to yourself.
Ooops you are in violation of the GPL - Stallman is gonna kick your little
sisters butt if you don't share your efforts with everyone for free.
------------------------------
From: Darren Wyn Rees <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: the Boom, Boom department
Date: Fri, 11 May 2001 01:38:50 +0100
Brian Langenberger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in
<9dbp6s$4cg$[EMAIL PROTECTED]> in comp.os.linux.advocacy :
>The ways Linux could improve its standing as a "gaming OS" by the
>latter definition is to provide superior programming libraries for
>the purpose (like Loki is attempting)
Oh, hear hear.
>and for the Linux users to buy sufficient quantities of games to make it a viable
>platform
>for developers to spend their time and energy on. But that's the
>subject for another thread...
It's hardly an invitation to buy a Linux game after looking at the
''games'' (I use that term loosely, imprecisely) shipped with the
average distro. A complete turn-off.
--
"S+M is outta the question, have you got a better suggestion
I'm fed up of waving my right hand" - rat salad www.ratsalad.co.uk
------------------------------
From: "Jan Johanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: bank switches from using NT 4
Date: 10 May 2001 19:39:11 -0500
"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Said Jan Johanson in comp.os.linux.advocacy on 9 May 2001 23:09:13
> >"Chad Everett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> On 9 May 2001 00:43:02 -0500, Jan Johanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >Your car has unique ID numbers etched into 100 locations, all recorded
in
> >a
> >> >corporate database and shared with the police and other dealers - you
> >don't
> >> >have a choice. That doesn't bother you? Seen any black helicopters
> >lately?
> >> >
> >>
> >> But I own my vehicle outright. It's all mine and it won't refuse to
run
> >if
> >> I make improvements to it.
> >>
> >
> >And you'll void your warranty. But a car isn't software and this software
is
> >licensed not sold. Trying leasing that car and see what happens when you
> >decide to swap out the motor and change in the interior...
>
> Try telling people who lease cars from you that they need permission to
> carry passengers. It might be a stupid analogy, but so's yours. Why
> would you lease a car if you wanted to swap out the motor?
>
> So where do I go to buy the Windows that we're allowed to modify?
Why would you want to modify Windows (according to your swapping motor reply
who'd ever want to - people who lease are always fully satisified with
off-the-shelf non-customized vehicals according to you)?
------------------------------
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