Linux-Advocacy Digest #91, Volume #35 Sat, 9 Jun 01 23:13:02 EDT
Contents:
Re: Linux dead on the desktop. (Chris Ahlstrom)
Re: UI Importance ("Stuart Fox")
Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft! ("Ayende Rahien")
Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft! ("Ayende Rahien")
Re: Microsoft - WE DELETE YOU! (Ed Allen)
Re: Linux dead on the desktop.
Re: European arrogance and ignorance... (was Re: Just when Linux (Rotten168)
which OS is better to learn for an entry level job? ("Steven")
Re: A Browser is a Browser (Ian Pulsford)
Re: Windows makes good coasters (A.M.F.)
Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft! (Greg Cox)
Re: Why homosexuals are a threat to heterosexuals (Rotten168)
Re: Why homosexuals are a threat to heterosexuals (Rotten168)
Re: Linux dead on the desktop. ("JS \\ PL")
Re: A Browser is a Browser ("Adam Warner")
Re: Here's a switch for a change (Greg Cox)
Re: Linux dead on the desktop. ("Les Mikesell")
Re: More micro$oft "customer service" ("Lance Togar")
Re: The beginning of the end for microsoft ("News at satx.rr.com")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Chris Ahlstrom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux dead on the desktop.
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 00:43:52 GMT
JS \\ PL wrote:
>
> Windows 2000 Server shipped 1 million in it's first year. Do the math,
> that's about 2700 a DAY switching or upgrading to the Windows 2000 server
> family. One million times $1188.00 is over a billion dollars. I wouldn't
> call that extremely embarrassing. I have no information on how many Pro
> licences have been sold, no doubt considerably more than have been sold for
> the server OS. Add em all up and your "extrmely embarasing" claim really
> turns out to be "extremely successfull".
The figure is for licenses. Who knows how many NT sites merely did
an upgrade to all of their servers? Good for Microsoft, though I'm
sure they expected to do much better.
2700/day? That's like 54 per day per state. Maybe like 1 per day per
city? Ooooh, that's a lot! Probably more people buying Linux servers
than Win 2000 servers, eh?
However, Microsoft's declining to provide a breakdown of sales
between Server, Advanced Server, and Datacenter Server. It is said
that the sales of Datacenter Server are only in the hundreds.
Very disappointing. Advanced Server seems to be Datacenter Server's
worst enemy.
And usage of Active Directory is relatively low... business seems
to be upgrading to Server just because it's there, which probably
indicates they view it as a way to fix a lot of bugs.
"Windows 2000 is colliding with Whistler (Windows XP),
which is colliding with .Net," said Giga analyst DiDio.
"It's a huge train wreck that's creating confusion out there."
http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1003-201-4745235-0.html?tag=mainstry
Chris
--
Please enter your Microsoft Client Access Code now,
or rat on your system administrator
at http://www.bsa.org/intnatl/report.phtml or
at http://www.microsoft.com/piracy/reporting/
------------------------------
From: "Stuart Fox" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: UI Importance
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 12:50:04 +1200
"drsquare" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> On Sun, 10 Jun 2001 10:47:23 +1200, in comp.os.linux.advocacy,
> >> Indeed. Now, explain to us why you are claiming BASH doesn't have any
> >> features that cmd.exe has when you obviously don't even know what
> >> features BASH has to begin with?
> >
> >Because I've never seen a bash script that doesn't use any external
> >executables.
>
> if [ $UID > 200 ]
> then
> ulimit -u 2
> fi
This is hardly an example of how the Windows CLI is crippled I'm afraid.
Given that Windows doesn't do process limits in a unix fashion, not having
this ability in the command interpreter is not crippled.
------------------------------
From: "Ayende Rahien" <don'[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft!
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 03:37:05 +0200
"Daniel Johnson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:CTyU6.72924$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Nor is it like it's easy to write realistically
> portable STL code. There is a lot of compiler
> and library variation.
Actually, if you write to STL, you can get a pretty reasonable portable
code.
http://www.stlport.com/doc/platforms.html
I'm *not* going to do any more for more portability than that!
See Mozilla.org for details about what you've to go through because some
obsene compilers does to normal C++ code.
I *like* exceptions, I use them whenever I can. I don't believe in error
codes in return values, return value should be something that is nice to
know, but not essensial. (printf, frex)
And templates sure makes life much easier.
If I want to be more portable, I'll learn to tolerate Java.
------------------------------
From: "Ayende Rahien" <don'[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft!
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 03:51:39 +0200
"Daniel Johnson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:LTyU6.72926$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> "Ayende Rahien" <don'[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:9ftqlt$7ru$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> > "Daniel Johnson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:jYrU6.72274$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> > > A *lot* of the problems and general weirdness
> > > of MFC are due to issues of this sort.
> >
> > That doesn't excuse the CSocket nightmare, though.
>
> I've never used CSocket. Should I be
> happy about this? What's wrong with it?
It's built on CAsynchSocket!
You don't build a synchronoussocket on asynchronous one!
You build a new one!
And it's *easy* to do so.
Pick any book about WinSock, even books that dedicade only few chapters for
it has their own class libraries for it.
And what they did with CCESocket is a crime against CS as a whole!
http://www.cyberport.com/~tangent/programming/winsock/articles/csocket.html
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Microsoft - WE DELETE YOU!
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Ed Allen)
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 01:01:16 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Chad Myers wrote:
>>
>> It's pretty standard. Anyone who is a militant rabid defender
>> of something is generally called a <term>inista.
>>
>> -c
>
>Therefore, that would make you a Windowinista... Billyinista...
>Gatesinista....
>
He goes by the self proclaimed title:
Chad Myers, jerk.
But I do like the sound of Windowinista...
--
Microsoft is trying to add to the list of biggest lies of all time:
"Hi. I'm from Microsoft and I am here to protect you from the threat of
the GPL."
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ()
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux dead on the desktop.
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 01:48:33 +0200
In article <3b20d820$0$94308$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
"Chad Myers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>>
>> So where does that leave M$ when it comes to security? At the
>> bottom of the pile.
>
> Do YOU even know what you're talking about? Have you ever
> heard of NT or Windows 2000?
Can't you read my .sig? When it comes to security MS are the pits.
--
Over 100 security bugs in Microsoft SW last year. An infamous
record. The worst offending piece of SW, by far, IIS. 2001 isn't
looking any better.
------------------------------
From: Rotten168 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: European arrogance and ignorance... (was Re: Just when Linux
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 01:34:47 GMT
drsquare wrote:
>
> On Sun, 10 Jun 2001 03:39:00 +0800, in comp.os.linux.advocacy,
> ("Todd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>) wrote:
>
> >"Nick Condon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> >> Why? It's just where you born. It's not like you achieved anything. Your
> >> parents fucked, and out you popped. It could have been anywhere. So just
> >> keep that image in mind, next time you feel patriotic, just visualise your
> >> father hunched over your mother. Which is all it comes down to, really.
> >
> >Well, I'm proud to be American.
>
> What is their to be proud of.
Well he was born as an American, that's apparently a real
accomplishment.
> >Strongest nation on earth. Others will surely balk at me, but who cares.
> >
> >We have the strongest economy, the strongest military,
>
> Meaningless.
Ah yes, the "my country is better than yours 'cause it can nuke yours".
This has always embarrassed me as an American. It's just so juvenile.
This is just "my dad can beat up your dad" on a bigger but no less
immature level.
> >the best movies
>
> I think not.
I'd agree... although we've had some good ones.
> >(hehe), we invented the light bulb, transistor, microprocessor, we started
> >the Internet, and a whole bunch more.
>
> Meaning what? Nothing.
You didn't question him on his use of 'we'. Who's 'we'? Was he on the
team that invented the light bulb? 'We' makes it seem like it was a
collective effort which included him.
Again, pretty embarrassing.
> >You can say what you want, but America rockz. That isn't to say that other
> >nations don't rock also, but for different reasons.
>
> Yeah, other countries have personal freedom.
No other nations _don't_ rock. Individuals rock, nations are just
political entities.
Individuals...
> >There is good in every nation... hey... my best friend is Australian, and my
> >favorite beer is from Singapore.
> >
> >So just relax on this patriotic shit because there is good stuff everywhere
> >and bad stuff everywhere.
Well... there's nothing wrong with loving your country, it's just that
it starts to get tedious and tiresome when it goes overboard, and when
people love it for no other reason than it's popular to do so.
> >W2k rockz and linux suxors. Need I say more? :)
>
> Yeah, American Windows and foreign Linux. Now what does that tell you?
Linux is a flavor of an American OS.
--
- Brent
"General Veer, prepare your underpants for ground assault."
- Darth Vader
http://rotten168.home.att.net
------------------------------
From: "Steven" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: which OS is better to learn for an entry level job?
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 01:39:39 GMT
Which OS should you focus on learning to get an entry level tech or
programming job? Linux or Windows?
Thanks
Steve
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 11:43:59 +1000
From: Ian Pulsford <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: A Browser is a Browser
Mig wrote:
>
> I think it would help a lot if you used Windows and not FreeBSD - i think
> it would add credibility :-).
I trust you mean when posting email to dignities in protest and are not
taking a stab at FreeBSD.
IanP
--
"Dear someone you've never heard of,
how is so-and-so. Blah blah.
Yours truly, some bozo." - Homer Simpson
------------------------------
From: A.M.F. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Windows makes good coasters
Crossposted-To: alt.linux.sux,alt.linux,comp.os.
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 01:41:07 GMT
Peter Hayes wrote:
> On Mon, 4 Jun 2001 16:28:25 +1000, "Interconnect" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
>> drsquare <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> > On Sat, 02 Jun 2001 23:43:57 GMT, in comp.os.linux.advocacy,
>> > ([EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bob Hauck)) wrote:
>> >
>> > >On Sat, 02 Jun 2001 19:28:01 GMT, Jonas Due Vesterheden
>> > ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> In article <9fbdk1$5mf$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Ian Pegel wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> > I'm kind of new to Linux, I like what I see so far - my only
>> > >> > reservation is leaving apps like Dreamweaver and Photoshop behind.
>> > >
>> > >> Have you tried the alternatives to these programs?
>> >
>> > >The de-facto Photoshop alternative for Linux would be GIMP. Most
>> > >distros seem to come with it.
>> >
>> > But it's nowhere near as good as PSP
>>
>> Well it depends on what you want it to do isn't it?
>> I know you can't do screen capture with PSP but with GIMP it's a piece of
>> cake.
>
> Of course you can do a screen capture with PSP. There's even a "capture"
> menu up front on the menu bar - sheesh...
>
> But anyone who thinks PSP is even close to Gimp needs their head examined.
>
> Peter
>
I guess the old saying "One man's meat is another man's poison" (One man's
trash is another aman's treasure) fits here.
I used photoshop for years as a graphic arts designer and most definately
think that gimp is much better, Of course if you want to spend 600 bucks
everytime they update their product then by all means go ahead and make
adobe rich.
------------------------------
From: Greg Cox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Justice Department LOVES Microsoft!
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 01:54:37 GMT
In article
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> Greg Cox wrote:
> > In article
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> > > It's true. There was a Seattle Times article a couple of years ago that
> > > mentioned the entry level salary of a MS programmer... $18k. But it
> > > mentioned that they also get stock options. (A carrot!)
> > >
> >
> > This is pure BS. Microsoft is known to have low salaries (with stock
> > options) but nothing anywhere this low.
> > --
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> BS yourself. Go read the Seattle Times... if they screwed up the
> article its not my fault.
> Do you work for MS??
>
>
I retired from Microsoft in 1999 after 18 years there. I had been a
developer, dev lead, and a dev manager during that time which included
dealing with the pay for the developers working under me. I KNOW what
the pay scale was and it was far more than $18K. Look at it this way,
how many newly minted CS grads from MIT, Harvard, and Stanford (typical
places Microsoft recruites from) do you think would work for $18K?
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: Rotten168 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: soc.men,soc.singles,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Why homosexuals are a threat to heterosexuals
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 02:00:17 GMT
"Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
> If so, thank a soldier.
> K: Truth in advertising:
> Anarchist Members of the ACLU
While I am in no way ungrateful to those who served this country, the
ACLU has done just as much to protect liberty as any war has.
--
- Brent
"General Veer, prepare your underpants for ground assault."
- Darth Vader
http://rotten168.home.att.net
------------------------------
From: Rotten168 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: soc.men,soc.singles,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Why homosexuals are a threat to heterosexuals
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 02:02:51 GMT
"Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
>
> Simple.
>
> Freedom to conduct business without your fuel prices being subjected to gouging
> by a Moscow-created Hitler-style dictator.
So, when are you going to war against the top 7 corporations who
basically own this country?
--
- Brent
"General Veer, prepare your underpants for ground assault."
- Darth Vader
http://rotten168.home.att.net
------------------------------
From: "JS \\ PL" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux dead on the desktop.
Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2001 22:10:40 -0400
"Chris Ahlstrom" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> JS \\ PL wrote:
> >
> > Windows 2000 Server shipped 1 million in it's first year. Do the math,
> > that's about 2700 a DAY switching or upgrading to the Windows 2000
server
> > family. One million times $1188.00 is over a billion dollars. I wouldn't
> > call that extremely embarrassing. I have no information on how many Pro
> > licences have been sold, no doubt considerably more than have been sold
for
> > the server OS. Add em all up and your "extrmely embarasing" claim really
> > turns out to be "extremely successfull".
>
> The figure is for licenses. Who knows how many NT sites merely did
> an upgrade to all of their servers? Good for Microsoft, though I'm
> sure they expected to do much better.
>
> 2700/day? That's like 54 per day per state. Maybe like 1 per day per
> city? Ooooh, that's a lot! Probably more people buying Linux servers
> than Win 2000 servers, eh?
Do the math - A billion in sales in first year minus half a billion to
develop from scratch equals half a billion in the black....and
counting....
Not to mention MS is sitting on 20 billion in cash that they don't know what
to do with. "embarrasingly low sales" isn't a problem at Microsoft as T Max
Devlin likes to claim. Rumor had it they were going to get rid of some of
the excess cash by simply buying Yahoo and all it's holdings outright, for
cash. MS themselves deny that rumor though.
------------------------------
From: "Adam Warner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: A Browser is a Browser
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 14:13:27 +1200
"Ayende Rahien" <don'[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> It's disabled by default.
In _this_ revision of IE6, plus Microsoft could allow/encourage partner OEMs
to enable it. Microsoft benefits by getting more links to its sites. The
partners benefit by being able to include their own third party tags that
hyperlink from different sites back to them.
Unless Microsoft gives an assurance this will not be turned on by default it
could even be enabled in IE6 SP1.
Regards,
Adam
------------------------------
From: Greg Cox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Here's a switch for a change
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 02:16:18 GMT
In article <9ftjl0$5va55$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> > Further, his data isn't gone. Just the OS is corrupted.
> >
>
> So how does the average user supposed to get his / her data back when the
> OS refuses to boot when most users need help just using the system normally
> - if you upgraded your copy of windows and were left with an unbootable PC
> and faced losing an important research project ( and maybe also failing an
> important exam or destroying your career because of it ) and were told by
> the shop that none of their staff can help and maybe being told you need to
> buy even more software to try to recover that data ( norton utilities
> perhaps) or being offered a refund on the upgrade then wouldn't you feel
> well pissed off.
You could at least try booting with the emergency boot disk you created
as part of the install of the new version of Windows, or the emergency
boot disk from a previous version...
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: "Les Mikesell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux dead on the desktop.
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 02:35:34 GMT
"Ayende Rahien" <don'[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:9fu779$rce$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> > >
> > > > I'm thinking that there has got to be a way to do this with NT, what
> > > > with ACL's and all. Any pointers from the Winvocates?
> > >
> > > She didn't know how to do it?
> > > Strange, it's very easy.
> > > Okay, here is how do to it:
> > >
> > > cacls *.* /t /p Everyone:W
> > >
> > > This should turn all the files (and all sub directirues) to write
only.
> >
> > A filesystem where no one can update files is pretty useless.
>
> In this case, everyone can update, but no one can read.
>
> > How can I make it impossible to write via ftp but still allow
> > the customer support people who are updating files for
> > download to write on the shared directory? (The anon
> > ftp account was only supposed to have read access but
> > that wasn't enough to protect it).
>
> Uncheck the "Enable write" in the FTP configuration.
> Set the permissions so IUSR_MachineName has read only access, too.
> (IUSR is the default anonymous connection, you might want to change that,
> though).
>
> Then share the FTP directory and give the customer people write access.
>
> Is that good enough for you?
I think that is the way it was originally set up (by someone who
understands NT's quirks better than I do) but then we needed to
allow one ftp user write access. Soon afterwards the internet
bandwidth filled both our T1's and then I found the directory
named PRN (how did they do that?) and the hidden video
clips under it. But, the anon user still wasn't supposed to
be able to write and I don't think the person with the password
to the writable account did it.
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: "Lance Togar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: More micro$oft "customer service"
Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2001 22:35:55 -0400
"Rick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> More micro$oft "customer service":
>
> http://public.wsj.com/sn/y/SB991862595554629527.html
>
> --
> Rick
..
There's a very simple answer to this and MS's other BS of late: DON'T BUY
IT. There's no compelling reason to upgrade Win or Office 2k so... DON'T.
What's so complicated about this?
..
..
------------------------------
From: "News at satx.rr.com" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.arch,misc.invest.stocks
Subject: Re: The beginning of the end for microsoft
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 02:50:20 GMT
Paysan, your an idiot. How did you ever fail at all installing all those
operating systems is beyond me. I installed all of them including your damn
linux and was successful at it.
"Bernd Paysan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Ian Pulsford wrote:
> > > The main "install nightmare" issue comes from wanabe techies who try
to
> > > install Linux themselves and fail. A lot of them would fail if they
had
> > > to try to install Windows, too.
> >
> > That is so arrogant. If you tried to install the Yoyodyne 2020 system
> > first time you would probably fail too. You are saying inexperienced
> > people shouldn't even try. First time I ever tried DOS, OS/2, Linux,
> > and FreeBSD I failed at installations. I redid them till I got them
> > right. You are no smarter than the average man on the street, the only
> > advantage you have is experience.
>
> Well, if you succeed second time, you are quite good. Most people don't
> want to fiddle with a computer, they want to work (type, surf the net,
> use the applications they have to do their job). Those people call for
> the helpful admin (or the helpful brother ;-) for much lesser things
> than installing a new OS. And they are right so; it should not be
> necessary to become an expert in a tool for daily work. People don't
> learn to repair their car, either. The new car of my father has a sealed
> motor with a sticker like "no serviceable parts inside" - it's not
> exactly that, but since there are about 2000 bars of pressure on the
> Diesel injection lines, damages can do severe harm.
>
> When computers become a matured product, you can really buy one with OS
> and apps installed, turn it on, and give the service a maintainance
> login every year or so (during which the computer is perhaps rebooted
> *once*).
>
> --
> Bernd Paysan
> "If you want it done right, you have to do it yourself"
> http://www.jwdt.com/~paysan/
------------------------------
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