On Sun, 19 May 2002, Nadav Har'El wrote:

> On Sun, May 19, 2002, Ely Levy wrote about "Re: official hebrew in Linux-IL mailing 
>lists?":
> > month work????
> > maybe if you work full time on it day by day..
> > if you know how do tell me I would be more than happy to do it
>
> Ok. How about the following idea: make a (say) Redhat 7.3 based Hebrew
> distribution to called "Redhat Ivrix 1.0", "Redhat 7.3 with Hebrew",
> "LinBrew", or whatever, like this:
>
> 1. Take the stock Redhat 7.3. This already includes some Hebrew fonts,
>    and full Hebrew support in Mozilla, QT (e.g., Licq, KDE stuff).
>    Some things are still buggy: this will be solved in the next release.

I haven't followed Reedhat closely for a while.

I know that Mandrake's installer already has quite a few hooks in place to
support other lanages. You probably won't have to touch a line of the
(perl, in case of Mandrake, python in case of redhat) installer, and only
edit the config files.

> 2. Add an RPM of Hebrew Open Office. Voila, we have a WYSIWYG editor for
>    the joy of the newbies.

OpenOffice is an overkill for that.

KDE3/gnome2 will give you that.

OpenOffice will give you a (Marketoid speak) "World class word-processor,
now finally with Hebrew support on Linux"

> 3. Add RPMs which will somehow cause the users to default to
>    LC_CTYPE=he_IL, or en_US.utf8, or something like that, set the
>    appropriate keyboard (English/Hebrew, no support for a third language
>    in this release for simplicity) map by default, set mutt (and pine,
>   etc. etc.) to work well with Hebrew, and so on.

Again: Mandrake's installer already does that, if you choose "Israel"
installation. I'm not sure about redhat. Some difaults may have to be
re-visited. For instance: the fact that Mandrake 8.1 defaluted to loading
KDE2 with the charset ISO-8859-8, and KDE happily crashed because of that.

> 4. Add a few more RPMs for available Hebrew software: fribidi, bidiv,
>    hdate/taarich, etc. If we can find a few more free Hebrew fonts to
>    stick in there, do it (I think we have at least the Elmar fonts).
>    Add a HOWTO on how to use Microsoft's Hebrew font on another partition.
> 5. If you feel brave, also add an RPM for Hebrew TeX, some very initial
>    (read: worthless) Hebrew spell checker, etc.

IMHO it is important, because it is needed for LyX.

> 6. Maybe add an antiword RPM. It's not Hebrew-specific, but somehow it
>    seems Israelis need this a lot...
> 7. If still have time in the month, try translating a few important HowTos,
>    READMEs, or best of all: the Redhat installation software. Translate
>    a few manual pages.

Try thinking about what the user encounters first. Start with the short
introduction docs on the CD.

> 8. If you really have time to waste, draw special Israeli backgrounds,
>    logos, and things like that.
>
> What we get from this is a rudementary version of Hebrew Linux. People
> could install this (either you get special CD-ROMs with these RPMs,or you
> install them on top of a preinstalled RedHat system) and get some Hebrew
> support out-of-the-box on their Linux system.

On-top? Or a seperate CD?

Changing configuration after install time is a whole lot trickier, and
requires some smarter scriptig and more testing.

> Some of the support will be buggy, some will be missing, and most of the
> system isn't translated yet. These things can be imporved upon in the next
> versions, if this is a continuing project (with RPM specs available) and
> not some one-time special Hebrew CD-ROM (like Tzafrir has done a few times
> in the past).
>
> I think that though people who don't know a word of English would not be
> able to use such an initial version, more "ordinary" people, people who know
> some English but are not comfortable with it, will be able to "endure" this
> version if some expert (or English speaker) helps them install the system
> initially.
>
> I have started working on this yesterday, but it's going very slowly because
> my knowledge of RPM building really sucks. I failed to even create an RPM
> of the sourforge fribidi even though it contains a spec file (yes, I'm
> stupid :( I'm trying to learn though).
>
> Tzafrir, you are undoubtedly our RPM expert. You did some specs and srpms
> previously. Where are they? Can we update them to the latest versions of
> stuff and collect a set of RPMs to make an initial Hebrew Linux release?
>
> Does anybody else think that this might be a good way to proceed? Or maybe
> it isn't? (see also the P.S.'s below before you answer) I'd like comments,
> and better yet: people willing to help me build RPMS :)
>
> P.S. The reason I'm suggesting Redhat 7.3 is because I personally use it and
> like it (and trust it), because it's cutting-edge enough to contain some new
> Hebrew features, and because it's a common distribution. I suppose the
> same thing can be done to Mandrake, Gentoo, Slackware, Debian, or whatever.
> I hope that the same SRPMs created for Redhat 7.3 could be used for Mandrake,
> but I don't know. Tzafrir?

I figure. I haven't yet studied debian's sutability.

>
> P.S.#2:
> Of course, when I say a month work I assume someone who has time to work on
> this night after night for a month. I unforunately have a few other things
> on my mind too :(
>
> P.S.#3:
> Basing such an effort on an existing distribution (such as Redhat 7.3 in
> my example) is very important in my opinion. Distributions have some huge
> burdons and responsibilities, not the least of which is to do timely releases
> of fixes in case of security problems, and I don't think we can, or want to
> duplicate these efforts. A new version of (say) Wu-FTPD coming out has nothing
> to do with Hebrew support, so we shouldn't even touch that package.
> In the future, weshould strive to have most of these things integrated with
> (again, for example) the official RedHat release. If (say) fribidi and hdate
> are important to Israeli users, I bet they won't mind adding a package or
> a few for us, like they already have hugepackages for other countries and
> even Hebrew.

Yes, it takes a bit longer, but the safest root is to push it to the
distros themselves.

-- 
Tzafrir Cohen
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.technion.ac.il/~tzafrir



=================================================================
To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with
the word "unsubscribe" in the message body, e.g., run the command
echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Reply via email to