I wasn't going to contribute to this thread, but let me just throw in my two cents, then leave it alone after that point... There have been repeated issues on this list that I've addressed with Mark. I won't go into the specifics, but we'll just leave it to say it took about literally 7 or 8 offenses along with an equal amount of off list notes to him before he even sort a publicly addressed the matter.
What the matter is isn't important, nor anyone's specific business, but rest assured, it took a lot before I saw him finally react. Honestly, anymore, I'm not sure how to interpret his reaction. On the one hand I feel he took over, but on the other hand, I feel like it was kind of a, "Fine, I addressed it. Happy now?" approach. I'm not sure which it was, nor am I going to sit here and try speculating either way. I do however agree that whoever started this initial thread which Mark has closed, thank you by the way, never should have occured on a list like this, and was totally irrelavent. As much as I hate to say it, I totally have to be on GS's side with this, and I unfortunately have to completely echo their opinion. Mark's a great guy, and I truly think he cares, and I don't think it's so much he's too leniant, as much as I feel he says he's gonna do something, but then, like GS said, he then procrastinates it. I don't know his whole reasoning for that, maybe it's legit, maybe it's not. I don't know. I just know what I observe, and, what I up to this point have observed is someone who you bring a concern to, but then, they'll do anything and everything to not have to deal with it unless you sweet talk them, and even then, you may or may not get results. It's truly a gamble in a hat. --- Christopher Gilland JAWS Certified, 2016. Training Instructor. i...@gillandmarketing.com Phone: (704) 256-8010. ----- Original Message ----- From: gs To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, November 10, 2016 5:32 PM Subject: Re: MODERATOR NOTE: RE: Global Warming Well, I'm being very honest here. I don't have the time to do this. I really value this list and know that even in the threads that I eventually get to with 50 or more messages with the predominant subject of demented political opinions, there might be a nugget of information that will mean an increase in productivity or a keystroke or an update or a piece of technical knowledge that will make a huge difference in the way I use an Apple product. In fact, I have found buried in the wordy, arrogant posts of some individuals, some really priceless tips for accomplishing tasks that I would have otherwise missed if I had not read the rest of the propaganda in the thread. Nevertheless, the owner/moderator has a responsibility that does not seem to be fulfilled on this list at this point. There are a boat load of mailing lists but I have decided to just create one myself. Send request to macwithvoiceover-requ...@freelists.org with subscribe in the subject. If it takes off that's fine. If it does not, that's fine too. On Nov 10, 2016, at 5:05 PM, Joseph Hudson <jhud7...@gmail.com> wrote: Well just say this much, when an issue arises, we are quick to stop it. And as far as traffic, we just don't have a lot of traffic going on right now. There are some days that are busier than others. and it's always very relevant. Joseph Hudson Group administrator for the following groups chat http://list.ntxability.org/mailman/listinfo/chat_list.ntxability.org blind apples http://cruising.ultragroups.com/mailman/listinfo/blindapples_cruising.ultragroups.com blind square GPS http://cruising.ultragroups.com/mailman/listinfo/blindsquaregps_cruising.ultragroups.com blind handyman http://cruising.ultragroups.com/mailman/listinfo/blindhandyman_cruising.ultragroups.com iPad help for the blind https://groups.io/g/IPadhelpfortheblind Email jhud7...@gmail.com I device support Telephone 2543007667 Skype joseph.hudson89 facebook https://www.facebook.com/joseph.hudson.9404 Twitter https://twitter.com/josephhudson89 FaceTime/iMessage jhud7...@yahoo.com On Nov 10, 2016, at 3:57 PM, gs <geoffsli...@gmail.com> wrote: I like a lot of traffic if it is relevant. The problem here is list management. Nobody seems to be dedicated enough to address the issues. The owner shows up every six months with some sort of apology and then cedes the running of the list to someone else who apparently doesn't get it either. Just run the thing correctly. It's not too much to ask. It's pathetic. On Nov 10, 2016, at 4:53 PM, Joseph Hudson <jhud7...@gmail.com> wrote: If you're looking for a group, the doesn't have stuff like this going on. You can come to the group that is below in my signature. We don't have junk like this going on. And not a lot of traffic either. Joseph Hudson Group administrator for the following groups chat http://list.ntxability.org/mailman/listinfo/chat_list.ntxability.org blind apples http://cruising.ultragroups.com/mailman/listinfo/blindapples_cruising.ultragroups.com blind square GPS http://cruising.ultragroups.com/mailman/listinfo/blindsquaregps_cruising.ultragroups.com blind handyman http://cruising.ultragroups.com/mailman/listinfo/blindhandyman_cruising.ultragroups.com iPad help for the blind https://groups.io/g/IPadhelpfortheblind Email jhud7...@gmail.com I device support Telephone 2543007667 Skype joseph.hudson89 facebook https://www.facebook.com/joseph.hudson.9404 Twitter https://twitter.com/josephhudson89 FaceTime/iMessage jhud7...@yahoo.com On Nov 10, 2016, at 3:50 PM, gs <geoffsli...@gmail.com> wrote: I waste a considerable amount of my time reviewing this list each day because it is a valuable resource to those who use VoiceOver on the Mac. If you have the time to wade through the bull, do so. I don't. On Nov 10, 2016, at 4:47 PM, Todor Fassl <fassl....@gmail.com> wrote: Lighten up, Francis. On 11/10/2016 03:45 PM, gs wrote: Hmm. Well I have contributed because the thread is split. I'm sick of it. This should have been addressed before and you need to remove people instead of making a generic announcement such as the one below. On Nov 10, 2016, at 2:12 PM, M. Taylor <mk...@ucla.edu> wrote: Everyone, This thread is now considered closed. Do not send anymore on-list posts regarding this subject or contribute to this thread. Thank you, Mark -----Original Message----- From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Todor Fassl Sent: Thursday, November 10, 2016 10:59 AM To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Global Warming Well, first of all, Chuck, it's not my job to disprove every theory you come up with. If you want to claim global warming might be caused by volcanos, you prove it. Secondly, I already indirectly answered the point you are making. All successful climate models do indeed take volcanic activity into account. They couldn't be successful otherwise. If you insist, I can dig up articles from scientific journals that show that certain climate models have predicted climate changes to a degree that cannot be accounted for by chance. These models also show that the amount of warming we have experienced cannot be accounted for by volcanos and that it is indeed due to the greenhouse gases we have emitted. Now, I am willing to dig up that evidence if you insist. But, as a gentleman, I would hope you don't make me look stuff up just on the hope that I won't bother. If you really do doubt something I say, by all means challenge me to prove it. But please do not waste my time. On 11/10/2016 12:28 PM, CHUCK REICHEL wrote: Hi Todor, Heres a "proverb" that applies here! Figures don't lie, but liars figure! Do you have statistics on the average carbon out put from a Volcano? With out these stats plugged into the Global Warming model the "theory" is flawed to begin with. BTW a Theory is a unproven fact! :) Unless you have that data how can you blame carbon on man caused pollution? FYI I remember the "ice age is coming rap" At least with the ice age coming they could keep their "cool aid" at the proper temperature! ;) Scott is absolutely correct again! Chuck On Nov 10, 2016, at 1:07 PM, Todor Fassl wrote: Here is the proof that global warming is being caused by human activity: Fact 1. We know absolutely that certain gasses in a planet's atmosphere cause the planet to heat up. This can be explained through the laws of physics and can be tested experimentally. This is called the "Greenhouse Effect". Fact 2. We know that humans have put an enormous amount of greenhouse gas into our planet's atmosphere. This is carbon that has been locked up in the earth's crust for millions of years. Here is a link to a web page that lists the top oil producing countries. I am going to say it adds up to more than a hundred million barrels of oil per day. That's right -- a hundred million barrels per day. There are also millions of tons of coal and natural gas being mined every day. https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder /2241rank.html Fact 3. Many scientists from all over the world have calculated how much effect the greenhouse gases we have emitted would have. Those calculations, often called climate models, are proven to be accurate because they can predict things like droughts and floods to a degree that cannot be accounted for by chance. And these climate models consistently show that we have indeed put enough greenhouse gas into our atmosphere to cause the planet to heat up. Now, those 3 facts taken together *prove* that global warming is being caused by human activity. This stuff about volcanos is what is called "fuzzy thinking". It's akin to a person defending themselves in court by saying the police can't prove that the guy he shot didn't just happen to drop dead from some other reason right before the bullet hit him. It is not my job to disprove every lame idea a skeptic might propose. The 3 facts I gave above prove that global warming is being caused by humans. Where is the flaw? On 11/10/2016 10:46 AM, CHUCK REICHEL wrote: Hi Scott, Your absolutely 100% correct again! Heres just 1 thing that blows "climate change" formally known as "global warming" out of the water! How much carbon does a average volcano spew out in just 1 major eruption? Can anybody stop a volcano from erupting? My Daughter who holds a "Ph.D. in Applied Physics: could shed some more light on this but at this point the only thing that would keep this on topic is that She uses a Mac book pro! LOL Talk soon Chuck On Nov 10, 2016, at 11:35 AM, Scott Granados wrote: Who boy we should move this over to the off topic list because I could blow huge holes in your global warming position. Scientists did infect fudge factor data and I can show you hard space weather data that indicates similar warming trends on other planets.;) That doesn’t mean I think we should be pumping crap in to the air and sea but the global warming deal is just a scheme to enrich a few. The next time Leonardo Decrapio tells me I need to use less energy while he’s flying around in his Gulfstream G5-50 burning more energy per hour than I do in my life I’ll smack him with a trout. On Nov 10, 2016, at 11:31 AM, Todor Fassl <fassl....@gmail.com> wrote: The USA has a long, disgraceful history of preventing minorities from voting via poll tests. So I know making people prove they know *something* before they vote is not practical. It would be nice though. If you ever thought global warming was a hoax, you shouldn't be allowed to vote. I don't mean if you ever hoped it wasn't true. I mean if you ever believed scientists were deliberately making it up, then you should never again be allowed to vote. Well, maybe that is a bit harsh. You should have to prove you have learned your lesson though. On 11/10/2016 10:13 AM, Karen Lewellen wrote: One thing I appreciate about countries like Australia is that they recognize that those who choose not to participate in the voting process hurt the country as a whole. So, they did and I believe still do, require you to vote or pay a fine. The choice to be willfully ignorant is often not something that a city, county or country can afford. I respect that many might not have enjoyed the menu options, but choosing to skip the democratic process is especially damaging where, like stateside, it is more of an electoral college election than a general public mandate anymore. Speaking only for myself, it seems time to give voters a clear incentive to educate themselves about those issues. fine want to stay home enough to pay a fine for that right? Kare On Thu, 10 Nov 2016, Todor Fassl wrote: But why? Why should people who know nothing about the issues vote? Just repeating your opinion that they should vote is no answer. It's like saying you should get brain surgery even if you're not sure you have something wrong with your brain. Just sign yourself up for random medical treatments, who knows, some of them might even help. Instead of picking someone at random, if you haven't studied the issues, you should STAY HOME! repeating that they should vote is NO answer. On 11/08/2016 05:19 PM, Robin wrote: I Disagree Voting is a Right & EveryOne should Vote No Matter What iff Eligible At 02:26 PM 11/8/2016, you wrote: I don't think people should vote just for the sake of voting. That's how bad guys get elected -- ignorant voters put them in office. If you havent studied the issues, please stay home. On 11/08/2016 05:50 AM, Scott Granados wrote: For our friends in the US, Totally apolitical here and please please let’s keep it that way. Get out there and vote today, do your civic duty regardless of your party / candidate / beliefs just get out and have your voice heard if you haven’t already. Uber is offering a $20 credit for a trip to your polling place, Lyft has a similar deal with up to $45 in credits, and Google also has the means to arrange a ride for you and provide some credits to get to your closest polls. the parties are offering rides and volunteer services as well. Also, make sure you take advantage of the deals available today to voters. Keep that “I voted†sticker and Krispy > Cream will give you a free donut, McDonalds and Seven Eleven are giving free coffee, and many small businesses are having election day promotions that include discounts or out right freebies. Remember that many service men and women have fought and died for your right to vote so let’s not let them down and make sure > > we take advantage of our most powerful expression of our freedom, our right to vote. Now get out there and be safe everyone. -- Todd -- The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries list. If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark at: macvisionaries+modera...@googlegroups.com and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com The archives for this list can be searched at: http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. 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