====================================================================== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. ======================================================================
On Aug 14, 2010, at 2:43 PM, Shane Mage wrote: > > On Aug 14, 2010, at 1:56 PM, C. G. Estabrook wrote: > >> But neither of the "two essentially different concepts" is an >> account of the >> Abrahamic (Judeo-Xn-Islamic) notion of deity. > > As I pointed out below, the "Abrahamic (Judeo-Xn-Islamic) notion of > deity," has two senses: the "Demiurge" of Genesis 1 who brings order > out of chaos and the "Zeus" of popular religion to whom Sacrifices > are due. > > If a concept different from these is to be found in the Bible, the > Gospels, or the Koran please spell it out. >> >>> On Aug 13, 2010, at 10:24 PM, C. G. Estabrook wrote: >>>> >>>> That sort of god - a Zeus, or demiurge - is rather far from the >>>> Judeo-Christian notion (as elaborated in the West by Augustine and >>>> Aquinas). >>>> >>> A Zeus and a Demiurge are two essentially different concepts. A >>> "Demiurge" >>> is an artisan, the shaper of an ordered world out of chaos, the >>> lawgiver to a >>> lawfully unfolding cosmos. That is the "God" of Genesis. "Zeus," >>> (especially as Jupiter) is impersonal energy, symbolized as the >>> thunderbolt >>> (the planetary connection is here particularly à propos) and >>> participating in >>> the life process in the "do ut des" fashion--invoked through ritual >>> sacrifices. That is the "God" of popular religion--Allah, Jesus, >>> Adonai. >>> For the philosophers, though, the impersonality of the cosmic >>> energy flow is >>> what counts: "It consents and does not consent to be called >>> Zeus"(Herakleitos). > > > > Shane Mage > > Porphyry in his Abstinance from Animal Flesh suggests that there > are appropriate offerings to all the Gods, and to the highest the > only offering acceptable is silence. > > > ________________________________________________ Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
