“How would it affect us if the critisism were proved correct?” ["At
least as much evil has been done by secular nations as religious
ones."] – Aaron

To begin with, the notion of ‘evil’ is weak at the very least.
Ignoring the term and/or supplanting it with something like ‘ignorant
acts’ results in something quite unlike criticism as I see it. It more
appears to match reality as such.


On Nov 18, 3:03 pm, Aaron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> "At least as much evil has been done by secular nations as religious
> ones."
>
> This critique of secularism is more insightful than we usually give it
> credit for.
>
> Sure, the simplistic version is easy to counter:  Look closely at any
> "evil" secular state and you'll see that the problem is not
> secularism, but a quasi-religious commitment to some ideology or
> personality.  As Sam Harris famously quips, "I know of no society in
> recorded history that ever suffered because its people became too
> reasonable."
>
> But the real force of this criticism is its implicit indictment of
> human nature.  Without a robust religious tradition (so the argument
> goes), people will inevitably attach themselves to something else, be
> it a personality, nationality, political ideology or racial/ethnic
> group.  The attachment will be every bit as irrational and dangerous
> as religion.  Possibly more.  That's just how people work.
>
> This criticism is not so easy to reject.  We can point to all the
> individuals who get along just fine without religious convictions, but
> that's beside the point.  A people does not always behave like an
> individual.  We have Europe, I suppose, but the jury is still out
> there.  Will liberal values hold up against the passion of Islam?
> Will "liberalism" itself become quasi-religious, persecuting the un-
> PC?
>
> Theoretically, this is an emperical question.  It says nothing about
> the objective truth of any religion, of course, but it might inform
> our politics or social impact strategies if it were true.  Most of us
> are not merely interested in getting rid of religion.  We want to
> improve society.  How would it affect us if the critisism were proved
> correct?
>
> Aaron
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