Yeah, and wonder if all black holes are "big bang" origins into another universe? After all, they say the big bang began from a super dense point. Wonder if the mass will balance out... Why couldnt that be the other side of a black hole? Always wanted to ask that question but kept forgetting.
On Mon, Dec 8, 2008 at 3:35 PM, CrossBow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Well, sounds anal...from that description. > > just wondering if they left room for a multiverse...maybe it's all stuck > between branes:) > > > > > On Mon, Dec 8, 2008 at 3:07 PM, Clogtowner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> >> Hi y'all - I suspect that the explanation will be that the universe >> expands until it runs out of energy and then contracts into a black >> hole until it reaches maximum density and then explodes starting the >> cycle again (sounds good anyway.) >> >> On Dec 8, 2:44 pm, Isparklaria <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> > I'm picking up a copy of Steinhardt and Turok's book from the library >> > so I'll let you know what it says about black holes. >> > >> > On Dec 8, 10:27 am, CrossBow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> > >> > >> > >> > > There must be an answer to black holes and where thier >> captured/devoured >> > > energy goes in this jumble somewhere...though I did not see it. I >> anyone >> > > has that info...please send it my way:) >> > >> > > On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 8:56 AM, Isparklaria <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> wrote: >> > >> > > > Here is some information on the big collision hypothesis and a link >> to >> > > > the page. Google Paul Steinhardt and Neil Turok, the creators of >> this >> > > > idea for more information. Steinhardt and Turok also wrote a popular >> > > > account in book form. I suggest that we read it next for the book >> > > > club, since it gives a hypothetical answer as to what happened >> before >> > > > the big bang. >> > >> > > >http://www.actionbioscience.org/newfrontiers/steinhardt.html >> > >> > > > The cyclic universe model >> > >> > > > In this context, a new paradigm has been recently proposed by Paul >> > > > Steinhardt (Princeton) and Neil Turok (Cambridge) —the cyclic >> universe >> > > > — that turns the conventional picture topsy-turvy.2 (Perhaps the >> model >> > > > should be called an old paradigm since it reinvigorates ancient >> cosmic >> > > > mythologies and philosophies, albeit using the tools of 21st century >> > > > physics.) In this picture: >> > > > · space and time exist forever >> > > > · the big bang is not the beginning of time; rather, it is a >> bridge >> > > > to >> > > > a pre-existing contracting era >> > > > · the Universe undergoes an endless sequence of cycles in >> which it >> > > > contracts in a big crunch and re-emerges in an expanding big bang, >> > > > with trillions of years of evolution in between >> > > > · the temperature and density of the universe do not become >> infinite >> > > > at any point in the cycle; indeed, they never exceed a finite bound >> > > > (about a trillion trillion degrees) >> > > > · no inflation has taken place since the big bang; the current >> > > > homogeneity and flatness were created by events that occurred before >> > > > the most recent big bang >> > > > · the seeds for galaxy formation were created by instabilities >> > > > arising >> > > > as the Universe was collapsing towards a big crunch, prior to our >> big >> > > > bang >> > > > The new model provides insight into some questions unanswered by the >> > > > Big Bang theory. >> > > > The prospects for an alternative cosmology that is so different from >> > > > the well-The prospects for an alternative cosmology that is so >> > > > different from the well-established convention would seem extremely >> > > > dim. Yet, the cyclic model recoups all of the successful predictions >> > > > of the big bang/inflationary theory and has sufficient additional >> > > > predictive power to address many questions which the big bang/ >> > > > inflationary model does not address at all: >> > > > · What occurred at the initial singularity? >> > > > · What is the ultimate fate of the Universe? >> > > > · What is the role of dark energy and the recently observed >> cosmic >> > > > acceleration? >> > > > · Does time, and the arrow of time, exist before the big bang? >> or >> > > > after the big crunch? >> > > > In the new paradigm, each cycle proceeds through a period of >> radiation >> > > > and matter domination consistent with standard cosmology, producing >> > > > the observed primordial abundance of elements, the cosmic microwave >> > > > background, the expansion of galaxies, etc. For the next trillion >> > > > years or more, the Universe undergoes a period of slow cosmic >> > > > acceleration (as detected in recent observations1), which ultimately >> > > > empties the Universe of all of the entropy and black holes produced >> in >> > > > the preceding cycle and triggers the events that lead to contraction >> > > > and a big crunch. Note that dark energy is not simply added on — it >> > > > plays an essential role. The transition from big crunch to big bang >> > > > automatically replenishes the Universe by creating new matter and >> > > > radiation. Gravity and the transition from big crunch to big bang >> keep >> > > > the cycles going forever. In fact, as will be discussed, the cyclic >> > > > behavior is a strong attractor. That is, even if the Universe were >> > > > disrupted from its periodic behavior, it would rapidly reconverge to >> > > > the cyclic solution. >> > >> > > > In the new paradigm, each cycle proceeds through a period of >> radiation >> > > > and matter domination consistent with standard cosmology, producing >> > > > the observed primordial abundance of elements, the cosmic microwave >> > > > background, the expansion of galaxies, etc. For the next trillion >> > > > years or more, the Universe undergoes a period of slow cosmic >> > > > acceleration (as detected in recent observations1), which ultimately >> > > > empties the Universe of all of the entropy and black holes produced >> in >> > > > the preceding cycle and triggers the events that lead to contraction >> > > > and a big crunch. Note that dark energy is not simply added on — it >> > > > plays an essential role. The transition from big crunch to big bang >> > > > automatically replenishes the Universe by creating new matter and >> > > > radiation. Gravity and the transition from big crunch to big bang >> keep >> > > > the cycles going forever. In fact, as will be discussed, the cyclic >> > > > behavior is a strong attractor. That is, even if the Universe were >> > > > disrupted from its periodic behavior, it would rapidly reconverge to >> > > > the cyclic solution. >> > > > Superstring theory and the cyclic universe >> > > > The linchpin to the new paradigm is the transition from big crunch >> to >> > > > big bang. The transition was thought to be an impossible passage in >> > > > which the laws of physics blow up. However, recent developments in >> > > > superstring theory suggest that the cosmic singularity is otherwise, >> > > > as the two authors have argued in a recent paper with Justin Khoury >> > > > (Princeton), Burt Ovrut (Penn) and Nathan Seiberg (IAS).3 >> Superstring >> > > > theory relies on the idea that the Universe contains nine or ten >> > > > spatial dimensions, depending on the formulation, all but three of >> > > > which are curled up in a compact manifold of microscopic size. In >> this >> > > > framework, the big bang and big crunch may be an illusion. Expressed >> > > > in the usual variables of general relativity, it may appear that our >> > > > usual space and time are disappearing. However, viewed with the >> proper >> > > > variables, our usual space dimensions actually remain infinite and >> > > > time runs continuously. The transition from big crunch to big bang >> is >> > > > due, instead, to the collapse, bounce and re-expansion of one of the >> > > > extra dimensions. For example, in a variant known as M theory: >> > > > · the Universe consists of two branes (surfaces) bounding an >> extra >> > > > dimension, and the singularity corresponds to a collision and bounce >> > > > of the two branes >> > > > · the temperature and density of ordinary radiation and matter >> remain >> > > > finite at the bounce, and particles move continuously in a natural >> and >> > > > intuitive way >> > > > New cosmological possibilities >> > > > If superstring theory is proven to dispel the myth that the big bang >> > > > is the beginning of time, then it opens up new possibilities for the >> > > > cosmological history of the Universe. Six months ago, the "ekpyrotic >> > > > model"4 was proposed by Khoury, Ovrut, Steinhardt and Turok as one >> new >> > > > possibility based on the idea of making a universe from a single >> > > > collapse of the extra dimension. The cyclic model builds on lessons >> > > > learned from the ekpyrotic example to produce a picture with >> > > > remarkable predictive and explanatory power. >> > > > (c) 2002, Paul J. Steinhardt, Ph.D. An update by the author of a >> > > > previously published paper from his personal web page. See reprint >> > > > policy. >> > > > Paul J. Steinhardt, Ph.D., is a theoretical physicist in the >> > > > departments of Physics and Astrophysical Sciences at Princeton >> > > > University. His research spans problems in cosmology, astrophysics, >> > > > particle physics and condensed matter physics. He is a leading >> expert >> > > > on inflationary cosmology and other events in the very early >> universe. >> > > > His work led to the first inflationary models for the universe, to >> the >> > > > discovery that inflation can seed galaxy formation, and to new >> > > > observational tests. He also introduced the concept of quasicrystals >> > > > and pioneered the study of their structural and elastic properties. >> > > > Prior to his position at Princeton, Dr. Steinhardt served as the >> Mary >> > > > Amanda Word Professor of Physics at the University of Pennsylvania. >> He >> > > > is a member of the National Academy of Sciences, a Fellow of the >> > > > American Physics Society, and a member of the American Astronomical >> > > > Society.http://www.physics.princeton.edu/www/jh/research/ >> > > > steinhardt_paul.html >> > >> > > -- >> > > gnothe se auton- Hide quoted text - >> > >> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - >> > >> > - Show quoted text - >> >> >> > > > -- > gnothe se auton > -- gnothe se auton --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Memphis Freethought Alliance" group. 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