A national magazine did a feature on that idea a few decades ago, "If the South Had Won the Civil War". I don't recall which magazine, though. The possible "Confederate States of America" map they had showed Cuba as a state, but that is about all I remember from so long ago. BillR
-----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Scott Ritchey Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2008 8:18 PM To: 'Mercedes Discussion List' Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Is Barack Obama a US Citizen or will he end up inCuba? The US Civil War was about more than slavery. At that time the main federal tax was import duties. The south, having little ability to manufacture goods paid a very disproportionate share of these taxes while the north made a lot of their own stuff and didn't need many imports. Lincoln's emancipation proclamation was a political move that only freed slaves in the south while any slaves in the north (still slaves under Dred-Scott) were not effected. The primary result was to push back open support for the south in Europe and the UK who were then anti-slave. Practically speaking, slavery was already doomed in the US because machines would be more economical in a just a few years. The real issue was secession and slavery was just one factor. The south believed that they because they joined the union voluntarily and could also leave if they wanted to. The constitution was silent (and still is) on that issue. Lincoln believed that the union would continue to fragment (like Germany) over every little issue once the precedent was set so, despite much political resistance in the north, he went to war to keep the union intact. By any measure, it was the worst war in US history. One wonders how the history of the world would be different if the south had been allowed to secede. -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Hendrik & Fay Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2008 03:05 To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Is Barack Obama a US Citizen or will he end up inCuba? Yeah I know that 'rule of law' thing is a bummer, especially when the US has to set up a concentration camp in Cuba (of all places, perhaps they put it on an old disused missile site) and then kidnap people from all over the world and torture them there. Apparently a couple of Oz citizens where 'invited' there as well. Of course the British being cultured and having a rule of law, made a big noise about their citizens being there and I suppose have a bit of clout in Washington and their people got let go pretty quick. Now we are a bit more laid back and trusting I suppose and believed that the people being held in the camp where big terrorists and this was all part of winning the war on terror. However our patience did grow a bit thin after a while (years) and the former PM had an election coming up and finally worked up the courage to ask George if it would be possible to do something about the guests of the US of A (ooh sorry that should be guests of the socialist republic of Cuba) (oooh double sorry that should be guests of the US military). All of a sudden a secret trial/military tribunal was organized and the person in question got released into Oz custody to do a few more months in the local jail and is not allowed to talk about any of this to anyone, otherwise we might have to let the US kidnap him again. Anyway if the South didn't want a war, all they had to do was to act civilized and abolish slavery. Now you might be OK with some states of the Union stealing people from Africa and forcing them to work for nothing and thereby denying them their basic human rights (apparently there is something about the rights of people in the constitution) but apparently the southern states did not read the constitution or felt it did not apply to them in that regard. My guess is that Lincoln felt the south was governed by people who went against the constitution and as such the war was justified in his view. Perhaps Lincoln really believed that America was the land of the free, as opposed to having underclasses of people with lesser rights. Now as far as that Holocaust denier goes, for one thing he was warned that if he didn't stop his stuff he would have the book thrown at him. He was well aware that he was violating German law and that the British where not going to hide him. Now are you going to maintain your stance that he was kidnapped or was he legally extradited? My take is that he is an embarrassment to the Australian nation and as long as everything is legal (including the right to a fair trial in an timely manner) they can stick him in jail for as long as they want and I don't think anyone in Oz will even care. He is an idiot saying stupid things to stir up trouble or whatever his plans are, whilst saying stupid things is not against the law here, it is in Germany. Hendrik who is off to do some domestic chores because we don't have no servants, paid or not Gary Hurst wrote: > we have something in this country called "rule of law" (as opposed to your > country where you let foreign nations kidnap your citizens because they say > things that offend the german government). states are sovereign entities > here that enter into a voluntary union with other states. the traditional > understanding is that these states can leave the union just as they entered > it. > > a young man joins a gang and then realizes that the gang is not really the > best course of action. so he leaves the gangs, only to be hunted down and > murdered by other members for leaving. when we hear a story like this, we > recoil in horror at this behavior as it violates so many of our ideals > regarding law and morality. it is barbarism and it is unacceptable. > > yet, when a president engages in such a deranged murderous orgy on a large > scale, we declare him a national hero rather than denounce him as the sick > rogue he is. > > > > _______________________________________ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _______________________________________ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _______________________________________ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
