Valid point. In fact, there is currently a looming shortage of all grains worldwide. Russia, and the Balkan states for example have had more than two years of drought and low production. Rice is going short in the Pacific rim for this years production. Famine is just around every corner you look.
People are starving, or about to starve, and we are turning edible corn into untaxed whisky to burn in our cars. Can anyone say "irresponsible" loud enough? Let me just adjust the "feel good, save the planet" volume control... ahhhh.... there, I can hardly hear the cry of starving children.. much better. Grant... On Sun, Dec 9, 2012 at 10:39 AM, OK Don <okd...@gmail.com> wrote: > Also with the return (at least it feels like it here) of the dust bowl, > that excess capacity might not be so "excess" as it seems. We might need to > eat that corn, what little is produced during the droughts. > > On Sun, Dec 9, 2012 at 11:14 AM, dave walton <walton.d...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > Assuming the current political environment that gives us relatively cheap > > oil will continue ad infinitum is naive. > > Failure to prepare alternatives would be irresponsible. > > > > On Sunday, December 9, 2012, Rich Thomas wrote: > > > > > The US is poised to become a net energy exporter and reserves now > exceed > > > the ME. With Canada, N America is awash in oil. Using corn for fuel > is > > > somewhat nonsensical. > > > > > > --R > > > On 12/9/12 10:33 AM, Dave Walton wrote: > > > > > > The infrastructure is already in place to produce, store, distribute > and > > > process corn. Given the millions of gallons of fuel we use per day it > is > > > currently the only alternative to oil we could possibly fall back on in > > > short notice if we had to. > > > > > > On Dec 9, 2012, at 9:19 AM, Mitch Haley <m...@voyager.net> wrote: > > > > > > Read this in another forum. > > > Any comments? Loren? > > > > > > Mitch. > > > > > > > http://www.fatwallet.com/**forums/finance/1239047/**m17370463/#m17370463 > > <http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/finance/1239047/m17370463/#m17370463> > > > > > > Corn ethanol wasn't really a scam, at least not originally. You have to > > > understand how it began. > > > > > > During the Dust Bowl of the Great Depression, the U.S. suffered crop > > > failures. So on top of the economic woes, food prices skyrocketed. The > > > country vowed never again, and began subsidizing food production. This > > > insured that every year there was an oversupply of food, and (by paying > > > farmers not to plant crops) there was excess food production capacity > > which > > > we could "turn on" to make up for shortfalls if it looked like a > natural > > > disaster might cause a shortage. This meant that every year, the U.S. > had > > > more corn than it needed (the #1 crop in the U.S.). When supply exceeds > > > demand, prices fall. To prevent corn farmers from going bankrupt and > > > jeopardizing production, the government began buying corn at a floor > > price > > > which was above market price. Corn farmers could thus be guaranteed > > they'd > > > receive $x/bushel and plan around that price to stay in business, even > if > > > left to its own devices the market would've set a lower price. > > > > > > That's the rationale between the two biggest crop subsidies. How does > > this > > > relate to ethanol? Well, since the government was buying all that corn, > > > that meant after all Americans had eaten their fill of corn, there was > > > still a lot left over. They had to figure out ways to use that extra > > corn. > > > The first obvious use was feed for cattle. Then someone figured out you > > > could convert it into fructose as a cane sugar substitute (and thus > high > > > fructose corn syrup was born). A lot of it is also given away as > foreign > > > aid. > > > > > > But there was still a bunch left over. During the Arab oil embargo in > the > > > 1970s, someone in the government looked at all that extra corn and > asked > > > themselves, "I wonder if there's some way to convert it into fuel for > > > cars?" And thus was born corn ethanol. Corn wasn't anywhere near as > > > efficient a crop for ethanol production as sugar cane (which can only > > > really grow in Florida and Hawaii) and sugar beets (which will grow > > pretty > > > much anywhere). But that was beside the point becuase we had a bunch of > > > extra corn sitting around which was otherwise going to grow moldy or > feed > > > rats. > > > > > > So converting it into ethanol made sense even if the overall energy > input > > > exceeded the energy you got out from it. The energy put into growing > the > > > excess corn is a sunk cost - we were going to write it off anyway. So > as > > > long as the energy to convert it into ethanol is less than you get from > > > burning the ethanol, it makes sense to do it. Only the energy needed to > > > convert excess corn to ethanol matters; the energy which went into > > growing > > > the corn in the first place isn't a factor. > > > > > > But then the corn industry lobby got involved. And now a program which > > was > > > originally intended for and made sense with excess corn, has been > > expanded > > > to cover corn grown specifically for the purpose of converting it to > > > ethanol. When you do that, the economics of it fall apart, and sugar > > beets > > > make a lot more sense. But the government is paid for and bought by > > > lobbyists, so we have a mutant corn ethanol program which no longer > makes > > > financial sense. > > > > > > ______________________________**_________ > > > http://www.okiebenz.com > > > For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com > > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/< > > http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/> > > > > > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > > > http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com< > > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com> > > > > > > ______________________________**_________ > > > http://www.okiebenz.com > > > For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com > > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/< > > http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/> > > > > > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > > > <http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com> > > > > > > > > _______________________________________ > > http://www.okiebenz.com > > For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > > > > > -- > OK Don > 2001 ML320 > 2012 Passat TDI DSG > 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager > 1957 C182A > _______________________________________ > http://www.okiebenz.com > For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > _______________________________________ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
