Mark,
 
“FAA can take action more quickly and at a broader scope than the individual 
airlines”. Why?
 
The fact that a government agency (FAA) has the command-and-control process to 
manage an airline’s Billions of dollars’ worth of aircraft assets better than 
the individual airline that owns these assets is what is wrong on some many 
levels.
 
I would be curious if you know of another industry that allows the government 
to manage their “day of” asset base? I don’t.
 
Of course, all industries have government rules that they need to follow, but 
full command and control - I don’t think so.
 
Of course, ATC trying to solve the airlines inefficiency problems (and failing) 
has been the norm since 1958 and the advent of Positive Control Airspace. This 
is not right and shouldn’t happen, but it is the reality.
 
Michael
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
R. Michael Baiada
cell - (303) 521-6047
 <mailto:[email protected]> [email protected]
 
From: Mark HANSEN via Mifnet <[email protected]> 
Sent: Monday, July 21, 2025 16:57
To: [email protected]
Cc: Mark HANSEN <[email protected]>
Subject: [Mifnet đź›° 73211] Re: Huh?
 
We interviewed a major carrier about their IROP procedures and this topic came 
up. According to my notes, "carrier-initiated traffic management initiatives" 
are used because FAA can take action more quickly and at a broader scope than 
the individual airlines can even for their own flights, and can also delay 
aircraft more readily once they have left the gate. Although the standard TMI 
involves flights of multiple airlines, the capability to implement a standard 
TMI can readily be used for a carrier initiated one. I don't see this as "wrong 
on so many levels" but rather as clever and resourceful.
 
On Mon, Jul 21, 2025 at 4:32 PM ATHGroup--- via Mifnet <[email protected] 
<mailto:[email protected]> > wrote:
Mark,
 
So, what you are saying is that ATC has a better command and control process 
for the movement of the airline’s $100s of Billions of aircraft assets than the 
airlines themselves.
 
This is so wrong on so many levels.
 
Michael
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
R. Michael Baiada
cell - (303) 521-6047
 <mailto:[email protected]> [email protected]
 
From: Mark HANSEN via Mifnet <[email protected] 
<mailto:[email protected]> > 
Sent: Monday, July 21, 2025 15:33
To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> 
Cc: Mark HANSEN <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >
Subject: [Mifnet đź›° 73206] Re: Huh?
 
This is actually an interesting corner of air traffic management. Airlines will 
sometimes ask FAA to implement ground stops or other ATM initiatives that the 
carriers could theoretically carry out themselves, because FAA has processes 
and systems in place to do this more easily.
 
On Mon, Jul 21, 2025 at 10:50 AM Mike Borfitz via Mifnet 
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > wrote:
Good question. Maybe "Advised" rather than "sought". No way is it necessary to 
get FAA approval. Air Traffic might appreciate it for their own planning. 
 
Borfitz 
 
Mike Borfitz, DER
 
Cell         206-714-8797
e-Mail:     [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> 
Kilroy Aviation LLC
Website:  <http://www.faaoda.com/> WWW.FAAODA.COM  
 
Kilroy is available for aviation regulatory and safety issues
- Type & Production Certification, Continued Operational Safety
- International validation & safety matters
- Program & system management
- FAA STC ODA
 
On Mon, Jul 21, 2025, 8:42 AM Tom Ronell via Mifnet <[email protected] 
<mailto:[email protected]> > wrote:

Alaska had to apply to FAA to not fly? Per below: 


"According to an FAA advisory, the airline sought approval to ground over 200 
planes under its brand. It later expanded the stoppage to include planes from 
its Horizon Air unit. Alaska Airlines said the decision stemmed from a computer 
network outage. While the ground stop was lifted about three hours later, 
around 11pm Pacific, Alaska said that “residual impacts” to its operations 
would be felt, adding, “It will take some time to get our overall operations 
back to normal.” As NBC News noted, the disruption comes almost exactly a year 
-- 
Professor Mark Hansen
Department of Civil and Environmental Engineering, UC Berkeley
Co-Director, National Center of Excellence for Aviation Operations Research
114 McLaughlin Hall
Berkeley CA 94720
Phone: 510-642-2880
Cell: 510-375-1745
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