Hi Dwight
Just to say that I use the recurrence property for a folder containing
todo lists every day, I hope there are no plans to remove that
feature, try it out, skip next (possibly receded by up to current)
occurrence is an approach to resetting todo lists within a folder. I
prefer storing my check lists in folders, seems neater to me :)
Laurence
On Wednesday, April 27, 2016 at 2:40:39 AM UTC+1, Dwight Arthur wrote:
Hi, Tolqua.
There are an unusually large number of issues in your latest post.
Let's deal with some smaller ones first.
1. __Support__. I rely on the MLO support email for issues like, I
found a bug, or I can't figure out how some feature should work. I
rely on the forums for help like, how can I get the most out of
some feature, how do I use MLO to manage some complex situation,
or is there a workaround for some bug that isn't fixed yet. This
is working pretty well for me.
2. _Recurring Folders._ Everything you said is correct. Folders
can do everything that tasks can do except for being completed.
This includes being a project, which is sometimes useful. It also
includes having recurrence options, which is unfortunately
meaningless for an object that cannot be completed (as you have
pointed out). My guess is that nobody before you has ever tried.
It would be a good idea for mlo to gray out the recurrence
options for folders. But this does not seem like a really urgent fix.
3. _Multiple inboxes_. It's very likely that at some point you
created a new profile on some device, used it for a while, and
then set up synch, and this caused your multiple inboxes. Cure:
pick one inbox and move all of your inbox content there. Delete
all empty inboxes. Sync. If you have multiple inboxes again,
repeat the procedure another time or two. Explanation: New
profiles are created without an inbox. There are numerous
functions within MLO that reference the inbox, if there is none
one is created. Now you have one. If you sync, the sync process
will add the inbox folder from the cloud copy to your profile. Now
you have two You are allowed to have multiple tasks on MLO with
the same description, so MLO does not recognize anything wrong
with having two inboxes. This should probably be fixed, but none
of us have pushed the issue very hard, probably because it only
affects users who are still trying to get their workflows set up,
after a while they get it cleaned up and don't care enough to
pursue getting a fix.
4. _Repeating tasks with repeating parents._ This is very unlikely
to produce the results that you wish for. Each task will be
regenerated when it is completed, and then will be regenerated
again when its parent is completed. If that is what you really
want you can do it but almost everyone wants their tasks to be
regenerated only once for each time it's completed.
OK, that brings us to the big issue: the requirements for the
checklist you want to build. Short answer: I don't know how to
meet all of these requirements in a single design. Maybe somebody
else does, in which case I will learn something. Otherwise, I
would venture to say it's probably not possible. This does not
happen very often. One possibility here is that you are asking for
something that is actually more complex than what you really need.
In that case, , maybe some of the people on this forum could help
you envision something that you would find useful although it's
not what you were requesting. Alternatively, maybe there is a
different tool that would be able to do all of this. I haven't
seen one, but maybe you would find one.
Recapping what I think are your requirements:
* Multiple checklists
* Each checklist has a header that describes it
* Each checklist follows a schedule for when it appears, like
daily 0900 or weekdays 1700
* Each checklist has multiple (zero, one or several) tasks under
its header
* When all of the tasks in a checklist are completed the
checklist header becomes inactive and does not appear until it
is next scheduled. The checklist header does not have to be
closed or completed, completion of the last task will close it.
* When a task in a checklist is completed it does not reappear
until some subsequent appearance of the checklist title
* A task may be present every time the checklist header appears
or in may have its own schedule. For example, a daily 0900
checklist could include a task which appears only on weekdays.
* A checklist can be opened with a single click at which time
all tasks that appear on this issue of the checklist will appear
* A checklist can have a reminder which will appear in the
notification area of a phone running MLO. From the reminder
area, it should take no more than one click to bring up the
checklist header and another click to open the checklist and
display its tasks.
As I said, I cannot envision a way to use MLO to satisfy these
requirements. If I were trying to make checklists of this sort, I
would devote a context to each checklist and create a saved view
showing each checklist. I would create tasks, each with its
appropriate recurrence and with a context associated with its
checklist.On my phone, I would create a home page within my
launcher with up to four MLO widgets, each showing one checklist.
On Windows, I would create a series of locked workspaces, each
showing one checklist. When I want to see a particular checklist
it should be only one tap to get there. I would doubt that I would
need a reminder for checklists that are tied to major events of
the day, like getting up or end of work. If I felt, for example,
that lunchtime might sneak up on me without my remembering to scan
my lunchtime checklist, I might set an alarm in my alarm app that
says "lunchtime checklist" to remind me, but without a link to the
checklist - no a big loss to me if the checklist is only a tap away.
-Dwight
On 4/26/2016 3:14 AM, Tolqua wrote:
Hi Dwight.
Not having a great deal of success here. I'm spending more time
writing these posts and sending questions to MLO support than I'm
saving using the program. This is to be expected at such an
early stage, but there are limits and if I'm not seeing any light
at the end of the tunnel I'll have to call it a day and try
something else (Todoist seems to have much better support, but I
just couldn't get started with the unhelpfully 'clean' UI). I've
made a specific request for some input on this here, but no luck
so far and I'm still waiting for a response to my last set of
questions. Looks like it's just one guy handling support and the
quality isn't great.
Here's a copy of the message which brings you up to speed with
where I am:
I’ve made a start and had some success using Folders for the
lists with the list items appearing as recurring Tasks (which
accommodates the differing recurrences of the items), but I’m
having some problems:
1.
I’ve set a daily recurrence pattern for the list Folders,
but since they’re folders, they don’t get completed so
how’s the recurrence supposed to work? I’ve set them so
they’ll regenerate when all Tasks are done but that
doesn’t seem to have created new folders – they’re still
showing yesterday’s date:
I have the reminder set to get triggered from the list rather
than the individual tasks (that’s the point of the checklist)
so if it doesn’t get regenerated I don’t get a reminder.
What’s the point of allowing recurrence options on a folder
if it can’t be completed and doesn’t get automatically
regenerated when all its tasks are complete?
1.
When I tap on the Folder’s reminder (on the phone) it
takes me to the folder, but I can’t see how to get to the
Tasks inside – This is the same whether it’s a Folder or
a Task.
2.
How do I Skip a recurring Task (it’s not required today
so I don’t want to mark it as done, but I do need to
check it off the list and regenerate the next instance)?
You can also see from the screen-shot that I have a couple of
empty erronrous duplicated <Inbox> folders. I have no idea how
these got created, but they only appeared after I'd done a Wi-Fi
sync. I've asked MLO support for some help, but they just said
to delete them. This I can do, but it isn't the first time I've
seen them so it probably won't be the last.
I'm a bit concerned now about the slowness of my progress and am
beginning to doubt that MLO's suitable for my needs. I don't
mind putting in the effort, but I'm seeing what looks like
upredictable (buggy?) behaviour, the support's not great and
you're the only one to have given any input here. Also, despite
looking awesomely powerful and configurable, MLO's a bit daunting
in its complexity. I've also had some unnecessary questions
regarding the rather limited Wi-Fi sync that could easily have
been avoided if the documentation were clearer, but pointing this
out didn't get a great response. For now I'm pushing ahead, but
life's too short to waste time going down roads that lead to more
work so I'm also taking another look around.
Thanks again for your time.
Tolqua.
On Thursday, 21 April 2016 14:37:50 UTC+1, Dwight Arthur wrote:
Hi, Tolqua, glad to meet you. This forum is a good place for
advice on issues like this. MLO is good at ad hoc task list
but so are dozens of other task managers, some of which are
probably better than MLO at the most basic stuff. Where MLO
really shines is when you spend the ime to figure out what
tasks you need to see when, and set up a system of contexts,
filters, etc that lets MLO manage that for you. You seem to
be totally headed in the right direction.
As you say, there are probably many ways to address what you
are trying to do. If I wanted to do this the first thing I
would try would involve dependencies on repeating trigger
tasks. I will explain. Disclaimer: I have not tried this. I
am not certain that I fully understand dependencies on
repeating trigger tasks. My usual practice is to test any
advice I'm unsure of, but I don't have time right now. So I'm
going to share untested advice, please come back and report
on what you do next (if you are lucky some other user will
show up with advice better than mine) and if you need it, I
may be able to help with debugging or further refinements
next week.
OK, so what I would do would be to create a recurring task
for each checklist (Morning Checklist, recurring daily at
7am, Going Home checklist recurring weekdays at 4:45pm, etc).
I would then set up each of the tasks that belongs in each
checklist, each with its own recurrence schedule (example,
pack lunch recurring weekly on MoTuThFr). Here is an
important gotcha: if there is a start time it *must* be
before the start time of the checklist header. Otherwise it
will be tomorrow's task. And I would feel safer if the task
start time was well in advance of the header's start time.
Make sure that any conditions for the task to go active
(open/closed contexts, dependencies, delayed dependencies,
tasks in order, uncompleted subtasks, etc) are all resolved
*before* the header task is activated. You can create a
reminder for each header task if you want it to appear on the
phone's notification bar: I think it should work as you want
but I am not sure because I don't use reminders often.
So, by 4:40 any weekday there will be a collection of tasks
that are all ready to go except for one thing: they are
dependent on the uncompleted "Going Home Checklist" task,
which is itself inactive pending its 4:45 start time. The
dependent tasks will consequently all be considered inactive
and will not appear on any list of active actions. at 4:45
the Going Home Checklist header task will reach its start
time and become active, appearing on your active actions
list. Presumably at about that time the reminder will go off.
Soon afterwards you will check the completion box on the
header task. Because it is a recurring task it will not
become completed; it will regenerate for the next weekday
afternoon. But during this regeneration process anything that
was dependent on the header task will see the dependency
satisfied and will become active, appearing in your active
actions list.
hth
-Dwight
On 4/20/2016 6:30 PM, Tolqua wrote:
I've just started using MLO, syncing between my Windows
desktop and Nexus 5 via Wi-Fi. I'm fine with using ad-hoc
tasks and organising them in Outline view, but I now want to
set up a system to deal with a particular type of recurring
tasks.
I have noticed that there are two or three times in my day
where a ‘checklist’ of items to be completed would be
extremely useful (e.g. Before going to work, Before going
home, etc.).The items on the list would all be recurrent
items, but with differing patterns (e.g. every working day,
every three days, alternate Wednesdays, etc.) so each day’s
lists will be different – or different enough that a repeat
cycle could be potentially very long.
The items on the lists would all be simple tasks without
sub-tasks (probably) that simply need to be checked off –
whether that’s achieved by marking a task complete or simply
by putting a check mark in a box is not important. What is
important is to have the lists appear on my To Do list or
Action List as just the checklist name (e.g. Morning
Checklist) with the items on the list hidden until the list
is opened.This is important so that the space on my daily
Action List isn’t filled with all the regular routine stuff
on the checklists. The checklist should probably have a
reminder.Since I’m in the habit of checking the status bar
at the top of my Nexus 5 whenever I pick it up, this tends
to be my immediate action list as it’s available to all
apps, not just MLO.The reminder, unless Snoozed or
Cancelled, should take me straight to the open checklist or
to the Action List with the checklist highlighted so that
one more tap would open up the checklist ready for me to go
through the things on the list.The list would need to stay
open or be available until I’d checked off all the items, at
which point the checklist would disappear from the Action
List until the next day (or be greyed-out or changed in some
way so it’s clear it’s complete).
I'm not sure whether the checklist itself would need a
recurrence pattern and how it would relate to the recurrence
patterns of the items, but in the unlikely event that none
of the checklist items was due to appear on the list, the
list should either appear empty or not appear at all.
It doesn't sound too complicated and I'm sure it's well
within the capabilities of MLO, but I need some guidance as
to the best way to set it up.Should I make each checklist a
Project with the items as Tasks or make each checklist as a
Task with the items as Sub-Tasks?How do I have the checklist
appear on the To Do List, but hide the items until the
checklist is opened?How can I have the checklist disappear
when all the items have been either checked off or ‘skipped’
(not done, but with the next occurrence in the pattern
generated)?
There may be many ways to achieve this and I’m sure I’ll
have a lot more questions once I start using it, but for now
I just need to get it up and running enough to be able to
start working with it on a daily basis so any
help/suggestions will be most welcome.
Tolqua.
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