Hi Alan Did you read this bit?
"If we can agree that we (all subscribers) collectively own this place, and are willing to reflect on this occasionally - that's more than enough for me. We can stay with furtherfield legacy infrastructure and near-zero moderation by Marc and me for now (if that suits everyone)." I was asking for responses to a proposal. I see your point about allowing people to go undeclared - I think it's a good one. On Sat, Jun 12, 2021 at 3:52 PM Alan Sondheim via NetBehaviour < netbehaviour@lists.netbehaviour.org> wrote: > Hi Ruth, > > I probably stand alone here. Occupy was many things, wasn't that well > organized, I was there several times. There was always a drum circle on the > outskirts that interrupted flow. There were outlying groups and meetings > that weren't on the main site. It was chaotic. It was bottom up. > > I don't like the suggestion below. First, I'm on a number of lists; on > most of them I don't post, but I learn. This is a tradition all the way > back. There are lists people have been silent on because they've > infiltrated right-wing or fascist organizations. There are people on lists > who don't want to be counted or accounted for, for many reasons. Your > suggestion seems like a forced enrollment: come forward, tell everyone who > you are, or you're gone. Another way to look at that: It's a privilege to > be on this list and you must actively participate or you're gone. Or it's > your duty as a member of this list to participate or you're gone. Or if > you're shy and just interested in reading or possibly backchanneling only, > you're gone. > > This literally has me in tears. For me, again, lists have had the > advantage of the commons. But this commons then has a different purpose, > and if you don't fit in, leave. Then it's not a commons, is it? Or are you > talking about a commons where people must announce their presence or be > gone? You say "This revolved around efforts to create open access" - but > does this mean that you _must_ access publicly and make your presence > known? > > Every list I'm on, by the way, is advertising-free; people might announce > they have a harmonica for sale (harmonica list) or a new book has come out > (wryting-l) or they're showing somewhere (Netbehaviour), but they're not > advertisement-based of course. People announce from within the list, not to > it. > > We have to "know who is in the woods"? In England, perhaps land and > parkland is managed differently than in the U.S. You have to sign in at > National Parks, but just once - in fact that's like a subscription - but > you don't need to announce who you are on any basis to everyone else. In > state parks, you just go in, Much as this country is horrific and lawless > and armed to the teeth, we feel comfortable going to parks (except for the > tics). > > I honestly don't feel comfortable on this list, and apologies for not > being more helpful. I'll continue posting daily, you'll do what you want to > do; the very performative discussion of unsubscribe is a signifier of > power. I am so tired of, so worn out, by promulgations of power. (Yes, I > know, power is everywhere, etc. But there are degrees and there are safe > spaces, at least for now.) > > Alan > > On Sat, Jun 12, 2021 at 10:06 AM Ruth Catlow via NetBehaviour < > netbehaviour@lists.netbehaviour.org> wrote: > >> Dear everyone, >> >> Thanks so much for helping me to work through some of my niggles with the >> list. I now have a much better sense of what its value is to some of us at >> the fireside and a few of the people from the woods. I've also been greatly >> enjoying the recent exchanges! >> >> I also found Adam's email beautiful. Especially personally resonant >> because I lived for a year in Penryn unaware of the history of the >> Ordinalia there. I find the format of passion plays - "acts" of faith >> "performed" by people in the places where they belong - enthralling.Thanks >> for that Adam! >> >> Annie's response was also really helpful for me. The revolutionary >> impulse of the early media art initiatives that interested me was tied up >> with infrastructural critique and a desire to create a new art context >> together. This revolved around efforts to create open access, and >> co-ownership of the media and platforms we needed for collaboration. >> Bringing together FLOSS and Art. There is still a lot of inspiring work in >> this area Constant https://constantvzw.org/ for example. >> >> While I "get" the Occupy vibe here, it doesn't feel so useful as an >> analogy for this list/community as it stands at the moment. Occupy's >> central commitment was to participatory democracy. The location of >> occupations were chosen for their symbolic significance to state-corporate >> capitalism, right? I guess we could think of this list as a prefigurative >> community resisting corporate platforms (I share everyone's love of this as >> an advertising-free space). But I detect less interest among this group in >> the question of how bottom-up decisions should be made to ensure fair >> distribution of power, and how that might in turn lead to the overthrow of >> capitalism. Occupy activists developed social technologies (some digital >> platforms, some gestures and techniques for use in large groups of people >> gathered physically) to make ALL the decisions together about all the >> things - from collective vision to organising waste-disposal. It's more >> emergent here. >> >> If we can agree that Commons are "shared cultural or material resources >> managed by communities for individual and collective benefit" then maybe >> this is what we have been working out here over the last couple of weeks >> and Netbehaviour is a kind of commons. If we can agree that we (all >> subscribers) collectively own this place, and are willing to reflect on >> this occasionally - that's more than enough for me. We can stay with >> furtherfield legacy infrastructure and near-zero moderation by Marc and me >> for now (if that suits everyone). >> >> Finally, I would be curious to hear your feelings about this proposal for >> list renewal. >> ======================= >> >> Over a 1 month period starting xxx >> We invite all subscribers to do one of 3 things >> >> 1. Make a post on any topic or responding to anyone else's post >> 2. Send an email with "Happy Lurker" in the subject header >> 3. Do nothing. >> >> At the end of this time, moderators could >> 1. gather a list of everyone who posted >> 2. unsubscribe everyone else. >> >> In this way we will know who we are, we will be able to see ourselves >> collectively and know who is in the woods. >> >> This is something we can do intermittently. >> ======================== >> If you all love, hate or have alternative suggestions to this idea I'd >> love to know. >> >> warmly >> Ruth >> >> -- >> Ruth Catlow >> she/her >> Co-founder & Artistic director of Furtherfield & DECAL Decentralised Arts >> Lab >> +44 (0) 77370 02879 >> >> *I will only agree to speak at events that are racially and gender >> balanced. >> >> **sending thanks >> <https://www.ovoenergy.com/ovo-newsroom/press-releases/2019/november/think-before-you-thank-if-every-brit-sent-one-less-thank-you-email-a-day-we-would-save-16433-tonnes-of-carbon-a-year-the-same-as-81152-flights-to-madrid.html> >> in >> advance >> >> *Furtherfield *disrupts and democratises art and technology through >> exhibitions, >> labs & debate, for deep exploration, open tools & free thinking. >> furtherfield.org <http://www.furtherfield.org/> >> >> *DECAL* Decentralised Arts Lab is an arts, blockchain & web 3.0 >> technologies research hub >> >> for fairer, more dynamic & connected cultural ecologies & economies now. >> >> decal.is <http://www.decal.is> >> >> Furtherfield is a Not-for-Profit Company Limited by Guarantee >> >> Registered in England and Wales under the Company No.7005205. >> >> Registered business address: Carbon Accountancy, 80-83 Long Lane, London, >> EC1A 9ET. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> NetBehaviour mailing list >> NetBehaviour@lists.netbehaviour.org >> https://lists.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour >> > > > -- > *=====================================================* > > *directory http://www.alansondheim.org <http://www.alansondheim.org> tel > 718-813-3285**email sondheim ut panix.com <http://panix.com>, sondheim ut > gmail.com <http://gmail.com>* > *=====================================================* > _______________________________________________ > NetBehaviour mailing list > NetBehaviour@lists.netbehaviour.org > https://lists.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour > -- Ruth Catlow she/her Co-founder & Artistic director of Furtherfield & DECAL Decentralised Arts Lab +44 (0) 77370 02879 *I will only agree to speak at events that are racially and gender balanced. **sending thanks <https://www.ovoenergy.com/ovo-newsroom/press-releases/2019/november/think-before-you-thank-if-every-brit-sent-one-less-thank-you-email-a-day-we-would-save-16433-tonnes-of-carbon-a-year-the-same-as-81152-flights-to-madrid.html> in advance *Furtherfield *disrupts and democratises art and technology through exhibitions, labs & debate, for deep exploration, open tools & free thinking. furtherfield.org <http://www.furtherfield.org/> *DECAL* Decentralised Arts Lab is an arts, blockchain & web 3.0 technologies research hub for fairer, more dynamic & connected cultural ecologies & economies now. decal.is <http://www.decal.is> Furtherfield is a Not-for-Profit Company Limited by Guarantee Registered in England and Wales under the Company No.7005205. Registered business address: Carbon Accountancy, 80-83 Long Lane, London, EC1A 9ET.
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