"Thomas A. Schmitz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > On Jun 14, 2008, at 1:07 PM, Oliver Buerschaper wrote: > >> Actually, I strongly disagree with the opinion that the only way to >> properly interact with TeX is via the command line. >> >> Counter example: in Mac application development your IDE of choice >> will almost certainly be Xcode. Although it delegates the entire >> compilation process to gcc you *never* ever see the command line. And >> there's no need to. All errors and warnings output by gcc are >> intercepted and passed on to you via the graphical IDE and you won't >> lose a tiny bit of information. In fact you gain a lot when trying to >> track down a problem ... >> >> Furthermore, in my humble opinion interaction with TeX should >> concentrate on programming the actual typesetting language and not on >> fumbling around with dozens of configuration files ... for instance, >> if you develop applications you wouldn't want to reconfigure your >> compiler twice a week either but rather focus on the source code *you* >> write. >> >> Oliver > > Who said that "the only way to properly interact with TeX is via the > command line"? What I said is: you can provide all the GUI tools you > want, at some point (and this will be rather sooner than later) > problems will crop up, and these problems will be impossible to > resolve if you don't want to use the command line, don't want to learn > about PATH settings, don't want to learn about where configuration > files go and what they do. This may be different in, say 10 years, but > it would be misleading to pretend that it is different today. TeXLive > 2008 is just being tested, and in this regard, it's no better than its > predecessors. Unless and until we have systems which will be easier to > maintain, users who expect to be able to stay away from the CLI are > bound to be disappointed. > > Your example about Apple's Xcode actually proves my point: I said that > if you can afford to throw a couple of million $ and a dozen > programmers at this, it is actually feasible (but will still take > time). Apple has done just that; the Xcode IDE hasn't been built by > volunteers in their spare time, now has it? So far, nobody has done > anything similar for TeX, and I had the impression that the volunteer > programmers who are actively contributing to it seem more interested > in adding new features and improving the code than in adding a > colorful pointy-clicky interface. But of course my impression could be > wrong and someone is already building such a GUI as we speak... > > As for "fumbling around with dozens of configuration files": such > exaggerations are not very helpful in this discussion.
Let me add that I have no aversion at all to using command line tools. The basis for my own comments in this thread do not lie in a preference for graphical tools, but rather for a straightforward way to stay up-to-date with the whole of ConTeXt in a way that ctxtools does not currently provide. A command-line interface for that would be great, and so would a graphical tool. I'm of course familiar with the minimals, but what's unpleasant about that approach to staying current with ConTeXt is that one has to put aside other installations. What I mean, more specifically, is that TeXlive is ignored. As far as I can see, I can't both use latex and the minimal ConTeXt in the same shell, because if I want to use the latter I can't use the former. For me an optimal solution would be a tool like, say, ctxtools --updatecontext, that combines downloading the latest binaries, fonts, and TeX code into one package, and overwrites the old contents in my TeXlive tree. A command-line tool to do that would certainly be appreciated. The discussion of environment variables leads me to wonder: is there a definitive discussion of these? I'm familiar with the TeXlive documentation, but what more should users know to gain a mastery of these variables in connection with ConTeXt? Jesse -- Jesse Alama ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________
