As per Samuel Agesilas's comments.... That is exactly why I think AIR is going to take off. It brings us some of the benefits of both online and offline in a very easy to use technology. Sure its not a perfect solution _yet_, but it is still very new and we can expect it to develop very quickly into something very usable.
On Fri, Feb 15, 2008 at 7:20 PM, Samuel Agesilas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Well mate, > > The desktop is FAR from dead. Most of the apps I use on my Mac are > desktop apps. Both for professional and recreational. There is a huge > market for software that cannot be made into a web app. Imagine if > Ableton was a live application, how many night clubs you know are > equipped > with broadband wifi. In my case I could have never written Saffron > into a web app and still maintain the level of quality and user > experience I wanted. > > The fact is that nothing beats instant on! And desktop applications > give you that. No sever waits or downloads or caching issues > or none of that. I think the trend is going to be towards more rich > client desktop app's that can connect the web but do not depend > implicitly on an internet > connection. > > Cheers, > Sam > > On Feb 15, 2008, at 4:39 AM, Cedric Muller wrote: > > > Failing examples: > > > > -....Bring merchants to the desktop, and start to sell on the desktop > > (IS THAT A JOKE ???) > > > > - then, there is AOL.... "With our Adobe AIR application, we can > > reach communities of users with compelling, free content available > > from AOL" (They now acknowledge they cannot reach communities of > > users online ;) > > > > - EBAY: The result: people can experience the world's largest online > > marketplace and engage with eBay services using a compact, intuitive > > desktop application. > > Wow really ? So what about revamping the website instead of > > developping a new interface ? In what sense does AIR feel right ? > > > > - The NASDAQ example: Quotes are everywhere, on your mobile on your > > tv on your paper on your face, but from now on, INVESTORS (gasp!) can > > follow quotes on their desktop (and this has been done thousand > > times, and this hasn't helped any investor :) ) > > > > Really really sorry, I am just a flash programmer, sites and > > applications, but I cannot feel the marketing crap here. > > > > I wonder if anyone at Adobe realized how old skool is the desktop, > > and how fast everything will move in the next 5 years ?? > > > > Cedric (ok ok, I am anti-air, but still pro flash platform) > > > > ps: the AIR symbol is fun (I see 'empty space') > > > >> I am quite intrigued by the hype and trendy comments AIR is receiving > >> (build with Flash, build with Flex, build with AJAX, build with > >> Legos, build with your cat, do a Tour, do some Zigs, and other > >> Zags) .,... I can count on the fingers of my hand the Good and > >> Functionnal AIR apps that are around ... and all the people > >> applausing just because the others are > >> Zinc is just a hell to make it work, but then it just works and IS > >> functionnal. They don't fancy around and such. > >> > >> Now Adobe asking for feedback and such ... :) > >> > >> The idea to find Hacks to a 1.0 version is soooo cheap... makes me > >> wonder what were those people thinking ? (They must have thought > >> something like: bring the browser to the desktop, but Nah! The > >> browser overtakes the desktop, so why would be have light apps > >> running on our desktop ? no sense at all) > >> > >> Really ? I am fed up of 'happy and glowing professionals' being over > >> optimistic on some overall not interesting initiative (actually: we > >> are all playing the idiots because we don't have any clue, we just > >> want to do technology and earn money, so we follow, so we > >> follow, ...). Do your homework, do some yoga (I need such right > >> now :P ) and bring better things than just doing over hyped > >> nonsense.... > >> > >> AIR ist Rad! > >> > >> Cedric > >> > >>> I totally agree. Without the ability to launch external apps AIR > >>> will have a hard time becoming more than a novelty. > >>> > >>> By the way, you can also use SQLLite with MDM. > >>> http://www.thecodezone.com/downloads/sqlite.php > >>> > >>> ------------------------------- > >>> Iman Khabazian > >>> Managing Director, iMAN IT > >>> 949.231.8042 > >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> www.imanit.com > >>> www.scuge.com > >>> www.imanit.com/blog > >>> > >>> On Feb 13, 2008 2:45 PM, Keith Peters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>> Even as a hack, it is not pure AIR. It requires installing and > >>> running another application on your machine. The Artemis project > >>> does something similar. I totally agree with what Sam that this > >>> was a really poor decision. I think most of us would have gladly > >>> left the SQLLite stuff behind in favor of this. > >>> > >>> > >>> Keith Peters > >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On Feb 13, 2008, at 5:38 PM, Iman Khabazian wrote: > >>> > >>>> has anyone tried the hack? > >>>> http://www.mikechambers.com/blog/2008/01/17/commandproxy-net-air- > >>>> integration-proof-of-concept/ > >>>> > >>>> -Iman > >>>> ------------------------------- > >>>> Iman Khabazian > >>>> Managing Director, iMAN IT > >>>> 949.231.8042 > >>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>>> www.imanit.com > >>>> www.scuge.com > >>>> www.imanit.com/blog > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> On Feb 13, 2008 2:31 PM, Samuel Agesilas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>>> wrote: > >>>> Yea it is a major, fudge up by Adobe. Essentially with AIR Adobe > >>>> build the Ferrari of desktop app development, but decided to slash > >>>> all the tires and put sugar in the gas tank when they decided to > >>>> seriously hamper AIR by not allowing calls apps to launch. Talk > >>>> about a dumb and stupid decision. and I don't believe Adobe knows > >>>> how crucial of a feature that is! For example, I had a client come > >>>> to us to develop a UI for an audio processing software project. > >>>> For the UI we looked at JavaFX ( which is not quite ready ), Java, > >>>> QT and Adobe AIR. AIR hit all of the points and the client was > >>>> ready to roll with AIR except for that crucial fact of not being > >>>> able to launch external apps. That was the deal breaker and the > >>>> client walked away from AIR development and decided to go with QT. > >>>> It's a shame to because that particular project was perfect for > >>>> Flash + AIR. If anyone at Adobe is reading this, PLEASE stop > >>>> handicapping your products and start trusting your developer > >>>> community. > >>>> > >>>> my two cents. > >>>> -sam > >>>> > >>>> On Feb 8, 2008, at 6:18 AM, slangeberg wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> Yeah, you're right. Not being able to make system calls / launch > >>>>> apps IS a major shortcoming of AIR, at this point. > >>>>> > >>>>> Here's an official Adobe statement, as of June: > >>>>> > >>>>> src: http://www.adobe.com/cfusion/webforums/forum/messageview.cfm? > >>>>> catid=641&threadid=1298770&STARTPAGE=2&FTVAR_FORUMVIEWTMP=Linear > >>>>> > >>>>> Thank you everyone who has contributed to this thread. My name is > >>>>> Rob Christensen and I'm a product manager on Adobe AIR. I'd like > >>>>> to provide some clarity on this topic, but also invite you to > >>>>> share additional thoughts. > >>>>> > >>>>> The primary reason that AIR 1.0 does not include support for > >>>>> launching native applications originates from a founding design > >>>>> decision/philosophy. Applications that do not depend on other > >>>>> applications to be installed result in a better user experience. > >>>>> Our goal with AIR has been to deliver a runtime that delivers > >>>>> applications consistently across operating systems. Please note > >>>>> that this doesn't mean we're right nor that we might not change > >>>>> our minds on this. > >>>>> > >>>>> We'd like to hear what you think on this topic. It's helpful if > >>>>> you can let us know what you're trying to build. The more > >>>>> specific you can be, the more helpful it is to our team. Please > >>>>> reply to this thread or send us a note through our feedback form. > >>>>> This form will send a message directly to our development and > >>>>> product management team. > >>>>> > >>>>> Feedback for (Adobe AIR) > >>>>> http://www.adobe.com/go/wish/ > >>>>> > >>>>> As with any design decision, there's plenty of opportunity to > >>>>> debate the topic and this is something we continue to discuss > >>>>> even internally. The major disadvantage is that it's much more > >>>>> difficult to take advantage of existing code libraries or launch > >>>>> other native applications. > >>>>> > >>>>> At the same time, one advantage to the current design is that > >>>>> when you distribute an application, you do not need to say, "This > >>>>> is a really great application, but make sure you have Microsoft > >>>>> Windows (or OSX) installed as well as Microsoft Word (or > >>>>> Photoshop or some other native product) to really take advantage > >>>>> of this application." > >>>>> > >>>>> Again, we may revisit this decision in the future and as with any > >>>>> 1.0, you almost always come to reconsider your initial design > >>>>> goals. There are some interesting options here such as the one > >>>>> discussed earlier of launching the default application for a > >>>>> specific file type. > >>>>> > >>>>> Stuartc11: It is possible to launch a web browser by the way and > >>>>> some of the sample applications have code that that demonstrate > >>>>> how to do this. > >>>>> > >>>>> Thanks, > >>>>> > >>>>> - Rob > >>>>> Product Manager, Adobe AIR > >>>>> > >>>>> -Scott > >>>>> > >>>>> PS: Zinc blows holes in the ozone. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> On Feb 8, 2008 5:41 AM, Cedric Muller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>>>> Actually, I was able to launch VLC with Zinc (not Zinc specific, > >>>>> but > >>>>> it does manage activex) and pass the HD streams to VLC > >>>>> now, I am looking at a splitted screen with 4 HD streams, all > >>>>> totally > >>>>> fluid. > >>>>> Ok ok, I have a tough graphic card, but my tests so far indicate > >>>>> that > >>>>> there is plenty of margin. > >>>>> Moreover, with VLC I can load in almost any video type (even > >>>>> FLVs)... > >>>>> though i am doing an internal check, and if video is FLV I > >>>>> stream it > >>>>> with Flash... > >>>>> The app I am building is quite technical, and clients' constraints > >>>>> are very high (regarding HD (and full hd) Streaming). To be > >>>>> honest, > >>>>> it isn't a desktop application, more like a 'computer app' > >>>>> > >>>>> Cedric > >>>>> > >>>>>> Not to be obtuse, but can you stream HD video with Zinc? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Does streaming HD video establish the validity of a desktop app? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Anyhow, you can stream video with Flash Media Server to the flash > >>>>>> player (AIR). Probably Red5 too. Right? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> On Feb 8, 2008 2:02 AM, Cedric Muller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>>>>> yes works well, but quite not a true desktop app: how would you > >>>>>> stream Full HD video with AIR ? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> yeah, and just to be the rah rah boy - AIR rocks. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> fine, shoot me, but it *works* well > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Feb 7, 2008 7:33 PM, Arnoud Bos <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>>>>>> Try screenweaver haxe (swhx) if you are not afraid of > >>>>> command line > >>>>>>> tools. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Works great! > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> And it's opensource (this is an open source list, right?) > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Arnoud > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Van: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:osflash- > >>>>>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] Namens bean tickler > >>>>>>> Verzonden: donderdag 7 februari 2008 23:25 > >>>>>>> Aan: [email protected] > >>>>>>> Onderwerp: [osflash] MDM Zinc v3 rant > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Sad sad sad. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Too long have I and almost everyone I know suffered with this > >>>>> poor > >>>>>>> product and its predecessors. 2.5 buggy buggy buggy. V3 beta, > >>>>> buggy > >>>>>>> but fine, BETA. V3 RELEASE, same as BETA, not one bug fixed from > >>>>>>> what I can tell and they have ditched tons of the functionality > >>>>>>> they had in 2.5!!! > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Why oh why do we bother??? Well, at one point they were the > >>>>> best of > >>>>>>> a bad bunch with shed loads of commands and slick marketing. > >>>>>>> However, I feel the competitors have overtaken them. Just > >>>>> look at > >>>>>>> the likes of Janus (a new but reliable tool) and SWF studio. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> For me I would have loved to have stayed with SWF Studio but > >>>>> they > >>>>>>> had no handheld or Mac output. Janus is my new favorite as it > >>>>> has > >>>>>>> yet to cause me an embarrassing client crash and has Mac and > >>>>> Linux > >>>>>>> output coming up). But wow, I feel soo dumb for ever buying > >>>>> Zinc!! > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Every negative post on their "community" forum gets deleted, > >>>>> they > >>>>>>> are now even checking posts _before_ they go live. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Sorry for the rant. But guessing this post wont be deleted!!! > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>>>> osflash mailing list > >>>>>>> [email protected] > >>>>>>> http://osflash.org/mailman/listinfo/osflash_osflash.org > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>> [ JPG ] > >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>>>> osflash mailing list > >>>>>>> [email protected] > >>>>>>> http://osflash.org/mailman/listinfo/osflash_osflash.org > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>>> osflash mailing list > >>>>>> [email protected] > >>>>>> http://osflash.org/mailman/listinfo/osflash_osflash.org > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> -- > >>>>>> : : ) Scott > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Helping your grandma on the interweb > >>>>>> at: http://blog.criticalpile.com > >>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>>> osflash mailing list > >>>>>> [email protected] > >>>>>> http://osflash.org/mailman/listinfo/osflash_osflash.org > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> osflash mailing list > >>>>> [email protected] > >>>>> http://osflash.org/mailman/listinfo/osflash_osflash.org > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> -- > >>>>> : : ) Scott > >>>>> > >>>>> Helping your grandma on the interweb > >>>>> at: http://blog.criticalpile.com > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> osflash mailing list > >>>>> [email protected] > >>>>> http://osflash.org/mailman/listinfo/osflash_osflash.org > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> osflash mailing list > >>>> [email protected] > >>>> http://osflash.org/mailman/listinfo/osflash_osflash.org > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> osflash mailing list > >>>> [email protected] > >>>> http://osflash.org/mailman/listinfo/osflash_osflash.org > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> osflash mailing list > >>> [email protected] > >>> http://osflash.org/mailman/listinfo/osflash_osflash.org > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> osflash mailing list > >>> [email protected] > >>> http://osflash.org/mailman/listinfo/osflash_osflash.org > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> osflash mailing list > >> [email protected] > >> http://osflash.org/mailman/listinfo/osflash_osflash.org > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > osflash mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://osflash.org/mailman/listinfo/osflash_osflash.org > > > _______________________________________________ > osflash mailing list > [email protected] > http://osflash.org/mailman/listinfo/osflash_osflash.org >
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