I think they are responding to the BYOD movement as well. The days of IT staff defining an SOE and forcing everyone to use it are gone, or at least disappearing fast. It's really common to have top-down decisions on this stuff now ie: CEOs coming in with their tablets and saying "make it work here".
I've just spent quite a bit of time moving around dozens of software houses, and I can tell you that almost everyone has an HTML5/CSS3/JS story. They see it as a design choice that isn't going to disappear again tomorrow, even though building apps there is still so much harder than what it should be. It's seen as a hard but safe bet. Most are using additional frameworks like KendoUI. This sort of change isn't new though. What does concern me is the loss of productivity we've had over the years. We didn't move to web apps in the first place because users were screaming out for slow delivery times, a lousy user interface and session state that's likely to throw away their work without warning. As an example, OWA is a pretty good web app but it's not a patch on Outlook. The initial move to web apps was all about IT departments not wanting to deal with deployment issues, because they were just too hard sometimes. I see this as just the next part of this trend. I look at productivity though and it could make you cry. I've just spent a couple of weeks coding in an MVC4 project, and while I like it and can see the appeal of it, I can't help but thinking I could have created the same business functionality in a winforms app in less than a day. At least it runs all over the place (sort of). Regards, Greg Dr Greg Low 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile│ +61 3 8676 4913 fax SQL Down Under | Web: <http://www.sqldownunder.com/> www.sqldownunder.com From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of Corneliu I. Tusnea Sent: Friday, 12 April 2013 3:04 PM To: ozDotNet Subject: Re: [OT] Surface RT or Surface Pro? Yes, but by the time .Net developers started to use WebServices everyone else moved on to REST as they figured out WS were bloody hard to use, incompatible between platforms, heavyweight, hard to upgrade and generally a pain in the *** to develop against :) Now everyone is talking lightweight REST + JSON and we just managed finally to get that in the WebApi ... On Fri, Apr 12, 2013 at 2:53 PM, Tom Rutter <therut...@gmail.com <mailto:therut...@gmail.com> > wrote: Wasn't the original intent for .net to be for creating web services? On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 3:47 AM, Katherine Moss <katherine.m...@gordon.edu <mailto:katherine.m...@gordon.edu> > wrote: Then why are the majority rather than the minority of windows 8 modern apps (I hate that term when talking about computers and servers, belongs on a mobile phone), nearly all written in pure HTML5 and JS? Where's the C# or VB in them? And touting HTML5 and JS more than the .net framework sounds more like a kill-off rather than an enhancement. From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com <mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com <mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> ] On Behalf Of Arjang Assadi Sent: Wednesday, April 10, 2013 6:12 AM To: ozDotNet Subject: Re: [OT] Surface RT or Surface Pro? Not taken over but augmented with, .net still reigns supreme, js and html allow one to rich the poorest of places in terms of OS and framework. Knowing knockout, backbone etc. is a must for any .net programmer. On 10 April 2013 19:15, Bec Carter <bec.usern...@gmail.com <mailto:bec.usern...@gmail.com> > wrote: .net taken over by html and js? Haha looks like the pendulum is swinging back again.... On Wed, Apr 10, 2013 at 4:57 AM, Katherine Moss <katherine.m...@gordon.edu <mailto:katherine.m...@gordon.edu> > wrote: I disagree, still. WPF was expanded for instance, from versions 4.0 to 4.5 of the .net framework significantly from what I can tell from MSDN. And besides, since Windows 8 modern apps are so limited in their feature set compared to what we know currently today, I sort of consider Microsoft a little crazy for thinking that everyone's going to accept less than what they have now. And that's what scares me about the "Gemini" update for Office coming in the future since in order to metro-ize Office completely, according to sources of Mary Joe Fowley on All About Microsoft over at ZDNet, she says that what people are telling her is that the update will be a subset of the current feature set. And that's what gets me; what about enthusiasts who need more than just a Fisher Price version? What if we want all of the cool features? What is Microsoft telling us to do, never move on because they are interested in depleting stuff? And then in terms of .net being taken over by HTML and JavaScript? How much more 1990's can you get? Come on, jees. I'll never accept a version of Windows or it's successors without .net installed and living in some form. From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com <mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com <mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> ] On Behalf Of Scott Barnes Sent: Monday, April 08, 2013 11:27 PM To: ozDotNet Subject: Re: [OT] Surface RT or Surface Pro? Its legacy simply because no investment will be put into it. Windows XP is legacy even though I still see people inside a Fortune 500 company right now using at as a desktop OS. Silverlight/WPF concepts and IP were consolidated and rehydrated into the Windows 8 XAML "runtime" so in a way Legacy would also imply that the vNext is the "new" and the older version are the old (just like Silverlight 2 is legacy vs Silverlight 4). The problem is Microsoft didn't understand what the notion of a "messaging framework" is in terms of Marketing and so they left that part out creating this whole conversation right now around Legacy true/false. Its also legacy because of the uncertainty in a lot of enterprise/companies around the "AS-IS" futures they've in turn suspended investment or looking to shift to a HTML5 deployment model or are open to new ideas around next bets. That's not to say a new project isnt created every 5secs in WPF/SL today... it's just not advertised and creates this whole "is it alive or isnt it" question. --- Regards, Scott Barnes http://www.riagenic.com On Tue, Apr 9, 2013 at 2:55 AM, Katherine Moss <katherine.m...@gordon.edu <mailto:katherine.m...@gordon.edu> > wrote: I don't know why people keep calling stuff like WPF and Win32/64 applications "old and legacy". I still see people using WPF all the time, so obviously it's still got some spirit in it. From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com <mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com <mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> ] On Behalf Of Arjang Assadi Sent: Monday, April 08, 2013 2:14 AM To: ozDotNet Subject: Re: [OT] Surface RT or Surface Pro? RT totally rocks, since I got it haven't put it down, it is just pure awesome. It is light, app switching and screen splitting are so easy. Since I got one I cant remember a day I didn't have it in my hand, most of times without the cover. I would like a Pro for alternative set of reasons, but RT will still be lighter. Regards Arjang On 2 April 2013 10:49, James Chapman-Smith <ja...@chapman-smith.com <mailto:ja...@chapman-smith.com> > wrote: Hi Folks, I'm thinking about getting myself either a Surface RT or a Surface Pro (or maybe some other alternative). Every time I think about it I convince myself that one is better than the other but then the next time I flip. What are everyone's thoughts? Should I get a Surface RT or a Surface Pro? Should I get a surface at all? How much memory should I get? I thank you for your well thought out ideas in advance. Cheers. James.
