You're welcome. I'm frequently amused by the scientists and secular humanists who describe what they think they see using a code they call mathematics. Of course since that code is based on what they have observed it fits this little circular universe perfectly. This of course proves to the weak minded that what they observe is indeed real. Doubt is the precursor to real knowledge. Arrogance is self defeating. On Oct 27, 2006, at 3:34 AM, mike wilson wrote:
> >> >> From: Paul Stenquist <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> Date: 2006/10/26 Thu PM 10:51:43 GMT >> To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List <pdml@pdml.net> >> Subject: Re: OT: Snowflake >> >> Well said. Absolutes are always ill-conceived. >> Paul > > Thank you. I needed that smile this morning. > >> On Oct 26, 2006, at 5:09 PM, Gonz wrote: >> >>> Faith and knowledge are not orthogonal to each other, which is what >>> the >>> original statement implied. >>> >>> I may know how the snowflake was created in physical terms, but may >>> also >>> have faith in a Creator who enabled the physical laws to create >>> such beauty. >>> >>> You can never prove that an arrowhead was created by a human, >>> unless you >>> were there to witness it or there is a chain of trust to someone who >>> witnessed it (this also requires faith). Of course we believe that >>> it >>> is the case, because its unlikely to have taken on that shape on its >>> own. However improbable, its still possible that the stone just >>> looked >>> like that. >>> >>> Life looks quite improbable according to the laws of entropy, but its >>> here. We could choose to believe that a Creator had something to do >>> with it, or we could also choose to believe that self replicating >>> molecular structures just appeared from the random chaos of the >>> primordial soup. Both require some form of faith. >>> >>> IMO there is no such thing as pure knowledge. After all what do we >>> really "know"? So we're all ignorant. >>> >>> rg >>> >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >>>> By ignorance I mean absence of knowledge, not stupidity. >>>> >>>> We know (rather than simply believe) that a human created the arrow >>>> head not only because it looks man-made, but because it looks man- >>>> made >>>> _and_ we have multiple compelling lines of independently verifiable >>>> and mutually verifying evidence to support the conclusion, not least >>>> of which is that we've seen it done by many people. >>>> >>>> It's a logical fallacy to conclude that just because something looks >>>> as though it was designed by an intelligence, that in fact it was. >>>> You >>>> need more & better evidence. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Cheers, >>>> Bob >>>> >>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On >>>>> Behalf Of Tom C >>>>> Sent: 26 October 2006 20:41 >>>>> To: pdml@pdml.net >>>>> Subject: RE: OT: Snowflake >>>>> >>>>> No - I see it has attributes that indicate it has a maker or >>>>> designer. A >>>>> roughly symmetrical chipped piece of flint lying on the >>>>> ground is believed >>>>> to be an arrowhead. We don't see the aboriginal that crafted >>>>> the arrowhead >>>>> yet we believe the event occurred. We don't see the designer of >>>>> our >>>> >>>> >>>>> physical universe, far more complex, and since we can't see >>>>> one, we believe >>>>> one does not exist. >>>>> >>>>> That doesn't manifest ignorance? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Tom C. >>>>> >>>>>> That is astonishing. I'm an atheist but it's difficult to look at >>>>> that >>>>>> photo and not perceive a creator. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Ah, the Argument from Personal Ignorance - "I don't know how that >>>> >>>> came >>>> >>>>> to be, therefore God made it". >>>>> >>>>> Bob >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>>>> PDML@pdml.net >>>>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>> PDML@pdml.net >>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >> >> >> -- >> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> PDML@pdml.net >> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >> > > > ----------------------------------------- > Email sent from www.ntlworld.com > Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software > Visit www.ntlworld.com/security for more information > > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
