Thanks alain.
Here is my metaphor: I help myself and share my "soup of stones" with
people that want to improve our soup of stones.
At the end our soup may be great.
Another way to present my metaphor is: "focus on what you need and
change the system (and send us fixes/enhancements) on what you need.
Because if you do not do it, then why a guy not needing it would need to
spend time."
ah to grow the market.... well Spur, 64 bits, better FFI, decent events,
automated build for VM and many many other things are already in the
pipeline and
(none of them is about research :) you can trust me on that
Stef
On 3/10/14 21:24, Alain Rastoul wrote:
Le 03/10/2014 13:44, Esteban Lorenzano a écrit :
Hi,
I’m writing this because I’m sad about what is happening in this list.
I’m seeing a lot of general negativity and non constructive ways to
discuss things.
I’m also seeing more and more people using Pharo for their particular
interests (which is of course a good thing) but less and less people
who contribute back to Pharo.
Finally, I’m seeing more frequently an attitude of “customer”, more
than the conviction than this, Pharo, is also yours…
Please people, we (the pharo “core” team) cannot do everything. We do
not have the manpower or the resources to hire manpower. We would
like, but we just do not have the resources (is already a blessing
that we can work on this, for now: INRIA is paying, but what it pays
is *research*, not “pharo the language”, so this is a collateral
advantage….)
So, having an OPEN SOURCE project, with limited resources means that
there is a lot of things that depend on the community.
It depends on the community not just to fix, but to enlarge the
ecosystem in general too.
So, I refuse to believe that we cannot be a cool and helpful community.
I refuse to believe that general negativity and bad humor can
overcome the joy of participating in this collective effort.
So, here some recommendations for enhance the way we participate:
- Be positive. Just “this is a s**t” does not help. Even if it is.
- Be propositional. Just “this is a s**t”, and not telling what you
want/prefer does not help.
- Be proactive. Just “this is a s**t”, and not report, discuss and
(at least time to time) provide a fix/enhancement does not help.
In conclusion: not helping does not help :)
After all, this is the “pharo-dev” list. I mean, the list of people
wanting to participate from this great, community effort.
cheers,
Esteban, still grateful of belonging to this community
Hi Esteban,
Sorry for the long response, but I (like others) feel concerned about
your post.
I don't see any "negativity" in this forum, I don't understand why you
are saying that, but
I understand your point of view about people not contributing, being
one of them.
I think you are too pessimistic (please, drink 2, 3 beers with
friends, one for me please - ... cheers :) -
talk or forget about what is boring you and then get back with strength).
Things are moving slowly, but they are moving in the good direction and
thanks to the *dictatorship* leading of Pharo here ;-) , and thanks to
people leading
projects with Pharo.
I think you have to consider that lot of people (may be I'm wrong, and
it is just me ?)
are here because they like and share the pharo vision of software
developmnent,
but have to work for a company just to make a living.
My company is very focused on productivity and immediate gain.
Efficiency against efficacity like our boss "explained" to us...
it has some good counterparts like paying my living and my harley :) ,
and bad ones, like
me not liking most of the job I have to do daily, and not agreeing
with the "vision" of the company
I live with that for now, I ride my bike very often :).
Their opinions may looks negative but they are not.
To me, people of the rmod team are lucky guys, they work on a sexy
technology.
May be they feel alone but they are not, may be this technology will
fail in next 10 years (I don't think so)
but, well, that's life, there will be a reason. Experience is good.
I'm still trying to make some smalltalk evangelism (is it
goodenglish?) around me at work,
and slowly getting people into considering smalltalk (and pharo) as a
serious technology
(for squeak it was just impossible, sorry), but have not so much time
to contribute seriously
(and as Pharo moves quite quickly, it requires quite some time
just to keeps up to date to last versions).
I saw some posts about Glorp, databases and orm (some of my current
working skills) and
consider getting into this just to help, but on the other hand
I have some other personal projects I would like to complete with Pharo.
I may look selfish, but that's another point here: Pharo has to have
more project going on to succeed.
"Pharo's "success stories" is IMHO ***very*** important -
and marketing is *****very***** important
beeing a developper, I feel a bit sad saying that but that's the
f***g reality.
Interesting coincidence, I had a discussion today with a collegue about
bad succeeding and good falling technologies (like javascript and
smaltalk in our talks)...
Just to say keep on the good stuff please.
And I stop here.
Regards ,
Alain
