Thanks Frank, It could not have been formulated better.
Von: Frank Schmitz [mailto:fs_2...@yahoo.de] Gesendet: Dienstag, 25. Juli 2017 14:47 An: Piler User Betreff: Re: GOBD certification Hi Janos, a GoBD certification would surely result in a higher "visibility" for piler, since quite a lot of companies are basing their business decisions on those. But please do NOT believe that Piler needs a GoBD certification to be used in germany! The ministry of finance in germany does not care whether the software is certified, it cares about 1. whether the software fulfills the legal requirements (i.e. to use piler for GoBD in germany you need to use timestamping) 2. how the company USES the software (You need a procedural documentation) In case of an audit, both will be checked and the auditor won't care whether piler is certified or not... To prove the point: https://www.bundesfinanzministerium.de/Content/DE/Downloads/BMF_Schreiben/Weitere_Steuerthemen/Abgabenordnung/Datenzugriff_GDPdU/2014-11-14-GoBD.pdf?__blob=publicationFile This is an official statement from the ministry of finance in germany, under heading 12 / 181 (last page) it reads: „Zertifikate“ oder „Testate“ Dritter können bei der Auswahl eines Softwareproduktes dem Unternehmen als Entscheidungskriterium dienen, entfalten jedoch aus den in Rz. 179 genannten Gründen gegenüber der Finanzbehörde keine Bindungswirkung. Roughly translated: Certificates or testimonies of third parties may be used by companies to choose a software, but they DO NOT have a binding effect for the ministry of finance because of the reasons named in Rz. 179. In short, those certificates for GoBD compliance aren't worth the paper they're written on if an auditor is knocking on your door... You must be able to show that piler is able to fulfill all GoBD Requirements. For a (german) "checklist" you can look those up here 15 Kriterien für GoBD-konforme Software | Scopevisio Ratgeber <https://www.scopevisio.com/ratgeber/buchhaltungssoftware/15-kriterien-fuer-gobd-konforme-software/> or here Neue GoBD: Ein umfassender Überblick <https://www.verband-e-rechnung.org/de/e-rechnung/wissen/fachartikel/414-gobd-zusammenfassung> . I'm no expert by any means, but as far as I understand it, piler is quite capable of doing all that IF you use timestamping so you can prove the emails haven't been changed since they were timestamped/received... Apart from the technical requirements, you will also need an "extensive" documentation about what exactly you are doing with your receipts/invoices/etc. You can even find a sample documentation to use here: GoBD - Verfahrensdokumentation, praxisrelevante Hilfestellungen / PSP München <http://www.gobd.de/verfahrensdokumentation.php> if you have no idea what to do... Make no mistake, THIS is what really matters to an auditor! (Well, maybe not if you use really crappy software ;-)) So unless you really want to spend several thousand euros on increasing the visibility/user base of piler, I would recommend you forget about purchasing a GoBD certificate... Speaking for myself, I would certainly consider throwing a bit of money into crowdfunding "useful" additions to piler, but for this I won't pay anything at all, sorry... Kind regards, Frank Textfeld: GoBD - Verfahrensdokumentation, praxisrelevante Hilfestellungen / PSP München Von PSP / Developer: Michael Cammannn Erfahren Sie in den Fachbeiträgen zur Verfahrensdokumentation, wie ein Unternehmen die Vollständigkeit, Ordnung ... Neue GoBD: Ein umfassender Überblick Von Stefan Groß VeR-Vorsitzender Stefan Groß erklärt in diesem Fachbeitrag, was Unternehmen über die neuen Buchführungsregeln wi... 15 Kriterien für GoBD-konforme Software | Scopevisio Ratgeber Die GoBD definieren Anforderungen an elektronische Buchführung. Unsere Checkliste sagt Ihnen, ob Ihre Software a... "s...@acts.hu" <s...@acts.hu> schrieb am 20:56 Montag, 24.Juli 2017: Dear piler users (especially the German ones at this time), probably all of you have heard that German law mandates that all German businesses must archive emails starting from this year. I've been convinced that it's worth to obtain GOBD certification for piler to offer the choice of freedom to German users to pick an open source email archiving product. Unfortunately it costs huge money* even for open source applications as well, so I thought some crowdfunding might help getting the required amount of money. For a successful fundraising campaign I need some helpers from Germany to spread the word (email, social media, etc) before the actual campaign launches, pick a crowdfunding platform, donating the initial seed (I have a small donation in mind, like 5 EUR or so), etc. If you agreed and willing to help, then please drop me a line. Perhaps I'll create a mailing list for the topic. Janos *: I got a quote from Audicon of 6500 EUR (not sure if any additional costs may occur during the process)
