Hallo Janos,
The certificate has as much impact as if you had taken part in a cooking course. Nice for your own office on the wall or to impress friends, but the tax authorities is completely no preference. ;-) Perhaps also comparable with the seal for E-Shop from "Trusted Shops" with more than 20000 positive votes. I would like to help you to translate the guide to the procedure documentation into German. If someone has suggestions, he can give them gladly. A very important topic for the software itself would be, for example, the> How is the unchangeability guaranteed. The most important thing, however, will be in the process documentation at a different level: Which domain is logged. How are the mails fed (IP of mailserver). How is the access guaranteed. Who has access to the system. When was archiving started. Best Regards zyrixx -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: s...@acts.hu [mailto:s...@acts.hu] Gesendet: Dienstag, 25. Juli 2017 21:43 An: Piler User Betreff: Re: GOBD certification Hello Frank, On 2017-07-25 14:47, Frank Schmitz wrote: > > a GoBD certification would surely result in a higher "visibility" for > piler, since quite a lot of companies are basing their business > decisions on those. > > But please do NOT believe that Piler needs a GoBD certification to be > used in germany! > The ministry of finance in germany does not care whether the software > is certified, it cares about > > 1. whether the software fulfills the legal requirements (i.e. to use > piler for GoBD in germany you need to use timestamping) do you mean that it's mandatory to use an external timestamp provider with piler? Or do you refer to the timestamps piler provides and stores in the metadata table? > 2. how the company USES the software (You need a procedural > documentation) I'll make it soon. > In case of an audit, both will be checked and the auditor won't care > whether piler is certified or not... > > To prove the point: > https://www.bundesfinanzministerium.de/Content/DE/Downloads/BMF_Schrei > ben/Weitere_Steuerthemen/Abgabenordnung/Datenzugriff_GDPdU/2014-11-14- > GoBD.pdf?__blob=publicationFile > > This is an official statement from the ministry of finance in germany, > under heading 12 / 181 (last page) it reads: > > _„Zertifikate“ oder „Testate“ Dritter können bei der Auswahl eines > Softwareproduktes _ _dem Unternehmen als Entscheidungskriterium > dienen, entfalten jedoch_ > > _ aus den in Rz. 179 genannten Gründen gegenüber der Finanzbehörde > keine Bindungswirkung._ > > Roughly translated: > > Certificates or testimonies of third parties may be used by companies > to choose a software, but they DO NOT have a binding effect for the > ministry of finance because of the reasons named in Rz. 179. I see. My point is that the usefulness of the certificate is that the auditing company has examined the given software and by providing the gobd compatible stamp they verify that the software complies with all demands by the law. > In short, those certificates for GoBD compliance aren't worth the > paper they're written on if an auditor is knocking on your door... > > You must be able to show that piler is able to fulfill all GoBD > Requirements. For a (german) "checklist" you can look those up here 15 > Kriterien für GoBD-konforme Software | Scopevisio Ratgeber [1] or here > Neue GoBD: Ein umfassender Überblick [2]. I'll check these docs. > I'm no expert by any means, but as far as I understand it, piler is > quite capable of doing all that IF you use timestamping so you can > prove the emails haven't been changed since they were > timestamped/received... > > Apart from the technical requirements, you will also need an > "extensive" documentation about what exactly you are doing with your > receipts/invoices/etc. You can even find a sample documentation to use > here: GoBD - Verfahrensdokumentation, praxisrelevante Hilfestellungen > / PSP München [3] if you have no idea what to do... Make no mistake, > THIS is what really matters to an auditor! (Well, maybe not if you use > really crappy software ;-)) > > So unless you really want to spend several thousand euros on > increasing the visibility/user base of piler, I would recommend you > forget about purchasing a GoBD certificate... > > Speaking for myself, I would certainly consider throwing a bit of > money into crowdfunding "useful" additions to piler, but for this I > won't pay anything at all, sorry... it's ok Frank, and I appreciate your feedback and advice. Janos
