Was he labeled a communist due to the necessity of association or was he an ideologue? On May 31, 2016 8:07 PM, "Keith In Tampa" <[email protected]> wrote:
True.....Although Minh was always a communist, and had communist sympathies and leaned that way long before the altercation with the French colonialists in the late 1940s and early 1950s.... On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 8:45 PM, geoffrey theist <[email protected]> wrote: > In all fairness I have read that Ho Chi Minh proposed to the American > government to adopt a constitution for Vietnam based on the US constitution > and asked for assistance getting rid of the French colonialist of course we > sent him packing right into the arms of Mao Tse Tung and helped our always > reliable french allies instead. well once again we were left left with our > thumb up our collective ass..... > On May 31, 2016 7:29 PM, "Keith In Tampa" <[email protected]> wrote: > >> It's sad to watch Secular Progressives attempt to delve into subject >> matter that they have no clue or inkling about.....Pitiful..... >> >> On Tue, May 31, 2016 at 4:17 PM, plainolamerican < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> it's fun to watch warmongering neocons, zionists and republicans shake >>> and tremble in fear and scream for more war. >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tuesday, May 31, 2016 at 2:22:59 PM UTC-5, Travis wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Daniel Greenfield's article: Obama's Ho Chi Minh Trail >>>> <http://sultanknish.blogspot.com/> >>>> >>>> [image: Link to Sultan Knish] <http://sultanknish.blogspot.com/> >>>> ------------------------------ >>>> >>>> Posted: 30 May 2016 07:17 AM PDT >>>> >>>> On his visit to meet with Communist leaders in Vietnam, Obama >>>> criticized the United States for having, “too much money in our politics, >>>> and rising economic inequality, racial bias in our criminal justice >>>> system.” He praised Ho Chi Minh’s evocation of the “American Declaration of >>>> Independence” and claimed that we had “shared ideals” with the murderous >>>> Communist dictator. >>>> >>>> <https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-IeRfXyjtn0Q/V0xK2_QkXMI/AAAAAAAAPzU/C7U9taNV4cE2-BJW75uLHNpRiFJljdaTgCLcB/s1600/22-stockdale-homecoming-sd.jpg> >>>> Shortly after the “evocation” that Obama praised, his beloved Ho was >>>> hard at work purging the opposition, political and religious. When Obama >>>> references these “shared ideals”, does he perhaps mean Ho’s declaration, >>>> “All who do not follow the line laid down by me will be broken.” >>>> >>>> Perhaps he means the euphemistically named “land reform” which may have >>>> killed up to a million people. Like Stalin and Mao, Ho Chi Minh seized land >>>> and executed property owners as “enemies of the state”. The original plan >>>> had been to murder one in a thousand. But the relatively modest plan for >>>> mass murder was swiftly exceeded by the enthusiastic Communist death >>>> squads. >>>> >>>> Obama has consistently called for wealth redistribution. This is what >>>> it really looks like. It’s men being hung from trees or lying in dirt dying >>>> of malaria. It’s death squads coming in the night. It’s a declaration that >>>> you are to be executed because you are the wrong class in a class war. It’s >>>> a man condemned to hard labor in a New Economic Zone and a family starving >>>> to death because the regime has commanded that they must be made an example >>>> of to other peasants. >>>> >>>> What’s wrong with a little wealth redistribution anyway? >>>> >>>> As Obama said, on his visit to the brutal Communist dictatorship in >>>> Cuba, “So often in the past there’s been a sharp division between left and >>>> right, between capitalist and communist or socialist... And especially in >>>> the Americas, that’s been a big debate, right? Oh, you know, you’re a >>>> capitalist Yankee dog, and oh, you know, you’re some crazy communist that’s >>>> going to take away everybody’s property... you should be practical and just >>>> choose from what works. You don’t have to worry about whether it neatly >>>> fits into socialist theory or capitalist theory — you should just decide >>>> what works.” >>>> >>>> Does Vietnam’s Communist dictatorship work? Obama seems to think that >>>> it does, talking up the, “skyscrapers and high-rises of Hanoi and Ho Chi >>>> Minh City, and new shopping malls and urban centers. We see it in the >>>> satellites Vietnam puts into space”. What’s a million dead when you’ve got >>>> satellites in space? What does it matter if you don’t have freedom of >>>> speech when there are skyscrapers in Ho Chi Minh City? >>>> >>>> Unlike Pol Pot, whose genocidal crimes leftist activists like Noam >>>> Chomsky tried and failed to cover up, the Communist butchery in Vietnam >>>> that took place even long before the Vietnam War has largely been erased >>>> from common history. The victims of Ho Chi Minh and his successors have >>>> become non-persons not just in Vietnam, but in Washington D.C. Instead >>>> Obama associates one of history’s bloodiest Communist butchers with Thomas >>>> Jefferson. >>>> >>>> What of the Declaration of Independence was there in Ho’s concentration >>>> camps? The brutal Communist regime whose ideals Obama praises, sent >>>> political dissidents to camps. Are those the ideals he shares with Uncle >>>> Ho? >>>> >>>> Obama praises the “Vietnamese constitution, which states that ‘citizens >>>> have the right to freedom of speech and freedom of the press, and have the >>>> right of access to information, the right to assembly, the right to >>>> association, and the right to demonstrate.’ That’s in the Vietnamese >>>> constitution.” >>>> >>>> The Soviet constitution had the same empty guarantees. The Nhan >>>> Van-Giai Pham intellectuals who were purged can testify that these words >>>> were as meaningless as those of the Vietnamese Declaration of Independence >>>> which Obama had quoted earlier. More relevantly the fourth article of the >>>> Vietnamese Constitution states that the “The Communist Party of Vietnam... >>>> the faithful representative of the interests of the working class, laborers >>>> and the whole nation, acting upon the Marxist-Leninist doctrine and Ho Chi >>>> Minh's thought, is the leading force of the State and society.” That means >>>> there’s no freedom of speech, press, assembly or anything else except >>>> within the confines of Marxist-Leninist doctrine and Uncle Ho’s cunning >>>> distortions that fooled almost as many American leftists as Uncle Joe’s >>>> plans for Eastern Europe fooled Western European leftists. >>>> >>>> Obama equates a Communist dictatorship to America in an ugly display of >>>> moral equivalence. “This is an issue about all of us, each country, trying >>>> to consistently apply these principles.” Vietnam locked up political >>>> bloggers for “abusing their freedom” just this March. According to Obama, >>>> America has “too much money in politics”. Vietnam doesn’t have that >>>> problem. It only has one party. The Communist Party. >>>> >>>> Vietnam only has one party because its Communist leaders banned, purged >>>> and criminalized the opposition. But Obama doesn’t think that Communism is >>>> a particularly bad thing. >>>> >>>> In his speech, he dismissed the Vietnam War as being caused by “fears >>>> of Communism” that overcame our “shared ideals”. Why were we afraid of >>>> Communism? It might have had to do something with the mass murder of 94 >>>> million people by Communist regimes. It might have a few things to do with >>>> concentration camps, bans of political parties and the imprisonment and >>>> execution of those practicing freedom of speech, assembly and the press. >>>> >>>> Our “fears of Communism” were as real and valid as our “fears of >>>> Nazism”. It is only the fellow travelers of the left who deny this >>>> undeniable fact. >>>> >>>> After one bout of mass murder, Ho Chi Minh dismissed his crimes with >>>> the words, “One cannot waken the dead.” Obama clearly agrees. The dead, >>>> American and Vietnamese, must be written off as part of an unfortunate >>>> conflict. We must forget why they died and embrace their killers. >>>> >>>> Obama marked the lives lost on “both sides” as if the Communist terror >>>> squads butchering Vietnamese farmers or massacring Catholics were somehow >>>> morally the equal of American soldiers dying to stop them. Lives were also >>>> lost on both sides when America fought the Nazis. Reagan was rightly >>>> criticized for that sort of moral equivalence when he equated Nazi soldiers >>>> at Bitburg and concentration camp victims. And yet the liberals who >>>> protested that equivalence have nothing but applause when Obama equates >>>> murdered American soldiers and butchered Vietnamese families with their >>>> Communist killers. >>>> >>>> When Viet Cong terrorists threw grenades into markets, are we supposed >>>> to mourn the children who were torn apart by shrapnel and the grenade >>>> throwers as morally equivalent? If we equate “the names of 58,315 Americans >>>> who gave their lives in the conflict” with the evil they were fighting, >>>> then we render their sacrifice worthless. >>>> >>>> Their deaths become a meaningless mistake in an unnecessary war caused >>>> by our failure to understand our “shared ideals” with Ho Chi Minh and our >>>> irrational fear of Communist concentration camps. >>>> >>>> That is Obama’s real message. We should have adapted some aspects of >>>> Communism and learned from our shared values. We should have closed our >>>> eyes to Ho Chi Minh’s atrocities as a matter of having to break human eggs >>>> to make Socialist omelets while celebrating him as another Thomas >>>> Jefferson. >>>> >>>> That is the way the left saw it. That is still the way it sees it. >>>> >>>> Obama’s trip to Vietnam is not a mere strategic journey, but yet >>>> another opportunity for him to remind us that the left has not repented or >>>> recanted of its solidarity and support for Communist terror whether in >>>> Cuba, in Vietnam or anywhere else. It still sees every Communist dictator >>>> as a role model worth emulating and every Communist mass grave as the price >>>> that must be paid for a better world. >>>> >>>> >>>> <http://feeds.feedburner.com/~ff/FromNyToIsraelSultanRevealsTheStoriesBehindTheNews?a=pUOQ_k8jOBw:ngEKHbX2vJI:yIl2AUoC8zA> >>>> <http://feeds.feedburner.com/~ff/FromNyToIsraelSultanRevealsTheStoriesBehindTheNews?a=pUOQ_k8jOBw:ngEKHbX2vJI:I9og5sOYxJI> >>>> <http://feeds.feedburner.com/~ff/FromNyToIsraelSultanRevealsTheStoriesBehindTheNews?a=pUOQ_k8jOBw:ngEKHbX2vJI:63t7Ie-LG7Y> >>>> <http://feeds.feedburner.com/~ff/FromNyToIsraelSultanRevealsTheStoriesBehindTheNews?a=pUOQ_k8jOBw:ngEKHbX2vJI:F7zBnMyn0Lo> >>>> <http://feeds.feedburner.com/~ff/FromNyToIsraelSultanRevealsTheStoriesBehindTheNews?a=pUOQ_k8jOBw:ngEKHbX2vJI:UT3xtbGYFzA> >>>> <http://feeds.feedburner.com/~ff/FromNyToIsraelSultanRevealsTheStoriesBehindTheNews?a=pUOQ_k8jOBw:ngEKHbX2vJI:qj6IDK7rITs> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Email delivery powered by Google >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> __._,_.___ >>>> ------------------------------ >>>> Posted by: "Beowulf" <[email protected]> >>>> ------------------------------ >>>> >>>> >>>> Visit Your Group >>>> <https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/grendelreport/info;_ylc=X3oDMTJmazg2dGZnBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzIwMTk0ODA2BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTMyMzY2NwRzZWMDdnRsBHNsawN2Z2hwBHN0aW1lAzE0NjQ3MDE1NTE-> >>>> >>>> >>>> [image: Yahoo! Groups] >>>> <https://groups.yahoo.com/neo;_ylc=X3oDMTJlNnUwZmU4BF9TAzk3NDc2NTkwBGdycElkAzIwMTk0ODA2BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTMyMzY2NwRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNnZnAEc3RpbWUDMTQ2NDcwMTU1MQ--> >>>> • Privacy <https://info.yahoo.com/privacy/us/yahoo/groups/details.html> >>>> • Unsubscribe • Terms of Use >>>> <https://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/terms/> >>>> >>>> __,_._,___ >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>> -- >>> Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. >>> For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum >>> >>> * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ >>> * It's active and moderated. 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