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[task #744] Latest Modifications:
Changes by:
Beno�t Audouard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
'Date:
dim 12.09.2004 � 14:25 (GMT)
------------------ Additional Follow-up Comments ----------------------------
Thanks for fast answer... take time though to be sure the procedures are robust vs
implementation
This time, you had no way of warning the users / project admins (apart linuxfr).
Having a list of project admin available for warning by mail would be fine...
My proposal of www.gna.org / gna.org that could be differentiated in case of emergency
is a simple / easy to remember way of access for users... If you want to have a
http://emergency.gna.org : that will do (just put it in the FAQ which may not be
accessible when it's down... so it has to be easily remembered). You may put there
planned downtime (which do not happen that often)
I agree that a wiki is a place for breakage, as a ML for spam... there will always be
bad guys out there :-( The important thing is that there remains a way to contact the
admin / be informed, and this place must be known.
BTW, tuxfamily.org had a similar problem today : power outage at lost-oasis ;-) maybe
they have the same cleaning lady as linuxfr :-))
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[task #744] Full Item Snapshot:
URL: <http://gna.org/task/?func=detailitem&item_id=744>
Project: Gna! Administration
Submitted by: Mathieu Roy
On: dim 12.09.2004 � 08:41
Should Start On: sam 11.09.2004 � 22:00
Should be Finished on: lun 11.10.2004 � 22:00
Category: Services Functionalities
Priority: 9 - Immediate
Resolution: None
Privacy: Public
Assigned to: None
Percent Complete: 0%
Status: Open
Effort: 0.00
Summary: emergency homepage
Original Submission: We definitely need an emergency homepage, as suggested by
Baud123, to be able to inform user easily in case all system go offline. This page
must be on another location that gna machines (otherwise it would probably not help
much). An account on this machine should be accessible through ssh to gna admins +
virtual domain.
We could set emergency.gna.org -- if we use a gna address, it means that the secondary
DNS must be a working thing.
Commentaires
------------------
-------------------------------------------------------
Date: dim 12.09.2004 � 14:25 By: Beno�t Audouard <baud123>
Thanks for fast answer... take time though to be sure the procedures are robust vs
implementation
This time, you had no way of warning the users / project admins (apart linuxfr).
Having a list of project admin available for warning by mail would be fine...
My proposal of www.gna.org / gna.org that could be differentiated in case of emergency
is a simple / easy to remember way of access for users... If you want to have a
http://emergency.gna.org : that will do (just put it in the FAQ which may not be
accessible when it's down... so it has to be easily remembered). You may put there
planned downtime (which do not happen that often)
I agree that a wiki is a place for breakage, as a ML for spam... there will always be
bad guys out there :-( The important thing is that there remains a way to contact the
admin / be informed, and this place must be known.
BTW, tuxfamily.org had a similar problem today : power outage at lost-oasis ;-) maybe
they have the same cleaning lady as linuxfr :-))
-------------------------------------------------------
Date: dim 12.09.2004 � 13:50 By: Mathieu Roy <yeupou>
"From a user point of view, as admin of a project, my requirements are :
- to be informed when it happens, when it's restored
- to get a planned date for restoration of service
- be told whether there's data loss or not (and what I should have done to avoid data
loss)"
And that's the kind of information we usually provide, so there's no problem providing
these. This remark will be taken into account when writing the template for the
emergency website.
"For example, you could have a http://www.gna.org hosted on another"
As currently gna.org eq www.gna.org and since it makes sense to do so, I do not think
we could do it that way without creating confusion.
An url that always work will be provided and will be the meeting point in case
www.gna.org/gna.org does not work.
"For hosting, you may ask several LUGs, maybe one can provide you with limited hosting
:
- a homepage for information (users have to find something interesting there, or they
will forget this URL...)
- maybe a wiki (as was done with tuxfamily.org...)
- perhaps a ML for emergency situations (that project admins are advised to subscribe
to)"
Emergency will be an homepage, I think that what fit most to the current need (gna
admins having a place where they can put gpg-signed messages) without being to big to
maintain (a wiki looks like a thing for endless breakage ; we do not intend to have
troubles longer than 24h long frequently, and surely not weeks).
"Last : for backups, they should be externalized if possible - either on user side :
for cvs that's easy (but not for support/bugs...)
- or by server side : maybe a regular rsync (but once gna grows it becomes more and
more heavy...)"
We already have such backups, even if projects are still advised to maintain their own
backups.
-------------------------------------------------------
Date: dim 12.09.2004 � 13:14 By: Beno�t Audouard <baud123>
I was not far for my previous request, as it was support #218 : reread the (full)
discussion...
>From a user point of view, as admin of a project, my requirements are :
- to be informed when it happens, when it's restored
- to get a planned date for restoration of service
- be told whether there's data loss or not (and what I should have done to avoid data
loss)
Possible implementations are :
- full redondancy on several sites (well quite expensive), quite compulsory for DNS
(at least for the secundary)
- no redundancy : means of information are indirect (currently linuxfr is quite good),
if you still could have sent a mail to subscribers of gna project ML it would have
been better
- partial redundancy : alternate hosts are available and can provide minimal service
(see below)
For example, you could have a www.gna.org hosted on another server :
- if www is unavailable, people go directly to gna.org
- if gna.org (projects) is unavailable, people go to www.gna.org and see what happened
=> it's interesting as it does not require any DNS change (which can be long to
propagate...)
For hosting, you may ask several LUGs, maybe one can provide you with limited hosting :
- a homepage for information (users have to find something interesting there, or they
will forget this URL...)
- maybe a wiki (as was done with tuxfamily.org...)
- perhaps a ML for emergency situations (that project admins are advised to subscribe
to)
Last : for backups, they should be externalized if possible - either on user side :
for cvs that's easy (but not for support/bugs...)
- or by server side : maybe a regular rsync (but once gna grows it becomes more and
more heavy...)
Maybe there's descriptions of procedures / implementations of this already on the web
? other than what I've already done...
http://wiki.eagle-usb.org/wakka.php?wiki=BesoinsUtilisateursHebergement in other
situations
-------------------------------------------------------
Date: dim 12.09.2004 � 08:51 By: Mathieu Roy <yeupou>
We should be careful when selecting the host: that's not something that should change
every years.
Naturally, using FSF France machines is not an option since they are all along with
Gna machines. And finally relying on FSF USA machines is not compatible with their
current policy related to machine access.
I could host the emergency page at coleumes.org, however it wont be a virtual domain
and it wont be accessible via ssh -- so I'm not sure that's the best solution, but
that's an option (if we do not find better in one month, I'd say go for it).
Finally, we could do it on an home connectivity line mine (my IP is static). My local
server is not always up but I can let it up during troubles.
Any thought? Any proposal?
CC List
-------
CC Address | Comment
------------------------------------+-----------------------------
baud123 | made request
loic | made request
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<http://gna.org/task/?func=detailitem&item_id=744>
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