On 6 November 2017 at 16:42, Lukasz Langa <luk...@langa.pl> wrote: > >> On 5 Nov, 2017, at 10:30 PM, Michel Desmoulin <desmoulinmic...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >> Le 06/11/2017 à 07:07, Nick Coghlan a écrit : >> >>> It's the default on Unix as well - you have to do "make install >>> ENSUREPIP=no" to avoid getting it. (And some distros also modify their >>> Python installations so that pip is missing by default) >> >> On debian and derivatives (so Ubuntu) you need to install python-pip to >> be able to use pip. >> >> Now it's annoying already. Because you have to write every tutorial to >> include a special case for them. But at least it's not a required step >> to run your program. >> >> However, if you do code using type hints and typing is not installed, >> you can't even run the program without installing something. So we >> finally have Python 3 by default on most Linux system, but still would >> not be able to assume we can run a modern script on it. > > This is a valid concern. Although this particular problem is self-inflicted > by Debian, I can understand their rationale behind explicit packaging. They > need to have control over the entire package graph. I wonder if there's a way > in .deb to specify a required installed package. I'm not calling it a > "dependency" since obviously it would rather be "python3-typing" that depends > on "python3".
Fedora just lives with the circular dependency between python3 and python3-pip, which ensures both are installed by default (this arrangement allows "python3 -m venv" to still install pip, without actually needing a second copy of pip inside the python3 package) A bundled typing module that "python -m venv" installed by default would probably require similar treatment. > But even if Debian installs python3-typing by default, will "pip install -U > typing" be possible in this scenario? I guess it wouldn't be terrible if that > only worked in virtualenvs, although ideally it would work also for the raw > host installation. "sudo pip install <anything>" remains a terrible idea on any distro, because it leads to pip and the system package manager getting into a fight over which tool is responsible for managing the affected files. "pip install --user --upgrade typing" should work OK, though. Cheers, Nick. -- Nick Coghlan | ncogh...@gmail.com | Brisbane, Australia _______________________________________________ Python-ideas mailing list Python-ideas@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-ideas Code of Conduct: http://python.org/psf/codeofconduct/
