Rex, Totally agree. My comments were utterly irrational. Thank you for understanding. Apologize once again! Regards, Harsh Singhal On 05-Mar-2011 4:50 AM, <rex.dw...@syngenta.com> wrote: > Harsh, not to worry, but you were wrong to assert that I engaged in any name calling, let alone constant name calling. > I also didn't and don't claim to be an authority on survey design. > > -----Original Message----- > From: r-help-boun...@r-project.org [mailto:r-help-boun...@r-project.org] On Behalf Of Harsh > Sent: Friday, March 04, 2011 4:13 PM > To: Ista Zahn > Cc: r-help@r-project.org > Subject: Re: [R] R usage survey > > Rex, Please accept my apologies for my inappropriate and utterly juvenile remarks. > I got carried away by what I thought was criticism and was quick to respond in a scathing manner. > I do accept and apologize for my inability in understanding what was essentially being asked of me. > > Thanks to Ista and other members for clarifying what I failed to understand. > > I'm now aware that I must submit to appropriately answering questions from potential respondents of the survey. > > I must reiterate that "This survey is not sponsored or approved by any organization or company. The purpose of the survey is to satisfy my personal curiosity regarding R usage patterns. Results will be posted to a publicly available weblog; the data will not be used for any other purpose". > (Thanks Ista for wording this out. I couldn't have done it better) > > Regards, > Harsh Singhal > http://in.linkedin.com/in/harshsinghal > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 2:11 AM, Ista Zahn <iz...@psych.rochester.edu> wrote: > >> On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 3:20 PM, Harsh <singhal...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > Hi Ista, Spencer and Greg, >> <snip> >> > The information being collected is purely out of personal interest >> > and I have mentioned this earlier. >> >> No, I don't think you did actually. This is the key thing we wanted to >> know up-front, and it's a shame that it took the better part of the >> day before we finally understand why you are conducting the survey. >> >> There is no commercial interest involved. >> > >> > Is it possible that I am interested in this sort of information to >> > better understand R's usage patterns ? In doing so, the survey I am >> > conducting would seem an appropriate way for my requirements. >> > >> > And how does belittling someone on a mailing list help ? >> > >> > If anyone wants the kind of information I am collecting, are there >> > suggestions of better ways of finding it besides the method that I >> > have adopted ? Sure I could scrape the data of LinkedIn pages, or >> > find other >> ways >> > of doing it, but I found this suitable. >> > >> > >> > >> > On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 1:27 AM, Spencer Graves >> > <spencer.gra...@structuremonitoring.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> Most surveys done in the US today are done during election >> >> season, >> to >> >> determine how to package candidates to attract votes. Officials >> >> elected under such circumstances spend half their time in office >> >> servicing the bribes that they accepted to pay for the surveys and >> >> the resulting advertising (and the other half soliciting more >> >> bribes er contributions >> for >> >> their next campaign). The best reference on this I know is Thomas >> Ferguson >> >> (1995) Golden Rule (U. Chicago Pr.). It's by now somewhat old but >> >> is >> still >> >> cited by leading researchers. >> >> >> >> >> >> People have a right to be cautious of surveys, because too >> >> rarely today are surveys used for legitimate scientific purposes. >> >> Most often, >> they >> >> are used to defraud the public into doing things that are contrary >> >> to >> their >> >> best interests. >> >> >> >> >> >> Spencer Graves >> >> >> >> >> >> On 3/4/2011 11:37 AM, Ista Zahn wrote: >> >>> >> >>> Now hold on a second Harsh! I was fairly neutral up to this point, >> >>> but this response is totally uncalled for. The problem is that >> >>> despite repeated requests you never clarified the purpose of your research! >> >>> That is all you were asked to do, but rather than responding to >> >>> this inquirly in a straightforward and honest manner you kept >> >>> dodging the question. The most charitable explanation is that you >> >>> just don't understand what information you were being asked to >> >>> provide, which is frustrating but understandable; your last >> >>> response on the other hand is completly out of line. Research >> >>> participants have a right to know the purpose for which their data >> >>> is being collected, and as a researcher you have a responsibility to tell them. >> >>> >> >>> Rex, thank you for generating this discussion. When I first say >> >>> Harsh's original email I was just getting ready to fill out the >> >>> survey. When I saw your response I delayed. Boy am I glad I did! >> >>> >> >>> Best, >> >>> Ista >> >>> >> >>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 2:20 PM, Harsh<singhal...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>>> >> >>>> Rex, >> >>>> You're just paranoid and I'm in no way answerable to you. Your >> constant >> >>>> name >> >>>> calling presupposes your own naivete. >> >>>> >> >>>> The survey has a disclaimer and those who wish to respond can do >> >>>> so at their own discretion. >> >>>> >> >>>> Judging by the nature (and number) of respondents, there seem to >> >>>> be a lot of highly qualified people who have no qualms about >> >>>> sharing information regarding their R usage patterns. >> >>>> >> >>>> You can believe what you want and can continue to spin your >> imaginative >> >>>> tales of "industrial espionage" while assuming a position of >> >>>> apparent authority on survey design, Oscar gowns and data >> >>>> security AND my apparent ulterior and "outrageous" motives. >> >>>> >> >>>> You also seem to be an ignorant and misinformed person. Google >> >>>> forms, using which the survey was created DOES NOT log IP >> >>>> addresses of the respondents. >> >>>> >> >>>> And exactly which question in the survey would contribute to >> endangering >> >>>> the >> >>>> professional or personal safety and security of people responding >> >>>> to >> the >> >>>> survey. The information sought is freely available on LinkedIn. I >> merely >> >>>> want to get more descriptive information directly from R users. >> >>>> >> >>>> If you haven't looked at the Survey questions, then refrain from >> making >> >>>> misconstrued remarks. >> >>>> >> >>>> I apologize to the other users of this list for prolonging this >> >>>> frivolous debate here. This will be my last response on the list >> >>>> regarding this topic. >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> If anyone has an issue pertaining to the Survey, its outcome and >> >>>> my motives, they can get in touch with me independently and off >> >>>> the list. All >> forms >> >>>> of >> >>>> constructive comments are also welcome. >> >>>> >> >>>> For those interested in sharing their R usage information please >> >>>> visit goo.gl/jw1ig >> >>>> >> >>>> - H >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> On 04-Mar-2011 10:34 PM,<rex.dw...@syngenta.com> wrote: >> >>>>> >> >>>>> You still don't say what organization you are associated with. >> >>>>> Your domain >> >>>> >> >>>> name and e-mail address give no hint. How do we know that "Harsh >> >>>> Singhal" is even a real person? An e-mail address at a university >> >>>> (for example) would go a long way to establish that. Gmail >> >>>> doesn't cut it for me. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> The preponderance of evidence is that you're just a naïve person >> >>>>> who would >> >>>> >> >>>> give your own information to anyone who asked. On the other hand, >> >>>> it's possible that you are conducting industrial espionage by >> >>>> recording IP addresses and associating "use cases" with >> >>>> companies. In my opinion, >> the >> >>>> onus is on you to show your bona fides, and you haven't done it. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> That's all I have to say... >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> From: Harsh [mailto:singhal...@gmail.com] >> >>>>> Sent: Friday, March 04, 2011 4:19 AM >> >>>>> To: bill.venab...@csiro.au >> >>>>> Cc: Dwyer Rex USRE; r-help@r-project.org >> >>>>> Subject: Re: [R] R usage survey >> >>>>> >> >>>>> The R usage survey goo.gl/jw1ig<http://goo.gl/jw1ig> has been >> updated >> >>>>> with >> >>>> >> >>>> the following changes: >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Addition of - >> >>>>> Disclaimer : >> >>>>> This data will not be used for any commercial purposes Do not >> >>>>> include any personally identifiable information >> >>>>> Contact: Harsh Singhal (singhalblr AT gmail DOT com) for any >> >>>>> queries >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Removal of - >> >>>>> Name field >> >>>>> >> >>>>> My primary purpose in conducting this survey is - >> >>>>> - Find multiple use cases for various R packages >> >>>>> - Understand the nature of work when R is being used in Academia >> >>>>> / >> >>>> >> >>>> Commercial settings >> >>>>> >> >>>>> - The kind of technologies that are being used in conjunction >> >>>>> with R >> >>>> >> >>>> (popularity of usage of Python with R, and what purpose does >> >>>> using Python >> >>>> solve) >> >>>>> >> >>>>> The outcome of this analysis will be published on my blog (in >> >>>>> the process >> >>>> >> >>>> of being created). >> >>>>> >> >>>>> There is absolutely no commercial purpose behind collecting this >> >>>> >> >>>> information and as earlier stated, this information will not be >> >>>> shared with personally identifiable information. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Thank you once again Mr. Dwyer and Mr. Venables for raising very >> import >> >>>> >> >>>> questions. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> I thank the R users who have already filled in the survey >> goo.gl/jw1ig< >> >>>> >> >>>> http://goo.gl/jw1ig> and request more to do so. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Regards, >> >>>>> Harsh Singhal >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 7:41 AM,<bill.venab...@csiro.au> wrote: >> >>>>> No. That's not answering the question. ALL surveys are for >> >>>>> collecting >> >>>> >> >>>> information. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> The substantive issue is what purpose do you have in seeking >> >>>>> this >> >>>> >> >>>> information in the first place and what are you going to do with >> >>>> it >> when >> >>>> you >> >>>> get it? >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Do you have some commercial purpose in mind? If so, what is it? >> >>>>> >> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >> >>>>> From: r-help-boun...@r-project.org<mailto: >> r-help-boun...@r-project.org> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> [mailto:r-help-boun...@r-project.org<mailto: >> r-help-boun...@r-project.org>] >> >>>> On Behalf Of Harsh >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Sent: Friday, 4 March 2011 1:13 AM >> >>>>> To: rex.dw...@syngenta.com<mailto:rex.dw...@syngenta.com> >> >>>>> Cc: r-help@r-project.org<mailto:r-help@r-project.org> >> >>>>> Subject: Re: [R] R usage survey >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Hi Rex and useRs, >> >>>>> >> >>>>> The purpose of the survey has been mentioned on the survey link >> >>>> >> >>>> goo.gl/jw1ig<http://goo.gl/jw1ig> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> but I will also reproduce it here. >> >>>>> - Geographical distribution of R users >> >>>>> - Application areas where R is being used >> >>>>> - Supporting technology being used along with R >> >>>>> - Academic background distribution of R users >> >>>>> >> >>>>> The potential personally identifiable information such as name >> >>>>> and >> >>>> >> >>>> employer >> >>>>> >> >>>>> name are optional fields. Actually all the fields in the survey >> >>>>> are optional. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Some of the analysis output(s) could be along the lines of :- >> >>>>> - Usage statistics of various R packages >> >>>>> - Distribution of R users across countries/cities >> >>>>> - Mapping various applications to packages >> >>>>> - Text Mining of the responses to create informative word clouds >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Personally, I am excited about the kind of data I will receive >> through >> >>>> >> >>>> this >> >>>>> >> >>>>> survey and the various insights that could be derived. As >> >>>>> already >> >>>> >> >>>> mentioned, >> >>>>> >> >>>>> the results will be shared with the community. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Thank you Rex for raising an important point. It is indeed >> >>>>> necessary for >> >>>> >> >>>> me >> >>>>> >> >>>>> to personally assure the user community that the results will be >> shared >> >>>>> in >> >>>> >> >>>> a >> >>>>> >> >>>>> manner that will not contain any personally identifiable information. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Those who wish to gain access to the raw data will be provided >> >>>>> with >> all >> >>>> >> >>>> the >> >>>>> >> >>>>> fields but not the name and employer name fields. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Just out of curiosity : It is possible to get name, employer >> >>>>> name, >> >>>> >> >>>> location, >> >>>>> >> >>>>> usage information and academic background details when searching >> >>>>> for >> R >> >>>> >> >>>> users >> >>>>> >> >>>>> on LinkedIn and the many R related groups there. >> >>>>> Does this also provide potential opportunities for misuse and >> >>>>> "outrageous" >> >>>>> analyses, since almost anyone can get onto LinkedIn and access >> >>>>> user >> >>>> >> >>>> profiles >> >>>>> >> >>>>> ? >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Thank you for your interest and support. >> >>>>> Regards, >> >>>>> Harsh >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 8:02 PM,<rex.dw...@syngenta.com<mailto: >> >>>> >> >>>> rex.dw...@syngenta.com>> wrote: >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> Harsh, "Suitably analyzed" for whose purposes? One man's "suitable" >> is >> >>>>>> another's "outrageous". That's why people want to see the gowns >> >>>>>> at >> the >> >>>>>> Oscars. Under what auspices are you conducting this survey? >> >>>>>> What do you intend to do with it? You don't give any assurance >> >>>>>> that the results you post won't have personally identifiable >> >>>>>> information. I don't get the impression that you know much >> >>>>>> about survey design. >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >> >>>>>> From: >> >>>>>> r-help-boun...@r-project.org<mailto:r-help-boun...@r-project.or >> >>>>>> g> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> [mailto:r-help-boun...@r-project.org<mailto: >> r-help-boun...@r-project.org>] >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> On Behalf Of Harsh >> >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2011 5:53 AM >> >>>>>> To: r-help@r-project.org<mailto:r-help@r-project.org> >> >>>>>> Subject: [R] R usage survey >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> Hi R users, >> >>>>>> I request members of the R community to consider filling a >> >>>>>> short survey regarding the use of R. >> >>>>>> The survey can be found at http://goo.gl/jw1ig >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> Please accept my apologies for posting here for a non-technical >> >>>>>> reason. >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> The data collected will be suitably analyzed and I'll post a >> >>>>>> link to the results in the coming weeks. >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> Thank you all for your interest and for sharing your R usage >> >>>>>> information. >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> Regards, >> >>>>>> Harsh Singhal >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> [[alternative HTML version deleted]] >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> ______________________________________________ >> >>>>>> R-help@r-project.org<mailto:R-help@r-project.org> mailing list >> >>>>>> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help >> >>>>>> PLEASE do read the posting guide >> >>>>>> http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html >> >>>>>> and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code. >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> message may contain confidential information. If you are not >> >>>>>> the >> >>>> >> >>>> designated >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> recipient, please notify the sender immediately, and delete the >> >>>>>> original >> >>>> >> >>>> and >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> any copies. Any use of the message by you is prohibited. >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>> [[alternative HTML version deleted]] >> >>>>> >> >>>>> ______________________________________________ >> >>>>> R-help@r-project.org<mailto:R-help@r-project.org> mailing list >> >>>>> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help >> >>>>> PLEASE do read the posting guide >> >>>> >> >>>> http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html >> >>>>> >> >>>>> and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> message may contain confidential information. If you are not the >> >>>> >> >>>> designated recipient, please notify the sender immediately, and >> >>>> delete the original and any copies. Any use of the message by you >> >>>> is prohibited. >> >>>> >> >>>> [[alternative HTML version deleted]] >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> ______________________________________________ >> >>>> R-help@r-project.org mailing list >> >>>> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help >> >>>> PLEASE do read the posting guide >> >>>> http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html >> >>>> and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code. >> >>>> >> > >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> Ista Zahn >> Graduate student >> University of Rochester >> Department of Clinical and Social Psychology http://yourpsyche.org >> > > [[alternative HTML version deleted]] > > > > > message may contain confidential information. If you are not the designated recipient, please notify the sender immediately, and delete the original and any copies. Any use of the message by you is prohibited. >
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______________________________________________ R-help@r-project.org mailing list https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.