Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
Don, Wayne: Do you have the schematic of the sideband filter you could send to me? I'd love to run it through an analysis program to see the frequency response. - Jim Tonne W4ENE __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
nothing was posted--need to resend Jim - Original Message - From: "Sara & Wayne Steiner" To: "Discussion of AM Radio in the Amateur Service" Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2010 12:55 PM Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Antennas > > > __ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
Hi Don I also have those R9 ssb articles and have been tempted to see if I could successfully duplicate it. I have a number open 1920s AF transformers for rewinding for the filters..To many projects. It might be fun to put a 1933 ssb rig on the air. A mid 30s Radio News has a receiver article using a simple crystal lattice filter. Anyway, as you say, this stuff didn't gain attention untill the late 40s. Wayne , N0TE __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
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Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
I believe that SSB was in use even before 1920. The Bell System used SSB in FDM Mux equipment (C-carrier, etc.,) in the "10's" (1915 and later). This was between 4.5 Khz and 60Khz. As FDM technology improved the frequencies in use increased into the megahertz range. I have some modern FDM gear in my storage unit. Goes from 34Khz to 200Khz. I'd love to modulate a 900 Mhz link with that! Ed, VA3ES --- Don k4kyv wrote: The first commercial use of SSB was around 1920 for transatlantic telephone links using VLF. __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
> From: "Larry Szendrei"
>>> There have been some interesting cases with short loaded antennas
>> in the BC band, the bandwidth has occasionally been so narrow that the AM
>> sidebands become attenuated! Not going to see that effect in the amateur
>> bands unless someone is running an antenna only a few feet long!!
>
> Correct. This has been observed on my 75M AM mobile signal, with reports
> of one sideband being attenuated relative to the other. Antenna is a
> Webster bandpanner ("a few feet long").
>
> 73,
> -Larry/NE1S
The first commercial use of SSB was around 1920 for transatlantic telephone
links using VLF. Even the tallest tower in the world would be only a tiny
fraction of a wave length at those frequencies. The bandwidth was too narrow
to pass both sidebands, but they found that they could get by transmitting
only one. Thus, the sideband filter was the antenna itself! The balanced
modulator circuit was known during the WW1 era. I have seen descriptions of
the circuit in old radio books of that day.
The first SSB ham rig was described in a series of construction articles in
R/9 magazine in 1933 and 1934. I have the issues with the articles.
A lot of to-day's Hammy Hambones think that SSB was invented during or
shortly after WW2.
Don k4kyv
___
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Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
Bernie Doran wrote:
> Hi Larry: what a dinosaur!!! you might even be older that I am. I
> have not heard an 80 AM station since 1950s. but that sure qualifies
> for a few feet. I wonder if anyone ever thought there was something
> wrong with their xmtr. bet you could tell them that you are setting it
> for side band the way TV does!! Bernie
Hi Bernie!
Yep, vestigial sideband.
Nope, you're older, but I probably have older gear!
The first time I got a report like that I didn't think much of it. The
second time it was from I a guy whose technical expertise I knew and
trusted, so I took it as accurate. At first I couldn't think what might
make a classic plate-modulated class C transmitter have asymmetric
sidebands, and wasn't coming up with anything for a satisfying
explanation (mobile transmitter was/is an Elmac A-54H, class C 807
modulated by pair of 5881s). Then I though about how sharp the antenna
tuned, and I came to the conclusion the antenna was acting as a sideband
filter - albeit not a terribly effective one (assuming you wanted SSB -
but who would want that? ;-))
73 and hope to talk to you on the air again this fall/winter,
-Larry/NE1S
> - Original Message - From: "Larry Szendrei"
> To: "Discussion of AM Radio in the Amateur Service"
>
> Sent: Tuesday, June 22, 2010 12:19 PM
> Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
>
>
>>> There have been some interesting cases with short loaded antennas
>>> in the BC band, the bandwidth has occasionally been so narrow that
>>> the AM
>>> sidebands become attenuated! Not going to see that effect in the
>>> amateur
>>> bands unless someone is running an antenna only a few feet long!!
>>
>> Correct. This has been observed on my 75M AM mobile signal, with reports
>> of one sideband being attenuated relative to the other. Antenna is a
>> Webster bandpanner ("a few feet long").
>>
>> 73,
>> -Larry/NE1S
>
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Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
Hi Larry: what a dinosaur!!! you might even be older that I am. I have not
heard an 80 AM station since 1950s. but that sure qualifies for a few feet.
I wonder if anyone ever thought there was something wrong with their xmtr.
bet you could tell them that you are setting it for side band the way TV
does!! Bernie
- Original Message -
From: "Larry Szendrei"
To: "Discussion of AM Radio in the Amateur Service"
Sent: Tuesday, June 22, 2010 12:19 PM
Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
>> There have been some interesting cases with short loaded antennas
>> in the BC band, the bandwidth has occasionally been so narrow that the AM
>> sidebands become attenuated! Not going to see that effect in the amateur
>> bands unless someone is running an antenna only a few feet long!!
>
> Correct. This has been observed on my 75M AM mobile signal, with reports
> of one sideband being attenuated relative to the other. Antenna is a
> Webster bandpanner ("a few feet long").
>
> 73,
> -Larry/NE1S
>
> --
> Pay a visit to my amateur radio web page at:
> ne1s.rfburn.org
> __
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Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
The other interesting thing about HiQ antennas is that the final must be neutralized very well else it will tend go into some weird oscillations with the slightest mistuning and may oscillator with modulation or at least have significant phasing products causing the signal to be much wider than it otherwise would be. I am not sure, in the case where neutralization is perfect, if HiQ tuning would cause phasing products with modulation near the slope of the tuning curve or not. It seems to me that it would, but the attenuation of the slope may cover that up. John -Original Message- From: amradio-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:amradio-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of D. Chester Sent: Tuesday, June 22, 2010 10:36 AM To: amradio@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Antennas > There have been some interesting cases with short loaded antennas > in the BC band, the bandwidth has occasionally been so narrow that the AM > sidebands become attenuated! Not going to see that effect in the amateur > bands unless someone is running an antenna only a few feet long!! > Bernie W8RPW I almost have that situation on 160m when I use my 80m dipole, fed with open wire line and balanced tuner. I can move maybe +/- 5 kHz before I have to retune. Using that antenna set-up is like being crystal controlled, since I have to go down to the tower to re-set the tuner. Hopefully, by upcoming season I'll have my remote tuning system, with reversible DC motor, so I'll at least be able to QSY within the same band without a trip to t he tower. I hope to eventually make it so I can change bands remotely as well. Don k4kyv ___ This message was typed using the DVORAK keyboard layout. http://www.mwbrooks.com/dvorak/ http://gigliwood.com/abcd/ __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
> There have been some interesting cases with short loaded antennas
> in the BC band, the bandwidth has occasionally been so narrow that the AM
> sidebands become attenuated! Not going to see that effect in the amateur
> bands unless someone is running an antenna only a few feet long!!
Correct. This has been observed on my 75M AM mobile signal, with reports
of one sideband being attenuated relative to the other. Antenna is a
Webster bandpanner ("a few feet long").
73,
-Larry/NE1S
--
Pay a visit to my amateur radio web page at:
ne1s.rfburn.org
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Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
well Don, The good thing about that is it must be fairly efficient. That thing is probably only a few ohms R and a bunch of x, any significant series r would make it wider, sort of like a 100 ft run of small coax and an SWR of " only 4 to 1 on 28 mc." it could be a dead short on the antenna end. 80 has been so noisy lately that I have about given up. Bernie W8RPW Original Message - From: "D. Chester" To: Sent: Tuesday, June 22, 2010 11:35 AM Subject: Re: [AMRadio] Antennas >> There have been some interesting cases with short loaded antennas >> in the BC band, the bandwidth has occasionally been so narrow that the AM >> sidebands become attenuated! Not going to see that effect in the amateur >> bands unless someone is running an antenna only a few feet long!! >> Bernie W8RPW > > I almost have that situation on 160m when I use my 80m dipole, fed with > open wire line and balanced tuner. I can move maybe +/- 5 kHz before I > have > to retune. Using that antenna set-up is like being crystal controlled, > since I have to go down to the tower to re-set the tuner. > > Hopefully, by upcoming season I'll have my remote tuning system, with > reversible DC motor, so I'll at least be able to QSY within the same band > without a trip to t he tower. I hope to eventually make it so I can > change > bands remotely as well. > > > Don k4kyv > > > > > > > ___ > > This message was typed using the DVORAK keyboard layout. > > http://www.mwbrooks.com/dvorak/ > http://gigliwood.com/abcd/ > > __ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
> There have been some interesting cases with short loaded antennas > in the BC band, the bandwidth has occasionally been so narrow that the AM > sidebands become attenuated! Not going to see that effect in the amateur > bands unless someone is running an antenna only a few feet long!! > Bernie W8RPW I almost have that situation on 160m when I use my 80m dipole, fed with open wire line and balanced tuner. I can move maybe +/- 5 kHz before I have to retune. Using that antenna set-up is like being crystal controlled, since I have to go down to the tower to re-set the tuner. Hopefully, by upcoming season I'll have my remote tuning system, with reversible DC motor, so I'll at least be able to QSY within the same band without a trip to t he tower. I hope to eventually make it so I can change bands remotely as well. Don k4kyv ___ This message was typed using the DVORAK keyboard layout. http://www.mwbrooks.com/dvorak/ http://gigliwood.com/abcd/ __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
One of the challenges of AM is that because the power is spread amongst carrier and two sidebands the power transfer from the rig to the sky has to be maximized in order to have quality QSOs as opposed to "Sorry OM dinner bell, gotta go." Ur Carolina Windom is too low, especially at the ends where you are loosing a lot of power to ground due to coupling. It may seem to be okay because if condx are good and/or you are operating cw or ssb you may be told you are "booming in" by a polite operator but if at that moment you could do an a/b with the antenna Bernie recommends I guarantee you'd probably gain 10 dB. Those C.W. antennas use baluns (another power waster) so you will be far better off with a 1/2 wave 75 m. dipole fed in the center with open wire feed and a Johnson KW matchbox or some other link coupled tuner, i.e. the antenna Bernie described. Get it up at least 50 feet and you will be amazed. Don't get me wrong, it won't be a 75 meter dx antenna; it will still be a cloud burner but the loss to ground will be way lower and with 100 to 200 watts carrier you will have a pretty strapping signal unless condx are really bad (like they have been lately). If you can go higher that's even better. 73 Rob K5UJ On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 7:56 AM, Brian - KF5CCN wrote: > I have a Carolina Windom Dipole I use on AM and SSB, oriented with ends N/S > at about a 30 deg. downward slope and ends 4 ft. above ground. I get good > reception and coverage all around the compass. But on AM I seem to be week on > AM toward Dallas and Oklahoma. I "boom in" on 75 meters in Dallas, OK, LA, > MS, and other states. > Is there a particular antenna and/or antenna configuration that is more > effective on AM? I know RF is RF, but, I am still learning. > > Thanks and 73 > Brian/KF5CCN > > __ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
The problem is not the antenna but the fact that compared to SSB you need 4 times the AM power to sound as strong. If you want a stronger signal and have the room, put up a half wave dipole with a reflector behing it to beam your signal to Dallas. That said, the configuration of your windom is like an inverted Vee and you sacrifice signal strength in the broadside direction to gain more omni-directional coverage. IIRC, Cebik said the windom in inverted Vee was about 85% as effective as in the flattop installation. My Carolina Windom worked like gangbusters when I was in Alabama and up in the 70 foot level between the trees. Here it is at 30 feet, no tall trees, and works ho-hum. Any antenna is better than no antenna. Don W4BWS/HC4 From: Brian - KF5CCN To: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net Sent: Mon, June 21, 2010 7:56:30 AM Subject: [AMRadio] Antennas I have a Carolina Windom Dipole I use on AM and SSB, oriented with ends N/S at about a 30 deg. downward slope and ends 4 ft. above ground. I get good reception and coverage all around the compass. But on AM I seem to be week on AM toward Dallas and Oklahoma. I "boom in" on 75 meters in Dallas, OK, LA, MS, and other states. Is there a particular antenna and/or antenna configuration that is more effective on AM? I know RF is RF, but, I am still learning. Thanks and 73 Brian/KF5CCN __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] Antennas
Brian, you are correct RF is RF, for all practical purposes that will be no detectable difference between AM or SSB for amateur use. however, I have little faith in the efficiency of so called multiband antennas. I strongly favor a " simple dipole" or a wire about 1/2 wave or more fed in the center with open wire feeders from a good tuner like the old Johnson match box. It does sound like your antenna is very low and that has a major impact on impedance and bandwidth. sure would help if you could get it up to 40 feet or so. There have been some interesting cases with short loaded antennas in the BC band, the bandwidth has occasionally been so narrow that the AM sidebands become attenuated! Not going to see that effect in the amateur bands unless someone is running an antenna only a few feet long!! I assume you are feeding with coax, hopefully the large stuff like RG8. If there is a balon transformer involved, they really do not like strange impedance loads attached to them. They really are a transmission line transformer and have been misused horribly! Bernie W8RPW - Original Message - From: "Brian - KF5CCN" To: Sent: Monday, June 21, 2010 8:56 AM Subject: [AMRadio] Antennas >I have a Carolina Windom Dipole I use on AM and SSB, oriented with ends N/S >at about a 30 deg. downward slope and ends 4 ft. above ground. I get good >reception and coverage all around the compass. But on AM I seem to be week >on AM toward Dallas and Oklahoma. I "boom in" on 75 meters in Dallas, OK, >LA, MS, and other states. > Is there a particular antenna and/or antenna configuration that is more > effective on AM? I know RF is RF, but, I am still learning. > > Thanks and 73 > Brian/KF5CCN > > __ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] antennas
Eddy, As a long-time re-modeling contractor in South Texas, I've seen silicone fail as a sealant more times than it was successful! Silicone makes a great gasket if firmly sandwiched between solid surfaces,but in the extreme heat and humidity here, it loses adhesion, and wicks water if left exposed. Best tip I've used is to apply black electrical tape upside- down over just the connection, follow up with coax-seal, etc. Cover with self-vulcanizing rubber tape, and spray paint. The up-side-down tape helps keep goo out of the threads, and the paint stops all UV. Also, never liked the thought of Acetic acid around coax braid.hi 73 es GL de AD5HR Jon --- On Sun, 10/18/09, Edward Swynar wrote: > From: Edward Swynar > Subject: Re: [AMRadio] antennas > To: "Discussion of AM Radio in the Amateur Service" > Date: Sunday, October 18, 2009, 10:49 AM > Hi Bob, > > I have never, ever seen silicone decomponse / deteriorate > in > sunlight---ever. I believe it's because there's no plastic > in it, per se, > which is affected (in time) by UV rays... > > Anyway, it works---AND it's cheap, AND it's readily > available! Hi Hi. > > ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ > > > * > > > - Original Message - > From: "Rob Atkinson" > To: "Discussion of AM Radio in the Amateur Service" > > Sent: Sunday, October 18, 2009 10:57 AM > Subject: Re: [AMRadio] antennas > > > > Eddy, > > > > I had wondered why no one had mentioned a simple tube > of silicone from > > the hardware store and was about to but you took the > words out of my > > mouth. I was starting to think there was some > gotcha associated with > > it that I didn't know about, but I've been using it > outside with no > > problems. Maybe it breaks down in sunlight? > > > > 73 > > > > Rob > > K5UJ > > > > On Sun, Oct 18, 2009 at 7:26 AM, Edward Swynar > wrote: > > > Hi Guys, > > > > > > Contrary to "...tribal knowledge", I insist that > clear silicone > > > sealant---G.E. brand, whatever---still can't be > beat on applications > that > > > are out-of-doors & in the open...! > > > > > > I smear it all over my PL-259 connectors---and > then some---that I use to > > > hook-up my feeders to the bases / tuning networks > of my extended > inverted > > > "L" arrays for 160-meters here: in the open air, > there are no noxious / > > > corrosive fumes to contend with... > > > > > > In the Spring, when it's time to roll-up the > radials & store away the > tuning > > > networks, I simply get an X-acto knife & make > a slit into the silicone > the > > > length of the connector, then peel the whole > thing off in one piece. > > > > > > It's cheap, effective, and never allows water > entry into the > "works"---even > > > when buried for (literally) months at a time > under a foot & more of > snow! > > > > > > I concur, however, with the "dangerous" potential > side-effects of > > > silicone...case in point: one Field Day, many > moons ago, I used silicone > as > > > an adhesive to anchor a small air-variable > capacitor down securely > inside a > > > Tupperware enclosure, used to tune a delta loop > on 40. It was a dewey > damp > > > Sunday morning when we opened-up the Tupperware > lid to se why the tuning > of > > > our antenna had gone awry...to our surprise, the > rotor blades of the > > > capacitor were completely coated in rust! > > > > > > Our only conclusion was that the noxious, > vinegar-like smell of the > > > silicone, in a sealed environment, had somehow > "attacked" the steel > > > capacitor, & aged it by a quantum leap! > > > > > > Used outdoors & in the open, however, I've > never had that problem... > > > > > > ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ > > > > > > __ > > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > > AMRadio mailing list > > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ > > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > > Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net > > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ
Re: [AMRadio] antennas
Okay Eddy FB thanks, Rob / K5UJ On Sun, Oct 18, 2009 at 10:49 AM, Edward Swynar wrote: > Hi Bob, > > I have never, ever seen silicone decomponse / deteriorate in > sunlight---ever. I believe it's because there's no plastic in it, per se, > which is affected (in time) by UV rays... > > Anyway, it works---AND it's cheap, AND it's readily available! Hi Hi. > > ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ > > > * > > > - Original Message - > From: "Rob Atkinson" > To: "Discussion of AM Radio in the Amateur Service" > > Sent: Sunday, October 18, 2009 10:57 AM > Subject: Re: [AMRadio] antennas > > >> Eddy, >> >> I had wondered why no one had mentioned a simple tube of silicone from >> the hardware store and was about to but you took the words out of my >> mouth. I was starting to think there was some gotcha associated with >> it that I didn't know about, but I've been using it outside with no >> problems. Maybe it breaks down in sunlight? >> >> 73 >> >> Rob >> K5UJ >> >> On Sun, Oct 18, 2009 at 7:26 AM, Edward Swynar wrote: >> > Hi Guys, >> > >> > Contrary to "...tribal knowledge", I insist that clear silicone >> > sealant---G.E. brand, whatever---still can't be beat on applications > that >> > are out-of-doors & in the open...! >> > >> > I smear it all over my PL-259 connectors---and then some---that I use to >> > hook-up my feeders to the bases / tuning networks of my extended > inverted >> > "L" arrays for 160-meters here: in the open air, there are no noxious / >> > corrosive fumes to contend with... >> > >> > In the Spring, when it's time to roll-up the radials & store away the > tuning >> > networks, I simply get an X-acto knife & make a slit into the silicone > the >> > length of the connector, then peel the whole thing off in one piece. >> > >> > It's cheap, effective, and never allows water entry into the > "works"---even >> > when buried for (literally) months at a time under a foot & more of > snow! >> > >> > I concur, however, with the "dangerous" potential side-effects of >> > silicone...case in point: one Field Day, many moons ago, I used silicone > as >> > an adhesive to anchor a small air-variable capacitor down securely > inside a >> > Tupperware enclosure, used to tune a delta loop on 40. It was a dewey > damp >> > Sunday morning when we opened-up the Tupperware lid to se why the tuning > of >> > our antenna had gone awry...to our surprise, the rotor blades of the >> > capacitor were completely coated in rust! >> > >> > Our only conclusion was that the noxious, vinegar-like smell of the >> > silicone, in a sealed environment, had somehow "attacked" the steel >> > capacitor, & aged it by a quantum leap! >> > >> > Used outdoors & in the open, however, I've never had that problem... >> > >> > ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ >> > >> __ >> Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net >> AMRadio mailing list >> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ >> List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html >> List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio >> Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net >> To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with >> the word unsubscribe in the message body. >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> > > > __ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] antennas
Hi Bob, I have never, ever seen silicone decomponse / deteriorate in sunlight---ever. I believe it's because there's no plastic in it, per se, which is affected (in time) by UV rays... Anyway, it works---AND it's cheap, AND it's readily available! Hi Hi. ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ * - Original Message - From: "Rob Atkinson" To: "Discussion of AM Radio in the Amateur Service" Sent: Sunday, October 18, 2009 10:57 AM Subject: Re: [AMRadio] antennas > Eddy, > > I had wondered why no one had mentioned a simple tube of silicone from > the hardware store and was about to but you took the words out of my > mouth. I was starting to think there was some gotcha associated with > it that I didn't know about, but I've been using it outside with no > problems. Maybe it breaks down in sunlight? > > 73 > > Rob > K5UJ > > On Sun, Oct 18, 2009 at 7:26 AM, Edward Swynar wrote: > > Hi Guys, > > > > Contrary to "...tribal knowledge", I insist that clear silicone > > sealant---G.E. brand, whatever---still can't be beat on applications that > > are out-of-doors & in the open...! > > > > I smear it all over my PL-259 connectors---and then some---that I use to > > hook-up my feeders to the bases / tuning networks of my extended inverted > > "L" arrays for 160-meters here: in the open air, there are no noxious / > > corrosive fumes to contend with... > > > > In the Spring, when it's time to roll-up the radials & store away the tuning > > networks, I simply get an X-acto knife & make a slit into the silicone the > > length of the connector, then peel the whole thing off in one piece. > > > > It's cheap, effective, and never allows water entry into the "works"---even > > when buried for (literally) months at a time under a foot & more of snow! > > > > I concur, however, with the "dangerous" potential side-effects of > > silicone...case in point: one Field Day, many moons ago, I used silicone as > > an adhesive to anchor a small air-variable capacitor down securely inside a > > Tupperware enclosure, used to tune a delta loop on 40. It was a dewey damp > > Sunday morning when we opened-up the Tupperware lid to se why the tuning of > > our antenna had gone awry...to our surprise, the rotor blades of the > > capacitor were completely coated in rust! > > > > Our only conclusion was that the noxious, vinegar-like smell of the > > silicone, in a sealed environment, had somehow "attacked" the steel > > capacitor, & aged it by a quantum leap! > > > > Used outdoors & in the open, however, I've never had that problem... > > > > ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ > > > __ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] antennas
Eddy, I had wondered why no one had mentioned a simple tube of silicone from the hardware store and was about to but you took the words out of my mouth. I was starting to think there was some gotcha associated with it that I didn't know about, but I've been using it outside with no problems. Maybe it breaks down in sunlight? 73 Rob K5UJ On Sun, Oct 18, 2009 at 7:26 AM, Edward Swynar wrote: > Hi Guys, > > Contrary to "...tribal knowledge", I insist that clear silicone > sealant---G.E. brand, whatever---still can't be beat on applications that > are out-of-doors & in the open...! > > I smear it all over my PL-259 connectors---and then some---that I use to > hook-up my feeders to the bases / tuning networks of my extended inverted > "L" arrays for 160-meters here: in the open air, there are no noxious / > corrosive fumes to contend with... > > In the Spring, when it's time to roll-up the radials & store away the tuning > networks, I simply get an X-acto knife & make a slit into the silicone the > length of the connector, then peel the whole thing off in one piece. > > It's cheap, effective, and never allows water entry into the "works"---even > when buried for (literally) months at a time under a foot & more of snow! > > I concur, however, with the "dangerous" potential side-effects of > silicone...case in point: one Field Day, many moons ago, I used silicone as > an adhesive to anchor a small air-variable capacitor down securely inside a > Tupperware enclosure, used to tune a delta loop on 40. It was a dewey damp > Sunday morning when we opened-up the Tupperware lid to se why the tuning of > our antenna had gone awry...to our surprise, the rotor blades of the > capacitor were completely coated in rust! > > Our only conclusion was that the noxious, vinegar-like smell of the > silicone, in a sealed environment, had somehow "attacked" the steel > capacitor, & aged it by a quantum leap! > > Used outdoors & in the open, however, I've never had that problem... > > ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ > __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] antennas
Hi Guys, Contrary to "...tribal knowledge", I insist that clear silicone sealant---G.E. brand, whatever---still can't be beat on applications that are out-of-doors & in the open...! I smear it all over my PL-259 connectors---and then some---that I use to hook-up my feeders to the bases / tuning networks of my extended inverted "L" arrays for 160-meters here: in the open air, there are no noxious / corrosive fumes to contend with... In the Spring, when it's time to roll-up the radials & store away the tuning networks, I simply get an X-acto knife & make a slit into the silicone the length of the connector, then peel the whole thing off in one piece. It's cheap, effective, and never allows water entry into the "works"---even when buried for (literally) months at a time under a foot & more of snow! I concur, however, with the "dangerous" potential side-effects of silicone...case in point: one Field Day, many moons ago, I used silicone as an adhesive to anchor a small air-variable capacitor down securely inside a Tupperware enclosure, used to tune a delta loop on 40. It was a dewey damp Sunday morning when we opened-up the Tupperware lid to se why the tuning of our antenna had gone awry...to our surprise, the rotor blades of the capacitor were completely coated in rust! Our only conclusion was that the noxious, vinegar-like smell of the silicone, in a sealed environment, had somehow "attacked" the steel capacitor, & aged it by a quantum leap! Used outdoors & in the open, however, I've never had that problem... ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ - Original Message - From: "BILL GUYGER" To: "Discussion of AM Radio in the Amateur Service" Sent: Sunday, October 18, 2009 12:18 AM Subject: Re: [AMRadio] antennas > I missed the original post, but this thread seems to be about sealing coax connectors. I have started using 3M Scotchfil which is an electrical insulating "putty" that comes in 1" wide rolls. It's the same stuff that Andrew sells as "Vaporwrap" except that instead of being in sheet form it is 1" tape as noted. > > Scotchfil is available from any electrical supply and I think Home Depot carries it too. These putty style tapes and sheets flow under pressure to fill all gaps and really work well. They of course require plastic electrical tape to be applied over them to apply that pressure, and the trick is to apply a layer of the electrical tape directly to the connector before putting the Scotchfil or Vaporwrap on. This keeps the gooie tape from oozing into the threads which makes things easier when you have to remove the connector. > > Bill AD5OL > > > > > ____ > From: Jim Wilhite > To: Discussion of AM Radio in the Amateur Service > Sent: Saturday, October 17, 2009 4:12:49 PM > Subject: Re: [AMRadio] antennas > > Hi Paul, > > Tacky tape is almost like Coax Seal in appearance and consistency. The > stuff I have is 1/2" wide and probably near 1/16" thick. I found this > by accident as well and did a search for it based on the name on the > cardboard roller at the center of the roll. Here is the website for it > so you can read it. > > http://tacky-tape.com/ > > __ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] antennas
I buy a product that is sold at a local mobile home supply store. It's the same thing as coax seal. It comes in a 1 inch by 25ft long roll. $16.00, it's also a little thicker than coax seal. Works very well. Dave W9WRL.com Jim Whiteley wrote: > Hi Paul, > > Tacky tape is almost like Coax Seal in appearance and consistency. The > stuff I have is 1/2" wide and probably near 1/16" thick. I found this > by accident as well and did a search for it based on the name on the > cardboard roller at the center of the roll. Here is the website for it > so you can read it. > > http://tacky-tape.com/ > > It is made by a company called Schnee-Morehead and works well. They > sell stuff to the military and other companies like one would expect, > but I didn't delve into the differences of the various types. After > finding it for sale in several places, I checked prices and being a > notoriously cheap ham found it less expensive so I thought I would pass > the information along. > > Given it appears that it is going to be a long winter, I felt it best to > do things now while it is very nice, even by Oklahoma standards. > > 73 > > Jim/W5JO > > > - Original Message - > > > > >> Jim, >> >> You've done well to get to your antenna maintenance before it's so >> cold the soldering gun won't even work (has felt like that anyway). >> >> I googled the "Tacky Tape" to see if it's the same stuff I'm thinking >> about, and nothing came up to match what I also will pass along -- >> >> "Rescue Tape" is one brand of some self-fusing tape that you can wrap >> connections with and it cuts off cleanly, as opposed to Coax-Seal and >> other variants of sealant. >> >> This stuff, and there are websites describing it fully, stretches >> significantly to apply layer pressure on the wrap, and then it fuses >> to itself like a self-vulcanizing patch. >> >> I originally got onto it when I found a case of it at a state surplus >> warehouse. Military nomenclature, and it had a taper to it where the >> center thickness was perhaps twice that of the edges, so it would >> feather along nicely and not bunch up. >> >> Excellent dielectric too, and apparently they've improved it today >> from the early stuff. The directions back then said to wrap it with >> conventinal electrical tape to prevent UV deterioration, but now I see >> it has inhibitors built-in. >> >> Don't know about a cost comparison, but anything that's watertight, >> physically strong, and non-corrosive (unlike silicon seal) is worth it >> to me. >> >> Best wishes >> >> Paul >> > > __ > Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net > AMRadio mailing list > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ > List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html > List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio > Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net > To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with > the word unsubscribe in the message body. > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > > > __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] antennas
I missed the original post, but this thread seems to be about sealing coax connectors. I have started using 3M Scotchfil which is an electrical insulating "putty" that comes in 1" wide rolls. It's the same stuff that Andrew sells as "Vaporwrap" except that instead of being in sheet form it is 1" tape as noted. Scotchfil is available from any electrical supply and I think Home Depot carries it too. These putty style tapes and sheets flow under pressure to fill all gaps and really work well. They of course require plastic electrical tape to be applied over them to apply that pressure, and the trick is to apply a layer of the electrical tape directly to the connector before putting the Scotchfil or Vaporwrap on. This keeps the gooie tape from oozing into the threads which makes things easier when you have to remove the connector. Bill AD5OL From: Jim Wilhite To: Discussion of AM Radio in the Amateur Service Sent: Saturday, October 17, 2009 4:12:49 PM Subject: Re: [AMRadio] antennas Hi Paul, Tacky tape is almost like Coax Seal in appearance and consistency. The stuff I have is 1/2" wide and probably near 1/16" thick. I found this by accident as well and did a search for it based on the name on the cardboard roller at the center of the roll. Here is the website for it so you can read it. http://tacky-tape.com/ __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] antennas
Hi Paul, Tacky tape is almost like Coax Seal in appearance and consistency. The stuff I have is 1/2" wide and probably near 1/16" thick. I found this by accident as well and did a search for it based on the name on the cardboard roller at the center of the roll. Here is the website for it so you can read it. http://tacky-tape.com/ It is made by a company called Schnee-Morehead and works well. They sell stuff to the military and other companies like one would expect, but I didn't delve into the differences of the various types. After finding it for sale in several places, I checked prices and being a notoriously cheap ham found it less expensive so I thought I would pass the information along. Given it appears that it is going to be a long winter, I felt it best to do things now while it is very nice, even by Oklahoma standards. 73 Jim/W5JO - Original Message - > Jim, > > You've done well to get to your antenna maintenance before it's so > cold the soldering gun won't even work (has felt like that anyway). > > I googled the "Tacky Tape" to see if it's the same stuff I'm thinking > about, and nothing came up to match what I also will pass along -- > > "Rescue Tape" is one brand of some self-fusing tape that you can wrap > connections with and it cuts off cleanly, as opposed to Coax-Seal and > other variants of sealant. > > This stuff, and there are websites describing it fully, stretches > significantly to apply layer pressure on the wrap, and then it fuses > to itself like a self-vulcanizing patch. > > I originally got onto it when I found a case of it at a state surplus > warehouse. Military nomenclature, and it had a taper to it where the > center thickness was perhaps twice that of the edges, so it would > feather along nicely and not bunch up. > > Excellent dielectric too, and apparently they've improved it today > from the early stuff. The directions back then said to wrap it with > conventinal electrical tape to prevent UV deterioration, but now I see > it has inhibitors built-in. > > Don't know about a cost comparison, but anything that's watertight, > physically strong, and non-corrosive (unlike silicon seal) is worth it > to me. > > Best wishes > > Paul __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [AMRadio] antennas
Jim, You've done well to get to your antenna maintenance before it's so cold the soldering gun won't even work (has felt like that anyway). I googled the "Tacky Tape" to see if it's the same stuff I'm thinking about, and nothing came up to match what I also will pass along -- "Rescue Tape" is one brand of some self-fusing tape that you can wrap connections with and it cuts off cleanly, as opposed to Coax-Seal and other variants of sealant. This stuff, and there are websites describing it fully, stretches significantly to apply layer pressure on the wrap, and then it fuses to itself like a self-vulcanizing patch. I originally got onto it when I found a case of it at a state surplus warehouse. Military nomenclature, and it had a taper to it where the center thickness was perhaps twice that of the edges, so it would feather along nicely and not bunch up. Excellent dielectric too, and apparently they've improved it today from the early stuff. The directions back then said to wrap it with conventinal electrical tape to prevent UV deterioration, but now I see it has inhibitors built-in. Don't know about a cost comparison, but anything that's watertight, physically strong, and non-corrosive (unlike silicon seal) is worth it to me. Best wishes Paul __ Our Main Website: http://www.amfone.net AMRadio mailing list Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/amradio@mailman.qth.net/ List Rules (must read!): http://w5ami.net/amradiofaq.html List Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/amradio Post: AMRadio@mailman.qth.net To unsubscribe, send an email to amradio-requ...@mailman.qth.net with the word unsubscribe in the message body. This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
