Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
But that would kill config.xml. I agree about not wanting to go down the road of making everyone happy. Right now though I think we can please 2 folks - the brand new folks (with the default hello world) and those who are experienced (bare bones mostly empty index.html). On 7/13/13 11:41 AM, "Anis KADRI" wrote: >or just `rm -rf www/*` if you don't like the default app. > >Trying to please everyone you'll end up either pleasing no one or >complicating things. > > >On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 3:14 PM, Wargo, John wrote: > >> cordova create [--shellOnly] >>
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
Michael, tell me how you feel after you *aren't* a new user. ;) That was my point. The project is cool when you start, but after that, it is just clutter imo. On 7/12/13 12:26 AM, "Michael Jackson" wrote: >I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it helped me >understand how to get started with it. > >-- >Michael Jackson >@mjackson > > >On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden wrote: > >>
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
Anis, if it was just a matter of blank-or-default-only that would be fine, but I think we do want a way to start with arbitrary app, and so "blank" is just one extra option (Can even be implemented not as a cli special case, but just as an app template referenced by the already planned generic implementation). -Michal On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 12:41 PM, Anis KADRI wrote: > or just `rm -rf www/*` if you don't like the default app. > > Trying to please everyone you'll end up either pleasing no one or > complicating things. > > > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 3:14 PM, Wargo, John wrote: > > > cordova create [--shellOnly] > > > > > > -Original Message- > > From: Carlos Santana [mailto:csantan...@gmail.com] > > Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 7:09 AM > > To: dev@cordova.apache.org > > Subject: Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project > > > > can it be an option to the cordova cli? > > cordova create [--noHelloApp] > > or > > cordova create [--blankIndexHTML] > > > > You get the point > > > > I vote for default to have defaultApp included. > > It provides gratification of every "Hello World" gives when starting with > > something new. > > > > > > > > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 1:26 AM, Michael Jackson > >wrote: > > > > > I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it helped me > > > understand how to get started with it. > > > > > > -- > > > Michael Jackson > > > @mjackson > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden > wrote: > > > > > > > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks > > think > > > > about the following: > > > > > > > > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be > > > > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely > > unnecessary > > > > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for > > folks > > > > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get > started > > > > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, > and > > JS > > > > used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be > > over > > > > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then > > > > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue > hits > > me > > > > more often than normal probably. > > > > > > > > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this > > before), > > > > but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Carlos Santana > > > > >
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
or just `rm -rf www/*` if you don't like the default app. Trying to please everyone you'll end up either pleasing no one or complicating things. On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 3:14 PM, Wargo, John wrote: > cordova create [--shellOnly] > > > -Original Message- > From: Carlos Santana [mailto:csantan...@gmail.com] > Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 7:09 AM > To: dev@cordova.apache.org > Subject: Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project > > can it be an option to the cordova cli? > cordova create [--noHelloApp] > or > cordova create [--blankIndexHTML] > > You get the point > > I vote for default to have defaultApp included. > It provides gratification of every "Hello World" gives when starting with > something new. > > > > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 1:26 AM, Michael Jackson >wrote: > > > I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it helped me > > understand how to get started with it. > > > > -- > > Michael Jackson > > @mjackson > > > > > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden wrote: > > > > > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks > think > > > about the following: > > > > > > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be > > > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely > unnecessary > > > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for > folks > > > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get started > > > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, and > JS > > > used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be > over > > > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then > > > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue hits > me > > > more often than normal probably. > > > > > > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this > before), > > > but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Carlos Santana > >
RE: Wondering what folks think about the default project
cordova create [--shellOnly] -Original Message- From: Carlos Santana [mailto:csantan...@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 7:09 AM To: dev@cordova.apache.org Subject: Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project can it be an option to the cordova cli? cordova create [--noHelloApp] or cordova create [--blankIndexHTML] You get the point I vote for default to have defaultApp included. It provides gratification of every "Hello World" gives when starting with something new. On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 1:26 AM, Michael Jackson wrote: > I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it helped me > understand how to get started with it. > > -- > Michael Jackson > @mjackson > > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden wrote: > > > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks think > > about the following: > > > > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be > > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely unnecessary > > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for folks > > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get started > > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, and JS > > used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be over > > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then > > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue hits me > > more often than normal probably. > > > > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this before), > > but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? > > > > > -- Carlos Santana
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
My bad, sorry for the mixup.
On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 12:01 PM, Brian LeRoux wrote:
> Indeed you did. I was responding to Michal.
>
> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 8:48 AM, Shazron wrote:
> > Brian, The discussion is in the mailing list as I mentioned, we can
> > continue there.
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 8:45 AM, Brian LeRoux wrote:
> >
> >> Well, hold on, mailing list is totally a valid place for discussion!
> >> The issue tracker is where stuff thats been agreed upon should happen.
> >> That said, I think we agree we'd like a path for project generation.
> >>
> >>
> >> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 8:03 AM, Michal Mocny
> wrote:
> >> > Agree with Shaz, most of these thoughts already addressed in that bug.
> >> > Please add further opinions about specifics there.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 10:48 AM, Shazron wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> Might be worth chiming in on the CB-4153 thread on this ML ("app"
> folder
> >> >> concept)
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:39 AM, Brian LeRoux wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> > In an earlier incarnation of Cordova the CLI had a a --recipe flag.
> >> That
> >> >> > could be modified to accept a path or a Git repo. This would retain
> >> the
> >> >> > existing and fulfill Ray's use case.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Thoughts?
> >> >> > On Jul 12, 2013 7:34 AM, "Lucas Holmquist"
> >> wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> > > +1 to keeping the default template, but the ability to change
> it if
> >> >> you
> >> >> > > want to
> >> >> > > On Jul 12, 2013, at 10:18 AM, Shazron wrote:
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > > Carlos I think that is essentially what others have proposed
> here
> >> -
> >> >> > > specify
> >> >> > > > a template to use.
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > > Personally I like the default project to still be the default,
> if
> >> >> only
> >> >> > > for
> >> >> > > > the majority of our users who are not more experienced
> >> programmers.
> >> >> > More
> >> >> > > > experienced programmers will not be put off by specifying a
> >> template
> >> >> > > option
> >> >> > > > for a blank template, IMO (but for less experienced people, I
> >> contend
> >> >> > it
> >> >> > > is
> >> >> > > > the reverse).
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > > While helping users troubleshoot in the Google Groups, or
> >> >> investigating
> >> >> > > > bugs in JIRA, I often tell a user to create a new project (thus
> >> using
> >> >> > the
> >> >> > > > default template) and isolate their bug there, so we have a
> common
> >> >> base
> >> >> > > to
> >> >> > > > verify and test bugs.
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:09 AM, Carlos Santana <
> >> >> csantan...@gmail.com
> >> >> > > >wrote:
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > >> can it be an option to the cordova cli?
> >> >> > > >> cordova create [--noHelloApp]
> >> >> > > >> or
> >> >> > > >> cordova create [--blankIndexHTML]
> >> >> > > >>
> >> >> > > >> You get the point
> >> >> > > >>
> >> >> > > >> I vote for default to have defaultApp included.
> >> >> > > >> It provides gratification of every "Hello World" gives when
> >> starting
> >> >> > > with
> >> >> > > >> something new.
> >> >> > > >>
> >> >> > > >>
> >> >> > > >>
> >> >> > > >> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 1:26 AM, Michael Jackson <
> >> >> > mjijack...@gmail.com
> >> >> > > >>> wrote:
> >> >> > > >>
> >> >> > > >>> I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it
> >> helped
> >> >> > me
> >> >> > > >>> understand how to get started with it.
> >> >> > > >>>
> >> >> > > >>> --
> >> >> > > >>> Michael Jackson
> >> >> > > >>> @mjackson
> >> >> > > >>>
> >> >> > > >>>
> >> >> > > >>> On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden <
> >> rayca...@adobe.com>
> >> >> > > wrote:
> >> >> > > >>>
> >> >> > > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what
> do
> >> >> folks
> >> >> > > >> think
> >> >> > > about the following:
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the
> >> CLI
> >> >> be
> >> >> > > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely
> >> >> > > >> unnecessary
> >> >> > > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great
> example
> >> for
> >> >> > > >> folks
> >> >> > > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to
> get
> >> >> > started
> >> >> > > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the
> HTML,
> >> CSS,
> >> >> > and
> >> >> > > >> JS
> >> >> > > used in the default then it does to create a new project.
> Not
> >> to
> >> >> be
> >> >> > > >> over
> >> >> > > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for
> >> me.
> >> >> > Then
> >> >> > > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this
> >> issue
> >> >> > hits
> >> >> > > >> me
> >> >> > > more often than normal probably.
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on
> this
> >> >> > > >> before),
> >> >> > > but shouldn't the default be something better for
>
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
Indeed you did. I was responding to Michal.
On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 8:48 AM, Shazron wrote:
> Brian, The discussion is in the mailing list as I mentioned, we can
> continue there.
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 8:45 AM, Brian LeRoux wrote:
>
>> Well, hold on, mailing list is totally a valid place for discussion!
>> The issue tracker is where stuff thats been agreed upon should happen.
>> That said, I think we agree we'd like a path for project generation.
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 8:03 AM, Michal Mocny wrote:
>> > Agree with Shaz, most of these thoughts already addressed in that bug.
>> > Please add further opinions about specifics there.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 10:48 AM, Shazron wrote:
>> >
>> >> Might be worth chiming in on the CB-4153 thread on this ML ("app" folder
>> >> concept)
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:39 AM, Brian LeRoux wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > In an earlier incarnation of Cordova the CLI had a a --recipe flag.
>> That
>> >> > could be modified to accept a path or a Git repo. This would retain
>> the
>> >> > existing and fulfill Ray's use case.
>> >> >
>> >> > Thoughts?
>> >> > On Jul 12, 2013 7:34 AM, "Lucas Holmquist"
>> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > > +1 to keeping the default template, but the ability to change it if
>> >> you
>> >> > > want to
>> >> > > On Jul 12, 2013, at 10:18 AM, Shazron wrote:
>> >> > >
>> >> > > > Carlos I think that is essentially what others have proposed here
>> -
>> >> > > specify
>> >> > > > a template to use.
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > > Personally I like the default project to still be the default, if
>> >> only
>> >> > > for
>> >> > > > the majority of our users who are not more experienced
>> programmers.
>> >> > More
>> >> > > > experienced programmers will not be put off by specifying a
>> template
>> >> > > option
>> >> > > > for a blank template, IMO (but for less experienced people, I
>> contend
>> >> > it
>> >> > > is
>> >> > > > the reverse).
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > > While helping users troubleshoot in the Google Groups, or
>> >> investigating
>> >> > > > bugs in JIRA, I often tell a user to create a new project (thus
>> using
>> >> > the
>> >> > > > default template) and isolate their bug there, so we have a common
>> >> base
>> >> > > to
>> >> > > > verify and test bugs.
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:09 AM, Carlos Santana <
>> >> csantan...@gmail.com
>> >> > > >wrote:
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > >> can it be an option to the cordova cli?
>> >> > > >> cordova create [--noHelloApp]
>> >> > > >> or
>> >> > > >> cordova create [--blankIndexHTML]
>> >> > > >>
>> >> > > >> You get the point
>> >> > > >>
>> >> > > >> I vote for default to have defaultApp included.
>> >> > > >> It provides gratification of every "Hello World" gives when
>> starting
>> >> > > with
>> >> > > >> something new.
>> >> > > >>
>> >> > > >>
>> >> > > >>
>> >> > > >> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 1:26 AM, Michael Jackson <
>> >> > mjijack...@gmail.com
>> >> > > >>> wrote:
>> >> > > >>
>> >> > > >>> I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it
>> helped
>> >> > me
>> >> > > >>> understand how to get started with it.
>> >> > > >>>
>> >> > > >>> --
>> >> > > >>> Michael Jackson
>> >> > > >>> @mjackson
>> >> > > >>>
>> >> > > >>>
>> >> > > >>> On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden <
>> rayca...@adobe.com>
>> >> > > wrote:
>> >> > > >>>
>> >> > > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do
>> >> folks
>> >> > > >> think
>> >> > > about the following:
>> >> > >
>> >> > > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the
>> CLI
>> >> be
>> >> > > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely
>> >> > > >> unnecessary
>> >> > > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example
>> for
>> >> > > >> folks
>> >> > > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get
>> >> > started
>> >> > > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML,
>> CSS,
>> >> > and
>> >> > > >> JS
>> >> > > used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not
>> to
>> >> be
>> >> > > >> over
>> >> > > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for
>> me.
>> >> > Then
>> >> > > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this
>> issue
>> >> > hits
>> >> > > >> me
>> >> > > more often than normal probably.
>> >> > >
>> >> > > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this
>> >> > > >> before),
>> >> > > but shouldn't the default be something better for developers?
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > > >>>
>> >> > > >>
>> >> > > >>
>> >> > > >>
>> >> > > >> --
>> >> > > >> Carlos Santana
>> >> > > >>
>> >> > > >>
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> >
>> >>
>>
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
Brian, The discussion is in the mailing list as I mentioned, we can
continue there.
On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 8:45 AM, Brian LeRoux wrote:
> Well, hold on, mailing list is totally a valid place for discussion!
> The issue tracker is where stuff thats been agreed upon should happen.
> That said, I think we agree we'd like a path for project generation.
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 8:03 AM, Michal Mocny wrote:
> > Agree with Shaz, most of these thoughts already addressed in that bug.
> > Please add further opinions about specifics there.
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 10:48 AM, Shazron wrote:
> >
> >> Might be worth chiming in on the CB-4153 thread on this ML ("app" folder
> >> concept)
> >>
> >>
> >> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:39 AM, Brian LeRoux wrote:
> >>
> >> > In an earlier incarnation of Cordova the CLI had a a --recipe flag.
> That
> >> > could be modified to accept a path or a Git repo. This would retain
> the
> >> > existing and fulfill Ray's use case.
> >> >
> >> > Thoughts?
> >> > On Jul 12, 2013 7:34 AM, "Lucas Holmquist"
> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > +1 to keeping the default template, but the ability to change it if
> >> you
> >> > > want to
> >> > > On Jul 12, 2013, at 10:18 AM, Shazron wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > > Carlos I think that is essentially what others have proposed here
> -
> >> > > specify
> >> > > > a template to use.
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Personally I like the default project to still be the default, if
> >> only
> >> > > for
> >> > > > the majority of our users who are not more experienced
> programmers.
> >> > More
> >> > > > experienced programmers will not be put off by specifying a
> template
> >> > > option
> >> > > > for a blank template, IMO (but for less experienced people, I
> contend
> >> > it
> >> > > is
> >> > > > the reverse).
> >> > > >
> >> > > > While helping users troubleshoot in the Google Groups, or
> >> investigating
> >> > > > bugs in JIRA, I often tell a user to create a new project (thus
> using
> >> > the
> >> > > > default template) and isolate their bug there, so we have a common
> >> base
> >> > > to
> >> > > > verify and test bugs.
> >> > > >
> >> > > >
> >> > > > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:09 AM, Carlos Santana <
> >> csantan...@gmail.com
> >> > > >wrote:
> >> > > >
> >> > > >> can it be an option to the cordova cli?
> >> > > >> cordova create [--noHelloApp]
> >> > > >> or
> >> > > >> cordova create [--blankIndexHTML]
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> You get the point
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> I vote for default to have defaultApp included.
> >> > > >> It provides gratification of every "Hello World" gives when
> starting
> >> > > with
> >> > > >> something new.
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 1:26 AM, Michael Jackson <
> >> > mjijack...@gmail.com
> >> > > >>> wrote:
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >>> I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it
> helped
> >> > me
> >> > > >>> understand how to get started with it.
> >> > > >>>
> >> > > >>> --
> >> > > >>> Michael Jackson
> >> > > >>> @mjackson
> >> > > >>>
> >> > > >>>
> >> > > >>> On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden <
> rayca...@adobe.com>
> >> > > wrote:
> >> > > >>>
> >> > > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do
> >> folks
> >> > > >> think
> >> > > about the following:
> >> > >
> >> > > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the
> CLI
> >> be
> >> > > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely
> >> > > >> unnecessary
> >> > > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example
> for
> >> > > >> folks
> >> > > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get
> >> > started
> >> > > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML,
> CSS,
> >> > and
> >> > > >> JS
> >> > > used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not
> to
> >> be
> >> > > >> over
> >> > > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for
> me.
> >> > Then
> >> > > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this
> issue
> >> > hits
> >> > > >> me
> >> > > more often than normal probably.
> >> > >
> >> > > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this
> >> > > >> before),
> >> > > but shouldn't the default be something better for developers?
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > >>>
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> --
> >> > > >> Carlos Santana
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >>
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> >
> >>
>
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
Well, hold on, mailing list is totally a valid place for discussion!
The issue tracker is where stuff thats been agreed upon should happen.
That said, I think we agree we'd like a path for project generation.
On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 8:03 AM, Michal Mocny wrote:
> Agree with Shaz, most of these thoughts already addressed in that bug.
> Please add further opinions about specifics there.
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 10:48 AM, Shazron wrote:
>
>> Might be worth chiming in on the CB-4153 thread on this ML ("app" folder
>> concept)
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:39 AM, Brian LeRoux wrote:
>>
>> > In an earlier incarnation of Cordova the CLI had a a --recipe flag. That
>> > could be modified to accept a path or a Git repo. This would retain the
>> > existing and fulfill Ray's use case.
>> >
>> > Thoughts?
>> > On Jul 12, 2013 7:34 AM, "Lucas Holmquist" wrote:
>> >
>> > > +1 to keeping the default template, but the ability to change it if
>> you
>> > > want to
>> > > On Jul 12, 2013, at 10:18 AM, Shazron wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > Carlos I think that is essentially what others have proposed here -
>> > > specify
>> > > > a template to use.
>> > > >
>> > > > Personally I like the default project to still be the default, if
>> only
>> > > for
>> > > > the majority of our users who are not more experienced programmers.
>> > More
>> > > > experienced programmers will not be put off by specifying a template
>> > > option
>> > > > for a blank template, IMO (but for less experienced people, I contend
>> > it
>> > > is
>> > > > the reverse).
>> > > >
>> > > > While helping users troubleshoot in the Google Groups, or
>> investigating
>> > > > bugs in JIRA, I often tell a user to create a new project (thus using
>> > the
>> > > > default template) and isolate their bug there, so we have a common
>> base
>> > > to
>> > > > verify and test bugs.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:09 AM, Carlos Santana <
>> csantan...@gmail.com
>> > > >wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > >> can it be an option to the cordova cli?
>> > > >> cordova create [--noHelloApp]
>> > > >> or
>> > > >> cordova create [--blankIndexHTML]
>> > > >>
>> > > >> You get the point
>> > > >>
>> > > >> I vote for default to have defaultApp included.
>> > > >> It provides gratification of every "Hello World" gives when starting
>> > > with
>> > > >> something new.
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 1:26 AM, Michael Jackson <
>> > mjijack...@gmail.com
>> > > >>> wrote:
>> > > >>
>> > > >>> I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it helped
>> > me
>> > > >>> understand how to get started with it.
>> > > >>>
>> > > >>> --
>> > > >>> Michael Jackson
>> > > >>> @mjackson
>> > > >>>
>> > > >>>
>> > > >>> On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden
>> > > wrote:
>> > > >>>
>> > > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do
>> folks
>> > > >> think
>> > > about the following:
>> > >
>> > > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI
>> be
>> > > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely
>> > > >> unnecessary
>> > > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for
>> > > >> folks
>> > > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get
>> > started
>> > > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS,
>> > and
>> > > >> JS
>> > > used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to
>> be
>> > > >> over
>> > > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me.
>> > Then
>> > > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue
>> > hits
>> > > >> me
>> > > more often than normal probably.
>> > >
>> > > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this
>> > > >> before),
>> > > but shouldn't the default be something better for developers?
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > >>>
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >> --
>> > > >> Carlos Santana
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>>
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
Agree with Shaz, most of these thoughts already addressed in that bug.
Please add further opinions about specifics there.
On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 10:48 AM, Shazron wrote:
> Might be worth chiming in on the CB-4153 thread on this ML ("app" folder
> concept)
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:39 AM, Brian LeRoux wrote:
>
> > In an earlier incarnation of Cordova the CLI had a a --recipe flag. That
> > could be modified to accept a path or a Git repo. This would retain the
> > existing and fulfill Ray's use case.
> >
> > Thoughts?
> > On Jul 12, 2013 7:34 AM, "Lucas Holmquist" wrote:
> >
> > > +1 to keeping the default template, but the ability to change it if
> you
> > > want to
> > > On Jul 12, 2013, at 10:18 AM, Shazron wrote:
> > >
> > > > Carlos I think that is essentially what others have proposed here -
> > > specify
> > > > a template to use.
> > > >
> > > > Personally I like the default project to still be the default, if
> only
> > > for
> > > > the majority of our users who are not more experienced programmers.
> > More
> > > > experienced programmers will not be put off by specifying a template
> > > option
> > > > for a blank template, IMO (but for less experienced people, I contend
> > it
> > > is
> > > > the reverse).
> > > >
> > > > While helping users troubleshoot in the Google Groups, or
> investigating
> > > > bugs in JIRA, I often tell a user to create a new project (thus using
> > the
> > > > default template) and isolate their bug there, so we have a common
> base
> > > to
> > > > verify and test bugs.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:09 AM, Carlos Santana <
> csantan...@gmail.com
> > > >wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> can it be an option to the cordova cli?
> > > >> cordova create [--noHelloApp]
> > > >> or
> > > >> cordova create [--blankIndexHTML]
> > > >>
> > > >> You get the point
> > > >>
> > > >> I vote for default to have defaultApp included.
> > > >> It provides gratification of every "Hello World" gives when starting
> > > with
> > > >> something new.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 1:26 AM, Michael Jackson <
> > mjijack...@gmail.com
> > > >>> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>> I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it helped
> > me
> > > >>> understand how to get started with it.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> --
> > > >>> Michael Jackson
> > > >>> @mjackson
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden
> > > wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do
> folks
> > > >> think
> > > about the following:
> > >
> > > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI
> be
> > > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely
> > > >> unnecessary
> > > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for
> > > >> folks
> > > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get
> > started
> > > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS,
> > and
> > > >> JS
> > > used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to
> be
> > > >> over
> > > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me.
> > Then
> > > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue
> > hits
> > > >> me
> > > more often than normal probably.
> > >
> > > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this
> > > >> before),
> > > but shouldn't the default be something better for developers?
> > >
> > >
> > > >>>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> --
> > > >> Carlos Santana
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > >
> > >
> >
>
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
Might be worth chiming in on the CB-4153 thread on this ML ("app" folder
concept)
On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:39 AM, Brian LeRoux wrote:
> In an earlier incarnation of Cordova the CLI had a a --recipe flag. That
> could be modified to accept a path or a Git repo. This would retain the
> existing and fulfill Ray's use case.
>
> Thoughts?
> On Jul 12, 2013 7:34 AM, "Lucas Holmquist" wrote:
>
> > +1 to keeping the default template, but the ability to change it if you
> > want to
> > On Jul 12, 2013, at 10:18 AM, Shazron wrote:
> >
> > > Carlos I think that is essentially what others have proposed here -
> > specify
> > > a template to use.
> > >
> > > Personally I like the default project to still be the default, if only
> > for
> > > the majority of our users who are not more experienced programmers.
> More
> > > experienced programmers will not be put off by specifying a template
> > option
> > > for a blank template, IMO (but for less experienced people, I contend
> it
> > is
> > > the reverse).
> > >
> > > While helping users troubleshoot in the Google Groups, or investigating
> > > bugs in JIRA, I often tell a user to create a new project (thus using
> the
> > > default template) and isolate their bug there, so we have a common base
> > to
> > > verify and test bugs.
> > >
> > >
> > > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:09 AM, Carlos Santana > >wrote:
> > >
> > >> can it be an option to the cordova cli?
> > >> cordova create [--noHelloApp]
> > >> or
> > >> cordova create [--blankIndexHTML]
> > >>
> > >> You get the point
> > >>
> > >> I vote for default to have defaultApp included.
> > >> It provides gratification of every "Hello World" gives when starting
> > with
> > >> something new.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 1:26 AM, Michael Jackson <
> mjijack...@gmail.com
> > >>> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it helped
> me
> > >>> understand how to get started with it.
> > >>>
> > >>> --
> > >>> Michael Jackson
> > >>> @mjackson
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>> On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden
> > wrote:
> > >>>
> > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks
> > >> think
> > about the following:
> >
> > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be
> > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely
> > >> unnecessary
> > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for
> > >> folks
> > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get
> started
> > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS,
> and
> > >> JS
> > used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be
> > >> over
> > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me.
> Then
> > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue
> hits
> > >> me
> > more often than normal probably.
> >
> > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this
> > >> before),
> > but shouldn't the default be something better for developers?
> >
> >
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> Carlos Santana
> > >>
> > >>
> >
> >
>
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
In an earlier incarnation of Cordova the CLI had a a --recipe flag. That could be modified to accept a path or a Git repo. This would retain the existing and fulfill Ray's use case. Thoughts? On Jul 12, 2013 7:34 AM, "Lucas Holmquist" wrote: > +1 to keeping the default template, but the ability to change it if you > want to > On Jul 12, 2013, at 10:18 AM, Shazron wrote: > > > Carlos I think that is essentially what others have proposed here - > specify > > a template to use. > > > > Personally I like the default project to still be the default, if only > for > > the majority of our users who are not more experienced programmers. More > > experienced programmers will not be put off by specifying a template > option > > for a blank template, IMO (but for less experienced people, I contend it > is > > the reverse). > > > > While helping users troubleshoot in the Google Groups, or investigating > > bugs in JIRA, I often tell a user to create a new project (thus using the > > default template) and isolate their bug there, so we have a common base > to > > verify and test bugs. > > > > > > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:09 AM, Carlos Santana >wrote: > > > >> can it be an option to the cordova cli? > >> cordova create [--noHelloApp] > >> or > >> cordova create [--blankIndexHTML] > >> > >> You get the point > >> > >> I vote for default to have defaultApp included. > >> It provides gratification of every "Hello World" gives when starting > with > >> something new. > >> > >> > >> > >> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 1:26 AM, Michael Jackson >>> wrote: > >> > >>> I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it helped me > >>> understand how to get started with it. > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Michael Jackson > >>> @mjackson > >>> > >>> > >>> On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden > wrote: > >>> > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks > >> think > about the following: > > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely > >> unnecessary > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for > >> folks > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get started > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, and > >> JS > used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be > >> over > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue hits > >> me > more often than normal probably. > > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this > >> before), > but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? > > > >>> > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Carlos Santana > >> > >> > >
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
+1 to keeping the default template, but the ability to change it if you want to On Jul 12, 2013, at 10:18 AM, Shazron wrote: > Carlos I think that is essentially what others have proposed here - specify > a template to use. > > Personally I like the default project to still be the default, if only for > the majority of our users who are not more experienced programmers. More > experienced programmers will not be put off by specifying a template option > for a blank template, IMO (but for less experienced people, I contend it is > the reverse). > > While helping users troubleshoot in the Google Groups, or investigating > bugs in JIRA, I often tell a user to create a new project (thus using the > default template) and isolate their bug there, so we have a common base to > verify and test bugs. > > > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:09 AM, Carlos Santana wrote: > >> can it be an option to the cordova cli? >> cordova create [--noHelloApp] >> or >> cordova create [--blankIndexHTML] >> >> You get the point >> >> I vote for default to have defaultApp included. >> It provides gratification of every "Hello World" gives when starting with >> something new. >> >> >> >> On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 1:26 AM, Michael Jackson >> wrote: >> >>> I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it helped me >>> understand how to get started with it. >>> >>> -- >>> Michael Jackson >>> @mjackson >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden wrote: >>> I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks >> think about the following: I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely >> unnecessary after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for >> folks learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get started quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, and >> JS used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be >> over dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue hits >> me more often than normal probably. I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this >> before), but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Carlos Santana >> >>
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
Carlos I think that is essentially what others have proposed here - specify a template to use. Personally I like the default project to still be the default, if only for the majority of our users who are not more experienced programmers. More experienced programmers will not be put off by specifying a template option for a blank template, IMO (but for less experienced people, I contend it is the reverse). While helping users troubleshoot in the Google Groups, or investigating bugs in JIRA, I often tell a user to create a new project (thus using the default template) and isolate their bug there, so we have a common base to verify and test bugs. On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:09 AM, Carlos Santana wrote: > can it be an option to the cordova cli? > cordova create [--noHelloApp] > or > cordova create [--blankIndexHTML] > > You get the point > > I vote for default to have defaultApp included. > It provides gratification of every "Hello World" gives when starting with > something new. > > > > On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 1:26 AM, Michael Jackson >wrote: > > > I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it helped me > > understand how to get started with it. > > > > -- > > Michael Jackson > > @mjackson > > > > > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden wrote: > > > > > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks > think > > > about the following: > > > > > > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be > > > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely > unnecessary > > > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for > folks > > > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get started > > > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, and > JS > > > used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be > over > > > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then > > > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue hits > me > > > more often than normal probably. > > > > > > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this > before), > > > but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Carlos Santana > >
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
can it be an option to the cordova cli? cordova create [--noHelloApp] or cordova create [--blankIndexHTML] You get the point I vote for default to have defaultApp included. It provides gratification of every "Hello World" gives when starting with something new. On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 1:26 AM, Michael Jackson wrote: > I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it helped me > understand how to get started with it. > > -- > Michael Jackson > @mjackson > > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden wrote: > > > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks think > > about the following: > > > > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be > > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely unnecessary > > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for folks > > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get started > > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, and JS > > used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be over > > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then > > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue hits me > > more often than normal probably. > > > > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this before), > > but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? > > > > > -- Carlos Santana
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
I really like the default app. As a brand new cordova dev it helped me understand how to get started with it. -- Michael Jackson @mjackson On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden wrote: > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks think > about the following: > > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely unnecessary > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for folks > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get started > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, and JS > used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be over > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue hits me > more often than normal probably. > > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this before), > but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? > >
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
Michal, that's exactly what I meant. On 7/11/13 2:09 PM, "Michal Mocny" wrote: >But outside of CLI you are the one who sets up your app, right? > >This has specifically to do with the "cordova create" step starting with a >copy of helloworld which is not empty. I think. > >-Michal >
RE: Wondering what folks think about the default project
I agree, I'd prefer a clean template to use for new projects. Give people who want a example app another mechanism. All of us stripping out all of the HelloWorld code for every new project is an unnecessary use of time. John M. Wargo SAP | Charlotte, NC | USA Office: +1 704.321.0265 | Mobile: +1 704.249.7476 Email: john.wa...@sap.com Twitter: @johnwargo -Original Message- From: Ray Camden [mailto:rayca...@adobe.com] Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2013 10:29 AM To: dev@cordova.apache.org Subject: Wondering what folks think about the default project I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks think about the following: I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely unnecessary after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for folks learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get started quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, and JS used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be over dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue hits me more often than normal probably. I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this before), but shouldn't the default be something better for developers?
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
But outside of CLI you are the one who sets up your app, right? This has specifically to do with the "cordova create" step starting with a copy of helloworld which is not empty. I think. -Michal On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 2:46 PM, Jesse MacFadyen wrote: > +1 to going back to an empty page that simply includes cordova.js > This applies to more than just CLI btw, so I don't think using a flag > is the way. > > > Cheers, > Jesse > > Sent from my iPhone5 > > On Jul 11, 2013, at 11:40 AM, Shazron wrote: > > +1 for a flag for specifying the template. > Adding this for iOS is easy in the create script (just parameterize the > template folder location) > > > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 11:31 AM, Michal Mocny > wrote: > > > > Fil has mentioned that we will eventually add a way to specify the > starting > > app template (ie, the "hello world" app) at cordova create time. > > > > In mobile-chrome-apps land we do this via an optional --source=... flag, > > and it accepts a few "magic" values such as --source=spec to > automatically > > create a spec test app. Perhaps whatever upstream solution we have for > > this could also include special values such as --source=blank. > > > > -Michal > > > > > >> On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 1:50 PM, Ray Camden wrote: > >> > >> To be clear, I want it to be nothing! > >> > >> Once I know how to use PG, how does this sample app help me? It doesn't. > > I > >> have to remove the JS, remove the CSS, remove the HTML. > >> > >> This is my ideal: > >> > >> One HTML file containing: > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> That's it. Let me decide what JS file to add, what CSS file to add, etc. > >> > >>> On 7/11/13 12:37 PM, "Anis KADRI" wrote: > >>> > >>> What would be something better for developers ? Do you mean a better > >>> boilerplate app ? It used to be a sample app that uses all the APIs but > >>> people thought that was too complicated and didn't look good. Most of > > the > >>> time it was broken too because it didn't get updated with newer > > releases. > >>> > >>> > >>> On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden > > wrote: > >>> > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks > think > about the following: > > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely > > unnecessary > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for > > folks > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get started > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, and > JS > used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be > > over > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue hits > me > more often than normal probably. > > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this > > before), > but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? > > >
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
+1 to going back to an empty page that simply includes cordova.js This applies to more than just CLI btw, so I don't think using a flag is the way. Cheers, Jesse Sent from my iPhone5 On Jul 11, 2013, at 11:40 AM, Shazron wrote: +1 for a flag for specifying the template. Adding this for iOS is easy in the create script (just parameterize the template folder location) > On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 11:31 AM, Michal Mocny wrote: > > Fil has mentioned that we will eventually add a way to specify the starting > app template (ie, the "hello world" app) at cordova create time. > > In mobile-chrome-apps land we do this via an optional --source=... flag, > and it accepts a few "magic" values such as --source=spec to automatically > create a spec test app. Perhaps whatever upstream solution we have for > this could also include special values such as --source=blank. > > -Michal > > >> On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 1:50 PM, Ray Camden wrote: >> >> To be clear, I want it to be nothing! >> >> Once I know how to use PG, how does this sample app help me? It doesn't. > I >> have to remove the JS, remove the CSS, remove the HTML. >> >> This is my ideal: >> >> One HTML file containing: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> That's it. Let me decide what JS file to add, what CSS file to add, etc. >> >>> On 7/11/13 12:37 PM, "Anis KADRI" wrote: >>> >>> What would be something better for developers ? Do you mean a better >>> boilerplate app ? It used to be a sample app that uses all the APIs but >>> people thought that was too complicated and didn't look good. Most of > the >>> time it was broken too because it didn't get updated with newer > releases. >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden > wrote: >>> I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks think about the following: I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely > unnecessary after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for > folks learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get started quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, and JS used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be > over dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue hits me more often than normal probably. I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this > before), but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? >
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
Is that all filed as an issue? Im forgetful :P On 7/11/13 11:31 AM, "Michal Mocny" wrote: >Fil has mentioned that we will eventually add a way to specify the >starting >app template (ie, the "hello world" app) at cordova create time. > >In mobile-chrome-apps land we do this via an optional --source=... flag, >and it accepts a few "magic" values such as --source=spec to automatically >create a spec test app. Perhaps whatever upstream solution we have for >this could also include special values such as --source=blank. > >-Michal > > >On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 1:50 PM, Ray Camden wrote: > >> To be clear, I want it to be nothing! >> >> Once I know how to use PG, how does this sample app help me? It >>doesn't. I >> have to remove the JS, remove the CSS, remove the HTML. >> >> This is my ideal: >> >> One HTML file containing: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> That's it. Let me decide what JS file to add, what CSS file to add, etc. >> >> On 7/11/13 12:37 PM, "Anis KADRI" wrote: >> >> >What would be something better for developers ? Do you mean a better >> >boilerplate app ? It used to be a sample app that uses all the APIs but >> >people thought that was too complicated and didn't look good. Most of >>the >> >time it was broken too because it didn't get updated with newer >>releases. >> > >> > >> >On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden >>wrote: >> > >> >> I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks >> >>think >> >> about the following: >> >> >> >> I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be >> >> changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely >>unnecessary >> >> after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for >>folks >> >> learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get >>started >> >> quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, >>and >> >>JS >> >> used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be >>over >> >> dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then >> >> again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue >>hits >> >>me >> >> more often than normal probably. >> >> >> >> I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this >>before), >> >> but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? >> >> >> >> >> >>
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
Couldn't find an open issue, created CB-4153 and assigned to Fil for now. -Michal On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 2:39 PM, Shazron wrote: > +1 for a flag for specifying the template. > Adding this for iOS is easy in the create script (just parameterize the > template folder location) > > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 11:31 AM, Michal Mocny > wrote: > > > Fil has mentioned that we will eventually add a way to specify the > starting > > app template (ie, the "hello world" app) at cordova create time. > > > > In mobile-chrome-apps land we do this via an optional --source=... flag, > > and it accepts a few "magic" values such as --source=spec to > automatically > > create a spec test app. Perhaps whatever upstream solution we have for > > this could also include special values such as --source=blank. > > > > -Michal > > > > > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 1:50 PM, Ray Camden wrote: > > > > > To be clear, I want it to be nothing! > > > > > > Once I know how to use PG, how does this sample app help me? It > doesn't. > > I > > > have to remove the JS, remove the CSS, remove the HTML. > > > > > > This is my ideal: > > > > > > One HTML file containing: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's it. Let me decide what JS file to add, what CSS file to add, > etc. > > > > > > On 7/11/13 12:37 PM, "Anis KADRI" wrote: > > > > > > >What would be something better for developers ? Do you mean a better > > > >boilerplate app ? It used to be a sample app that uses all the APIs > but > > > >people thought that was too complicated and didn't look good. Most of > > the > > > >time it was broken too because it didn't get updated with newer > > releases. > > > > > > > > > > > >On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden > > wrote: > > > > > > > >> I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks > > > >>think > > > >> about the following: > > > >> > > > >> I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be > > > >> changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely > > unnecessary > > > >> after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for > > folks > > > >> learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get > started > > > >> quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, > and > > > >>JS > > > >> used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be > > over > > > >> dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. > Then > > > >> again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue > hits > > > >>me > > > >> more often than normal probably. > > > >> > > > >> I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this > > before), > > > >> but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? > > > >> > > > >> > > > > > > > > >
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
+1 for a flag for specifying the template. Adding this for iOS is easy in the create script (just parameterize the template folder location) On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 11:31 AM, Michal Mocny wrote: > Fil has mentioned that we will eventually add a way to specify the starting > app template (ie, the "hello world" app) at cordova create time. > > In mobile-chrome-apps land we do this via an optional --source=... flag, > and it accepts a few "magic" values such as --source=spec to automatically > create a spec test app. Perhaps whatever upstream solution we have for > this could also include special values such as --source=blank. > > -Michal > > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 1:50 PM, Ray Camden wrote: > > > To be clear, I want it to be nothing! > > > > Once I know how to use PG, how does this sample app help me? It doesn't. > I > > have to remove the JS, remove the CSS, remove the HTML. > > > > This is my ideal: > > > > One HTML file containing: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's it. Let me decide what JS file to add, what CSS file to add, etc. > > > > On 7/11/13 12:37 PM, "Anis KADRI" wrote: > > > > >What would be something better for developers ? Do you mean a better > > >boilerplate app ? It used to be a sample app that uses all the APIs but > > >people thought that was too complicated and didn't look good. Most of > the > > >time it was broken too because it didn't get updated with newer > releases. > > > > > > > > >On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden > wrote: > > > > > >> I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks > > >>think > > >> about the following: > > >> > > >> I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be > > >> changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely > unnecessary > > >> after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for > folks > > >> learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get started > > >> quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, and > > >>JS > > >> used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be > over > > >> dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then > > >> again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue hits > > >>me > > >> more often than normal probably. > > >> > > >> I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this > before), > > >> but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? > > >> > > >> > > > > >
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
I'd be cool with a command line flag and having the default be as it is. For folks who care (like me ;) I'd just remember to add the flag. On 7/11/13 1:31 PM, "Michal Mocny" wrote: >Fil has mentioned that we will eventually add a way to specify the >starting >app template (ie, the "hello world" app) at cordova create time. > >In mobile-chrome-apps land we do this via an optional --source=... flag, >and it accepts a few "magic" values such as --source=spec to automatically >create a spec test app. Perhaps whatever upstream solution we have for >this could also include special values such as --source=blank. > >-Michal > > >On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 1:50 PM, Ray Camden wrote: > >> To be clear, I want it to be nothing! >> >> Once I know how to use PG, how does this sample app help me? It >>doesn't. I >> have to remove the JS, remove the CSS, remove the HTML. >> >> This is my ideal: >> >> One HTML file containing: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> That's it. Let me decide what JS file to add, what CSS file to add, etc. >> >> On 7/11/13 12:37 PM, "Anis KADRI" wrote: >> >> >What would be something better for developers ? Do you mean a better >> >boilerplate app ? It used to be a sample app that uses all the APIs but >> >people thought that was too complicated and didn't look good. Most of >>the >> >time it was broken too because it didn't get updated with newer >>releases. >> > >> > >> >On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden >>wrote: >> > >> >> I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks >> >>think >> >> about the following: >> >> >> >> I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be >> >> changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely >>unnecessary >> >> after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for >>folks >> >> learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get >>started >> >> quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, >>and >> >>JS >> >> used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be >>over >> >> dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then >> >> again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue >>hits >> >>me >> >> more often than normal probably. >> >> >> >> I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this >>before), >> >> but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? >> >> >> >> >> >>
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
Fil has mentioned that we will eventually add a way to specify the starting app template (ie, the "hello world" app) at cordova create time. In mobile-chrome-apps land we do this via an optional --source=... flag, and it accepts a few "magic" values such as --source=spec to automatically create a spec test app. Perhaps whatever upstream solution we have for this could also include special values such as --source=blank. -Michal On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 1:50 PM, Ray Camden wrote: > To be clear, I want it to be nothing! > > Once I know how to use PG, how does this sample app help me? It doesn't. I > have to remove the JS, remove the CSS, remove the HTML. > > This is my ideal: > > One HTML file containing: > > > > > > > > > > > > That's it. Let me decide what JS file to add, what CSS file to add, etc. > > On 7/11/13 12:37 PM, "Anis KADRI" wrote: > > >What would be something better for developers ? Do you mean a better > >boilerplate app ? It used to be a sample app that uses all the APIs but > >people thought that was too complicated and didn't look good. Most of the > >time it was broken too because it didn't get updated with newer releases. > > > > > >On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden wrote: > > > >> I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks > >>think > >> about the following: > >> > >> I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be > >> changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely unnecessary > >> after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for folks > >> learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get started > >> quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, and > >>JS > >> used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be over > >> dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then > >> again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue hits > >>me > >> more often than normal probably. > >> > >> I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this before), > >> but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? > >> > >> > >
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
To be clear, I want it to be nothing! Once I know how to use PG, how does this sample app help me? It doesn't. I have to remove the JS, remove the CSS, remove the HTML. This is my ideal: One HTML file containing: That's it. Let me decide what JS file to add, what CSS file to add, etc. On 7/11/13 12:37 PM, "Anis KADRI" wrote: >What would be something better for developers ? Do you mean a better >boilerplate app ? It used to be a sample app that uses all the APIs but >people thought that was too complicated and didn't look good. Most of the >time it was broken too because it didn't get updated with newer releases. > > >On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden wrote: > >> I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks >>think >> about the following: >> >> I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be >> changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely unnecessary >> after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for folks >> learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get started >> quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, and >>JS >> used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be over >> dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then >> again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue hits >>me >> more often than normal probably. >> >> I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this before), >> but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? >> >>
Re: Wondering what folks think about the default project
What would be something better for developers ? Do you mean a better boilerplate app ? It used to be a sample app that uses all the APIs but people thought that was too complicated and didn't look good. Most of the time it was broken too because it didn't get updated with newer releases. On Thu, Jul 11, 2013 at 10:28 AM, Ray Camden wrote: > I can add this as a Jira item if it makes sense, but, what do folks think > about the following: > > I'd like to propose that the 'default' PG app created by the CLI be > changed. Right now it is cool. Looks neat. But is completely unnecessary > after you've after learned how to use PG. It's a great example for folks > learning PG, but for those of us who know and just want to get started > quickly, it actually takes me more time to *remove* the HTML, CSS, and JS > used in the default then it does to create a new project. Not to be over > dramatic, but it really is the worst part of the process for me. Then > again, I tend to make quite a few POCs with the CLI so this issue hits me > more often than normal probably. > > I know the CLI is just copying a template (I've blogged on this before), > but shouldn't the default be something better for developers? > >
