Re: [EVDL] Most efficient drive system for a bicycle/tricycle.

[harry henderson via EV]

i ruled out recumbent trikes a long time ago for the same reasons, now if you 
want maximum visibility check out my ride

http://www.evalbum.com/4414 

harry Albuquerque, NM current bike:  http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1179 
current non-bike: http://evalbum.com/1000


On Mon, 5/29/17, Robert Bruninga via EV  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [EVDL] Most efficient drive system for a bicycle/tricycle.
 To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" 
 Date: Monday, May 29, 2017, 8:56 AM
 
 I bought a 3 wheel recumbent and
 the first thing I wanted to do was
 increase
 it's top speed above 20 MPH.  Having ridden a bike all
 my life, I
 figured it was no big deal...
 
 Once I got it, I rode it the
 next day AS-IS on my 15 mile rail-to-trail
 commute just to see how it rode, and I never
 rode it again.  20 MPH was
 scarry.  THe
 turning radius was worse than my prius.  My head was below
 the
 top of the wheels of massive cars next
 to me (on the 1 mile at the start it
 takes
 me to get to the trail).  That same mile had no sidewalks
 or sholders.
 
 Plus with
 three wheels you can be guaranteed to hit EVRY pothole and
 bump
 which are impossible to miss.  and
 Finally, I felt so vulnerable sitting
 just 1
 foot off the pavement and no emergency escape capability
 whatsoever.  On a vertical 2-wheel, I feel I
 can hit and roll, or avoid, or
 veer, or lay
 it down... all kinds of escape manevres.  Absoolutely
 none
 with a recumbent.  You are dead
 meat.
 
 Just a surprising
 awakening...
 
 Bob
 
 On Sun, May 28, 2017 at 4:04
 PM, Michael Ross via EV 
 wrote:
 
 > In
 many states there is a limit to the speed a pedal assisted
 motorized
 > bicycle can legally achieve
 on level ground. 20mph is common. What you can
 > hit on a downhill is not considered.
 >
 > You will find it
 difficult to get gearing that will provide a 30mph top
 > speed and allow enough torque at a
 standstill to start off with even the
 >
 slightest incline.  Since you are a fairly heavy pilot (and
 with the added
 > battery weight) this
 will be additionally difficult. You will have some
 > trouble finding hub motors (wherever you
 actually mount them, these are
 > your
 better choices) with useful gearing and that can take
 repeated
 > application of starting torque
 from you and the motor together.  Starting
 > off is you worst condition
 structurally.
 >
 > I
 think you want to investigate RC controller electronics
 (Kelley has stuff
 > that works). You did
 not say what sort of range you wish. A reasonable
 > starting point might be 10 miles on a
 charge. I was commuting 25 miles each
 >
 way with an Organic Transit ELF for a year. Battery-ing up
 for that was
 > costly. The ELF is a lot
 heavier due to substantial body work. Remember not
 > to let fully charged Li-ion cells too get
 hot.  Don't charge in the hot sun
 >
 and leave it all sitting out to broil.  It will ruin the
 cells, LiFePo
 > particularly. 100F or
 less only when fully charged.
 >
 > As trike user, I always thought a trailer
 with a pusher motor would bee a
 > good
 arrangement. It allows you to dispense with the electric
 drive when
 > that makes sense. You will
 have an easier time creating an experimental
 > test chassis and battery mounting means if
 it is not stuck onto a severely
 > space
 constrained and less than heartily built compact
 tricycle.
 >
 > Also the
 system can be switch from trike to trike or bike.
 >
 > I say this with
 significant knowledge of recumbent trike design.  I own
 a
 > Greenspeed touring trike (20003
 vintage GTO) which is considerably larger
 > and stouter than a Terratrike.
 >
 > I would also advocate
 a streamlined tailbox of some sort to improve drag. A
 > front fairing provides less improvement
 for the cost and effort compared to
 > a
 tail box. Full streamlining is of course the best
 solution.  People have
 > maintained
 45mph hour speeds for an hour with a good full fairing
 (level
 > ground).
 >
 > I have been to SF where I believe you
 live. Respectfully and as one who
 > used
 to ride off weighing 250 pounds, I think will be
 disappointed with how
 > a recumbent trike
 functions with the steep grades you will encounter (until
 > you reduce your body weight below 200
 pounds or less).  Even then it will
 > be
 quite strenuous and at time daunting.
 >
 >
 >
 There a folks in CA that have done a lot of the ground work
 for this.  You
 > would get ahead meeting
 and cultivating them. William Patterson  at UC
 > Irvine or Davis, I forget, used to teach
 ME classes on single track
 > recumbent
 design. Those classes spawned a host of smart recumbent
 builders.
 >
 > Good
 luck.
 >
 > On Sun, May
 28, 2017 at 3:19 PM, Russ Sciville via EV 
 > wrote:
 >
 > > I can vouch for the Lynch motor as I
 use one on my ride on mower.Using
 > >
 three 90Ah 12v Pb cells it easily cuts for 20 minutes or
 more at time.
 > > A brilliantly simple
 

[EVDL] looking for cheap load tester for trojan T125 6v floodies

[harry henderson via EV]

the 16 trojan T125 6v floodies in my bradley are 5 years old with around 5k-10k 
miles on them, however, because of abuse and negligent some to all of them need 
replaced.  i am retireing my 69 bus that has 20 trojan T125 6v floodies from 
the same pallet and those batteries are in better shape.  i would like to have 
an easy and cheap way to find the best 16 batteries out of those 36.  would 
specific gravity be enough or should i get a load tester?  if i need a load 
tester would either of these below suffice to at least let me rank the 
batteries.  i don't think either are perfect solutions but maybe good enough to 
weed out the worst of the batteries?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Battery-Load-Tester-100-Amp-Load-Type-6V-12V-Mechanics-6-12-Volt-Car-Truck-/400774129287?hash=item5d4fffe687:g:I-gAAOSwhQhYyBBw

http://www.ebay.com/itm/6V-12V-500-Amp-Carbon-Pile-Battery-Load-Tester-Alternator-Starter-1000A-Testing-/400801422805?hash=item5d51a05dd5:g:EFEAAOSw8w1YBSTQ

harry Albuquerque, NM current bike:  http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1179 
current non-bike: http://evalbum.com/1000
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Re: [EVDL] Watt-Hr Motorcycle Efficiency...

[harry henderson via EV]

my bike gets about 200 watt per mile

harry Albuquerque, NM current bike:  http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1179 
current non-bike: http://evalbum.com/1000


On Thu, 11/12/15, EVDL Administrator via EV  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [EVDL] Watt-Hr Motorcycle Efficiency...
 To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" 
 Date: Thursday, November 12, 2015, 1:23 PM
 
 On 12 Nov 2015 at 11:59,
 Ing. Marco Antonio Gaxiola via EV wrote:
 
 > Considering the rule of EVs efficiency of
 250Watt-hr per mile on a 2500 lbs
 >
 compact car,  May it apply same in order to calculate the
 energy efficiency of
 > a prototype
 motorcycle?
 
 Maybe, but
 remember that a  bike's aerodynamic qualities are
 significantly 
 worse than a car's. 
 This is because the bike's rider adds quite a bit of 
 wind resistance.
 
 Another (possibly better) way to estimate the
 EV bike's energy efficiency 
 might be to
 look at a similar ICE bike's fuel efficiency.  
 
 Taking the efficiency
 difference into account, an 8kWh lithium battery, 
 fully discharged, provides about the same range
 as a gallon of gasoline.  So 
 if your car
 got 35mpg as an ICEV, it should get around 230Wh/mi as an
 EV.  
 If your motorcycle got 100mpg as an
 ICEV, it should use around 80 Wh/mi as 
 an
 EV.
 
 Another way is to check
 the EV Album for similar vehicles.  For example:
 
 http://evalbum.com/5125
 
 This is a 450lb conversion
 bike with an 84v, 30ah (2520Wh) LiFePO4 battery. 
 The range is listed as 40mi, so that's 63
 Wh/mi.
 
 Or this one:
 
 http://evalbum.com/5128
 
 This has a 768Wh battery and a
 range of 15 miles for an energy usage of 51.2 
 Wh/mi.  However, the top speed is only 35mph,
 so the bikes' relatively poor 
 aerodynamics may not play a very large role
 here.
 
 This bike can do
 60mph:
 
 http://evalbum.com/5114
 
 Even though it weighs only
 176lb, it has a 3990 (!) Wh battery and a range 
 of 50 miles, which works out to about 80
 Wh/mi.  
 
 David Roden -
 Akron, Ohio, USA
 EVDL Administrator
 
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Re: [EVDL] EV facts, coal and shooting ourselves in the foot

[harry henderson via EV]

it is also possible for the % of EV owners who have solar panels to drop and 
for dirty energy to also drop, for example, if 100% of people drove electric 
but only 25% of them have solar then the % of dirty energy would drop since so 
many people are now using renewables.

while that might be an extreme scenario, the fact is as more and more people 
put up solar panels the % use of dirty energy will drop thus even if the % of 
EV owners putting up solar drops becuase we will still be using less dirty 
energy.  

but as many pointed out i also think % of solar of by EV owners will go up, 
solar is cheaper than grid [but it requires an initial investment] but the 
credit you get from buying an EV will cover a PV system that will provide more 
power than your EV needs 

harry

Albuquerque, NM
current bike:  http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1179
current non-bike: http://evalbum.com/1000


On Sat, 8/15/15, tomw via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote:

 Subject: Re: [EVDL] EV facts, coal and shooting ourselves in the foot
 To: ev@lists.evdl.org
 Date: Saturday, August 15, 2015, 8:02 AM
 
 /You may power your
 EV from the dirty power in your state, but studies in
 2012 showed about 50% of EV owners charged
 their cars from 100% renewable
 solar or
 wind./  
 
 I
 didn't say I powered my EV from the grid, you just made
 that assumption
 and acted on it without
 bothering to check if it was correct.  Actually, I
 installed solar in 2008 the year before I
 converted the car, and supply the
 grid with
 6kWh/day on average in addition to supplying the house and
 car. 
 Most of the people in the local ev
 club do not have solar so I give the
 representative case, and also mention mine gets
 power from solar.
 
 /Now just last week (2015) the Ford
 survey found that 83% of EV purchasers
 charge from 100% renewables or will when they
 can. So quoting the grid mix
 is doing a
 disservice to 83% of EV owners.../ 
 
 Is that survey of Ford EV
 purchasers a representative sample of all EV
 purchasers?  Ford has sold a small proportion
 of the total number of EVs
 sold.  How many
 in the survey were in the will when they can
 category, and
 how do you know they actually
 will?  You are very quick to make assumptions
 that serve your case.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 --
 View this message in context: 
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EV-facts-coal-and-shooting-ourselves-in-the-foot-tp4677154p4677170.html
 Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List
 mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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Re: [EVDL] adding solar charging to 12 volt battery on LEAF

[harry henderson via EV]

S, like i said, battery was at 4 volts and i had to jump it to start it [my 
first EV/EV jump] i had to jump it two more times that day then i got a new 
battery, however, the 'old' battery was only a month old.  as another data 
point, i did need to fill up one tire several times as it had a slow leak, 
carmax also fixed that, but i might have been using the 12 volt too much?

harry

Albuquerque, NM
current bike:  http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1179
current non-bike: http://evalbum.com/1000


On Wed, 7/15/15, Jamie K via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote:

 Subject: Re: [EVDL] adding solar charging to 12 volt battery on LEAF
 To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@lists.evdl.org
 Date: Wednesday, July 15, 2015, 8:12 AM
 
 
 As
 another data point, so far we haven't noticed any
 problems with the 
 12 volt battery in the
 2013 LEAF that we bought about a year and a half ago.
 
 What model LEAF did you buy?
 S, SV or SL?
 What symptoms have you had?
 
 Cheers,
  
 -Jamie
 
 
 On
 7/14/15 10:41 PM, harry henderson via EV wrote:
  the 2013 nissan leaf has a known issue
 with its 12 volt battery
  either by lack
 of charging or vampiric drains, i just got a 2013 leaf
  and found my 12 volt battery at 4
 something volts a couple weeks
  after i
 got it.  carmax replaced it but what they replaced was
 not
  the original battery.  the battery
 they replaced was only a month old
  and
 i don't know how many batteries this 2 year old EV has
 used in
  its 10,000 miles of life.
 
  i'm considering
 hooking up a solar charging unit to the battery.
  i've been using solar charging systems
 on my 12 volt systems as their
  only
 power source for 10 years now on my homemade EVs, however,
 this
  is a little different, since it
 supposed has a DC/DC system.  the
 
 options i've pondered include:
 
  1. add an unregulated trickle charge [but
 with diode: 1-2 watts] to
  existing
 battery 2. add a regulated [charge controller: 10-20
 watts]
  to existing battery 3. add a
 regulated [charge controller: 10-20
 
 watts] to a deep cycle [that is larger than existing
 battery, maybe
  about 30% larger]
 
  #3 is what i've
 been using very successfully for 10 years, but again
  this is different situation, eager for
 other folk's suggestions
 
  i realize this might void some or all
 warranty issues, please don't
 
 respond if that is your only contribution, thanks
 
  harry
 
  Albuquerque, NM
 current bike:  http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1179
  current non-bike: http://evalbum.com/1000
 
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[EVDL] adding solar charging to 12 volt battery on LEAF

[harry henderson via EV]

the 2013 nissan leaf has a known issue with its 12 volt battery either by lack 
of charging or vampiric drains, i just got a 2013 leaf and found my 12 volt 
battery at 4 something volts a couple weeks after i got it.  carmax replaced it 
but what they replaced was not the original battery.  the battery they replaced 
was only a month old and i don't know how many batteries this 2 year old EV has 
used in its 10,000 miles of life.

i'm considering hooking up a solar charging unit to the battery.  i've been 
using solar charging systems on my 12 volt systems as their only power source 
for 10 years now on my homemade EVs, however, this is a little different, since 
it supposed has a DC/DC system.  the options i've pondered include:

1. add an unregulated trickle charge [but with diode: 1-2 watts] to existing 
battery
2. add a regulated [charge controller: 10-20 watts] to existing battery
3. add a regulated [charge controller: 10-20 watts] to a deep cycle [that is 
larger than existing battery, maybe about 30% larger]

#3 is what i've been using very successfully for 10 years, but again this is 
different situation, eager for other folk's suggestions

i realize this might void some or all warranty issues, please don't respond if 
that is your only contribution, thanks

harry

Albuquerque, NM
current bike:  http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1179
current non-bike: http://evalbum.com/1000
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Re: [EVDL] suggestions for buying a used leaf and fed tax credits expire in ?

[harry henderson via EV]

right i know you can not use the fed tax credit on a used care, i had two two 
separate questions i should have made that clearer

harry

Albuquerque, NM
current bike:  http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1179
current non-bike: http://evalbum.com/1000


On Thu, 6/11/15, Ben Goren b...@trumpetpower.com wrote:

 Subject: Re: [EVDL] suggestions for buying a used leaf and fed tax credits 
expire in ?
 To: harry henderson hendersonmotorcyc...@yahoo.com, Electric Vehicle 
Discussion List ev@lists.evdl.org
 Date: Thursday, June 11, 2015, 2:35 PM
 
 On Jun 11, 2015, at 12:17
 PM, harry henderson via EV ev@lists.evdl.org
 wrote:
 
  i'm
 thinking about a 2013 S model right now
 
 
  also, does anyone know if the $7500
 fed tax credits will expire?
 
 The tax credit only applies to the initial
 purchase of a new vehicle from a dealer.
 
 On the other hand...you can get like-new 2013
 Leafs for $13K cash on the barrelhead, as my parents just
 did a couple weeks ago.
 
 b
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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: “Is this thing on?” Mastering the art of driving an EV

[harry henderson via EV]

just be glad the media is getting things wrong in favor of EVs for a change

harry

Albuquerque, NM
current bike:  http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1179
current non-bike: http://evalbum.com/1000


On Thu, 5/28/15, EVDL Administrator via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote:

 Subject: Re: [EVDL]EVLN: “Is this thing on?” Mastering the art of driving 
an EV
 To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@lists.evdl.org
 Date: Thursday, May 28, 2015, 2:57 PM
 
 On 28 May 2015 at 12:06,
 damon henry via EV wrote:
 
  It probably also has to do with the
 guess-o-meter syndrome found in
  many
 EV's. 
 
 I think you have
 it right.  If the remaining range meter goes up
 because 
 you drove easier, someone who
 doesn't know how it works might think the EV 
 really had more charge.
 
 We don't know who Scott Smith from
 Ford is, but you would think that if 
 he's connected with their EV program
 he'd be better informed.  Apparently 
 not.
 
 David
 Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
 EVDL
 Administrator
 
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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Muller's cross-country trip on her e-bicycle solar-trailer

[harry henderson via EV]

does anyone know if she needs housing along the way? i'm guessing not with that 
sleek website and many backers

harry

Albuquerque, NM
current bike:  http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1179
current non-bike: http://evalbum.com/1000


On Wed, 5/27/15, brucedp5 via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote:

 Subject: [EVDL] EVLN: Muller's cross-country trip on her e-bicycle
solar-trailer
 To: ev@lists.evdl.org
 Date: Wednesday, May 27, 2015, 3:34 AM
 
 
 
 
http://inmenlo.com/2015/05/20/marissa-muller-takes-off-on-cross-country-trip-riding-a-solar-powered-electric-bike/
 Marissa Muller takes off on cross country trip riding a
 solar-powered
 electric bike
 by Linda Hubbard Gulker  May 20, 2015
 
 [image  
 
http://inmenlo.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Melissa-Muller_solar-bike-ride.jpg
 Marissa Muller steadies her solar-powered electric bike
 ]
 
 Sacred Heart Prep grad Marissa Muller started her
 professional career as a
 journalist at CNN before taking a hard right turn and
 working for companies
 focused on sustainability. As she embarks from Southern
 California on
 Thursday atop a solar-charged electric bike on a
 cross-country trip — which
 she will be chronicling along the way — you could conclude
 she’s combined
 the two pursuits.
 
 “The motto for the trip is ‘get well and do well,'”
 she said. “Before I took
 my sabbatical, I’d been traveling on business three weeks
 out of the month.
 I hit a ‘soft low’ one night in eastern Idaho where I
 was terribly sick. As
 I tossed and turned and wrestled with the sheets, my mind
 wandered to the
 idea of doing a cross country trip.
 
 “I gave myself a one-week deadline to put the logistics
 together or I’d
 abandon the idea.”
 
 Using mainly LinkedIn as a way to connect with people
 separated by two or
 more degrees, she quickly lined up an engineer at the bike
 company
 Specialized and then enlisted the help of another engineer
 at Sun Power. The
 result: the pairing of an electric bicycle and a solar
 panel.
 
 A Specialized Turbo S electric bike has been re-engineered
 to rely on solar
 energy to charge the battery, which powers the electric
 assist motor, giving
 the bicycle the extra boost of power and speed. As she
 rides, the battery
 will be charged by a lightweight SunPower solar panel,
 designed with the
 same high efficiency solar technology used to generate clean
 power for
 homes, businesses and utilities around the world.
 
 Marissa, who is doing the trip solo, plans to average about
 60 miles a day,
 stopping at schools, businesses and municipalities along the
 way to talk
 about her journey before ending up in Washington, DC, where
 she will present
 what she learned along the way.
 
 She foresees three types of challenges: the elements
 themselves,
 particularly with the tornado season dragging on, sitting on
 a bike saddle
 daily for three months — “every day is a training
 day,” she says — and
 general safety.
 
 You can follow her journey across the country and get
 involved with some
 charitable aspects by visiting her website (which will go
 live May 21).
 
 Summing up the trip, she said: “It’s the ultimate
 demonstration of freedom —
 a clean, electric vehicle, powered by decentralized energy,
 and an open road
 of opportunity.”
 [© InMenlo 2015]
 
 
 
 
 For EVLN posts use:
 http://evdl.org/evln/
 
 
 {brucedp.150m.com}
 
 
 
 --
 View this message in context: 
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-Muller-s-cross-country-trip-on-her-e-bicycle-solar-trailer-tp4675779.html
 Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
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[EVDL] acquiring commercial l BEVs in non-compliance states

[harry henderson via EV]

does any one have any insight or experience on acquiring commercial BEVs in 
non-compliance states.  for example if i wanted the chevy spark in new mexico 
is my only option to buy one in CA and drive/transport it to NM?  once in NM 
will the local dealerships provide support such as maintenance or repairs?

harry

Albuquerque, NM
current bike:  http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1179
current non-bike: http://evalbum.com/1000
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Re: [EVDL] What serious EVs are available, at what price how do they compare?

[harry henderson via EV]

what about the chevy spark?


harry

Albuquerque, NM
current bike:  http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1179
current non-bike: http://evalbum.com/1000


On Mon, 7/7/14, brucedp5 via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote:

 Subject: Re: [EVDL] What serious EVs are available, at what price  how do 
they compare?
 To: ev@lists.evdl.org
 Date: Monday, July 7, 2014, 10:53 AM
 
 With a little help from
 my friends, I am corrected: according to
 http://www.nissanusa.com/electric-cars/leaf/charging-range/range/
 The Nissan LEAF® can get you 84 miles on
 a single charge. [*] Speed,
 topography,
 load, and accessory use can significantly affect the
 estimated
 range.
 
 So, recalculating the list using 84 miles @
 $3200 for the Leaf EV: 
 
 Leaf: ~381 (=32000/84)
 
 i3: ~511 (=43000/81)
 
 Tesla-S: ~337 (=7/208)
 
 The Tesla Model-S is still the overall better
 deal using my funny-numbers
 above, and the
 Leaf is still the better lower-purchase-cost deal.
 
 I hope everyone realizes that
 range figures are a moving target (everyone's
 range will vary). The  mynissanleaf.com 
 forum had a chart that showed some
 speed to
 range ratios that some might find interesting:
 http://www.smidgeindustriesltd.com/leafrangewithtesla.gif
 
 But I stuck with using the EPA
 numbers for each EV, not because I believe
 the EPA range is fact, but to compare apples
 with apples.
 
 
 {brucedp.150m.com}
 
 
 
 
 On Mon, Jul 7, 2014, at 09:21 AM, Jamie K via
 EV wrote:
  Note that the LEAF is
 currently rated at 84 mile EPA range, not 75. 
  Taking that into account, and if you look
 at the actual price people are 
  likely
 to pay post tax incentives, the LEAF currently has the
 lowest 
  cost per range mile of those
 three EVs.
 -
 
 
 
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