Re: [MBZ] Semi-OT: Dual alternators?
Also well said, but the 2 independent circuits are better. fmiser via Mercedes wrote on 4/12/19 11:16 PM: Curt wrote: Do any of you great founts on knowledge have any experience with dual alternators? The fearless leader of the snowmobile club wants to run 2x 4 foot light bars on his 1989 Tucker Sno-Cat. The machine is powered by a Cummins 6BT and currently has a 105amp alternator. Those big light bars are rated at 24a each (!) which I think is bonkers. Anyway really big alternators are available but very expensive so the idea was floated, can we run 2 of the smaller alternators together?I think its possible but I'd guess they either need to be isolated or there needs to be one voltage regulator for both. What do you guys think? ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Semi-OT: Dual alternators?
Well said! +1 G Mann via Mercedes wrote on 4/12/19 11:03 PM: With that kind of amp draw per light bar, I'm thinking they must be Halogen bulbs, which in todays LED world are "old stuff". First, ask what lights he is wanting to run. Then suggest he switch to LEDs, which are much lower amp draw and much better light. Just switched to an LED landing light on the Aeronca Sedan and it is magnitudes of better light, with much less amp draw, so I am a full convert to LED because of that. IF he insists on going the high amp draw and adding a second alternator, I suggest that alternator be wired into a completely separate bank of batteries with a dedicated wiring harness which ONLY runs the high amp draw lights. That way, the start system and the "lighting system" do not kill each other and leave you to walk home, in the snow, in the dark. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Semi-OT: Dual alternators?
On Sat, 13 Apr 2019 19:26:35 + (UTC) Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote: > I'm assuming the 100a rating is peak and that operating we should stay > 20% down, so 80a. I don't know what the heater fan draws but I'm going > to guess 5-6a, then the internal lights, heater mirrors (you need > heated mirrors, the tracks throw snow onto the mirrors) > etc...Fortunately this is a 1989 machine so its a fully mechanical > engine, no electricity other than the starter. Its got a semi-truck > style battery so lots of starting capacity. We got a grant this year to > do a big rebuild on it so we're trying to be as complete as possible. I'm not sure you have to derate the alternator, beside when you will be operating the snow machine it will be cold outside. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Semi-OT: Dual alternators?
I'm assuming the 100a rating is peak and that operating we should stay 20% down, so 80a. I don't know what the heater fan draws but I'm going to guess 5-6a, then the internal lights, heater mirrors (you need heated mirrors, the tracks throw snow onto the mirrors) etc...Fortunately this is a 1989 machine so its a fully mechanical engine, no electricity other than the starter. Its got a semi-truck style battery so lots of starting capacity. We got a grant this year to do a big rebuild on it so we're trying to be as complete as possible. -Curt On Saturday, April 13, 2019, 8:17:37 AM EDT, Mitch Haley via Mercedes wrote: > On April 12, 2019 at 10:10 PM Curt Raymond via Mercedes > wrote: > The machine is powered by a Cummins 6BT and currently has a 105amp > alternator. Those big light bars are rated at 24a each (!) which I think is > bonkers. So, what's the problem? My 1977 Saab has K-Jetronic injection, a high pressure high volume fuel pump that probably draws 10A, four 60-65W high beams and a 55A alternator. If the snow cat sends 50A to the aux lights, that leaves 55A for everything else. And I assume the snow cat rarely runs for less than an hour, so it has plenty of time to fully charge the batteries. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Semi-OT: Dual alternators?
Craig's got it, he wants to use a 300w light bar. I think he's crazy, I have a 24" bar on the ASV and its like daytime, I dunno what he thinks he's going to achieve. I'm going to go back with "Dual alternators is harder than its worth" which is true in a very practical sense... -Curt On Saturday, April 13, 2019, 12:54:22 AM EDT, Craig via Mercedes wrote: On Fri, 12 Apr 2019 21:03:15 -0700 G Mann via Mercedes wrote: > With that kind of amp draw per light bar, I'm thinking they must be > Halogen bulbs, which in todays LED world are "old stuff". There are 300 W LED light bars. 300 W / 12 V = 25 A. > IF he insists on going the high amp draw and adding a second > alternator, I suggest that alternator be wired into a completely > separate bank of batteries with a dedicated wiring harness which ONLY > runs the high amp draw lights. That way, the start system and the > "lighting system" do not kill each other and leave you to walk home, in > the snow, in the dark. That's a good idea. Somewhere around here I have a link to a CB page where they had a 1 kW CB transmitter in an automobile. They had thre, maybe four, alternators. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Semi-OT: Dual alternators?
I think if you just gang them it'll be fine, they should share. (Just like one vs two big guys at the back of your car pushing it up the hill.) Make sure you have a voltmeter, though, as if one should poop out you'll be running at a deficit, which would be nice to know before you get into trouble. 24A at 12V is only 288W. I had 400W of high beams in Jill's old 450SL. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Semi-OT: Dual alternators?
On Sat, 13 Apr 2019 10:08:16 -0400 archer75--- via Mercedes wrote: > > Doesn't Dodge use a Cummins 6BT in their pickups? > Did you look at this link? > > https://www.ebay.com/itm/100-NEW-HIGH-OUTPUT-ALTERNATOR-FOR-DODGE-DIESEL-CUMMINS-250AMP-1-YR-WARRANTY-/271118352661 Thay also have higher output alternators: https://www.ebay.com/itm/300-AMP-8301N-Alternator-High-Output-Chevy-GMC-Hummer-Cadillac-2-pin-NEW-HD/283327566332?hash=item41f7a391fc:g:wz8AAOSwkelcL51l https://www.ebay.com/itm/300-AMP-11348N-GMC-CHEVY-Alternator-EXPRESS-SILVERADO-HIGH-OUTPUT-SIERRA-CLASSIC/283327781402?hash=item41f7a6da1a:g:9OIAAOSwkHxcL9eC https://www.ebay.com/itm/300-AMP-8267-Alternator-Lincoln-Navigator-Blackwood-High-Output-HD-Performance/283354236564?epid=12028444788=item41f93a8694:g:mj0AAOSw3s9cTMkV https://www.ebay.com/itm/350-AMP-11516-Alternator-Toyota-Camry-High-Output-HD-Performance-NEW/283446210603?hash=item41feb5f02b:g:H4YAAOSwWtFcQgs6 https://www.ebay.com/itm/350-AMP-11026-Alternator-Crown-Victoria-Town-Car-Police-High-Output-Performance/254103060185?epid=19028606189=item3b29b8fed9:g:948AAOSwvapcUjXJ https://www.ebay.com/itm/350-AMP-8267-Alternator-Lincoln-Navigator-Blackwood-High-Output-HD-Performance/352579004944?epid=13028460814=item521758aa10:g:fUMAAOSw0YlcTMiS I wonder who makes them and if any have remote sense capability ... Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Semi-OT: Dual alternators?
Doesn't Dodge use a Cummins 6BT in their pickups? Did you look at this link? https://www.ebay.com/itm/100-NEW-HIGH-OUTPUT-ALTERNATOR-FOR-DODGE-DIESEL-CUMMINS-250AMP-1-YR-WARRANTY-/271118352661 On Sat, 13 Apr 2019 02:10:08 + (UTC) Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote: > Do any of you great founts on knowledge have any experience with dual > alternators? > The fearless leader of the snowmobile club wants to run 2x 4 foot light bars > on his 1989 Tucker Sno-Cat. The machine is powered by a Cummins 6BT and > currently has a 105amp alternator. Those big light bars are rated at 24a each > (!) which I think is bonkers. > Anyway really big alternators are available but very expensive so the idea > was floated, can we run 2 of the smaller alternators together?I think its > possible but I'd guess they either need to be isolated or there needs to be > one voltage regulator for both. What do you guys think? > -Curt > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > -- arche...@embarqmail.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. https://www.avg.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Semi-OT: Dual alternators?
> On April 12, 2019 at 10:10 PM Curt Raymond via Mercedes > wrote: > The machine is powered by a Cummins 6BT and currently has a 105amp > alternator. Those big light bars are rated at 24a each (!) which I think is > bonkers. So, what's the problem? My 1977 Saab has K-Jetronic injection, a high pressure high volume fuel pump that probably draws 10A, four 60-65W high beams and a 55A alternator. If the snow cat sends 50A to the aux lights, that leaves 55A for everything else. And I assume the snow cat rarely runs for less than an hour, so it has plenty of time to fully charge the batteries. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Semi-OT: Dual alternators?
On Fri, 12 Apr 2019 21:03:15 -0700 G Mann via Mercedes wrote: > With that kind of amp draw per light bar, I'm thinking they must be > Halogen bulbs, which in todays LED world are "old stuff". There are 300 W LED light bars. 300 W / 12 V = 25 A. > IF he insists on going the high amp draw and adding a second > alternator, I suggest that alternator be wired into a completely > separate bank of batteries with a dedicated wiring harness which ONLY > runs the high amp draw lights. That way, the start system and the > "lighting system" do not kill each other and leave you to walk home, in > the snow, in the dark. That's a good idea. Somewhere around here I have a link to a CB page where they had a 1 kW CB transmitter in an automobile. They had thre, maybe four, alternators. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Semi-OT: Dual alternators?
> Curt wrote: > Do any of you great founts on knowledge have any experience with > dual alternators? The fearless leader of the snowmobile club > wants to run 2x 4 foot light bars on his 1989 Tucker Sno-Cat. > The machine is powered by a Cummins 6BT and currently has a > 105amp alternator. Those big light bars are rated at 24a each > (!) which I think is bonkers. Anyway really big alternators are > available but very expensive so the idea was floated, can we run > 2 of the smaller alternators together?I think its possible but > I'd guess they either need to be isolated or there needs to be > one voltage regulator for both. What do you guys think? One regulator won't work because the two alternators won't respond the same. Trying to get the non-adjustable regulators to exactly match each other just won't happen. There is no good way to balance the load between two alternators. But it may not matter. So the one carries all the load until it can't keep up and the the other one joins in. That is, if "A" is set just a bit higher than "B", then "B" will be functionally off until the voltage drops lower than the set point for "A" - which will happen when "A" can't keep up. I don't know - but I think this will work just fine. Or - just run the lights off the second alternator. Total isolation from the start battery and engine electronics. You could add a second battery and have two isolated systems - with a manual switch to link them in "emergency" situations such as self-jump start, alternator failure, etc. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Semi-OT: Dual alternators?
With that kind of amp draw per light bar, I'm thinking they must be Halogen bulbs, which in todays LED world are "old stuff". First, ask what lights he is wanting to run. Then suggest he switch to LEDs, which are much lower amp draw and much better light. Just switched to an LED landing light on the Aeronca Sedan and it is magnitudes of better light, with much less amp draw, so I am a full convert to LED because of that. IF he insists on going the high amp draw and adding a second alternator, I suggest that alternator be wired into a completely separate bank of batteries with a dedicated wiring harness which ONLY runs the high amp draw lights. That way, the start system and the "lighting system" do not kill each other and leave you to walk home, in the snow, in the dark. On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 7:10 PM Curt Raymond via Mercedes < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > Do any of you great founts on knowledge have any experience with dual > alternators? > The fearless leader of the snowmobile club wants to run 2x 4 foot light > bars on his 1989 Tucker Sno-Cat. The machine is powered by a Cummins 6BT > and currently has a 105amp alternator. Those big light bars are rated at > 24a each (!) which I think is bonkers. > Anyway really big alternators are available but very expensive so the idea > was floated, can we run 2 of the smaller alternators together?I think its > possible but I'd guess they either need to be isolated or there needs to be > one voltage regulator for both. What do you guys think? > -Curt > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Semi-OT: Dual alternators?
I've seen articles on dual alternators for aircraft, but they are usually for totally redundant electrical systems, not twice the amps. On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 9:10 PM Curt Raymond via Mercedes < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > Do any of you great founts on knowledge have any experience with dual > alternators? > The fearless leader of the snowmobile club wants to run 2x 4 foot light > bars on his 1989 Tucker Sno-Cat. The machine is powered by a Cummins 6BT > and currently has a 105amp alternator. Those big light bars are rated at > 24a each (!) which I think is bonkers. > Anyway really big alternators are available but very expensive so the idea > was floated, can we run 2 of the smaller alternators together?I think its > possible but I'd guess they either need to be isolated or there needs to be > one voltage regulator for both. What do you guys think? > -Curt > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > -- OK Don *“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts.”* – Mark Twain "There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence for themselves." WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers* 2013 F150, 18 mpg 2017 Subaru Legacy, 30 mpg 1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph! ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Semi-OT: Dual alternators?
buying leds would be cheaper. (or are these leds consuming 24 amps?) How about he strap on his honda generator and run 120, 240, or 277 Volt lights?? my one 4" aircraft landing light lit up the whole world for plowing snow. It did NOT draw 24 amps @ 12 V. Luckily, johnny law never stopped me tor it, but I seldom turned it on while on a road. It would light up the interior of the car ahead like daylight or better! Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote on 4/12/19 9:10 PM: Do any of you great founts on knowledge have any experience with dual alternators? The fearless leader of the snowmobile club wants to run 2x 4 foot light bars on his 1989 Tucker Sno-Cat. The machine is powered by a Cummins 6BT and currently has a 105amp alternator. Those big light bars are rated at 24a each (!) which I think is bonkers. Anyway really big alternators are available but very expensive so the idea was floated, can we run 2 of the smaller alternators together?I think its possible but I'd guess they either need to be isolated or there needs to be one voltage regulator for both. What do you guys think? -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
