Re: [OSM-talk] Reporting routing problems
On Thu, May 28, 2015 at 4:14 PM, Clifford Snow wrote: > Notes provides that feedback as long as the poster was logged in. > Notes are often missing three things: the feedback mechanism, the route origin & destination, and a clear description of the problem. Improvement to notes could be: 1) Attach the most recently routed origin & destination. 2) Add a field for "enter your email" which will "be used only for communication about this issue and destroyed when the issue is resolved". Encourage them to register, but at least let them leave contact info. 3) Include a brief description of how complete a note needs to be, if the poster expects another human to interpret it. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Reporting routing problems
On Thu, May 28, 2015 at 2:54 PM, Daniel Koć wrote: > Yes, I did it. But it means it's another complexity to consider when > reporting problems with their engine. > > I don't know how open.mapquest.org routing service is different (in terms > of routing code) from what we have on OSM website, but that should be done > automatically if they're not the same. Anyway, that's really tech2tech kind > of problem. > As stated earlier, routing engines are simply doing the math. Certainly there are routing issues, but I suspect that most routing problems will come back to OSM data. If we report all problems to the router and it is our problem, how does it get back to OSM to fix? If OSM editors determine that the problem isn't with our data, there needs to be a feedback mechanism to the OP so they can decide if they want to report it to the routing provider. Notes provides that feedback as long as the poster was logged in. -- @osm_seattle osm_seattle.snowandsnow.us OpenStreetMap: Maps with a human touch ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Reporting routing problems
W dniu 28.05.2015 23:11, Paul Norman napisał(a): On 5/28/2015 11:25 AM, Daniel Koć wrote: promises as to when we might get to this." Maybe our technical team should talk with theirs to make better feedback channel available? I would suggest reproducing the issue on open.mapquest.com and providing a link to that route when reporting. Yes, I did it. But it means it's another complexity to consider when reporting problems with their engine. I don't know how open.mapquest.org routing service is different (in terms of routing code) from what we have on OSM website, but that should be done automatically if they're not the same. Anyway, that's really tech2tech kind of problem. -- "The train is always on time / The trick is to be ready to put your bags down" [A. Cohen] ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Reporting routing problems
On 5/28/2015 11:25 AM, Daniel Koć wrote: With MapQuest it was much harder to find how can I report another bug. Finally I have found "Residential Map or Route Errors" link on Support page ( https://support.mapquest.com/hc/en-us - looks like the link itself is dynamic, because it has issue number included). Help service was as quick as in OSRM, but they said MapQuest currently support is only active for USA and Canada and while they hope international routing will be also supported, they can only recommend me Open MapQuest with OSM data. =} After I said that I originally came from OSM itself, the help line operator said that he will "share this with our routing team but please note that we are not actively supporting international routing right now so I unfortunately can't make any promises as to when we might get to this." Maybe our technical team should talk with theirs to make better feedback channel available? I would suggest reproducing the issue on open.mapquest.com and providing a link to that route when reporting. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Reporting routing problems
W dniu 28.05.2015 18:33, Janko Mihelić napisał(a): I'd like the following procedure: 4. Later a mapper clicks the note, and it shows the text and the problematic route. I'm also interested in 5. - standard procedure for reporting routing errors to engine operators. =} For OSRM I have just opened an issue on GitHub ( https://github.com/Project-OSRM/osrm-backend/issues ) and that's all - mission accomplished. With MapQuest it was much harder to find how can I report another bug. Finally I have found "Residential Map or Route Errors" link on Support page ( https://support.mapquest.com/hc/en-us - looks like the link itself is dynamic, because it has issue number included). Help service was as quick as in OSRM, but they said MapQuest currently support is only active for USA and Canada and while they hope international routing will be also supported, they can only recommend me Open MapQuest with OSM data. =} After I said that I originally came from OSM itself, the help line operator said that he will "share this with our routing team but please note that we are not actively supporting international routing right now so I unfortunately can't make any promises as to when we might get to this." Maybe our technical team should talk with theirs to make better feedback channel available? We're left with GraphHopper feedback for now, but I can't say anything about it, because I just don't have an issue with their service. =} -- "The train is always on time / The trick is to be ready to put your bags down" [A. Cohen] ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Reporting routing problems
I'd like the following procedure: 1. user makes a route and finds an error 2. There is a button "Found an error in your route?" 3. You click the button, and it behaves the same as the existing note button. You drag the pointer to the problematic part of your route and write "you can't turn left here". 4. Later a mapper clicks the note, and it shows the text and the problematic route. Janko čet, 28. svi 2015. 16:50 Clifford Snow je napisao: > > On Thu, May 28, 2015 at 3:00 AM, Daniel Koć wrote: > >> User wouldn't know it and that's why I proposed also a note. We >> (OSM+routing providers) should resolve it or reject if this is not the real >> problem or it's too hard/too esoteric (#WONTFIX), but there should be an >> easy way of reporting IMO. > > > +1 > > We already have Scout reporting routing errors as notes why not encourage > users to report routing errors using a note? We may not be able to correct > those where the routing engine refuses to use tracks to reach a destination > but we should be able to fix turn restrictions, unconnected ways, correct > access permissions for bikes, etc. > > The problem is where to place the instructions to leave a note. Ideally it > wouldn't show until the user created a route. I wonder if the group that > implemented routing on osm.org considered this in their design? > > Alternatively, the user could report the problem on the help tab of OSM. > Personally I like notes for their persistence. > > > > -- > @osm_seattle > osm_seattle.snowandsnow.us > OpenStreetMap: Maps with a human touch > ___ > talk mailing list > talk@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk > ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Reporting routing problems
On Thu, May 28, 2015 at 3:00 AM, Daniel Koć wrote: > User wouldn't know it and that's why I proposed also a note. We > (OSM+routing providers) should resolve it or reject if this is not the real > problem or it's too hard/too esoteric (#WONTFIX), but there should be an > easy way of reporting IMO. +1 We already have Scout reporting routing errors as notes why not encourage users to report routing errors using a note? We may not be able to correct those where the routing engine refuses to use tracks to reach a destination but we should be able to fix turn restrictions, unconnected ways, correct access permissions for bikes, etc. The problem is where to place the instructions to leave a note. Ideally it wouldn't show until the user created a route. I wonder if the group that implemented routing on osm.org considered this in their design? Alternatively, the user could report the problem on the help tab of OSM. Personally I like notes for their persistence. -- @osm_seattle osm_seattle.snowandsnow.us OpenStreetMap: Maps with a human touch ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Reporting routing problems
W dniu 28.05.2015 11:45, Florian Lohoff napisał(a): Hi Daniel, On Thu, May 28, 2015 at 11:15:34AM +0200, Daniel Koć wrote: the current provider and maybe note on the map (in case this is a tagging problem). Typically there is no such thing as a route error. The engine consumes the OSM Data, interprets it based on rules and then makes a mathematically decision which route is the most preferred one (typically shortest or fastest). User wouldn't know it and that's why I proposed also a note. We (OSM+routing providers) should resolve it or reject if this is not the real problem or it's too hard/too esoteric (#WONTFIX), but there should be an easy way of reporting IMO. -- "The train is always on time / The trick is to be ready to put your bags down" [A. Cohen] ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Reporting routing problems
Hi Daniel, On Thu, May 28, 2015 at 11:15:34AM +0200, Daniel Koć wrote: > I have encountered some routing errors using our main website, but > while trying to report it, I've found nowhere I could do it on the > website and Tom said there's only one way to report it - directly at > respective routing providers. > > I will manage that, but I think we should have better integration > with them, because average user would be confused. I mean something > like: "Wrong route? report it!" button/link sending the message to > the current provider and maybe note on the map (in case this is a > tagging problem). Typically there is no such thing as a route error. The engine consumes the OSM Data, interprets it based on rules and then makes a mathematically decision which route is the most preferred one (typically shortest or fastest). The causes for dissatisfaction with the route are typically - OSM data - Badly tagged/attributed - Bad or Intransparent data consumption e.g. scoring of the router - Expectation caused by local knowledge which cant be represented in tags Routing engines can only be "quite good" not perfect whatever attribution you put in the data. I am always trying routing engines to guide me home and i am never satisfied with the result - Some refuse to route via tracks (which i happen to live at - in the middle of the Woods), some take very strange decisions for bicycle routes. So reporting bugs for routing is VERY difficult. It depends on the time of the data snapshot, route, profile for data consumption (e.g. osrm lua profile), time of day, expectation etc ... Flo -- Florian Lohoff f...@zz.de We need to self-defense - GnuPG/PGP enable your email today! signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Reporting routing problems
I have encountered some routing errors using our main website, but while trying to report it, I've found nowhere I could do it on the website and Tom said there's only one way to report it - directly at respective routing providers. I will manage that, but I think we should have better integration with them, because average user would be confused. I mean something like: "Wrong route? report it!" button/link sending the message to the current provider and maybe note on the map (in case this is a tagging problem). -- "The train is always on time / The trick is to be ready to put your bags down" [A. Cohen] ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
