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but you dont believe in the covenant...
On Fri, Dec 31, 2010 at 1:01 AM, wrote:
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> Naison you are a covenant breaker
>
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esn't exist. Sen is Satan in that he supports, in a stealth
> fashion, the persecution of atheists and Baha'is. It is hard to tell, but
> it is certain. Sen is a Muslim, a Satan, an enemy of good deeds and good
> acts.
>
>
> On Dec 30, 2010, at 11:47 AM, Naison Jones w
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You dont believe in God but you do believe in the devil??
On Fri, Dec 31, 2010 at 12:08 AM, wrote:
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> Sen is satan
>
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The unforgivable sin is hating the light. There are those who didnt
recognise the manifestation who were forgiven. Even those who cursed the
manifestations who repented and were forgiven. It is despising the light.
Read some answered questions "blasphemy against the holy
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I used the word priest because I dont want to sound finger pointing. ie its
more generic.
Also that and im a slacker when it comes to word usages 0:
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nce you mention me in the 3rd person that wouldn't make sense. But
> neither Atheist nor Matt seem to be using "Bahais as a shield" and I
> don't see why it would apply to them.
>
> On Thu, Dec 23, 2010 at 9:35 PM, Naison Jones
> wrote:
> > The Baha'i
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LOL.
I was just thinking that perhaps people get spirituality confused with
burning incense and meditation. THose things are related but not the core of
spirituality which is religiously related.
We could say a monk is a very spiritual person. He spends his whole day
me
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Dear Khazeh.
I have been reading your posts and find them very helpful. Please keep them
coming!!!
And never be dishearted if the message you impart falls on deaf ears.
kind regards,
Naison.
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Who do you think.
On Fri, Dec 24, 2010 at 10:24 AM, Gilberto Simpson <
gilberto.simp...@gmail.com> wrote:
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> Who are you talking to here?
>
> On Thu, Dec 23, 2010 at 9:04 PM, Naison Jones
> wrote:
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Unfortunately religion becomes perverted after time and you *do* get higher
incidences of priests doing silly things as I was explaining before to
Gilberto and falling on deaf ears.
Now you have to defend yourself against all sorts of silly accusations or
alternatively y
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Good. Just so you know the topic of Bahais demonising Muslims and implying
Bahais are persecuting muslims is pretty absurd when looking at history.
Wouldnt you say?
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So pointing out historical events is Demonising muslims?
How you exaggerate. All i said was that these things point to a need for
renewal and change. Where did I once say muslims were bad?
And yes these muslims Did comit attrocities. Does that mean that I am
suggesting B
this make sense?
On Thu, Dec 23, 2010 at 12:13 PM, Naison Jones wrote:
> Yeh but arnt these things all just names for the same thing?
> Mehdi or whatever. It's just a name.
> Not sure what you mean by "Spin", can you explain that?
> thanks
>
>
>
> On Thu,
he first two out of three. He claims to be
> the return of Joshua, Kalki, the knight on a white horse, the Saoshyant,
> Maitreya (as a bodhisattva-mahasattva while Bahullah is Amitabha ie a
> buddha), the Madhi, the return of Jesus, etc. A Manifestation of God as this
> doctrine is lin
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I shutter to think in a thousand years, that Muslim children will be beaten
up at school by their Baha'i classmates for being a "Bab' killer."
Instead of shuttering about something that hasnt happened yet and may not
ever happen why dont you shutter about the things th
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"Baha'is are people, Muslims are people. People are not perfect, they make
mistakes. To think that belonging to a particular group magically makes it
impossible to do wrong, is a complete fantasy."
And I didnt imply that. I said Bahais are not free from sin so you are j
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I gave you clear signs that God has put in religion to show that it needs to
be renewed. So i will ask the question again.
What signs do you need to show a religion needs renewal? What signs is
enough? How many dead? God isnt going to leep off the cloud into your lap
and
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Wow everyone has nicely evaded my points then accused me of endorsing hatred
of other religions simply by pointing out known historical facts. Nicely
done.
You can all get up on your high horses and say "well this is anti religious
sentiments you are espousing" but if we
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*WHen the universal house of justice begins to take up muslims and slay them
for being fanatics then i will also defer to the opinion that the Bahai
faith is past its used by date, it is only a logical conclusion.*
**
This implies they are slaying them for having done so
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Sorry i meant.
"Islam and Christianity are the most recent religions before Bahai that Both
Islam and Bahai acknowledges are from God."
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10 at 3:44 PM, Gilberto Simpson <
gilberto.simp...@gmail.com> wrote:
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> On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 11:47 PM, Naison Jones
> wrote:
> > The Baha'i Studies Listserv
> >
> > Ok. That being the case do you witness old religions of
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spirituality and religion is inseperable.
On Wed, Dec 22, 2010 at 1:24 PM, Susan Maneck wrote:
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> > RASG has made a claim that is outside of the Bahai pardigm in that he
> doesn't bring a new religion or any, bust just spirituality.
>
> My
you see them acting like bloodthirsty beasts. Tell me then that religion
needs not to be renewed.
On Wed, Dec 22, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Gilberto Simpson <
gilberto.simp...@gmail.com> wrote:
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>
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 10:00 PM, Naison
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The concept is not that difficult. Do they claim to be the return of the
manifestations before them? e.g. Christ Moses Baha'u'llah.
Do they claim to posses divine knowledge? Do they bring a new set of laws
and book?
They must fulfil these things. Now Jesus may not have b
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Woops that didnt post correctly. Sorry...
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Interesting. The mature and deapening of ideas is rather difficult when you
have priests telling you to kill infidels, and declare holy war on other
countries, but thats ok.
Do you really think in 2000 years time the new muslims arriving and
declaring their belief in tha
gt; 'Abdu'l-Bahá replied: "Mankind needs a universal motive power to quicken
> it. The inspired messenger who is directly assisted by the power of God
> brings about universal results. Bahá'u'lláh rose as a light in Persia and
> now that light is going out to the w
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A seeker must put aside all love and hate. Love because what he loves can
blind him to finding the beloved in another form because he is too attached
to the old form.
if I love the symbol of the cross and am so in love with Jesus dying on the
cross and his self-less sacr
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Is it possible some of These hadiths were made by muslims who just never
wanted to see Islam succeeded by a new religion?
Like from a statement of Muhammad it gets multiplied and reinforced.
In any case yes names and titles have ever been a test.
What if Muhammad said "I
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The titles of the prophets from God have always caused confusion up to this
point for the petty minded. Think about it.
Jesus is God, Jesus is the Son of God, Jesus is the Son of Man. That is a
true test for Christians because it gives them the notion that Jesus is
super
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But if Baha'u'llah is the supreme manifestation and we are entering a new
cycle then why isnt it reasonable to say last of those kinds of Israili
prophets. Maybe the new ones will be not related to that family either (not
that that is probably that important).
Also there
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But saying someone is last prophet different. It is like saying "I am the
alpha and the Omega". Do you interpret that as meaning he is literally the
first and last prophet?
Wheras his statement is an explicit time period before the coming of the
next manifestation and co
great not interested"
On Wed, Dec 15, 2010 at 1:44 PM, Naison Jones wrote:
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>
> Starting on book 4 sounds like a good idea.
> Now that im thinking it seems easier to invite people to learn about
> Bahai history then to invite them to "Stud
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Starting on book 4 sounds like a good idea.
Now that im thinking it seems easier to invite people to learn about Bahai
history then to invite them to "Study religious writings" and in some ways
more logical.
On Wed, Dec 15, 2010 at 12:30 PM, Susan Maneck wrote:
> Th
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The core activities is a way of channeling the energy to teach into
practical method of getting numbers into an environment of exposure to the
writings. I think Bahais are entitled to pursue whatever other personal ways
they believe is effective as well. In our feasts we
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It does not matter quanitity it's quality. One inspired soul can raise up a
whole generation of believers.
On the other hand the ruhi will ensure that the new Bahais will be deepened
and its much better than how it was before with Bahais simply coming in then
leaving.
owledge.
On Tue, Dec 7, 2010 at 11:21 AM, Naison Jones wrote:
> "He Doeth whatsoever he willeth" doesnt mean Baha'u'llah isnt informed that
> God wouldnt raise a manifestation before that period especially considering
> that Baha'u'llah is considered
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"He Doeth whatsoever he willeth" doesnt mean Baha'u'llah isnt informed that
God wouldnt raise a manifestation before that period especially considering
that Baha'u'llah is considered to be God in one sense.
Also dont Christians use the same argument to say the Bahais had
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You shouldnt give these quotes credence.
Anyone can come along and say whatever they want it doesnt give them the
authority to do so.
All you need is a bit of skill in english and a flare for writing with
eloquence.
On Fri, Nov 12, 2010 at 6:37 AM, Stephen Gray wrote:
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Obviously these are simplistic things to help people of that time understand
things that cannot be understood whilst in this world.
The emphasis in Bahai is to exert our efforts to people to develop these
qualities - the spiritual arms and legs of the next world.
On T
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They are equal in one sense. ie their value is the same they are both human
beings. In another sense they are not equal.
I have probably ranted too much though.
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r you many years. This will lead to
bitterness and resentment in this marraige of two unequal persons.
On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 10:22 AM, Naison Jones wrote:
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>
> I guarentee you if you stick to the principle of equality in a Bahai
> marraige you wi
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I guarentee you if you stick to the principle of equality in a Bahai
marraige you will see this comes from inequality.
Otherwise your marraige wil suck. It will be like "No dear its now your turn
to drop off the kids", "No i did this last time its your turn".
"No I was t
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It is impracticle and undesirable to say men and women should have the same
roles in a marraige.
If you want to balance equal raising of children perfectly between them it
is very difficult to reconcile this with steady jobs.
Not only that, it is a cause for disunity and
about opportunities of man and women are
equal.
On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 8:57 AM, Naison Jones wrote:
> Yes The Bahai faith is very different in the sense the equality of men and
> women has become manifest. Ie the spiritual truth of their equality is now
> shown forth in the material life
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Yes The Bahai faith is very different in the sense the equality of men and
women has become manifest. Ie the spiritual truth of their equality is now
shown forth in the material life.
What I was talking about is talking more philisofically true equality is a
utopean unre
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You dont need to nitpick about what Baha'u'llah said, if it is interpretted
as such by the authorities then we follow it just as if it came from
Baha'u'llah that is the covenant.
In any case. You think Abdul'Baha said when women are the primary educators
of men he was pe
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Actually this statement doesnt contradict me.
The emancipation of women, the achievement of full equality between
the sexes, is one of the most important, though less acknowledged
prerequisites of peace. The denial of such equality perpetrates an
injustice against one h
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Ok Well I am not being understood.
When i Say 'true equality' in that context i mean trully identical. Ie true
equality comes from things not being identical.
'true outward equality' is not ideal. ie true sameness of roles does not
produce the ideal outcome of a system w
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Lets say you have a bunch of people inside a fort being attacked by a band
of aggressors.
There are a few women and a few men and a limited food supply that needs to
be cooked.
You will divide the defense up into men taking spears and defending and
women cooking and the
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I am disinclined to keep going on this if it's going to turn into an
argument.
I have to reply in short cos i am at work.
-I am not claiming any ascendancy over 'acedemics'.
"-> But in any case there are apparent differences in man and woman
> that go beyond the physic
m> wrote:
> The Baha'i Studies Listserv
> Naison, I wasn't criticizing your explanation or metaphor. I was being
> critical of Susan's complaint that you were echoing what Muslims say.
>
> On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 11:37 PM, Naison Jones
> wrote:
> > The
into it we have
> > made no progress whatsoever over the past dispensation.
> >
> > On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 9:03 PM, Naison Jones
> wrote:
> >> The Baha'i Studies Listserv
> >>
> >> Hi,
> >> I want to share some thoughts not from a so-calle
d men will have identical roles and functions in the world.
On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 10:49 AM, Naison Jones wrote:
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>
> Ok fair enough. I was just giving food for thought not making a 'full
> argument' as such.
> But in any case there are ap
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Ok fair enough. I was just giving food for thought not making a 'full
argument' as such.
But in any case there are apparent differences in man and woman
that go beyond the physical. Even still physical differences necessitate
different roles in the physical world. Why ha
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Hi,
I want to share some thoughts not from a so-called scholarly perspective but
more a 'spiritual-inights' one.
True equality can Never exist between man and women because they are
different. All is meant in Bahai is that women have the same spiritual rank
as men and t
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Hi,
from Shoghi Effendi-God passes by.
", first, the bigoted, the sickly, the vacillating Muhammad Sháh," page 1.
"The arch villains who joined hands with the prime movers of so wicked a
conspiracy were the two grand vizirs, Hájí Mírzá Aqásí, the idolized tutor
of Muham
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It DOES NOT MATTER WHAT YOU CALL THEM.
Forget the world of names look inward. They are distortions of the true
treachings of the real image of Bahai.
You cannot pick and chose what teachings you will accept from the
successorship and merge them into your beliefs.
They ca
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It's just a link to a blog, why so up in arms?
There have been a TON of anti-admin links posted here and when there is one
link to a critique of the individual who wrote the attacking paper everyone
cries foul.
regards
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This is interesting reading.
http://www.keshertalk.com/archives/2006/07/juancoleyale.php
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bvious bunch of crap.
cheers.
On Sun, Sep 12, 2010 at 11:44 PM, Naison Jones wrote:
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>
>
>
> On Sun, Sep 12, 2010 at 10:24 PM, Don Calkins > wrote:
>
>> The Baha'i Studies Listserv
>>
>> The Baha'i Studies
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On Sun, Sep 12, 2010 at 10:24 PM, Don Calkins wrote:
> The Baha'i Studies Listserv
>
> The Baha'i Studies Listserv
>
> How can people write about what they think the Bahai world government will
> look like in the future?
>
>
> So we are to ignore the claim that the Fai
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How can people write about what they think the Bahai world government will
look like in the future?
If it became a tyranical system not tolerant of other religions that would
not be in keeping with the spirit of the faith at all.
Correct me if I'm wrong, I read some of t
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I am guessing Abdul'Baha is talking about a different mindset- which is more
the Bahai mindset. When a man gives to charity although he
is not a believer it is motivated through self. that is- even though it
might be a compassionate act it is done through the self of man
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On Thu, Sep 2, 2010 at 12:39 AM, Stephen Gray wrote:
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>
>
>
> I've only seen limited negativity.
>
It depends how you define negativity.
In light of the fact that it creates division amongst a religion whose soul
purpose is to create a un
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Hi all I am new here so forgive me if my words are not perfect to this
thread.
It is interesting to note that covenant-breaker material -as the Bahais call
it- is quite different from the material of different religious sects.
If you look at Christianity you will see tha
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Interesting.
Also interesting to note though is that when a maiden appeared to
Baha'u'llah and spoke exact words, it does give the impression that this
maiden was an angel and not just some metephor. The reason why I think this
is because God cannot manifest his essence
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