Re: [DNSOP] Insecure delegations from 239.in-addr.arpa needed? [was: draft-ietf-dnsop-rfc6598-rfc6303-01]

2014-08-20 Thread Mark Andrews
In message , Chris Thompson w rites: > On Aug 15 2014, Mark Andrews wrote: > > [...] > >The last delegation in the current chain is a secure delegation from > >IN-ADDR.ARPA to 100.IN-ADDR.ARPA so there is a problem currently. > >No one can safely setup their own reverse zones validation is now >

Re: [DNSOP] draft-ietf-dnsop-rfc6598-rfc6303-01

2014-08-20 Thread Evan Hunt
On Thu, Aug 21, 2014 at 12:17:25PM +1000, Mark Andrews wrote: > If they fail it can > fallback to making iterative queries or just accept the failure. I'd quibble with this bit: if it can make iterative queries, then we might as well just call it a validating resolver. IMHO the thing we're descri

Re: [DNSOP] draft-ietf-dnsop-rfc6598-rfc6303-01

2014-08-20 Thread Mark Andrews
In message <54885a5d-2afa-4d37-9b83-2229082d7...@virtualized.org>, David Conrad writes: > > Hi, > > On Aug 20, 2014, at 6:21 PM, Andrew Sullivan > wrote: > > > On Thu, Aug 21, 2014 at 10:52:46AM +1000, Mark Andrews wrote: > >> It was also a required step as you can't reliably > >> validate in th

Re: [DNSOP] draft-ietf-dnsop-rfc6598-rfc6303-01

2014-08-20 Thread Mark Andrews
In message <20140821012100.gc2...@mx1.yitter.info>, Andrew Sullivan writes: > On Thu, Aug 21, 2014 at 10:52:46AM +1000, Mark Andrews wrote: > > It was also a required step as you can't reliably > > validate in the client unless the recursive server has filtered out > > the spoofed answers. > > If

Re: [DNSOP] draft-ietf-dnsop-rfc6598-rfc6303-01

2014-08-20 Thread David Conrad
Hi, On Aug 20, 2014, at 6:21 PM, Andrew Sullivan wrote: > On Thu, Aug 21, 2014 at 10:52:46AM +1000, Mark Andrews wrote: >> It was also a required step as you can't reliably >> validate in the client unless the recursive server has filtered out >> the spoofed answers. > > If I understand you cor

Re: [DNSOP] draft-ietf-dnsop-rfc6598-rfc6303-01

2014-08-20 Thread Ted Lemon
On Aug 20, 2014, at 9:21 PM, Andrew Sullivan wrote: > On Thu, Aug 21, 2014 at 10:52:46AM +1000, Mark Andrews wrote: >> It was also a required step as you can't reliably >> validate in the client unless the recursive server has filtered out >> the spoofed answers. > > If I understand you correctly

Re: [DNSOP] draft-ietf-dnsop-rfc6598-rfc6303-01

2014-08-20 Thread Andrew Sullivan
On Thu, Aug 21, 2014 at 10:52:46AM +1000, Mark Andrews wrote: > It was also a required step as you can't reliably > validate in the client unless the recursive server has filtered out > the spoofed answers. If I understand you correctly, this devolves to the claim that the validating client has to

Re: [DNSOP] draft-ietf-dnsop-rfc6598-rfc6303-01

2014-08-20 Thread Mark Andrews
In message <20140820235118.e952b1d1b...@rock.dv.isc.org>, Mark Andrews writes: > > In message , Joe Abley writ > es > : > > > > On 20 Aug 2014, at 17:48, Mark Andrews wrote: > > > > > You will give answers that validate as bogus in the stub resolver. > > > > This seems to be the crux of our diff

Re: [DNSOP] draft-ietf-dnsop-rfc6598-rfc6303-01

2014-08-20 Thread Mark Andrews
In message , Joe Abley writes : > > On 20 Aug 2014, at 17:48, Mark Andrews wrote: > > > You will give answers that validate as bogus in the stub resolver. > > This seems to be the crux of our differing world views. > > > A validating stub resolver > > Validating stub resolvers? > > In my own pers

Re: [DNSOP] draft-ietf-dnsop-rfc6598-rfc6303-01

2014-08-20 Thread Joe Abley
On 20 Aug 2014, at 17:48, Mark Andrews wrote: > You will give answers that validate as bogus in the stub resolver. This seems to be the crux of our differing world views. > A validating stub resolver Validating stub resolvers? In my own personal taxonomy a stub resolver doesn't validate. Val

Re: [DNSOP] draft-ietf-dnsop-rfc6598-rfc6303-01

2014-08-20 Thread Mark Andrews
In message <19ae3cb3-b108-42cb-bae2-a2f1fbb55...@hopcount.ca>, Joe Abley writes : > Hi Chris, > > I went quiet on this thread because I was going to try this out in a lab > before commenting further, but since I haven't done that and you had > something to say... > > On 20 Aug 2014, at 12:50, Chri

Re: [DNSOP] draft-ietf-dnsop-rfc6598-rfc6303-01

2014-08-20 Thread Joe Abley
Hi Chris, I went quiet on this thread because I was going to try this out in a lab before commenting further, but since I haven't done that and you had something to say... On 20 Aug 2014, at 12:50, Chris Thompson wrote: > On Aug 14 2014, Joe Abley wrote: > > [...] >> It seems to me that no d

[DNSOP] New draft on representing DNS messages in JSON

2014-08-20 Thread Paul Hoffman
Greetings again. I have a need for expressing DNS messages in JSON for an application I have written. Stephane and I had started to work on this but ended up dropping it. draft-dulaunoy-kaplan-passive-dns-cof comes at the same problem from another direction, but it is specific for one problem sp

Re: [DNSOP] draft-ietf-dnsop-rfc6598-rfc6303-01

2014-08-20 Thread Chris Thompson
On Aug 14 2014, Joe Abley wrote: [...] It seems to me that no delegation is a perfectly reasonable steady state, It fails to break the chain of trust. Because a validator can "prove" that the names in the putative subzone do not exist, it will consider locally defined content "bogus". The only

[DNSOP] Insecure delegations from 239.in-addr.arpa needed? [was: draft-ietf-dnsop-rfc6598-rfc6303-01]

2014-08-20 Thread Chris Thompson
On Aug 15 2014, Mark Andrews wrote: [...] The last delegation in the current chain is a secure delegation from IN-ADDR.ARPA to 100.IN-ADDR.ARPA so there is a problem currently. No one can safely setup their own reverse zones validation is now starting to be done in stub resolvers and to do so wo