Re: (313) kdj represses
On Wed, 18 Jun 2003 17:54:28 +0200, Fabrizio Nahum [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: yep, Live in LA 1996 Being pedantic, but isn't 1998? Such an awesome record! -- Benn Glazier [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.royaltech.net
(313) OT: UK TechnoTourist alert: British Airways' 1 day sale (fwd)
Sorry for the SPAM but in case any of you UK lot want to come to NYC or go to Melbourne (and visit Cyclone? :) ), jump on this one fast lads ... - Greg (just back from Barca/Sonar and still jet-lagged a bit) --- Forwarded Message Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 01:59:42 +0200 (CEST) From: Airfares Deal mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Organization: Airfares Deal mailing list MIME-Version: 1.0 List: airfares List-Archive: http://www.tarom.net/cgi-bin/mojo/mojo.cgi?f=archivel=airfares List-ID: 20030619013318 List-Owner: [EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://www.tarom.net/cgi-bin/mojo/mojo.cgi?f=sl=airfares List-Unsubscribe: http://www.tarom.net/cgi-bin/mojo/mojo.cgi?f=ul=airfares List-URL: http://www.tarom.net/cgi-bin/mojo/mojo.cgi?l=airfares List-Software: Mojo Mail 2.8.4 Precedence: list X-Priority: 3 Subject: Airfare alert: BA 1 day sale, London Heathrow-Melbourne for just £369 British Airways' one day seat sale for July/Aug./Sept. (Melbourne) includes: NEW YORK Price: from £265 Travel dates: 01/07/03-31/08/03 TORONTO Price: £285 Travel dates: 01/07/03-31/08/03 MELBOURNE Price: £369 Travel dates: 01/07/03-30/09/03 Bookable on June 19 ONLY. --- End of Forwarded Message
Re: Re[2]: (313) Richie Hawtin k
On Wed, 18 Jun 2003 11:23:51 -0700, Garrett McGrath [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: Steve, seriously... Didn't Ben just ask you to tell us why you think this way? That doesn't sound like an attack. - Original Message - From: spw [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Benn Glazier [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 10:23 AM Subject: Re: Re[2]: (313) Richie Hawtin k I cant spend all day position email to this list but let me just say this thread is a case of my criticism hitting a little to close to home to some people on the 313 list. I really don't mind people having a little fun with threads like Richie hawtin k but if you don't like my opinion that's tuff, my opinion of the Plus 8 label looking like crap and other label's that try to go minimal but it doesn't look right because of the imagery or style font/ logo they are using is only my opinion. Spot on Garrett. I'm just looking for why you think the way you do. Saying the 'k' looks crap because of the typeface doesn't say much. It could simply be that while one person likes Helvetica, you in turn like Univers. Justification of your point is all that was asked for. Here's a question Steve. You see a rare Retroactive record, Feel The Fire for $5 with the basic artwork in red and black and say a record on Nukleuz that has some mind blowing artwork but the music IMHO leaves a lot to be desired, which do you choose, and why? Can I have my pacifier back now? thanks Benn -- Benn Glazier [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.royaltech.net
(313) Re: New Detroit releases
Submerge (via Gary Girard) wrote: Finally, UR FANS!! Check the Underground Resistance section for an exclusive to the S.I.D online store, a special limited edition UR MIX CD release. Anyone know anything more about this? Is it the URLE-01 DJ Rolando live @ For Those Who Know - May, 2002 CD? (Just thinking about that party makes my feet scream No! NO! NOT 4 HOURS OF NON-STOP DANCING ABUSE OF ME AGAIN! NOOO!!!) - Greg (who's still rockin' the same Puma Clydes/Puma Suedes line he's been wearing since 1975, and will continue to wear through the next 5 Electro and Northern Soul revivals (-: )
Fw: (313) Re: New Detroit releases
Friends, I want to introduce Greg Earle, a guy who chooses his shoes like Tiger Woods chooses his irons on the fairway of the 18th hole. At Movement on Sunday this year, the moment the rain stopped, Greg fished in his bag and pulled out the CORRECT shoes for dryland transportation. I was in awe! fred PS I know what you're thinking: anything NOT to talk about label logos . . . -- mail forwarded, original message follows -- To: 313@hyperreal.org From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Greg Earle Subject: (313) Re: New Detroit releases Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 18:53:08 -0700 Submerge (via Gary Girard) wrote: Finally, UR FANS!! Check the Underground Resistance section for an exclusive to the S.I.D online store, a special limited edition UR MIX CD release. Anyone know anything more about this? Is it the URLE-01 DJ Rolando live @ For Those Who Know - May, 2002 CD? (Just thinking about that party makes my feet scream No! NO! NOT 4 HOURS OF NON-STOP DANCING ABUSE OF ME AGAIN! NOOO!!!) - Greg (who's still rockin' the same Puma Clydes/Puma Suedes line he's been wearing since 1975, and will continue to wear through the next 5 Electro and Northern Soul revivals (-: )
Re: (313) Traxx last night......
Hahahahahahah Mel always stays places for a week. On Wed, 18 Jun 2003, MM wrote: well traxx played last night for us out hereand as usual, he did not dissapoint...he played a great set , dropped loads of dirty tracks.people were real into what he was playingall in all a good night..traxx will be staying with us for the rest of the week and might be playing again around here.if anyone is around the portland area and wants to see traxx, just email me and i will give you info. out michael www.renegaderhythms.com
RE: (313) Soul Music (was some nonsense spw was going on about)
Yeah, it is...but a lot of things used to be black people music too. Although jazz was pioneered by black artists...who is the most well known jazz musician today? Kenny G? (What happened to Coltrane and Miles Davis?) Um, they died. I would also suspect that these datys Winston Marsalis is more popular than Kenny G. Although blues music was pioneered by black artists...who is the most well known blues musician today? Stevie Ray Vaughn? (What happened to Muddy Waters, Albert King and Robert Johnson? Even Robert Cray?) Again, mostly dead. As for Cray, I gotta figure that Vaughn's fusion of rock and blues was more appealing than Cray's more basic straigh blues style. And although rock was pioneered by black artists...who is the most well loved and respected rock group in the world? The Beatles? (What happened to Little Richard , Chuck Berry, and Bo Diddley?) I gotta say the Beatles took the formula of Richard, Berry, Diddley and made a lot of innovations on it. Their songwriting was much more advanced and as for recording, instumentation and experimentation, you can't touch the Beatles for their time. Apathy. People didn't care, they didn't pay attention to what was going on, they didn't take a stand...they supported what was safe, common, predictable, expected...just like Living Colour's record company did with the cover of their first album...they didn't and dont' challenge the presumed wisdom of the day...and so much of this music (Black Music?) has died. They largely did this because, they were comfortable and complacent in the cultural resonance they were receiving from MI at the time - and the fact that the music industry was successful in keeping them pacified in this way. Same game today? They were content with their Bread and Circuses... It's hard to say. .. |-Original Message- |From: David Powers [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] |Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 5:31 PM |To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; David Powers |Cc: 313@hyperreal.org |Subject: RE: (313) Soul Music (was some nonsense spw was going on about) | | |Great post. I may have been misinformed, I was thinking about it |more in terms of the classifying of music by the record labels |than the meaning of the music for the people who made it. Now I'm |trying to remember which label it was that the record industry |used, maybe it was RB? | |And actually, I have to admit that the concept of soul you are |speaking about does not require any kind of metaphysics and could |be a very useful Idea. I come from a very conservative white |Christian background where soul is used as an extremely |repressive idea and justifies oppresion rather than encouraging |people to seek for a better life here on earth. So what is really |interesting is that African-Americans took a notion from their |oppresors and transformed it, took it down a life of flight so |that it became a liberating concept. | |And if you think about it in terms of music, this is really |interesting because African-Americans have always borrowed from |the white European tradition, but at the same time have often been |successful at liberating these elements from their hierarchical |origins and set them in motion, into a continuous variation where |the elements that are ripped from their foundation in an oppresive |hierarchical Culture now enter into free play and communicate with |all the other elements of music. A continuous line of variation |rather than a strict code of meaning. (On the other hand there is |always a Winton Marsalis at the end of the line trying to block |the development, saying our music is a CLASSICAL music, hip hop, |techno and free jazz, well THAT doesn't swing, that's not real |music, that's not our identity, we need to find our place as an |extension of Western Culture.) | |313 people, you might think I'm off topic but really I'm talking |about things like jazz chords, instrumental virtuosity, 808, 909, |303, DIY use of technology, sampler; all the elements of Detroit |techno can be understood very well in this context. | |dave | | |-- Original Message - |Subject: RE: (313) Soul Music (was some nonsense spw was going on about) |Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2003 01:41:17 +0200 |From: Sylvia [EMAIL PROTECTED] |To: David Powers [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | | ||On the other hand, Soul Music as a genre was a just a euphimism for ||black music, and doesn't have anything to do with soul as a spiritual ||or metaphysical concept. | |Euphemism | |'blues' is without hope and that its singers accept their |conditions without |complaint or expectation of anything better. Soul borrowed an |expectation of |a better world from gospel, but translate it into a worldly context as |opposed to a religious one. Gospel gives soul its optimism because it |believes in a better world in heaven, soul starts looking for that better |world on earth. | |Soul Music is the product of
Re: (313) OT: UK TechnoTourist alert: British Airways' 1 day sale (fwd)
Yeah, you can come and see me Cyclone, aka The Witch, 'DJ' on 10 decks Saturday at Honkytonks playing all my new Detroit records, then stay for Stacey Pullen (supported by Christian Vance, official record bag security for Francois K and D May at Movement afterparty) and LTJ Bukem over the week, they're some up-and-coming kids, I hear. You can look at my sexy Movement pictures too. ;) -- From: Greg Earle [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) OT: UK TechnoTourist alert: British Airways' 1 day sale (fwd) Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 10:02 AM Sorry for the SPAM but in case any of you UK lot want to come to NYC or go to Melbourne (and visit Cyclone? :) ), jump on this one fast lads ... - Greg (just back from Barca/Sonar and still jet-lagged a bit) --- Forwarded Message Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 01:59:42 +0200 (CEST) From: Airfares Deal mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Organization: Airfares Deal mailing list MIME-Version: 1.0 List: airfares List-Archive: http://www.tarom.net/cgi-bin/mojo/mojo.cgi?f=archivel=airfares List-ID: 20030619013318 List-Owner: [EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://www.tarom.net/cgi-bin/mojo/mojo.cgi?f=sl=airfares List-Unsubscribe: http://www.tarom.net/cgi-bin/mojo/mojo.cgi?f=ul=airfares List-URL: http://www.tarom.net/cgi-bin/mojo/mojo.cgi?l=airfares List-Software: Mojo Mail 2.8.4 Precedence: list X-Priority: 3 Subject: Airfare alert: BA 1 day sale, London Heathrow-Melbourne for just £369 British Airways' one day seat sale for July/Aug./Sept. (Melbourne) includes: NEW YORK Price: from £265 Travel dates: 01/07/03-31/08/03 TORONTO Price: £285 Travel dates: 01/07/03-31/08/03 MELBOURNE Price: £369 Travel dates: 01/07/03-30/09/03 Bookable on June 19 ONLY. --- End of Forwarded Message
Re: (313) OT: UK TechnoTourist alert: British Airways' 1 day sale (fwd)
Oops, meant to spell that Kyklone. ;) -- From: Cyclone Wehner [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) OT: UK TechnoTourist alert: British Airways' 1 day sale (fwd) Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 2:18 PM Yeah, you can come and see me Cyclone, aka The Witch, 'DJ' on 10 decks Saturday at Honkytonks playing all my new Detroit records, then stay for Stacey Pullen (supported by Christian Vance, official record bag security for Francois K and D May at Movement afterparty) and LTJ Bukem over the week, they're some up-and-coming kids, I hear. You can look at my sexy Movement pictures too. ;) -- From: Greg Earle [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) OT: UK TechnoTourist alert: British Airways' 1 day sale (fwd) Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 10:02 AM Sorry for the SPAM but in case any of you UK lot want to come to NYC or go to Melbourne (and visit Cyclone? :) ), jump on this one fast lads ... - Greg (just back from Barca/Sonar and still jet-lagged a bit) --- Forwarded Message Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 01:59:42 +0200 (CEST) From: Airfares Deal mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Organization: Airfares Deal mailing list MIME-Version: 1.0 List: airfares List-Archive: http://www.tarom.net/cgi-bin/mojo/mojo.cgi?f=archivel=airfares List-ID: 20030619013318 List-Owner: [EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://www.tarom.net/cgi-bin/mojo/mojo.cgi?f=sl=airfares List-Unsubscribe: http://www.tarom.net/cgi-bin/mojo/mojo.cgi?f=ul=airfares List-URL: http://www.tarom.net/cgi-bin/mojo/mojo.cgi?l=airfares List-Software: Mojo Mail 2.8.4 Precedence: list X-Priority: 3 Subject: Airfare alert: BA 1 day sale, London Heathrow-Melbourne for just £369 British Airways' one day seat sale for July/Aug./Sept. (Melbourne) includes: NEW YORK Price: from £265 Travel dates: 01/07/03-31/08/03 TORONTO Price: £285 Travel dates: 01/07/03-31/08/03 MELBOURNE Price: £369 Travel dates: 01/07/03-30/09/03 Bookable on June 19 ONLY. --- End of Forwarded Message
Re: (313) OT: UK TechnoTourist alert: British Airways' 1 day sale (fwd)
On Thu, 19 Jun 2003 14:18:13 +1000, Cyclone Wehner [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: Yeah, you can come and see me Cyclone, aka The Witch, 'DJ' on 10 decks Saturday at Honkytonks playing all my new Detroit records, then stay for Stacey Pullen (supported by Christian Vance, official record bag security for Francois K and D May at Movement afterparty) and LTJ Bukem over the week, they're some up-and-coming kids, I hear. You can look at my sexy Movement pictures too. ;) After all... where do you think Mad Mike came up with the name for UR-18? Working all the decks with hands, feet and ESP. All I have to say is 'unbelievable'! ;) -- Benn Glazier [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.royaltech.net
RE: (313) Soul Music (was some nonsense spw was going on about)
Its discussions like this that really makes me hate techno and everyone that goes with it. |-Original Message- |From: Sylvia [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] |Sent: 18 June 2003 23:52 |To: David Powers |Cc: 313@hyperreal.org |Subject: RE: (313) Soul Music (was some nonsense spw was going |on about) | | |because African-Americans have always borrowed from |the white European tradition, | |Borrowed ? say What ? Kind of comment can just come from a |perfect imbecile who is a waste of human flesh, and his only |use on this earth is to take up space, God knows why, thank |you very much for your brilliant comments, I much appreciated |meantime let me tell you that: | |The music was a product of the existing environment of the |time in which the musicians who created it lived.. social and |political striking periods of black people in America, have |always been accompanied with a new musical genre, as an |example Period of Soul is roughly defined as 1955 - 1970. It |very much parallels the Civil Rights movement. | |- African roots music 1619! brought to us Negro spirituals 1825-1850 |- Negro spiritual antique Gospel Music brought to us Gospel |music: 1890 then Rhythm and Blues as BLUES: early 1900s and |then Jazz: 1920 |- Gospel and RB brought to us Soul |- Jazz brought to us Funk | |I wonder how you can be daily, next, go alongside to people of |which you do not even know the life, the existence, the |history ...the roots! | |Take some teach on my web at |http://www.guerrillafunk.com/thoughts/doc1788.html | |And let me quote myself from an email that I sent to this same |list on March 6th 2002! | |Yeah, it is...but a lot of things used to be black people |music too. Although jazz was pioneered by black artists...who |is the most well known jazz musician today? Kenny G? (What |happened to Coltrane and Miles Davis?) Although blues music |was pioneered by black artists...who is the most well known |blues musician today? Stevie Ray Vaughn? (What happened to |Muddy Waters, Albert King and Robert Johnson? Even Robert |Cray?) |And although rock was pioneered by black artists...who is the |most well loved and respected rock group in the world? The |Beatles? (What happened to Little Richard , Chuck Berry, and |Bo Diddley?) Apathy. People didn't care, they didn't pay |attention to what was going on, they didn't take a |stand...they supported what was safe, common, |predictable, expected...just like Living Colour's record |company did with the cover of their first album...they didn't |and dont' challenge the presumed wisdom of the day...and so |much of this music (Black Music?) has died. They largely did |this because, they were comfortable and complacent in the |cultural resonance they were receiving from MI at the time - |and the fact that the music industry was successful in keeping |them pacified in this way. Same game today? They were content |with their Bread and Circuses... It's hard to say. .. | | ||-Original Message- ||From: David Powers [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ||Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 5:31 PM ||To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; David Powers ||Cc: 313@hyperreal.org ||Subject: RE: (313) Soul Music (was some nonsense spw was going on ||about) || || ||Great post. I may have been misinformed, I was thinking |about it more ||in terms of the classifying of music by the record labels than the ||meaning of the music for the people who made it. Now I'm trying to ||remember which label it was that the record industry used, |maybe it was ||RB? || ||And actually, I have to admit that the concept of soul you are ||speaking about does not require any kind of metaphysics and |could be a ||very useful Idea. I come from a very conservative white Christian ||background where soul is used as an extremely repressive idea and ||justifies oppresion rather than encouraging people to seek |for a better ||life here on earth. So what is really interesting is that ||African-Americans took a notion from their oppresors and transformed ||it, took it down a life of flight so that it became a liberating ||concept. || ||And if you think about it in terms of music, this is really |interesting ||because African-Americans have always borrowed from the white |European ||tradition, but at the same time have often been successful at ||liberating these elements from their hierarchical origins and |set them ||in motion, into a continuous variation where the elements that are ||ripped from their foundation in an oppresive hierarchical Culture now ||enter into free play and communicate with all the other elements of ||music. A continuous line of variation rather than a strict code of ||meaning. (On the other hand there is always a Winton Marsalis at the ||end of the line trying to block the development, saying our |music is a ||CLASSICAL music, hip hop, techno and free jazz, well THAT doesn't ||swing, that's not real music, that's not our identity, we |need to find
(313) Ghetto-tech and electro in Brixton tonight
Just in case any 313ers are going to be wandering the sultry streets of South London tonight looking for loud 808 kick drums, WIDE is doing a Bootyquake party at the Dogstar. Entry is free, and myself and mute 313 subscriber Guy Thackeray will be appearing as the Non Stop DJs at 10pm! For more info (or just to see the lo-fi flyer) go to http://www.wideadventure.com/dogstar_0603.htm, or alternatively give me a shout... Brendan
Re: (313) Glasgow this Saturday...
Hi Tom, got my tickets already - see you Saturday. List, if anyone else is thinking of getting tickets, I got an email from Trax saying that tuesday was the last day for online purchases so you will have to go to The Arches box office. Cheers BT PS: any more info on the afterparty you mentioned a while ago Tom? Excuse the plug - hopefully see a few of the Scottish list members here... Traxxevents and The Arches present... Traxx, Melting Pot and Death Disco The Arches, Saturday June 21st, 2230-0400, £15 Traxx Room Stacey Pullen (Black Flag, Detroit) 3 hour set Kirk Degiorgio (As One, Ubiquity, ART) Ableton Live set Tom Churchill (Emoticon/Headspace Recordings) plus VJ Michael Heap (Raya) Melting Pot Room Danny Krivit (Body and Soul, NYC) 4 hour set - Scottish debut Billy Woods (Melting Pot) Death Disco Room Ladytron (DJ set) The Freelance Hellraiser (DJ set) DJ Mingo-go Onna X (bis) More info, tickets etc: http://www.traxxevents.com/news/event.php?ID=11 Cheers, Tom
Re: (313) Glasgow this Saturday...
PS: any more info on the afterparty you mentioned a while ago Tom? Sadly this now won't be happening - a combination of factors conspired against us and it just wasn't feasible in the end. But the main night goes on until 4 so it should still be a great night... Cheers, Tom
(313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
But you can't
(313) Radio Show - Friday 6pm - 8pm - www.wbar.org
My weekly radio show at WBAR 87.9 FM Barnard College radio, NYC is tomorrow and every Friday night from 6pm to 8pm. I realized last week that the station doesn't have an FCC license so doesn't transmit so it's basically an internet station. The stream is accessible from www.wbar.org. I haven't decided what I will be playing tomorrow but it will be some form of house - possibly disco house. You can email me with feedback to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or AIM me at the station at wbarrequest. The MP3s from last week's show are on my web site (www.skooch.com). The MP3s from this week's show will be posted over the weekend. Thanks, Eric
RE: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
Me ? :D -- This message is intended only for the personal and confidential use of the designated recipient(s) named above. If you are not the intended recipient of this message you are hereby notified that any review, dissemination, distribution or copying of this message is strictly prohibited. This communication is for information purposes only and should not be regarded as an offer to sell or as a solicitation of an offer to buy any financial product, an official confirmation of any transaction, or as an official statement of Lehman Brothers. Email transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free. Therefore, we do not represent that this information is complete or accurate and it should not be relied upon as such. All information is subject to change without notice.
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
Jeff Mills ?
RE: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
I am. See you guys there.
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
i dunno but it better be good cause its my birthday.. - Original Message - From: Placid [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Org 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2003 4:36 PM Subject: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'? But you can't
RE: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
Julian 'Jumpin' Perez? The Wee Papa Girl Rappers? Inquiring minds demand to know! :) -Original Message- From: Placid [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 19 June 2003 15:36 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Org Subject: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'? But you can't
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
Jeff I can afford a luxury yacht on the money I make from lost' mills Are there no other dj's in the world that play techno On 19/6/03 4:24 pm, Brendan Nelson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Julian 'Jumpin' Perez? The Wee Papa Girl Rappers? Inquiring minds demand to know! :) -Original Message- From: Placid [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 19 June 2003 15:36 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Org Subject: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'? But you can't
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
19/6/03 3:41 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jeff I can afford a luxury yacht on the money I make from lost' mills That's a tad unfair, he's put the hours in fella... Are there no other dj's in the world that play techno Of course there are, that's down to the promoter not the DJ Martin
(313) a sonomu update
sonomu: sound - noise - music http://sonomu.net hia it's been a while so i thought a quick update on sound noise music activity wouldn't go amiss. apologies for blatantly plugging the list but it should be of interest to most of you for those who click through and aren't members yet - we only ask for your email address so we can verify you're genuinely interested in joining sonomu and its community - and membership is free... lots of exciting stuff happening behind the scenes at sonomu too - will keep you posted... -- recent news: sonomu.net co-curate 'placard festival' [16 Jun 2003] Sonomu.net is pleased to announce its involvement in Placard - the headphone-only festival taking place in London on 19 July 2003. http://sonomu.net/news/+sonomunetannounc/ -- fresh events: Not Clickable v5.0 Cursor Miner delivers his own special brand of twisted digipop madness while Chris Sattinger aka Timeblind, in his mad scientist alter ego Crucial Felix combines sound with Jem Finer, composer... http://sonomu.net/event/+notclickablev50/ Slow Sound System This month Slub (fallt, fals.ch) bring us their customised brand of process-based sonic improvisations: live generative music using hand-crafted Macintosh and Unix applications (in networked synchrony). With... http://sonomu.net/event/+slowsoundsystem/ -- new reviews: - Chiglaik - Adam Johnson My initial response to Adam Johnson's Chiglaik album was yet another pleasantly laid back album from m3rck... says Andrew Jones http://sonomu.net/review/+chiglaik/ - Also Rising - Subarachnoid Space Less pot, more speed. says Michael W Woodring http://sonomu.net/review/+alsorising/ - Reconstruction - Zero dB Truly, this is modern jazz-influenced dance music with a large, sturdy set of balls... says John Stevens http://sonomu.net/review/+reconstruction/ - Pick Up - Bonobo Was one of the musical highlights of that year for me... says Jez Wells http://sonomu.net/review/+pickup/ more reviews include: - Sofienberg Variations - Christian Wallumrød - The Mess We Made - Matt Elliott - One Word Extinguisher - Prefuse 73 - Pondfloorsample - Gen Ken Montgomery - sync or swim - double helix - Rounds - Four Tet - Supreme Infinite Essence - Zero Ohms - Time is a Good Thing - Denzel and Huhn - Ear Shot - The Music of Mel Graves - Mel Graves - L'Illustration Musicale - King Of Woolworths - Burning Shed Sampler 2 - Various Artists - Undir, Feilnotum - Einoma - Wanna Buy A Craprak? - Various Artists Latest label members include: emoticon - http://emoticon.sonomu.net highpoint lowlife - http://highpointlowlife.sonomu.net horseglue - http://horseglue.sonomu.net - NEW! lo recordings - http://lorecordings.sonomu.net memphis industries - http://memphis.sonomu.net moshi moshi music - http://moshi.sonomu.net pickled egg - http://pickledegg.sonomu.net trace recordings - http://tracerecordings.sonomu.net - NEW! tummy touch - http://tummytouch.sonomu.net superglider - http://superglider.sonomu.net uncharted audio - http://unchartedaudio.sonomu.net underground sounds - http://undergroundsounds.sonomu.net - NEW! if you're interested in what label membership is and what it can do for your label contact me on [EMAIL PROTECTED] cheers susanna/the legendary jesse belle ps, anyone off to cybersonica tonight ( http://www.cybersonica.org/ ) at the ica in london, i'll be there djing with thorsten sideb0ard of 8bitrecs.com fame! _ susanna glaser: words, music, networks http://sonomu.net/ : managing editor state51 conspirator: http://state51.co.uk/
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
On 19/6/03 5:41 pm, Martin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 19/6/03 3:41 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jeff I can afford a luxury yacht on the money I make from lost' mills That's a tad unfair, he's put the hours in fella... Got the upmost respect for mills.. I'm just making a point that mills plays at nearly every lost... That¹s all.. Are there no other dj's in the world that play techno Of course there are, that's down to the promoter not the DJ Martin
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
19/6/03 3:41 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jeff I can afford a luxury yacht on the money I make from lost' mills That's a tad unfair, he's put the hours in fella... aye, most of em at lost. and while everyone down south moans about him playing there yet again us poor northerners haven't seen him in a decent club in 5 years. Are there no other dj's in the world that play techno Of course there are, that's down to the promoter not the DJ Martin
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
19/6/03 4:00 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] On 19/6/03 5:41 pm, Martin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 19/6/03 3:41 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jeff I can afford a luxury yacht on the money I make from lost' mills That's a tad unfair, he's put the hours in fella... Got the upmost respect for mills.. I'm just making a point that mills plays at nearly every lost... That¹s all.. Isn't he the 1/4 resident there tho, which would explain why he's there a lot...We tried to bring him north, his agent wouldn't have it, the crowd wasn't big enough, we could have put him on in Sheffield, Wales and then Liverpool - still no joy. Martin
(313) FA
If anyone's interested, I have about 95 things up on ebay (all CD) - some this-listy, including the Andres, a Theo and a few others. Almost all electronic stuff. In my attempt to keep a cashflow during a temporary layoff, I'm uploading more than I usually do for the next several weeks. Low start bids, no reserves. This will be my only 313 post to that effect, so hate me only temporarily. :-) seller id = [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thanks. jeff
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
Even though it's predictable, Mills is such a great DJ that I'm sure I'll go back to hear him again. He played the best set I've heard in a long time at Lost in February - I've not been to a night that's come close to it since. innercity [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 19/06/2003 17:03:57 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Org 313@hyperreal.org cc: Subject: Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'? 19/6/03 3:41 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jeff I can afford a luxury yacht on the money I make from lost' mills That's a tad unfair, he's put the hours in fella... aye, most of em at lost. and while everyone down south moans about him playing there yet again us poor northerners haven't seen him in a decent club in 5 years. Are there no other dj's in the world that play techno Of course there are, that's down to the promoter not the DJ Martin
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
Mills?! Man, I had my money on the deason/lawrence donky thing. --- Martin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 19/6/03 4:00 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] On 19/6/03 5:41 pm, Martin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 19/6/03 3:41 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jeff I can afford a luxury yacht on the money I make from lost' mills That's a tad unfair, he's put the hours in fella... Got the upmost respect for mills.. I'm just making a point that mills plays at nearly every lost... That¹s all.. Isn't he the 1/4 resident there tho, which would explain why he's there a lot...We tried to bring him north, his agent wouldn't have it, the crowd wasn't big enough, we could have put him on in Sheffield, Wales and then Liverpool - still no joy. Martin __ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
i really wish i could complain about seeing jeff mills all the time. tom -- Original Message -- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 17:11:04 +0100 Even though it's predictable, Mills is such a great DJ that I'm sure I'll go back to hear him again. He played the best set I've heard in a long time at Lost in February - I've not been to a night that's come close to it since. innercity [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 19/06/2003 17:03:57 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Org 313@hyperreal.org cc: Subject: Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'? 19/6/03 3:41 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jeff I can afford a luxury yacht on the money I make from lost' mills That's a tad unfair, he's put the hours in fella... aye, most of em at lost. and while everyone down south moans about him playing there yet again us poor northerners haven't seen him in a decent club in 5 years. Are there no other dj's in the world that play techno Of course there are, that's down to the promoter not the DJ Martin andythepooh.com
Re: (313) dan curtin on downlow
hi j.t. and minto, thanks for getting back to me...just listened to the clips on the site (www.downlowmusic.org) and i'm impressed. proper dan curtin goodnesshope the release is in july now :) the $tinkworks/phrenic clips don't sound too shabby either...looking forward to that too cheers robin...
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
it's a real tragedy - Original Message - From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2003 9:29 AM Subject: Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'? i really wish i could complain about seeing jeff mills all the time. tom -- Original Message -- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 17:11:04 +0100 Even though it's predictable, Mills is such a great DJ that I'm sure I'll go back to hear him again. He played the best set I've heard in a long time at Lost in February - I've not been to a night that's come close to it since. innercity [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 19/06/2003 17:03:57 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Org 313@hyperreal.org cc: Subject: Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'? 19/6/03 3:41 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jeff I can afford a luxury yacht on the money I make from lost' mills That's a tad unfair, he's put the hours in fella... aye, most of em at lost. and while everyone down south moans about him playing there yet again us poor northerners haven't seen him in a decent club in 5 years. Are there no other dj's in the world that play techno Of course there are, that's down to the promoter not the DJ Martin andythepooh.com
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
Heh, mate, try talking to Frederic about booking him anywhere in the States. On Thu, 19 Jun 2003, Martin wrote: Isn't he the 1/4 resident there tho, which would explain why he's there a lot...We tried to bring him north, his agent wouldn't have it, the crowd wasn't big enough, we could have put him on in Sheffield, Wales and then Liverpool - still no joy.
Re: (313) Traxx last night......
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hahahahahahah Mel always stays places for a week. That's part of his charm;-) m*
(313) More Derrick May ID
Hi there, Could anyone ID these tracks for me?? Derrick May Live @ Fuse 1999 Part One: - 15'20 (the track after Ben Sims' Killabite track) Derrick May DEMF 2000 Part Two: - 29'20 (the track after Derrick May's Salsa Life) - 31:40 Derrick May Live in Norway 1998?): - 5'39 - 8'54 (a Dance Mania sounding track) - 10'57 (a house track with trumpets) - 18'22 (the track after Gene Ferris 'The Spirit') Cheers, -h _ Get mobile Hotmail. Go to http://ninemsn.com.au/mobilecentral/signup.asp
RE: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
I think you said it man, we are lucky. -Original Message- From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 19 June 2003 17:30 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'? i really wish i could complain about seeing jeff mills all the time. tom -- Original Message -- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 17:11:04 +0100 Even though it's predictable, Mills is such a great DJ that I'm sure I'll go back to hear him again. He played the best set I've heard in a long time at Lost in February - I've not been to a night that's come close to it since. innercity [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 19/06/2003 17:03:57 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Org 313@hyperreal.org cc: Subject: Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'? 19/6/03 3:41 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jeff I can afford a luxury yacht on the money I make from lost' mills That's a tad unfair, he's put the hours in fella... aye, most of em at lost. and while everyone down south moans about him playing there yet again us poor northerners haven't seen him in a decent club in 5 years. Are there no other dj's in the world that play techno Of course there are, that's down to the promoter not the DJ Martin andythepooh.com --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.489 / Virus Database: 288 - Release Date: 10/06/03 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.489 / Virus Database: 288 - Release Date: 10/06/03
RE: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
exactly, I think he is one of the residents and really what a resident to have. I have to say that Mills is still pushing boundaries and its nice to hear what he may play next, its still has that excitment for me :) -Original Message- From: Martin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 19 June 2003 18:03 To: 313 Hyperreal. Org Subject: Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'? 19/6/03 4:00 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] On 19/6/03 5:41 pm, Martin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 19/6/03 3:41 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jeff I can afford a luxury yacht on the money I make from lost' mills That's a tad unfair, he's put the hours in fella... Got the upmost respect for mills.. I'm just making a point that mills plays at nearly every lost... That¹s all.. Isn't he the 1/4 resident there tho, which would explain why he's there a lot...We tried to bring him north, his agent wouldn't have it, the crowd wasn't big enough, we could have put him on in Sheffield, Wales and then Liverpool - still no joy. Martin --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.489 / Virus Database: 288 - Release Date: 10/06/03 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.489 / Virus Database: 288 - Release Date: 10/06/03
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
are you on millsy's payroll? On Thu, 19 Jun 2003, Martin wrote: 19/6/03 3:41 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jeff I can afford a luxury yacht on the money I make from lost' mills That's a tad unfair, he's put the hours in fella... Are there no other dj's in the world that play techno Of course there are, that's down to the promoter not the DJ Martin
Re: (313) More Derrick May ID
Derrick May Live @ Fuse 1999 Part One: - 15'20 (the track after Ben Sims' Killabite track) you mean this track: http://www.morthenkiang.com/samples/derrickatfuse103.ram I don´t know it, sorry! Anyone? Derrick May DEMF 2000 Part Two: - 29'20 (the track after Derrick May's Salsa Life) - 31:40 The sound clip is not working on the groovetech site, but if my memory serves me well, these are the last tracks of that mix (starting just after salsa life): Combustible (g la tortue / warrior / c carrier) - Carnaval - Combustible 01 Green Channel - 12 Years Of Dance - Access 58 004 Disco Tex - I Love Music - Disco Tex 03 Sound Of k - Silvery Sounds - F Communication 087 limited Gumbo - Submarine - Dance Mania 217 Derrick May Live in Norway 1998?): - 5'39 Is this the first actual trac kof the mix? In that case it is Flexible - Symptoms [ Offshoot 009 (´99) ] Or something else from this ep.. it is by steve rachmad. - 8'54 (a Dance Mania sounding track) Don´t have the audiophile here.. but it could be Dj Funk - Fast-N-Crazy (Backwards) [ Funk 000 (´96) ] - 10'57 (a house track with trumpets) No idea. - 18'22 (the track after Gene Ferris 'The Spirit') you mean this track? http://www.morthenkiang.com/samples/derrickatfuse101.ram Don´t know it either... Cheers, Maarten
RE: (313) New Detroit releases
Minto said (re: Rei Loci): This is what i call pump your fist toughness no playin' around techno Yeah! Now the bigger question is this description going to start showing up in the Watts New Releases descriptions? Kinda like peak hour screamer or aceeed phunk or tweaked out groover ha ha ps - I agree about Rei Loci. Gotta keep my eye on everything Jason Brunton has a hand in... if you like quality product and class techno that is. peace
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
Mills? He ain't nothin' special, see him 'round all the time. Why, I've seen him twice in the last 3 1/2 weeks alone ... what's the big deal? :-) (That said, personally I'd rather hear a certain female DJ who is closely associated with a certain person who likes the letter k and who has achieved instant Goddess status simply by wearing Joy Division t-shirts while spinning) Smugly, - Greg (who was rooting for Rob and the midget wrestler headlining)
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
(That said, personally I'd rather hear a certain female DJ who is closely associated with a certain person who likes the letter k and who has achieved instant Goddess status simply by wearing Joy Division t-shirts while spinning) Thanks - I was sure that was an old JD T-shirt she was wearing at Movement, but got distracted at the point when I was going to make my way up close to the stage a look closer. She didn't lose control, though ;-) jeff
RE: (313) Soul Music (was some nonsense spw was going on about)
Borrowed ? say What ? Kind of comment can just come from a perfect imbecile who is a waste of human flesh, and his only use on this earth is to take up space, God knows why, thank you very much for your brilliant comments, Whoa, Sylvia, chill the f*ck out for a second. I questioned David too but he did have some stuff to back up what he was saying (Dave I hope you don't mind me posting this and I apologize for including sections of a private post but I think in this case it's necessary): 1. Adaption of western instruments, use of these instruments in non-traditional ways. Although it's not cut and dry - there are some instruments that African's picked up after being taken to the Americas (largely brass marching band instruments and piano). 2. Obvious examples, the black church's use of white gospel music; Duke Ellington influenced by Ravel and Debussy; Art Tatum's reworking of the Western classical virtuosic pianistic tradition; Charlie Parker playing along with Stravinsky records; the uses jazz musicians have made of a classical text called Slominsky's Thesaurus of Scales... This is true. *Some* African-American jazz artists were and are influenced by European classical forms. 3. All jazz harmony is a mutant, revised version of Western classical harmony. Well, this isn't actually true - blue notes/harmonies are African in origin and never existed in Western scales /dave I don't think he is saying that African-American's have borrowed *everything* from European traditions. I think what he is trying to say is that there was a bit of back and forth between both cultures. However, you are right, Anglo culture has taken much more without giving credit (and also watering it down to the point of *blah*) and also trying to keep black artists underfunded, underrepresented, and corralled into a stereotype (ie. gangsta rap). Here's some other info that does defend what Dave was saying: Many Jazz writers have pointed out that the non-Jazz elements from which Jazz was formed, the Blues, Ragtime, Brass Band Music, Hymns and Spirituals, Minstrel music and work songs were ubiquitous in the United States and known in dozens of cities. Why then, they reason, should New Orleans be singled out as the sole birthplace of Jazz? These writers are overlooking one important factor that existed only in New Orleans, namely, the black Creole subculture. The Creoles were free, French and Spanish speaking Blacks, originally from the West Indies, who lived first under Spanish then French rule in the Louisiana Territory. They became Americans as a result of the Louisiana Purchase of 1803 and Louisiana statehood in 1812. The Creoles rose to the highest levels of New Orleans society during the 19th century. They lived in the French section of the city east of Canal Street and became prominent in the economic and cultural life of the section. The Creole musicians, many of whom were Conservatory trained in Paris, played at the Opera House and in chamber ensembles. Some led the best society bands in New Orleans. They prided themselves on their formal knowledge of European music, precise technique and soft delicate tone and had all of the social and cultural values that characterize the upper class. In sharp contrast were the people of the American part of New Orleans, who lived west of Canal Street. They were newly freed blacks who were poor, uneducated, and totally lacking in cultural and economic advantages. The musicians of the American section, also called the Back o' town section, were schooled in the blues, Gospel music, and work songs that they sang or played mostly by ear. Memorization and improvisation characterized the west side bands; sight reading and correct performance were characteristic of Creole bands. Then in 1894 an odious racial segregation law was enacted in New Orleans which forced the refined Creoles to live on the other side of Canal Street. Though this was a cultural catastrophe for the Creoles, they soon gained musical leadership of the American section . It was the musical sparks that flew on the clashing of these very different cultures in the ensuing decade that ignited the flames of Jazz. These happenings are discussed in the numerous recordings of Jelly Roll Morton made in 1938 at the Library of Congress in which he is interviewed by folk music expert Alan Lomax. They are the best documents we have of the
(313) theo parrish contact info?
i tried the old booking email addy at the sound signiature page a while back and got no response. tom andythepooh.com
(313) playlist WNUR Chicago - 13 June 2003
Clinically Inclined 13 June 2003 9:30pm - 12:30am CDT live stream www.wnur.org during showtime / 89.3 FM in Chicago 9:30 - 11pmMatt MacQueen Donny Hathaway - Valdez In The Country - Extension of a Man (Atco) '74 Shake - Lay Back (In the Cut) - Convalescence EP - (Frictional) Amp Fiddler - Freakin - Love and War EP (Genuine) Astrud Gilberto - The Beginning - Basic Principles of Sound (Soundsational) untitled - A1 (Sound Signature 18 test) Moodymann - Sweet Yesterday (feat. Pitch Black City) - Silence In The Secret Garden (Peacefrog) Russ Gabriel - Flip Down To Break (Emoticon) Silky - vol. 1 (Moxie) Apollonia 6 - Sex Shooter - Dance Version (Warner Bros.) '84 i:cube - Vacuum Jackers (Versatile) Tim Harper - Slammin All Night (Relief) Glenn Underground - May Detroit - Atmosfear (Peace Frog) Romanthony - The Wanderer (Journey Man Thump mix) (Prescription) Iz Diz - What We Need (Satisfaction Mix) (Silver) 3 Chairs - All Over (3 Chairs) untitled B2 - Bleed To Be Free EP (Ferris Park test) Double Helix -Subscript (Emoticon) Kelley Polar Quartet - Hammer/Anvil - Audition EP (Environ) Jesse Saunders - Funk You Up (Club Mix) (Streetfire) Pepe Braddock - Ghost - 6 Million Pintades (Atavisme) 11:00pm - 12:30amKarl Meier, Interrupt Media monolake - mass transit railway - hongkong (chain reaction) fumiya tanaka - sketch 1 (exist) motorbass - visine (astralwerks) a j sound - bassmental (decay) makaton - ? - animal worship (rodz konez) max duley - doublefront (meta) dj hell - passionate (traxx rmx) (unreleased) mion - drop the filter (music man) dj skull - frequency respone (red cat) regis - unknown (rsp 01) planetary assault systems - booster (surgeon rmx) (peacefrog) surgeon - waiting for me (counterbalance) exium - untitled (tsunami) dj shufflemaster - sole survivor (theory) archae grovskopa - dive (emergence TEST) curve - falling free (aphex twin rmx) (anxious) gescom vs ad vanz - viral (fatcat) octagon (basic channel) cyrus - enforcement (mills mix) (basic channel) oliver ho - jackal (blueprint) hiroaki iizuka - slapback (coda) kalpa - untitled (pure plastic) takaaki itoh - where is svetan? (pvc) steevio - core (echoplex rmx) (mindtours) sascha zastiral - new continents (physical soul) ulf lohmann - 3 - because before (kompakt) peace, Matt MacQueen
Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'?
A but have you seen Traxx's new Joy Division JACKET?? Now that's cool ;-) m* - Original Message - From: Greg Earle [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2003 3:22 PM Subject: Re: (313) Wow.. Guess who is headlining at 24th August 'lost'? Mills? He ain't nothin' special, see him 'round all the time. Why, I've seen him twice in the last 3 1/2 weeks alone ... what's the big deal? :-) (That said, personally I'd rather hear a certain female DJ who is closely associated with a certain person who likes the letter k and who has achieved instant Goddess status simply by wearing Joy Division t-shirts while spinning) Smugly, - Greg (who was rooting for Rob and the midget wrestler headlining)
(313) Vinyl for sale/trade
Hi, spam for some - treasure for others. I've listed quite a few things from my collection and others at: http://home.iprimus.com.au/richardcranston/ a fair bit of detroit techno/house, other u.s. house, disco, italo, electro let me know if there's anything you like apologies for the spam rc
(313) Berlin, labels, etc.
Hi folks, I'm living in Berlin for at least the next few months. I'd love to meet any list members who are also in the area. Also, I've got a new album pretty much finished and I've decided, for a variety of reasons, not to release it with my old label k2o records. As a relative newcomer to the scene I'm not as familiar with other, potentially more compatible labels than many of you on this list. If you have any ideas about good matches for the kind of music I do, it'd be great to hear about them For both of these things, feel free to reply off-list. Hope to hear from you soon, -- Dennis DeSantis www.dennisdesantis.com
