Re: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted gas generator?

[Steve Jones]

do you want perpetual energy? thats how you get perpetual energy

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 9:24 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> So, plug it into itself...
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 19, 2021, at 7:59 PM, Bill Prince  wrote:
>
> 
> It's part of their new hybrid package. I think it has a large battery that
> powers the inverter up to a point, and if you use too much power, it starts
> the engine to supplement. The generator also runs as a motor as a
> supplement to the gas engine, but only for short bursts. The braking is
> hybrid regen/friction, so if you are "light" on the brakes, that energy
> goes into the battery. Based on what I've read about it, the only energy
> that goes into the big battery while you're driving is from the regen.
>
> I presume (but don't know) that there is some way to charge the big
> battery via an AC plug?
>
> --
> bp
> part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 6:35 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
> wrote:
>
>> So is a separate generator driven from the main engine?
>>
>> *From:* Jason McKemie
>> *Sent:* Friday, February 19, 2021 1:23 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted
>> gas generator?
>>
>> The new F150 that they're referring to has MUCH more power than that, up
>> to 7.2kW.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:23 AM Bill Prince  wrote:
>>
>>> We have an F150 that's a few years old now that has a 400 watt inverter.
>>> Not particularly useful for house backup. That's why we have a generator
>>> that can run the house.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> bp
>>> 
>>>
>>> On 2/18/2021 9:36 PM, Steve D wrote:
>>>
>>> Anyone look into the F-150 with the built in generator?
>>>
>>> https://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/features/power/
>>>
>>> The inverter that powered the outlet in the bed of my Nissan Titan was
>>> adequate to run power tools all day.  I'd think something like the Ford
>>> would be even better for powering your trailers maybe!  Be quiet, and one
>>> less thing to maintain and fuel up too.
>>>
>>> -Steve D
>>>
>>> On Wed, Feb 17, 2021 at 2:08 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Noise is a huge issue for splicing trailers.  RV generators are what I
 will use going forward.

 Sent from my iPhone

 On Feb 17, 2021, at 12:50 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:

 
 Any generator can be mounted if you try hard enough.



 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions 
 
 
 
 
 Midwest Internet Exchange 
 
 
 
 The Brothers WISP 
 


 
 --
 *From: *"Mark Radabaugh" 
 *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
 *Sent: *Wednesday, February 17, 2021 1:38:05 PM
 *Subject: *[AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted
 gas generator?

 I have had it with the piece of shit Onan generator on the fiber
 trailer.   If the splicing trailer didn’t have a built in fuel tank I would
 just strap a Honda on and be done with it, but I would prefer something
 with a fuel pump.

 Mark
 --
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

 --
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

 --
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>> --
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted gas generator?

[Chuck McCown via AF]

So, plug it into itself...

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 19, 2021, at 7:59 PM, Bill Prince  wrote:
> 
> 
> It's part of their new hybrid package. I think it has a large battery that 
> powers the inverter up to a point, and if you use too much power, it starts 
> the engine to supplement. The generator also runs as a motor as a supplement 
> to the gas engine, but only for short bursts. The braking is hybrid 
> regen/friction, so if you are "light" on the brakes, that energy goes into 
> the battery. Based on what I've read about it, the only energy that goes into 
> the big battery while you're driving is from the regen.
> 
> I presume (but don't know) that there is some way to charge the big battery 
> via an AC plug?
> 
> --
> bp
> part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com
> 
> 
>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 6:35 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:
>> So is a separate generator driven from the main engine?
>>  
>> From: Jason McKemie
>> Sent: Friday, February 19, 2021 1:23 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted gas 
>> generator?
>>  
>> The new F150 that they're referring to has MUCH more power than that, up to 
>> 7.2kW.
>>  
>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:23 AM Bill Prince  wrote:
>>> We have an F150 that's a few years old now that has a 400 watt inverter. 
>>> Not particularly useful for house backup. That's why we have a generator 
>>> that can run the house.
>>> 
>>>  
>>> 
>>> bp
>>> 
 On 2/18/2021 9:36 PM, Steve D wrote:
 Anyone look into the F-150 with the built in generator?
  
 https://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/features/power/
  
 The inverter that powered the outlet in the bed of my Nissan Titan was 
 adequate to run power tools all day.  I'd think something like the Ford 
 would be even better for powering your trailers maybe!  Be quiet, and one 
 less thing to maintain and fuel up too.
  
 -Steve D
  
 On Wed, Feb 17, 2021 at 2:08 PM Chuck McCown via AF  
 wrote:
> Noise is a huge issue for splicing trailers.  RV generators are what I 
> will use going forward.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Feb 17, 2021, at 12:50 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Any generator can be mounted if you try hard enough.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions
>> 
>> Midwest Internet Exchange
>> 
>> The Brothers WISP
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: "Mark Radabaugh" 
>> To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 17, 2021 1:38:05 PM
>> Subject: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted gas 
>> generator?
>> 
>> I have had it with the piece of shit Onan generator on the fiber 
>> trailer.   If the splicing trailer didn’t have a built in fuel tank I 
>> would just strap a Honda on and be done with it, but I would prefer 
>> something with a fuel pump.   
>> 
>> Mark
>> -- 
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>  
>> -- 
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> -- 
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
 
>>> -- 
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>> 
>> -- 
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>> -- 
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> -- 
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted gas generator?

[Bill Prince]

It's part of their new hybrid package. I think it has a large battery that
powers the inverter up to a point, and if you use too much power, it starts
the engine to supplement. The generator also runs as a motor as a
supplement to the gas engine, but only for short bursts. The braking is
hybrid regen/friction, so if you are "light" on the brakes, that energy
goes into the battery. Based on what I've read about it, the only energy
that goes into the big battery while you're driving is from the regen.

I presume (but don't know) that there is some way to charge the big battery
via an AC plug?

--
bp
part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com


On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 6:35 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> So is a separate generator driven from the main engine?
>
> *From:* Jason McKemie
> *Sent:* Friday, February 19, 2021 1:23 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted
> gas generator?
>
> The new F150 that they're referring to has MUCH more power than that, up
> to 7.2kW.
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:23 AM Bill Prince  wrote:
>
>> We have an F150 that's a few years old now that has a 400 watt inverter.
>> Not particularly useful for house backup. That's why we have a generator
>> that can run the house.
>>
>>
>>
>> bp
>> 
>>
>> On 2/18/2021 9:36 PM, Steve D wrote:
>>
>> Anyone look into the F-150 with the built in generator?
>>
>> https://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/features/power/
>>
>> The inverter that powered the outlet in the bed of my Nissan Titan was
>> adequate to run power tools all day.  I'd think something like the Ford
>> would be even better for powering your trailers maybe!  Be quiet, and one
>> less thing to maintain and fuel up too.
>>
>> -Steve D
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 17, 2021 at 2:08 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Noise is a huge issue for splicing trailers.  RV generators are what I
>>> will use going forward.
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On Feb 17, 2021, at 12:50 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>> Any generator can be mounted if you try hard enough.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -
>>> Mike Hammett
>>> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Midwest Internet Exchange 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> The Brothers WISP 
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>> --
>>> *From: *"Mark Radabaugh" 
>>> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
>>> *Sent: *Wednesday, February 17, 2021 1:38:05 PM
>>> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted
>>> gas generator?
>>>
>>> I have had it with the piece of shit Onan generator on the fiber
>>> trailer.   If the splicing trailer didn’t have a built in fuel tank I would
>>> just strap a Honda on and be done with it, but I would prefer something
>>> with a fuel pump.
>>>
>>> Mark
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted gas generator?

[Chuck McCown via AF]

So is a separate generator driven from the main engine?

From: Jason McKemie 
Sent: Friday, February 19, 2021 1:23 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted gas 
generator?

The new F150 that they're referring to has MUCH more power than that, up to 
7.2kW.

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:23 AM Bill Prince  wrote:

  We have an F150 that's a few years old now that has a 400 watt inverter. Not 
particularly useful for house backup. That's why we have a generator that can 
run the house.



bp
On 2/18/2021 9:36 PM, Steve D wrote:

Anyone look into the F-150 with the built in generator? 

https://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/features/power/


The inverter that powered the outlet in the bed of my Nissan Titan was 
adequate to run power tools all day.  I'd think something like the Ford would 
be even better for powering your trailers maybe!  Be quiet, and one less thing 
to maintain and fuel up too.

-Steve D

On Wed, Feb 17, 2021 at 2:08 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

  Noise is a huge issue for splicing trailers.  RV generators are what I 
will use going forward.


  Sent from my iPhone


On Feb 17, 2021, at 12:50 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:


 
Any generator can be mounted if you try hard enough.




-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions

Midwest Internet Exchange

The Brothers WISP








From: "Mark Radabaugh" 
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
Sent: Wednesday, February 17, 2021 1:38:05 PM
Subject: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted gas 
generator?

I have had it with the piece of shit Onan generator on the fiber 
trailer.   If the splicing trailer didn’t have a built in fuel tank I would 
just strap a Honda on and be done with it, but I would prefer something with a 
fuel pump.   

Mark
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

  -- 
  AF mailing list
  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


 
  -- 
  AF mailing list
  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com




-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Mathew Howard]

The Mikrotiks are by far the easiest to align of any of the 60ghz stuff
I've tried, and I think they're probably the most reliable too. I have a
set of the new variant sitting here, and they look to be an improvement,
but I haven't tried them yet. They would be my first choice for super short
links.

I had high hopes for the Cambium 60ghz, but unfortunately it looks like
they only support up to channel 4 (64.8ghz), which means they won't have
significantly different range than the Mikrotiks, but if you need more than
1 gig, they're likely the best thing out there at the moment.

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 6:07 PM Steve Jones  wrote:

> We ordered the newer variant of the wireless wire today, we will see how
> it goes. We are waiting to see how the cambium product does and plan on
> using the extensively for short short stuff, we have an odd number of banks
> with remote drivethroughs very nearby.
>
> I'm jaded on ignitnet. One of those incidental ones we dealt with had
> killed one of our POPs off and on, the operator had the apparent default
> 5ghz backup enabled and it was misaligned so it would sporadically trash
> 5ghz, noisy useless bastards that they are
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 4:31 PM Mathew Howard  wrote:
>
>> The 5ghz backup would have been pretty useless on longer links. The
>> problem is that it has tiny antennas (8dbi, if I remember right)... so it
>> really only worked for really short links anyway, and even then, it seemed
>> kind of buggy.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:55 PM Sterling Jacobson 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> It’s wise of them to have dropped 5GHz because it never really worked
>>> all that well.
>>>
>>> The radios/antennas didn’t seem to be made for it and it ends up causing
>>> more issues than it solves IMO.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Carl Peterson
>>> *Sent:* Friday, February 19, 2021 2:50 PM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Seems strange to me that they dropped the 5GHz backup radio from the GBE
>>> Plus and the AF60LR.  All the other 60GHz radios have a 5GHz backup of some
>>> sort.
>>>
>>> We have installed a number of the little 60GHz GBE radios and they seem
>>> solid for short links with easy aim.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:31 PM Mathew Howard 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I think they claim their "Wave AI" feature is supposed to somehow
>>> magically make long links work better... but yeah, being able to use
>>> 66-70ghz behaves more like 70/80ghz than the lower 60ghz band, so you can
>>> do much longer distances... you still have the same problem with rain fade,
>>> but even on something like a 1 mile link that will work at 64-65ghz, it
>>> works a lot better, since you have more signal to work with.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:11 PM Carl Peterson <
>>> cpeter...@portnetworks.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Is that the only extra magic in the LR?  They claim 12KM vs 2KM.  I
>>> would never try 12 but I'm tempted to go for up to 3.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mathew Howard 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> At 1km it won't drop much, but it will still drop occasionally. Ubiquiti
>>> AF60LR will do a bit better than the other options, because it can use the
>>> higher channels.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 2:16 PM Dev  wrote:
>>>
>>> 700 meter Ignitenet MetroLinq PTP60-35 running around -48dbm during
>>> clear day says it will do >2.5Gbps with this RSSI, these things do a ton of
>>> bandwidth. It hangs in there surprisingly well during rain unless it’s
>>> really DUMPING rain. I think during normal or heavy rain it’s still in the
>>> mid to high 50’s. Doesn’t seem to use the 5GHz backup much, but traffic
>>> drops off fast when you do. I have another link doing 1.3km, much worse in
>>> heavy rain, but very impressive throughput when it’s not raining,
>>> surprisingly.
>>>
>>> > On Feb 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, Steve Jones 
>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor so ive
>>> never looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of fade are we
>>> talking in a normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
>>> > We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need more
>>> capacity, the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never understood the 60 ghz
>>> ones with 5ghz backup. its like a cruise ship having a backup canoe
>>> > --
>>> > AF mailing list
>>> > AF@af.afmug.com
>>> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Carl Peterson
>>>
>>> *PORT NETWORKS*
>>>
>>> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
>>>
>>> Baltimore, MD 21202
>>>
>>> (410) 637-3707
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>> --
>>> 

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Steve Jones]

We ordered the newer variant of the wireless wire today, we will see how it
goes. We are waiting to see how the cambium product does and plan on using
the extensively for short short stuff, we have an odd number of banks with
remote drivethroughs very nearby.

I'm jaded on ignitnet. One of those incidental ones we dealt with had
killed one of our POPs off and on, the operator had the apparent default
5ghz backup enabled and it was misaligned so it would sporadically trash
5ghz, noisy useless bastards that they are

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 4:31 PM Mathew Howard  wrote:

> The 5ghz backup would have been pretty useless on longer links. The
> problem is that it has tiny antennas (8dbi, if I remember right)... so it
> really only worked for really short links anyway, and even then, it seemed
> kind of buggy.
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:55 PM Sterling Jacobson 
> wrote:
>
>> It’s wise of them to have dropped 5GHz because it never really worked all
>> that well.
>>
>> The radios/antennas didn’t seem to be made for it and it ends up causing
>> more issues than it solves IMO.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Carl Peterson
>> *Sent:* Friday, February 19, 2021 2:50 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km
>>
>>
>>
>> Seems strange to me that they dropped the 5GHz backup radio from the GBE
>> Plus and the AF60LR.  All the other 60GHz radios have a 5GHz backup of some
>> sort.
>>
>> We have installed a number of the little 60GHz GBE radios and they seem
>> solid for short links with easy aim.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:31 PM Mathew Howard 
>> wrote:
>>
>> I think they claim their "Wave AI" feature is supposed to somehow
>> magically make long links work better... but yeah, being able to use
>> 66-70ghz behaves more like 70/80ghz than the lower 60ghz band, so you can
>> do much longer distances... you still have the same problem with rain fade,
>> but even on something like a 1 mile link that will work at 64-65ghz, it
>> works a lot better, since you have more signal to work with.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:11 PM Carl Peterson 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Is that the only extra magic in the LR?  They claim 12KM vs 2KM.  I would
>> never try 12 but I'm tempted to go for up to 3.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mathew Howard 
>> wrote:
>>
>> At 1km it won't drop much, but it will still drop occasionally. Ubiquiti
>> AF60LR will do a bit better than the other options, because it can use the
>> higher channels.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 2:16 PM Dev  wrote:
>>
>> 700 meter Ignitenet MetroLinq PTP60-35 running around -48dbm during clear
>> day says it will do >2.5Gbps with this RSSI, these things do a ton of
>> bandwidth. It hangs in there surprisingly well during rain unless it’s
>> really DUMPING rain. I think during normal or heavy rain it’s still in the
>> mid to high 50’s. Doesn’t seem to use the 5GHz backup much, but traffic
>> drops off fast when you do. I have another link doing 1.3km, much worse in
>> heavy rain, but very impressive throughput when it’s not raining,
>> surprisingly.
>>
>> > On Feb 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor so ive
>> never looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of fade are we
>> talking in a normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
>> > We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need more
>> capacity, the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never understood the 60 ghz
>> ones with 5ghz backup. its like a cruise ship having a backup canoe
>> > --
>> > AF mailing list
>> > AF@af.afmug.com
>> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Carl Peterson
>>
>> *PORT NETWORKS*
>>
>> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
>>
>> Baltimore, MD 21202
>>
>> (410) 637-3707
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Carl Peterson
>>
>> *PORT NETWORKS*
>>
>> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
>>
>> Baltimore, MD 21202
>>
>> (410) 637-3707
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Mathew Howard]

The 5ghz backup would have been pretty useless on longer links. The problem
is that it has tiny antennas (8dbi, if I remember right)... so it really
only worked for really short links anyway, and even then, it seemed kind of
buggy.

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:55 PM Sterling Jacobson 
wrote:

> It’s wise of them to have dropped 5GHz because it never really worked all
> that well.
>
> The radios/antennas didn’t seem to be made for it and it ends up causing
> more issues than it solves IMO.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Carl Peterson
> *Sent:* Friday, February 19, 2021 2:50 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km
>
>
>
> Seems strange to me that they dropped the 5GHz backup radio from the GBE
> Plus and the AF60LR.  All the other 60GHz radios have a 5GHz backup of some
> sort.
>
> We have installed a number of the little 60GHz GBE radios and they seem
> solid for short links with easy aim.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:31 PM Mathew Howard 
> wrote:
>
> I think they claim their "Wave AI" feature is supposed to somehow
> magically make long links work better... but yeah, being able to use
> 66-70ghz behaves more like 70/80ghz than the lower 60ghz band, so you can
> do much longer distances... you still have the same problem with rain fade,
> but even on something like a 1 mile link that will work at 64-65ghz, it
> works a lot better, since you have more signal to work with.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:11 PM Carl Peterson 
> wrote:
>
> Is that the only extra magic in the LR?  They claim 12KM vs 2KM.  I would
> never try 12 but I'm tempted to go for up to 3.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mathew Howard 
> wrote:
>
> At 1km it won't drop much, but it will still drop occasionally. Ubiquiti
> AF60LR will do a bit better than the other options, because it can use the
> higher channels.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 2:16 PM Dev  wrote:
>
> 700 meter Ignitenet MetroLinq PTP60-35 running around -48dbm during clear
> day says it will do >2.5Gbps with this RSSI, these things do a ton of
> bandwidth. It hangs in there surprisingly well during rain unless it’s
> really DUMPING rain. I think during normal or heavy rain it’s still in the
> mid to high 50’s. Doesn’t seem to use the 5GHz backup much, but traffic
> drops off fast when you do. I have another link doing 1.3km, much worse in
> heavy rain, but very impressive throughput when it’s not raining,
> surprisingly.
>
> > On Feb 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, Steve Jones 
> wrote:
> >
> > We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor so ive
> never looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of fade are we
> talking in a normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
> > We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need more
> capacity, the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never understood the 60 ghz
> ones with 5ghz backup. its like a cruise ship having a backup canoe
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Carl Peterson
>
> *PORT NETWORKS*
>
> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
>
> Baltimore, MD 21202
>
> (410) 637-3707
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Carl Peterson
>
> *PORT NETWORKS*
>
> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
>
> Baltimore, MD 21202
>
> (410) 637-3707
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Carl Peterson]

ditto on the metrolinq.  I like the 5GHz backup.  Seems to work fine for
short links as long as you understand it is just a patch antenna on the
font.

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:55 PM Sterling Jacobson 
wrote:

> It’s wise of them to have dropped 5GHz because it never really worked all
> that well.
>
> The radios/antennas didn’t seem to be made for it and it ends up causing
> more issues than it solves IMO.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Carl Peterson
> *Sent:* Friday, February 19, 2021 2:50 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km
>
>
>
> Seems strange to me that they dropped the 5GHz backup radio from the GBE
> Plus and the AF60LR.  All the other 60GHz radios have a 5GHz backup of some
> sort.
>
> We have installed a number of the little 60GHz GBE radios and they seem
> solid for short links with easy aim.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:31 PM Mathew Howard 
> wrote:
>
> I think they claim their "Wave AI" feature is supposed to somehow
> magically make long links work better... but yeah, being able to use
> 66-70ghz behaves more like 70/80ghz than the lower 60ghz band, so you can
> do much longer distances... you still have the same problem with rain fade,
> but even on something like a 1 mile link that will work at 64-65ghz, it
> works a lot better, since you have more signal to work with.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:11 PM Carl Peterson 
> wrote:
>
> Is that the only extra magic in the LR?  They claim 12KM vs 2KM.  I would
> never try 12 but I'm tempted to go for up to 3.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mathew Howard 
> wrote:
>
> At 1km it won't drop much, but it will still drop occasionally. Ubiquiti
> AF60LR will do a bit better than the other options, because it can use the
> higher channels.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 2:16 PM Dev  wrote:
>
> 700 meter Ignitenet MetroLinq PTP60-35 running around -48dbm during clear
> day says it will do >2.5Gbps with this RSSI, these things do a ton of
> bandwidth. It hangs in there surprisingly well during rain unless it’s
> really DUMPING rain. I think during normal or heavy rain it’s still in the
> mid to high 50’s. Doesn’t seem to use the 5GHz backup much, but traffic
> drops off fast when you do. I have another link doing 1.3km, much worse in
> heavy rain, but very impressive throughput when it’s not raining,
> surprisingly.
>
> > On Feb 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, Steve Jones 
> wrote:
> >
> > We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor so ive
> never looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of fade are we
> talking in a normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
> > We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need more
> capacity, the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never understood the 60 ghz
> ones with 5ghz backup. its like a cruise ship having a backup canoe
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Carl Peterson
>
> *PORT NETWORKS*
>
> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
>
> Baltimore, MD 21202
>
> (410) 637-3707
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Carl Peterson
>
> *PORT NETWORKS*
>
> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
>
> Baltimore, MD 21202
>
> (410) 637-3707
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>


-- 

Carl Peterson

*PORT NETWORKS*

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Sterling Jacobson]

It’s wise of them to have dropped 5GHz because it never really worked all that 
well.
The radios/antennas didn’t seem to be made for it and it ends up causing more 
issues than it solves IMO.


From: AF  On Behalf Of Carl Peterson
Sent: Friday, February 19, 2021 2:50 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

Seems strange to me that they dropped the 5GHz backup radio from the GBE Plus 
and the AF60LR.  All the other 60GHz radios have a 5GHz backup of some sort.
We have installed a number of the little 60GHz GBE radios and they seem solid 
for short links with easy aim.

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:31 PM Mathew Howard 
mailto:mhoward...@gmail.com>> wrote:
I think they claim their "Wave AI" feature is supposed to somehow magically 
make long links work better... but yeah, being able to use 66-70ghz behaves 
more like 70/80ghz than the lower 60ghz band, so you can do much longer 
distances... you still have the same problem with rain fade, but even on 
something like a 1 mile link that will work at 64-65ghz, it works a lot better, 
since you have more signal to work with.

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:11 PM Carl Peterson 
mailto:cpeter...@portnetworks.com>> wrote:
Is that the only extra magic in the LR?  They claim 12KM vs 2KM.  I would never 
try 12 but I'm tempted to go for up to 3.

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mathew Howard 
mailto:mhoward...@gmail.com>> wrote:
At 1km it won't drop much, but it will still drop occasionally. Ubiquiti AF60LR 
will do a bit better than the other options, because it can use the higher 
channels.

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 2:16 PM Dev 
mailto:d...@logicalwebhost.com>> wrote:
700 meter Ignitenet MetroLinq PTP60-35 running around -48dbm during clear day 
says it will do >2.5Gbps with this RSSI, these things do a ton of bandwidth. It 
hangs in there surprisingly well during rain unless it’s really DUMPING rain. I 
think during normal or heavy rain it’s still in the mid to high 50’s. Doesn’t 
seem to use the 5GHz backup much, but traffic drops off fast when you do. I 
have another link doing 1.3km, much worse in heavy rain, but very impressive 
throughput when it’s not raining, surprisingly.

> On Feb 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, Steve Jones 
> mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor so ive never 
> looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of fade are we talking in a 
> normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
> We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need more capacity, 
> the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never understood the 60 ghz ones with 
> 5ghz backup. its like a cruise ship having a backup canoe
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


--

Carl Peterson

PORT NETWORKS

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707
--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


--

Carl Peterson

PORT NETWORKS

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Sterling Jacobson]

I wouldn't recommend the MetroLinq. We still have a few of them in our network, 
but they tend to just die out of the blue especially in cold weather.
And it's not really 2.5Gbps unless you are all 1500 byte packets. It's more 
back to 1Gbps or even less throughput on smaller packets because it has a weak 
CPU/PPS capacity.
We've pulled most of them out of our network.


-Original Message-
From: AF  On Behalf Of Dev
Sent: Friday, February 19, 2021 1:15 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

700 meter Ignitenet MetroLinq PTP60-35 running around -48dbm during clear day 
says it will do >2.5Gbps with this RSSI, these things do a ton of bandwidth. It 
hangs in there surprisingly well during rain unless it’s really DUMPING rain. I 
think during normal or heavy rain it’s still in the mid to high 50’s. Doesn’t 
seem to use the 5GHz backup much, but traffic drops off fast when you do. I 
have another link doing 1.3km, much worse in heavy rain, but very impressive 
throughput when it’s not raining, surprisingly. 

> On Feb 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, Steve Jones  wrote:
> 
> We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor so ive never 
> looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of fade are we talking in a 
> normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
> We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need more capacity, 
> the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never understood the 60 ghz ones with 
> 5ghz backup. its like a cruise ship having a backup canoe
> -- 
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Carl Peterson]

Seems strange to me that they dropped the 5GHz backup radio from the GBE
Plus and the AF60LR.  All the other 60GHz radios have a 5GHz backup of some
sort.
We have installed a number of the little 60GHz GBE radios and they seem
solid for short links with easy aim.

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:31 PM Mathew Howard  wrote:

> I think they claim their "Wave AI" feature is supposed to somehow
> magically make long links work better... but yeah, being able to use
> 66-70ghz behaves more like 70/80ghz than the lower 60ghz band, so you can
> do much longer distances... you still have the same problem with rain fade,
> but even on something like a 1 mile link that will work at 64-65ghz, it
> works a lot better, since you have more signal to work with.
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:11 PM Carl Peterson 
> wrote:
>
>> Is that the only extra magic in the LR?  They claim 12KM vs 2KM.  I would
>> never try 12 but I'm tempted to go for up to 3.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mathew Howard 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> At 1km it won't drop much, but it will still drop occasionally. Ubiquiti
>>> AF60LR will do a bit better than the other options, because it can use the
>>> higher channels.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 2:16 PM Dev  wrote:
>>>
 700 meter Ignitenet MetroLinq PTP60-35 running around -48dbm during
 clear day says it will do >2.5Gbps with this RSSI, these things do a ton of
 bandwidth. It hangs in there surprisingly well during rain unless it’s
 really DUMPING rain. I think during normal or heavy rain it’s still in the
 mid to high 50’s. Doesn’t seem to use the 5GHz backup much, but traffic
 drops off fast when you do. I have another link doing 1.3km, much worse in
 heavy rain, but very impressive throughput when it’s not raining,
 surprisingly.

 > On Feb 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, Steve Jones 
 wrote:
 >
 > We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor so ive
 never looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of fade are we
 talking in a normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
 > We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need more
 capacity, the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never understood the 60 ghz
 ones with 5ghz backup. its like a cruise ship having a backup canoe
 > --
 > AF mailing list
 > AF@af.afmug.com
 > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


 --
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Carl Peterson
>>
>> *PORT NETWORKS*
>>
>> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
>>
>> Baltimore, MD 21202
>>
>> (410) 637-3707
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>


-- 

Carl Peterson

*PORT NETWORKS*

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Mathew Howard]

I think they claim their "Wave AI" feature is supposed to somehow magically
make long links work better... but yeah, being able to use 66-70ghz behaves
more like 70/80ghz than the lower 60ghz band, so you can do much longer
distances... you still have the same problem with rain fade, but even on
something like a 1 mile link that will work at 64-65ghz, it works a lot
better, since you have more signal to work with.

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:11 PM Carl Peterson 
wrote:

> Is that the only extra magic in the LR?  They claim 12KM vs 2KM.  I would
> never try 12 but I'm tempted to go for up to 3.
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mathew Howard 
> wrote:
>
>> At 1km it won't drop much, but it will still drop occasionally. Ubiquiti
>> AF60LR will do a bit better than the other options, because it can use the
>> higher channels.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 2:16 PM Dev  wrote:
>>
>>> 700 meter Ignitenet MetroLinq PTP60-35 running around -48dbm during
>>> clear day says it will do >2.5Gbps with this RSSI, these things do a ton of
>>> bandwidth. It hangs in there surprisingly well during rain unless it’s
>>> really DUMPING rain. I think during normal or heavy rain it’s still in the
>>> mid to high 50’s. Doesn’t seem to use the 5GHz backup much, but traffic
>>> drops off fast when you do. I have another link doing 1.3km, much worse in
>>> heavy rain, but very impressive throughput when it’s not raining,
>>> surprisingly.
>>>
>>> > On Feb 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, Steve Jones 
>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor so ive
>>> never looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of fade are we
>>> talking in a normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
>>> > We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need more
>>> capacity, the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never understood the 60 ghz
>>> ones with 5ghz backup. its like a cruise ship having a backup canoe
>>> > --
>>> > AF mailing list
>>> > AF@af.afmug.com
>>> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
>
> --
>
> Carl Peterson
>
> *PORT NETWORKS*
>
> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
>
> Baltimore, MD 21202
>
> (410) 637-3707
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[TJ Trout]

It seems like three to four miles on the LR is The Sweet spot with heavy
rain to keep the link up

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 1:11 PM Carl Peterson 
wrote:

> Is that the only extra magic in the LR?  They claim 12KM vs 2KM.  I would
> never try 12 but I'm tempted to go for up to 3.
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mathew Howard 
> wrote:
>
>> At 1km it won't drop much, but it will still drop occasionally. Ubiquiti
>> AF60LR will do a bit better than the other options, because it can use the
>> higher channels.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 2:16 PM Dev  wrote:
>>
>>> 700 meter Ignitenet MetroLinq PTP60-35 running around -48dbm during
>>> clear day says it will do >2.5Gbps with this RSSI, these things do a ton of
>>> bandwidth. It hangs in there surprisingly well during rain unless it’s
>>> really DUMPING rain. I think during normal or heavy rain it’s still in the
>>> mid to high 50’s. Doesn’t seem to use the 5GHz backup much, but traffic
>>> drops off fast when you do. I have another link doing 1.3km, much worse in
>>> heavy rain, but very impressive throughput when it’s not raining,
>>> surprisingly.
>>>
>>> > On Feb 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, Steve Jones 
>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor so ive
>>> never looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of fade are we
>>> talking in a normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
>>> > We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need more
>>> capacity, the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never understood the 60 ghz
>>> ones with 5ghz backup. its like a cruise ship having a backup canoe
>>> > --
>>> > AF mailing list
>>> > AF@af.afmug.com
>>> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
>
> --
>
> Carl Peterson
>
> *PORT NETWORKS*
>
> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
>
> Baltimore, MD 21202
>
> (410) 637-3707
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Carl Peterson]

Is that the only extra magic in the LR?  They claim 12KM vs 2KM.  I would
never try 12 but I'm tempted to go for up to 3.

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mathew Howard  wrote:

> At 1km it won't drop much, but it will still drop occasionally. Ubiquiti
> AF60LR will do a bit better than the other options, because it can use the
> higher channels.
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 2:16 PM Dev  wrote:
>
>> 700 meter Ignitenet MetroLinq PTP60-35 running around -48dbm during clear
>> day says it will do >2.5Gbps with this RSSI, these things do a ton of
>> bandwidth. It hangs in there surprisingly well during rain unless it’s
>> really DUMPING rain. I think during normal or heavy rain it’s still in the
>> mid to high 50’s. Doesn’t seem to use the 5GHz backup much, but traffic
>> drops off fast when you do. I have another link doing 1.3km, much worse in
>> heavy rain, but very impressive throughput when it’s not raining,
>> surprisingly.
>>
>> > On Feb 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor so ive
>> never looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of fade are we
>> talking in a normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
>> > We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need more
>> capacity, the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never understood the 60 ghz
>> ones with 5ghz backup. its like a cruise ship having a backup canoe
>> > --
>> > AF mailing list
>> > AF@af.afmug.com
>> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>


-- 

Carl Peterson

*PORT NETWORKS*

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Mathew Howard]

I think they claim something like 13km, which probably is actually
possible. We have one link running at 4 miles, which actually works a lot
better than I expected. It doesn't take too much of a storm to take it out
at that distance, but it can be pretty useful as an emergency backup.

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 3:05 PM Jay Weekley  wrote:

> What is the maximum distance for the AF60LR?  Ubiquiti makes some pretty
> wild claims as usual.
>
> Mathew Howard wrote:
> > At 1km it won't drop much, but it will still drop occasionally.
> > Ubiquiti AF60LR will do a bit better than the other options, because
> > it can use the higher channels.
> >
> > On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 2:16 PM Dev  > > wrote:
> >
> > 700 meter Ignitenet MetroLinq PTP60-35 running around -48dbm
> > during clear day says it will do >2.5Gbps with this RSSI, these
> > things do a ton of bandwidth. It hangs in there surprisingly well
> > during rain unless it’s really DUMPING rain. I think during normal
> > or heavy rain it’s still in the mid to high 50’s. Doesn’t seem to
> > use the 5GHz backup much, but traffic drops off fast when you do.
> > I have another link doing 1.3km, much worse in heavy rain, but
> > very impressive throughput when it’s not raining, surprisingly.
> >
> > > On Feb 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, Steve Jones
> > mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>>
> wrote:
> > >
> > > We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor
> > so ive never looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of
> > fade are we talking in a normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
> > > We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need
> > more capacity, the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never
> > understood the 60 ghz ones with 5ghz backup. its like a cruise
> > ship having a backup canoe
> > > --
> > > AF mailing list
> > > AF@af.afmug.com 
> > > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com 
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> *Jay Weekley*
> *Cyber Broadband
> *
>
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> https://www.avg.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Jay Weekley]

What is the maximum distance for the AF60LR?  Ubiquiti makes some pretty 
wild claims as usual.


Mathew Howard wrote:
At 1km it won't drop much, but it will still drop occasionally. 
Ubiquiti AF60LR will do a bit better than the other options, because 
it can use the higher channels.


On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 2:16 PM Dev > wrote:


700 meter Ignitenet MetroLinq PTP60-35 running around -48dbm
during clear day says it will do >2.5Gbps with this RSSI, these
things do a ton of bandwidth. It hangs in there surprisingly well
during rain unless it’s really DUMPING rain. I think during normal
or heavy rain it’s still in the mid to high 50’s. Doesn’t seem to
use the 5GHz backup much, but traffic drops off fast when you do.
I have another link doing 1.3km, much worse in heavy rain, but
very impressive throughput when it’s not raining, surprisingly.

> On Feb 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, Steve Jones
mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor
so ive never looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of
fade are we talking in a normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
> We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need
more capacity, the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never
understood the 60 ghz ones with 5ghz backup. its like a cruise
ship having a backup canoe
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com 
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


-- 
AF mailing list

AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com





--
*Jay Weekley*
*Cyber Broadband
*

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com


--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Mathew Howard]

At 1km it won't drop much, but it will still drop occasionally. Ubiquiti
AF60LR will do a bit better than the other options, because it can use the
higher channels.

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021, 2:16 PM Dev  wrote:

> 700 meter Ignitenet MetroLinq PTP60-35 running around -48dbm during clear
> day says it will do >2.5Gbps with this RSSI, these things do a ton of
> bandwidth. It hangs in there surprisingly well during rain unless it’s
> really DUMPING rain. I think during normal or heavy rain it’s still in the
> mid to high 50’s. Doesn’t seem to use the 5GHz backup much, but traffic
> drops off fast when you do. I have another link doing 1.3km, much worse in
> heavy rain, but very impressive throughput when it’s not raining,
> surprisingly.
>
> > On Feb 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, Steve Jones 
> wrote:
> >
> > We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor so ive
> never looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of fade are we
> talking in a normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
> > We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need more
> capacity, the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never understood the 60 ghz
> ones with 5ghz backup. its like a cruise ship having a backup canoe
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted gas generator?

[Bill Prince]

  
  
I know, but I'm not going to buy one for that anyway.


bp

On 2/19/2021 12:23 PM, Jason McKemie
  wrote:


  
  The new F150 that they're referring to has MUCH
more power than that, up to 7.2kW.
  
  
On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:23
  AM Bill Prince  wrote:


  
We have an F150 that's a few years old now that has a 400
  watt inverter. Not particularly useful for house backup.
  That's why we have a generator that can run the house.


bp

On 2/18/2021 9:36 PM, Steve D wrote:


  Anyone look into the F-150 with the built
in generator?


https://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/features/power/



The inverter that powered the outlet in the bed of
  my Nissan Titan was adequate to run power tools all
  day.  I'd think something like the Ford would be even
  better for powering your trailers maybe!  Be quiet,
  and one less thing to maintain and fuel up too.


-Steve D
  
  
  
On Wed, Feb 17, 2021
  at 2:08 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
  wrote:


  Noise is a huge issue for splicing
trailers.  RV generators are what I will use going
forward.

Sent from my iPhone

  On Feb 17, 2021, at 12:50
PM, Mike Hammett 
wrote:

  


  
Any
  generator can be mounted if you try hard
  enough.
  
  

-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent
  Computing Solutions

Midwest Internet
  Exchange

The Brothers WISP

  
  

  
  
  From:
"Mark Radabaugh" 
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users
Group" 
Sent: Wednesday, February 17, 2021
1:38:05 PM
Subject: [AFMUG] Does anyone other
than Onan make a decent mounted gas
generator?

I have had it with the piece of shit Onan
generator on the fiber trailer.   If the
splicing trailer didn’t have a built in fuel
tank I would just strap a Honda on and be
done with it, but I would prefer something
with a fuel pump.   

Mark
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
  
  

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
  

  
  -- 
  AF mailing list
  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

  
  
  

  
  -- 
  AF mailing list
  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

  
  
  

  


-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted gas generator?

[Jason McKemie]

The new F150 that they're referring to has MUCH more power than that, up to
7.2kW.

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:23 AM Bill Prince  wrote:

> We have an F150 that's a few years old now that has a 400 watt inverter.
> Not particularly useful for house backup. That's why we have a generator
> that can run the house.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 2/18/2021 9:36 PM, Steve D wrote:
>
> Anyone look into the F-150 with the built in generator?
>
> https://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/features/power/
>
> The inverter that powered the outlet in the bed of my Nissan Titan was
> adequate to run power tools all day.  I'd think something like the Ford
> would be even better for powering your trailers maybe!  Be quiet, and one
> less thing to maintain and fuel up too.
>
> -Steve D
>
> On Wed, Feb 17, 2021 at 2:08 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
> wrote:
>
>> Noise is a huge issue for splicing trailers.  RV generators are what I
>> will use going forward.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Feb 17, 2021, at 12:50 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:
>>
>> 
>> Any generator can be mounted if you try hard enough.
>>
>>
>>
>> -
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Midwest Internet Exchange 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> The Brothers WISP 
>> 
>>
>>
>> 
>> --
>> *From: *"Mark Radabaugh" 
>> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
>> *Sent: *Wednesday, February 17, 2021 1:38:05 PM
>> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted gas
>> generator?
>>
>> I have had it with the piece of shit Onan generator on the fiber trailer.
>>   If the splicing trailer didn’t have a built in fuel tank I would just
>> strap a Honda on and be done with it, but I would prefer something with a
>> fuel pump.
>>
>> Mark
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Dev]

700 meter Ignitenet MetroLinq PTP60-35 running around -48dbm during clear day 
says it will do >2.5Gbps with this RSSI, these things do a ton of bandwidth. It 
hangs in there surprisingly well during rain unless it’s really DUMPING rain. I 
think during normal or heavy rain it’s still in the mid to high 50’s. Doesn’t 
seem to use the 5GHz backup much, but traffic drops off fast when you do. I 
have another link doing 1.3km, much worse in heavy rain, but very impressive 
throughput when it’s not raining, surprisingly. 

> On Feb 19, 2021, at 11:51 AM, Steve Jones  wrote:
> 
> We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor so ive never 
> looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of fade are we talking in a 
> normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
> We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need more capacity, 
> the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never understood the 60 ghz ones with 
> 5ghz backup. its like a cruise ship having a backup canoe
> -- 
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Sterling Jacobson]

It will work but have some bad fade and/or disconnects in the rain.

We are using the Ubiquiti Airfiber 60 LR for PTP links of that range.
It’s UI, but this product stands out since it can use the “upper” channels of 
the 60GHz (near 70Ghz).


From: AF  On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Friday, February 19, 2021 12:52 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor so ive never 
looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of fade are we talking in a 
normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need more capacity, 
the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never understood the 60 ghz ones with 5ghz 
backup. its like a cruise ship having a backup canoe
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

[Bill Prince]

  
  
With fingers like that, I bet he can do some interesting chords.


bp

On 2/19/2021 11:46 AM, Jaime Solorza
  wrote:


  
  You know it's all about the bass
  
  
On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, 3:38 PM
  Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:


  

  
I wonder how it navigates.  I presume a barometric
  altimeter will work there.  But how would they get
  bearing and distance from the ground vehicle?  You
  could use a Doppler antenna array to get a bearing I
  suppose.  And maybe some kind of DME for distance. 
  Like to see a write up on that.  
  

  
  -- 
  AF mailing list
  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

  
  
  

  


-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

[AFMUG] Wireless Wire Dish @ 1km

[Steve Jones]

We havent dealt with 60ghz other than as an outside contractor so ive never
looked at performance directly. At 1 km what kind of fade are we talking in
a normal rain shower, and in a downpour?
We have had pretty good luck with af24 over the years but need more
capacity, the fade in 60ghz concerns me, and I never understood the 60 ghz
ones with 5ghz backup. its like a cruise ship having a backup canoe
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

[Jaime Solorza]

You know it's all about the bass

On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, 3:38 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> I wonder how it navigates.  I presume a barometric altimeter will work
> there.  But how would they get bearing and distance from the ground
> vehicle?  You could use a Doppler antenna array to get a bearing I
> suppose.  And maybe some kind of DME for distance.  Like to see a write up
> on that.
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

[Bill Prince]

  
  
I'm going to guess that there is some sort of homing beacon on
  the rover. With a 90 second TTL, I don't think it's going to go
  too far. In fact, there is probably some sort of contingency plan
  to have the rover pick it up and plop it back down on its charging
  platform.


bp

On 2/19/2021 10:57 AM, Adam Moffett
  wrote:


  
  I suppose you could still navigate by a local magnetic
field as long as you know it's position and shape.
  
  On 2/19/2021 1:50 PM, Adam Moffett
wrote:
  
  

I was going to say the same thing.  The rotating molten blob
  in the middle makes our magnetic field way stronger.  There's
  a feedback loop between flowing iron passing through magnetic
  fields making a current which increases magnetism which
  increases current, etc.  I'm sure I'm describing it poorly.

I just looked up and Mars is supposed to have localized
  magnetic fields from iron deposits in the crust, but not a
  global magnetic field like Earth.


On 2/19/2021 12:26 PM, Bill Prince
  wrote:


  
  Does Mars have a molten core? I would think that's
necessary for a magnetic pole. In fact, the major reason
Mars has very little atmosphere is because there is no
magnetic pole, or at least too little to provide protection
from the solar wind.
  
  
  bp

  On 2/19/2021 8:31 AM, Chuck
McCown via AF wrote:
  
  




  
It probably has a magnetic pole.  And they can get
  a celestial reference too.  

  
 

  From: Brian Webster 
  Sent: Friday, February 19, 2021 8:58
AM
  To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave
  Users Group' 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on
Mars

  
   


  
Assuming gyroscopic effect still
works on mars? That would be one way to keep a
reference ”north”
 

  Thank you,
  Brian Webster
  www.wirelessmapping.com

 

  
From:
AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com]
On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2021
6:22 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on
Mars
  

 

  It’s only got a 90 second
flight time. So presumably it doesn’t get very
far away. 


   


  I would guess radio ranging
and camera would allow it to get guidance -
similar to how missals could kick into radio
station signals to find a city back in the 60s.



  


  On
Feb 18, 2021, at 6:09 PM, Jaime Solorza 
wrote:


  


  BFM

 

  
On Thu, Feb 18, 2021,
  3:38 PM Chuck McCown via AF 
  wrote:
  
  

  

  
I wonder how it
navigates.  I presume a
barometric altimeter will work
there.  But how would they get
bearing and distance from the
 

Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

[Adam Moffett]

even better is Elon's Martians will know exactly where to dig for iron.

On 2/19/2021 1:57 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:


I suppose you could still navigate by a local magnetic field as 
long as you know it's position and shape.


On 2/19/2021 1:50 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:


I was going to say the same thing.  The rotating molten blob in the 
middle makes our magnetic field way stronger.  There's a feedback 
loop between flowing iron passing through magnetic fields making a 
current which increases magnetism which increases current, etc.  I'm 
sure I'm describing it poorly.


I just looked up and Mars is supposed to have localized magnetic 
fields from iron deposits in the crust, but not a global magnetic 
field like Earth.



On 2/19/2021 12:26 PM, Bill Prince wrote:


Does Mars have a molten core? I would think that's necessary for a 
magnetic pole. In fact, the major reason Mars has very little 
atmosphere is because there is no magnetic pole, or at least too 
little to provide protection from the solar wind.



bp

On 2/19/2021 8:31 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
It probably has a magnetic pole.  And they can get a celestial 
reference too.

*From:* Brian Webster
*Sent:* Friday, February 19, 2021 8:58 AM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

Assuming gyroscopic effect still works on mars? That would be one 
way to keep a reference ”north”


Thank you,

Brian Webster

www.wirelessmapping.com

*From:*AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Matt Hoppes
*Sent:* Thursday, February 18, 2021 6:22 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

It’s only got a 90 second flight time. So presumably it doesn’t get 
very far away.


I would guess radio ranging and camera would allow it to get 
guidance - similar to how missals could kick into radio station 
signals to find a city back in the 60s.




On Feb 18, 2021, at 6:09 PM, Jaime Solorza 
 wrote:




BFM

On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, 3:38 PM Chuck McCown via AF
 wrote:

I wonder how it navigates.  I presume a barometric
altimeter will work there.  But how would they get bearing
and distance from the ground vehicle?  You could use a
Doppler antenna array to get a bearing I suppose.  And
maybe some kind of DME for distance. Like to see a write up
on that.

-- 
AF mailing list

AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


-- 
AF mailing list

AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com



-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

[Adam Moffett]

I suppose you could still navigate by a local magnetic field as long 
as you know it's position and shape.


On 2/19/2021 1:50 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:


I was going to say the same thing.  The rotating molten blob in the 
middle makes our magnetic field way stronger.  There's a feedback loop 
between flowing iron passing through magnetic fields making a current 
which increases magnetism which increases current, etc.  I'm sure I'm 
describing it poorly.


I just looked up and Mars is supposed to have localized magnetic 
fields from iron deposits in the crust, but not a global magnetic 
field like Earth.



On 2/19/2021 12:26 PM, Bill Prince wrote:


Does Mars have a molten core? I would think that's necessary for a 
magnetic pole. In fact, the major reason Mars has very little 
atmosphere is because there is no magnetic pole, or at least too 
little to provide protection from the solar wind.



bp

On 2/19/2021 8:31 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
It probably has a magnetic pole.  And they can get a celestial 
reference too.

*From:* Brian Webster
*Sent:* Friday, February 19, 2021 8:58 AM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

Assuming gyroscopic effect still works on mars? That would be one 
way to keep a reference ”north”


Thank you,

Brian Webster

www.wirelessmapping.com

*From:*AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Matt Hoppes
*Sent:* Thursday, February 18, 2021 6:22 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

It’s only got a 90 second flight time. So presumably it doesn’t get 
very far away.


I would guess radio ranging and camera would allow it to get 
guidance - similar to how missals could kick into radio station 
signals to find a city back in the 60s.




On Feb 18, 2021, at 6:09 PM, Jaime Solorza 
 wrote:




BFM

On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, 3:38 PM Chuck McCown via AF
 wrote:

I wonder how it navigates.  I presume a barometric altimeter
will work there.  But how would they get bearing and
distance from the ground vehicle? You could use a Doppler
antenna array to get a bearing I suppose. And maybe some
kind of DME for distance.  Like to see a write up on that.

-- 
AF mailing list

AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


-- 
AF mailing list

AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com



-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

[Adam Moffett]

I was going to say the same thing.  The rotating molten blob in the 
middle makes our magnetic field way stronger.  There's a feedback loop 
between flowing iron passing through magnetic fields making a current 
which increases magnetism which increases current, etc.  I'm sure I'm 
describing it poorly.


I just looked up and Mars is supposed to have localized magnetic fields 
from iron deposits in the crust, but not a global magnetic field like Earth.



On 2/19/2021 12:26 PM, Bill Prince wrote:


Does Mars have a molten core? I would think that's necessary for a 
magnetic pole. In fact, the major reason Mars has very little 
atmosphere is because there is no magnetic pole, or at least too 
little to provide protection from the solar wind.



bp

On 2/19/2021 8:31 AM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:
It probably has a magnetic pole.  And they can get a celestial 
reference too.

*From:* Brian Webster
*Sent:* Friday, February 19, 2021 8:58 AM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

Assuming gyroscopic effect still works on mars? That would be one way 
to keep a reference ”north”


Thank you,

Brian Webster

www.wirelessmapping.com

*From:*AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Matt Hoppes
*Sent:* Thursday, February 18, 2021 6:22 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

It’s only got a 90 second flight time. So presumably it doesn’t get 
very far away.


I would guess radio ranging and camera would allow it to get guidance 
- similar to how missals could kick into radio station signals to 
find a city back in the 60s.




On Feb 18, 2021, at 6:09 PM, Jaime Solorza 
 wrote:




BFM

On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, 3:38 PM Chuck McCown via AF
 wrote:

I wonder how it navigates.  I presume a barometric altimeter
will work there.  But how would they get bearing and distance
from the ground vehicle?  You could use a Doppler antenna
array to get a bearing I suppose.  And maybe some kind of DME
for distance.  Like to see a write up on that.

-- 
AF mailing list

AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


-- 
AF mailing list

AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com



-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

[Bill Prince]

  
  
Does Mars have a molten core? I would think that's necessary for
  a magnetic pole. In fact, the major reason Mars has very little
  atmosphere is because there is no magnetic pole, or at least too
  little to provide protection from the solar wind.


bp

On 2/19/2021 8:31 AM, Chuck McCown via
  AF wrote:


  
  
  
  

  It probably has a magnetic pole.  And they can get a
celestial reference too.  
  

   
  
From: Brian Webster 
Sent: Friday, February 19, 2021 8:58 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users
Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars
  

 
  
  

  Assuming gyroscopic effect still works on
  mars? That would be one way to keep a reference
  ”north”
   
  
Thank you,
Brian Webster
www.wirelessmapping.com
  
   
  

  From: AF
  [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of
  Matt Hoppes
  Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2021 6:22 PM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

  
   
  
It’s only got a 90 second flight
  time. So presumably it doesn’t get very far away. 
  
  
 
  
  
I would guess radio ranging and
  camera would allow it to get guidance - similar to how
  missals could kick into radio station signals to find
  a city back in the 60s. 
  
  

  
  
On Feb
  18, 2021, at 6:09 PM, Jaime Solorza
   wrote:
  
  

  
  
BFM
  
   
  

  On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, 3:38 PM
Chuck McCown via AF 
wrote:


  

  

  I wonder how it
  navigates.  I presume a barometric
  altimeter will work there.  But how
  would they get bearing and distance
  from the ground vehicle?  You could
  use a Doppler antenna array to get a
  bearing I suppose.  And maybe some
  kind of DME for distance.  Like to see
  a write up on that.  

  

  
  -- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

  
  -- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

  




-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
  

  
  
  

  


-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted gas generator?

[Bill Prince]

  
  
We have an F150 that's a few years old now that has a 400 watt
  inverter. Not particularly useful for house backup. That's why we
  have a generator that can run the house.


bp

On 2/18/2021 9:36 PM, Steve D wrote:


  
  Anyone look into the F-150 with the built in
generator?


https://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/features/power/



The inverter that powered the outlet in the bed of my
  Nissan Titan was adequate to run power tools all day.  I'd
  think something like the Ford would be even better for
  powering your trailers maybe!  Be quiet, and one less thing to
  maintain and fuel up too.


-Steve D
  
  
  
On Wed, Feb 17, 2021 at 2:08
  PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:


  Noise is a huge issue for splicing trailers. 
RV generators are what I will use going forward.

Sent from my iPhone

  On Feb 17, 2021, at 12:50 PM, Mike
Hammett 
wrote:

  


  
Any
  generator can be mounted if you try hard enough.
  
  

-
Mike
  Hammett
Intelligent Computing
  Solutions

Midwest Internet Exchange

The Brothers WISP

  
  

  
  
  From:
"Mark Radabaugh" 
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
Sent: Wednesday, February 17, 2021 1:38:05
PM
Subject: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan
make a decent mounted gas generator?

I have had it with the piece of shit Onan generator
on the fiber trailer.   If the splicing trailer
didn’t have a built in fuel tank I would just strap
a Honda on and be done with it, but I would prefer
something with a fuel pump.   

Mark
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
  
  

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
  

  
  -- 
  AF mailing list
  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

  
  
  

  


-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

[Bill Prince]

  
  
NASA put a GPS constellation up in orbit around Mars?


bp

On 2/18/2021 2:38 PM, Chuck McCown via
  AF wrote:


  
  

  Oh, silly me, GPS of course...
  

   
  
From: Chuck
McCown 
Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2021 3:37 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Subject: OT Helicopter on Mars
  

 
  
  

  
I wonder how it navigates.  I presume a barometric
  altimeter will work there.  But how would they get
  bearing and distance from the ground vehicle?  You
  could use a Doppler antenna array to get a bearing I
  suppose.  And maybe some kind of DME for distance. 
  Like to see a write up on that.  
  

  

  
  
  

  


-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

[Chuck McCown via AF]

It probably has a magnetic pole.  And they can get a celestial reference too.  

From: Brian Webster 
Sent: Friday, February 19, 2021 8:58 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

Assuming gyroscopic effect still works on mars? That would be one way to keep a 
reference ”north”

 

Thank you,

Brian Webster

www.wirelessmapping.com

 

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2021 6:22 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

 

It’s only got a 90 second flight time. So presumably it doesn’t get very far 
away. 

 

I would guess radio ranging and camera would allow it to get guidance - similar 
to how missals could kick into radio station signals to find a city back in the 
60s. 





On Feb 18, 2021, at 6:09 PM, Jaime Solorza  wrote:

  

  BFM

   

  On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, 3:38 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

I wonder how it navigates.  I presume a barometric altimeter will work 
there.  But how would they get bearing and distance from the ground vehicle?  
You could use a Doppler antenna array to get a bearing I suppose.  And maybe 
some kind of DME for distance.  Like to see a write up on that.  

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

  -- 
  AF mailing list
  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com




-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Do Vlans care about protocol?

[Jan-GAMs]

At my age CRS is a very real issue.  Try to define what your acronyms 
are, once in awhile


On 2/18/21 10:06 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
Hell if I know. I have my first set of CRS coming in. I dont know how 
much different switchos is than ROS. But historically, task specific 
software is always better. I'm just hoping wireless isnt on in every 
package.


On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, 11:57 PM Nate Burke > wrote:


Router OS.  Just because I know it better.  In theory with the
Hardware offloading, it should be the same, right?

On 2/18/2021 9:30 PM, Steve Jones wrote:

Are you running router OS or switch OS on the switch?

On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, 9:06 PM Nate Burke mailto:n...@blastcomm.com>> wrote:

ROS 6.47.7

It's a production switch, so I'll have to change it around
during a maintenance window.  The switch is passing several
vlans between different ports, but this is the first IPv6
traffic I'm putting through it.

On 2/18/2021 8:22 PM, Jesse DuPont wrote:

What RouterOS version is on your CRS317? In your third
scenario, what happens if you turn off VLAN filtering in the
Bridge's VLAN tab?


*Jesse DuPont*

Owner / Network Architect
email: jesse.dup...@celeritycorp.net

Celerity Networks LLC / Celerity Broadband LLC
Like us! facebook.com/ celeritynetworksllc

Like us! facebook.com/ celeritybroadband

On 2/18/21 6:55 PM, Nate Burke wrote:

The P2P provider is saying that they find no technical
reason why the IPv6 traffic is not passing, and they're
pointing to my equipment.

I've plugged a couple more routers into the CRS317 to test
with.  What I found is that if I have the PVID set to the
Vlan, and Admit all packets on the interface, then I can
ping with IPv6 between the 2 routers.  But if I define a
VLan on either router, no IPv6 traffic passes.

Router1 <- Ethernet Cable -> Router2  Ipv6 works

Router1 <-CRS317 port1 PVID=3000 <-> CRS317 Port2 PVID=3000
-> Router2  IPv6 works

Router1 <-CRS317 Port1 PVID=3000 <-> CRS317 Port2 ->
Vlan3000 Router 2  IPv6 fails.

But even if I have the PVID of my P2P port and Router1 set
the same, I still can't ping an IPv6 address on the other
end of the P2P circuit. I'm about ready to give up and Kill
my Dualstack.

Has anyone tried IPv6 with Vlans on a CRS317? Am I missing
something simple?

On 2/15/2021 11:34 AM, Jesse Dupont wrote:

The CRS will pass all ethertypes by default.

Sent from my iPhone


On Feb 15, 2021, at 9:52 AM, Nate Burke
  wrote:

 After escalating with the provider, they think that
might be what is happening.  If what they're telling me
is true, Their Core network is running MPLS, but it's in
a QinQ to the NID that I'm plugged into.  So all IPv4 is
fine, but might not pass IPv6.

So do I need to set anything special on my CRS317 bridge
to pass the IPv6 Traffic on the Vlans?   The Only
Ethertype setting I see in the bridge interface itself,
and you can only choose 0x8100, 0x88a8, or 0x9100

On 2/15/2021 10:12 AM, Jesse DuPont wrote:

It is possible your P2P provider is filtering
Ethertypes. IPv4's Ethertype if 0x0800 whereas IPv6's
Ethertype is 0x86dd. This field is right after the
802.1Q VLAN header in the L2 header.


*Jesse DuPont*

Owner / Network Architect
email: jesse.dup...@celeritycorp.net

Celerity Networks LLC / Celerity Broadband LLC
Like us! facebook.com/
celeritynetworksllc

Like us! facebook.com/
celeritybroadband

On 2/15/21 7:36 AM, Nate Burke wrote:

I don't 'think' it's an MTU issue, even a simple IPv6
ping won't go across the P2P circuit.

On the CRS317, if I torch Vlan3000 on the ccr1009
interface, I see the IPv6 icmp packets coming in from
my CCR1009,  but if I torch the Interface going to the
P2P circuit on the CRS317, I see no IPv6 traffic.  Is
that a problem, or because of the way the Mikrotik
packet flows work, I would only see traffic as it
enters the router, and since there is no reply from the
far end, nothing would show up.

On 2/15/2021 6:15 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:


I don't think MTU would be the issue.  If the endpoint
has a 1500 byte MTU then it will send IP packets up to
1500 bytes long. IPv6 header is a little longer, but
that means the data 

Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

[Brian Webster]

Assuming gyroscopic effect still works on mars? That would be one way to keep a 
reference ”north”

 

Thank you,

Brian Webster

www.wirelessmapping.com

 

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2021 6:22 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Helicopter on Mars

 

It’s only got a 90 second flight time. So presumably it doesn’t get very far 
away. 

 

I would guess radio ranging and camera would allow it to get guidance - similar 
to how missals could kick into radio station signals to find a city back in the 
60s. 





On Feb 18, 2021, at 6:09 PM, Jaime Solorza  wrote:



BFM

 

On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, 3:38 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

I wonder how it navigates.  I presume a barometric altimeter will work there.  
But how would they get bearing and distance from the ground vehicle?  You could 
use a Doppler antenna array to get a bearing I suppose.  And maybe some kind of 
DME for distance.  Like to see a write up on that.  

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent mounted gas generator?

[Adam Moffett]

When the Ford is Found On Road Dead I'll show up in my pink dress to tow 
it for you.


Governor Cuomo wanted New Yorkers to stay home, so he ordered everyone 
to buy a Ford.



On 2/19/2021 1:03 AM, Steve Jones wrote:
Do they give you a choice in dress color free with the Nissan? Or do 
they just assume pink is acceptable?


On Thu, Feb 18, 2021, 11:37 PM Steve D > wrote:


Anyone look into the F-150 with the built in generator?

https://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/features/power/


The inverter that powered the outlet in the bed of my Nissan Titan
was adequate to run power tools all day.  I'd think something like
the Ford would be even better for powering your trailers maybe! 
Be quiet, and one less thing to maintain and fuel up too.

-Steve D

On Wed, Feb 17, 2021 at 2:08 PM Chuck McCown via AF
mailto:af@af.afmug.com>> wrote:

Noise is a huge issue for splicing trailers.  RV generators
are what I will use going forward.

Sent from my iPhone


On Feb 17, 2021, at 12:50 PM, Mike Hammett mailto:af...@ics-il.net>> wrote:


Any generator can be mounted if you try hard enough.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 


Midwest Internet Exchange 


The Brothers WISP 





*From: *"Mark Radabaugh" mailto:m...@amplex.net>>
*To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*Sent: *Wednesday, February 17, 2021 1:38:05 PM
*Subject: *[AFMUG] Does anyone other than Onan make a decent
mounted gas generator?

I have had it with the piece of shit Onan generator on the
fiber trailer.   If the splicing trailer didn’t have a built
in fuel tank I would just strap a Honda on and be done with
it, but I would prefer something with a fuel pump.

Mark
-- 
AF mailing list

AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


-- 
AF mailing list

AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

-- 
AF mailing list

AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


-- 
AF mailing list

AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com



-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com