Re: [AFMUG] Odd routing issue
are your routing IPs in a bridge with other IP addresses? On Wed, Jan 3, 2024, 10:09 AM castarritt wrote: > Had an odd issue last night. All 'tik OSPF routed network with routers at > each tower site. Simple single area OSPF setup, no MPLS or other overlay, > about 700 internal routes. Last night, some customers on APs connected to > specific tower routers lost connection to the internet. Our monitoring > system never lost connection to any of the customer SMs or anything else in > our network, so no alarms were raised. The issue lasted a few hours > overnight and recovered on its own without any of us getting to take a look > at it. It is like the affected routers lost their dynamic default route. > The affected routers appear to be randomly scattered around our network. > They aren't all connected along the same backhaul paths, and in one case > where we had two routers at a specific site, only one of the routers was > affected. This happened at the tail end of a heavy rain storm that was > causing a lot of OSPF topology changes as microwave links went in and out > of service due to rain fade. > > Anyone else seen something like this? Is our routing table getting too > big for 'tik to handle with a single OSPF area? > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant
+1 I was just going to point that out, although I was under the impression that LFP (that's the short name for LiFePo4) batteries could do 80% DOD. Either way, it's a big deal because of the additional storage. bp On 1/3/2024 5:02 PM, Peter Kranz via AF wrote: Something to think about is that LiFePO4 is good to 100% DOD, whereas we should all be keeping lead-acids above 50% DOD if we want lifespan.. So 460Ah lifepo4 = 920Ah lead-acid in my mind.. Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 4:57 PM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Of course the algorithms will be showing us all ads for LiFePO4 batts now. I got one the other day for this one: https://www.epochbatteries.com/products/12v-460ah-lifepo4-battery-ip67-heate d-bluetooth-victron-comms 12V 460Ah in an 8D size. What some people call a "truck battery". That's a lot of Ah. We have some 10+ year old old 8D AGMs I think they are rated 225 Ah. Heavy suckers. Just hauling them to the recycler at EOL is a chore. -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Peter Kranz via AF Sent: Wednesday, January 3, 2024 5:31 PM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' Cc: Peter Kranz Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Yes you poll each unit. Each battery in the string has a Battery ID set by dip switches. If you have a compatible inverter/charger it polls each battery to pull data points of interest. Take a look at this battery, it supports CANBUS, RS-485, and chaining batteries with battery ID's set by dip switch. https://signaturesolar.com/eg4-ll-s-48v-100ah-server-rack-battery/ Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 2:57 PM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant It's kind of an awkward situation. Suppose you have 4 batteries total, each with their own internal BMS. Do you want to monitor each battery? Maybe. My first impression is no. But perhaps knowing that battery #3 has a problem would be a good thing, like your car telling you all the tires are at 34 psi except front right is at 26 psi. Chuck's forklift probably just has one battery (and no SNMP). -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Bill Prince Sent: Wednesday, January 3, 2024 4:42 PM To: af@af.afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Somebody could make a bluetooth to SNMP adapter/converter or something. Nah, that would be too hard. bp On 1/3/2024 2:37 PM, Peter Kranz via AF wrote: There are rack mount LiFePO4 batteries with other options than Bluetooth. RS232, RS485, and HTTP/SNMP are available with LiFEPO4 batteries built in BMS systems.. The HTTP/SNMP ones are the hardest to find, pretty much all support RS232/CANBUS. Some inverter/rectifier shelf vendors now support RS485 monitoring of your battery strings natively. Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 12:21 PM To: af@af.afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Conservatism and institutional momentum, well said. Same here. One issue apparently is can't charge them below 0 degrees C. But I'm seeing ads claiming internal heaters and temperature controls. Can't speak from experience, I just put in a bunch more AGMs. I also see from specs a lot about Bluetooth. I'm used to lots of controls and stats via web and SNMP from some of the high end charge controllers like Alpha, Eltek, ICT. How do you access the battery control module at a remote site if it's Bluetooth? Or is that just for initial commissioning? Original Message From: dmmoff...@gmail.com Sent: 1/3/2024 1:25:16 PM To: "'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'" Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant We're still building with VRLA batteries...but that's just the combination of conservatism and institutional momentum. I'd look seriously at LiFePo4. For compatibility with existing rectifiers you'd look for battery packs with a charge controller and management built in. You can then disable the temperature comp, equalization, or whatever other smart/fancy stuff the rectifier would do and just let it serve as a power supply and distribution device. There's a devil on my shoulder telling me that with Lithium drop in replacements with integrated controllers I can eliminate the rectifier and just get a beefy 48V power supply and a PDU. But there's that institutional momentum thing again. -Adam -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Mark - Myakka Technologies Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 1:45 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: [AFMUG] -48v power plant
Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant
Something to think about is that LiFePO4 is good to 100% DOD, whereas we should all be keeping lead-acids above 50% DOD if we want lifespan.. So 460Ah lifepo4 = 920Ah lead-acid in my mind.. Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 4:57 PM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Of course the algorithms will be showing us all ads for LiFePO4 batts now. I got one the other day for this one: https://www.epochbatteries.com/products/12v-460ah-lifepo4-battery-ip67-heate d-bluetooth-victron-comms 12V 460Ah in an 8D size. What some people call a "truck battery". That's a lot of Ah. We have some 10+ year old old 8D AGMs I think they are rated 225 Ah. Heavy suckers. Just hauling them to the recycler at EOL is a chore. -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Peter Kranz via AF Sent: Wednesday, January 3, 2024 5:31 PM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' Cc: Peter Kranz Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Yes you poll each unit. Each battery in the string has a Battery ID set by dip switches. If you have a compatible inverter/charger it polls each battery to pull data points of interest. Take a look at this battery, it supports CANBUS, RS-485, and chaining batteries with battery ID's set by dip switch. https://signaturesolar.com/eg4-ll-s-48v-100ah-server-rack-battery/ Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 2:57 PM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant It's kind of an awkward situation. Suppose you have 4 batteries total, each with their own internal BMS. Do you want to monitor each battery? Maybe. My first impression is no. But perhaps knowing that battery #3 has a problem would be a good thing, like your car telling you all the tires are at 34 psi except front right is at 26 psi. Chuck's forklift probably just has one battery (and no SNMP). -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Bill Prince Sent: Wednesday, January 3, 2024 4:42 PM To: af@af.afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Somebody could make a bluetooth to SNMP adapter/converter or something. Nah, that would be too hard. bp On 1/3/2024 2:37 PM, Peter Kranz via AF wrote: > There are rack mount LiFePO4 batteries with other options than Bluetooth. > RS232, RS485, and HTTP/SNMP are available with LiFEPO4 batteries built > in BMS systems.. The HTTP/SNMP ones are the hardest to find, pretty > much all support RS232/CANBUS. Some inverter/rectifier shelf vendors > now support > RS485 monitoring of your battery strings natively. > > Peter Kranz > www.UnwiredLtd.com > Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 > Mobile: 510-207- > pkr...@unwiredltd.com > > -Original Message- > From: AF On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof > Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 12:21 PM > To: af@af.afmug.com > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant > > Conservatism and institutional momentum, well said. Same here. > > One issue apparently is can't charge them below 0 degrees C. But I'm > seeing ads claiming internal heaters and temperature controls. Can't > speak from experience, I just put in a bunch more AGMs. > > I also see from specs a lot about Bluetooth. I'm used to lots of > controls and stats via web and SNMP from some of the high end charge > controllers like Alpha, Eltek, ICT. How do you access the battery > control module at a remote site if it's Bluetooth? Or is that just for initial commissioning? > > Original Message > From: dmmoff...@gmail.com > Sent: 1/3/2024 1:25:16 PM > To: "'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'" > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant > > We're still building with VRLA batteries...but that's just the > combination of conservatism and institutional momentum. I'd look seriously at LiFePo4. > For compatibility with existing rectifiers you'd look for battery > packs with a charge controller and management built in. You can then > disable the temperature comp, equalization, or whatever other > smart/fancy stuff the rectifier would do and just let it serve as a > power supply and distribution device. > > There's a devil on my shoulder telling me that with Lithium drop in > replacements with integrated controllers I can eliminate the rectifier > and just get a beefy 48V power supply and a PDU. But there's that > institutional momentum thing again. > > -Adam > > > -Original Message- > From: AF On Behalf Of Mark - Myakka > Technologies > Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 1:45 PM > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group > Subject: [AFMUG] -48v power plant > > Happy New Year > > I need to build a new -48v power plant. Last one I did was about 7 > years ago. I know things have changed. Any recommendations
Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant
Of course the algorithms will be showing us all ads for LiFePO4 batts now. I got one the other day for this one: https://www.epochbatteries.com/products/12v-460ah-lifepo4-battery-ip67-heate d-bluetooth-victron-comms 12V 460Ah in an 8D size. What some people call a "truck battery". That's a lot of Ah. We have some 10+ year old old 8D AGMs I think they are rated 225 Ah. Heavy suckers. Just hauling them to the recycler at EOL is a chore. -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Peter Kranz via AF Sent: Wednesday, January 3, 2024 5:31 PM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' Cc: Peter Kranz Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Yes you poll each unit. Each battery in the string has a Battery ID set by dip switches. If you have a compatible inverter/charger it polls each battery to pull data points of interest. Take a look at this battery, it supports CANBUS, RS-485, and chaining batteries with battery ID's set by dip switch. https://signaturesolar.com/eg4-ll-s-48v-100ah-server-rack-battery/ Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 2:57 PM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant It's kind of an awkward situation. Suppose you have 4 batteries total, each with their own internal BMS. Do you want to monitor each battery? Maybe. My first impression is no. But perhaps knowing that battery #3 has a problem would be a good thing, like your car telling you all the tires are at 34 psi except front right is at 26 psi. Chuck's forklift probably just has one battery (and no SNMP). -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Bill Prince Sent: Wednesday, January 3, 2024 4:42 PM To: af@af.afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Somebody could make a bluetooth to SNMP adapter/converter or something. Nah, that would be too hard. bp On 1/3/2024 2:37 PM, Peter Kranz via AF wrote: > There are rack mount LiFePO4 batteries with other options than Bluetooth. > RS232, RS485, and HTTP/SNMP are available with LiFEPO4 batteries built > in BMS systems.. The HTTP/SNMP ones are the hardest to find, pretty > much all support RS232/CANBUS. Some inverter/rectifier shelf vendors > now support > RS485 monitoring of your battery strings natively. > > Peter Kranz > www.UnwiredLtd.com > Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 > Mobile: 510-207- > pkr...@unwiredltd.com > > -Original Message- > From: AF On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof > Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 12:21 PM > To: af@af.afmug.com > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant > > Conservatism and institutional momentum, well said. Same here. > > One issue apparently is can't charge them below 0 degrees C. But I'm > seeing ads claiming internal heaters and temperature controls. Can't > speak from experience, I just put in a bunch more AGMs. > > I also see from specs a lot about Bluetooth. I'm used to lots of > controls and stats via web and SNMP from some of the high end charge > controllers like Alpha, Eltek, ICT. How do you access the battery > control module at a remote site if it's Bluetooth? Or is that just for initial commissioning? > > Original Message > From: dmmoff...@gmail.com > Sent: 1/3/2024 1:25:16 PM > To: "'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'" > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant > > We're still building with VRLA batteries...but that's just the > combination of conservatism and institutional momentum. I'd look seriously at LiFePo4. > For compatibility with existing rectifiers you'd look for battery > packs with a charge controller and management built in. You can then > disable the temperature comp, equalization, or whatever other > smart/fancy stuff the rectifier would do and just let it serve as a > power supply and distribution device. > > There's a devil on my shoulder telling me that with Lithium drop in > replacements with integrated controllers I can eliminate the rectifier > and just get a beefy 48V power supply and a PDU. But there's that > institutional momentum thing again. > > -Adam > > > -Original Message- > From: AF On Behalf Of Mark - Myakka > Technologies > Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 1:45 PM > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group > Subject: [AFMUG] -48v power plant > > Happy New Year > > I need to build a new -48v power plant. Last one I did was about 7 > years ago. I know things have changed. Any recommendations on manufacturers? > What are thoughts about LiFePO batteries vs the standard telcomm batteries? > > > -- > > Thanks, > Mark mailto:m...@mailmt.com > > Myakka Communications > www.Myakka.com > > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant
Yes you poll each unit. Each battery in the string has a Battery ID set by dip switches. If you have a compatible inverter/charger it polls each battery to pull data points of interest. Take a look at this battery, it supports CANBUS, RS-485, and chaining batteries with battery ID's set by dip switch. https://signaturesolar.com/eg4-ll-s-48v-100ah-server-rack-battery/ Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 2:57 PM To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant It's kind of an awkward situation. Suppose you have 4 batteries total, each with their own internal BMS. Do you want to monitor each battery? Maybe. My first impression is no. But perhaps knowing that battery #3 has a problem would be a good thing, like your car telling you all the tires are at 34 psi except front right is at 26 psi. Chuck's forklift probably just has one battery (and no SNMP). -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Bill Prince Sent: Wednesday, January 3, 2024 4:42 PM To: af@af.afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Somebody could make a bluetooth to SNMP adapter/converter or something. Nah, that would be too hard. bp On 1/3/2024 2:37 PM, Peter Kranz via AF wrote: > There are rack mount LiFePO4 batteries with other options than Bluetooth. > RS232, RS485, and HTTP/SNMP are available with LiFEPO4 batteries built > in BMS systems.. The HTTP/SNMP ones are the hardest to find, pretty > much all support RS232/CANBUS. Some inverter/rectifier shelf vendors > now support > RS485 monitoring of your battery strings natively. > > Peter Kranz > www.UnwiredLtd.com > Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 > Mobile: 510-207- > pkr...@unwiredltd.com > > -Original Message- > From: AF On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof > Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 12:21 PM > To: af@af.afmug.com > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant > > Conservatism and institutional momentum, well said. Same here. > > One issue apparently is can't charge them below 0 degrees C. But I'm > seeing ads claiming internal heaters and temperature controls. Can't > speak from experience, I just put in a bunch more AGMs. > > I also see from specs a lot about Bluetooth. I'm used to lots of > controls and stats via web and SNMP from some of the high end charge > controllers like Alpha, Eltek, ICT. How do you access the battery > control module at a remote site if it's Bluetooth? Or is that just for initial commissioning? > > Original Message > From: dmmoff...@gmail.com > Sent: 1/3/2024 1:25:16 PM > To: "'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'" > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant > > We're still building with VRLA batteries...but that's just the > combination of conservatism and institutional momentum. I'd look seriously at LiFePo4. > For compatibility with existing rectifiers you'd look for battery > packs with a charge controller and management built in. You can then > disable the temperature comp, equalization, or whatever other > smart/fancy stuff the rectifier would do and just let it serve as a > power supply and distribution device. > > There's a devil on my shoulder telling me that with Lithium drop in > replacements with integrated controllers I can eliminate the rectifier > and just get a beefy 48V power supply and a PDU. But there's that > institutional momentum thing again. > > -Adam > > > -Original Message- > From: AF On Behalf Of Mark - Myakka > Technologies > Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 1:45 PM > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group > Subject: [AFMUG] -48v power plant > > Happy New Year > > I need to build a new -48v power plant. Last one I did was about 7 > years ago. I know things have changed. Any recommendations on manufacturers? > What are thoughts about LiFePO batteries vs the standard telcomm batteries? > > > -- > > Thanks, > Mark mailto:m...@mailmt.com > > Myakka Communications > www.Myakka.com > > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant
It's kind of an awkward situation. Suppose you have 4 batteries total, each with their own internal BMS. Do you want to monitor each battery? Maybe. My first impression is no. But perhaps knowing that battery #3 has a problem would be a good thing, like your car telling you all the tires are at 34 psi except front right is at 26 psi. Chuck's forklift probably just has one battery (and no SNMP). -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Bill Prince Sent: Wednesday, January 3, 2024 4:42 PM To: af@af.afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Somebody could make a bluetooth to SNMP adapter/converter or something. Nah, that would be too hard. bp On 1/3/2024 2:37 PM, Peter Kranz via AF wrote: > There are rack mount LiFePO4 batteries with other options than Bluetooth. > RS232, RS485, and HTTP/SNMP are available with LiFEPO4 batteries built > in BMS systems.. The HTTP/SNMP ones are the hardest to find, pretty > much all support RS232/CANBUS. Some inverter/rectifier shelf vendors > now support > RS485 monitoring of your battery strings natively. > > Peter Kranz > www.UnwiredLtd.com > Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 > Mobile: 510-207- > pkr...@unwiredltd.com > > -Original Message- > From: AF On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof > Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 12:21 PM > To: af@af.afmug.com > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant > > Conservatism and institutional momentum, well said. Same here. > > One issue apparently is can't charge them below 0 degrees C. But I'm > seeing ads claiming internal heaters and temperature controls. Can't > speak from experience, I just put in a bunch more AGMs. > > I also see from specs a lot about Bluetooth. I'm used to lots of > controls and stats via web and SNMP from some of the high end charge > controllers like Alpha, Eltek, ICT. How do you access the battery > control module at a remote site if it's Bluetooth? Or is that just for initial commissioning? > > Original Message > From: dmmoff...@gmail.com > Sent: 1/3/2024 1:25:16 PM > To: "'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'" > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant > > We're still building with VRLA batteries...but that's just the > combination of conservatism and institutional momentum. I'd look seriously at LiFePo4. > For compatibility with existing rectifiers you'd look for battery > packs with a charge controller and management built in. You can then > disable the temperature comp, equalization, or whatever other > smart/fancy stuff the rectifier would do and just let it serve as a > power supply and distribution device. > > There's a devil on my shoulder telling me that with Lithium drop in > replacements with integrated controllers I can eliminate the rectifier > and just get a beefy 48V power supply and a PDU. But there's that > institutional momentum thing again. > > -Adam > > > -Original Message- > From: AF On Behalf Of Mark - Myakka > Technologies > Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 1:45 PM > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group > Subject: [AFMUG] -48v power plant > > Happy New Year > > I need to build a new -48v power plant. Last one I did was about 7 > years ago. I know things have changed. Any recommendations on manufacturers? > What are thoughts about LiFePO batteries vs the standard telcomm batteries? > > > -- > > Thanks, > Mark mailto:m...@mailmt.com > > Myakka Communications > www.Myakka.com > > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant
Somebody could make a bluetooth to SNMP adapter/converter or something. Nah, that would be too hard. bp On 1/3/2024 2:37 PM, Peter Kranz via AF wrote: There are rack mount LiFePO4 batteries with other options than Bluetooth. RS232, RS485, and HTTP/SNMP are available with LiFEPO4 batteries built in BMS systems.. The HTTP/SNMP ones are the hardest to find, pretty much all support RS232/CANBUS. Some inverter/rectifier shelf vendors now support RS485 monitoring of your battery strings natively. Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 12:21 PM To: af@af.afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Conservatism and institutional momentum, well said. Same here. One issue apparently is can't charge them below 0 degrees C. But I'm seeing ads claiming internal heaters and temperature controls. Can't speak from experience, I just put in a bunch more AGMs. I also see from specs a lot about Bluetooth. I'm used to lots of controls and stats via web and SNMP from some of the high end charge controllers like Alpha, Eltek, ICT. How do you access the battery control module at a remote site if it's Bluetooth? Or is that just for initial commissioning? Original Message From: dmmoff...@gmail.com Sent: 1/3/2024 1:25:16 PM To: "'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'" Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant We're still building with VRLA batteries...but that's just the combination of conservatism and institutional momentum. I'd look seriously at LiFePo4. For compatibility with existing rectifiers you'd look for battery packs with a charge controller and management built in. You can then disable the temperature comp, equalization, or whatever other smart/fancy stuff the rectifier would do and just let it serve as a power supply and distribution device. There's a devil on my shoulder telling me that with Lithium drop in replacements with integrated controllers I can eliminate the rectifier and just get a beefy 48V power supply and a PDU. But there's that institutional momentum thing again. -Adam -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Mark - Myakka Technologies Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 1:45 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Happy New Year I need to build a new -48v power plant. Last one I did was about 7 years ago. I know things have changed. Any recommendations on manufacturers? What are thoughts about LiFePO batteries vs the standard telcomm batteries? -- Thanks, Mark mailto:m...@mailmt.com Myakka Communications www.Myakka.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant
There are rack mount LiFePO4 batteries with other options than Bluetooth. RS232, RS485, and HTTP/SNMP are available with LiFEPO4 batteries built in BMS systems.. The HTTP/SNMP ones are the hardest to find, pretty much all support RS232/CANBUS. Some inverter/rectifier shelf vendors now support RS485 monitoring of your battery strings natively. Peter Kranz www.UnwiredLtd.com Desk: 510-868-1614 x100 Mobile: 510-207- pkr...@unwiredltd.com -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 12:21 PM To: af@af.afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Conservatism and institutional momentum, well said. Same here. One issue apparently is can't charge them below 0 degrees C. But I'm seeing ads claiming internal heaters and temperature controls. Can't speak from experience, I just put in a bunch more AGMs. I also see from specs a lot about Bluetooth. I'm used to lots of controls and stats via web and SNMP from some of the high end charge controllers like Alpha, Eltek, ICT. How do you access the battery control module at a remote site if it's Bluetooth? Or is that just for initial commissioning? Original Message From: dmmoff...@gmail.com Sent: 1/3/2024 1:25:16 PM To: "'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'" Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant We're still building with VRLA batteries...but that's just the combination of conservatism and institutional momentum. I'd look seriously at LiFePo4. For compatibility with existing rectifiers you'd look for battery packs with a charge controller and management built in. You can then disable the temperature comp, equalization, or whatever other smart/fancy stuff the rectifier would do and just let it serve as a power supply and distribution device. There's a devil on my shoulder telling me that with Lithium drop in replacements with integrated controllers I can eliminate the rectifier and just get a beefy 48V power supply and a PDU. But there's that institutional momentum thing again. -Adam -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Mark - Myakka Technologies Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 1:45 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Happy New Year I need to build a new -48v power plant. Last one I did was about 7 years ago. I know things have changed. Any recommendations on manufacturers? What are thoughts about LiFePO batteries vs the standard telcomm batteries? -- Thanks, Mark mailto:m...@mailmt.com Myakka Communications www.Myakka.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant
That means you took out the counter weight...? On Wed, Jan 3, 2024 at 3:46 PM Chuck McCown via AF wrote: > I just replaced some forklift batts with lithium. Something like 8 cents > per watt hour. Super light too. > I think I will go with lithium from here on out. > > > -Original Message- > From: Mark - Myakka Technologies > Sent: Wednesday, January 3, 2024 11:45 AM > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group > Subject: [AFMUG] -48v power plant > > Happy New Year > > I need to build a new -48v power plant. Last one I did was about 7 years > ago. I know things have changed. Any recommendations on manufacturers? > What are thoughts about LiFePO batteries vs the standard telcomm batteries? > > > -- > > Thanks, > Mark mailto:m...@mailmt.com > > Myakka Communications > www.Myakka.com > > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant
I just replaced some forklift batts with lithium. Something like 8 cents per watt hour. Super light too. I think I will go with lithium from here on out. -Original Message- From: Mark - Myakka Technologies Sent: Wednesday, January 3, 2024 11:45 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Happy New Year I need to build a new -48v power plant. Last one I did was about 7 years ago. I know things have changed. Any recommendations on manufacturers? What are thoughts about LiFePO batteries vs the standard telcomm batteries? -- Thanks, Mark mailto:m...@mailmt.com Myakka Communications www.Myakka.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant
Conservatism and institutional momentum, well said. Same here. One issue apparently is can't charge them below 0 degrees C. But I'm seeing ads claiming internal heaters and temperature controls. Can't speak from experience, I just put in a bunch more AGMs. I also see from specs a lot about Bluetooth. I'm used to lots of controls and stats via web and SNMP from some of the high end charge controllers like Alpha, Eltek, ICT. How do you access the battery control module at a remote site if it's Bluetooth? Or is that just for initial commissioning? Original Message From: dmmoff...@gmail.com Sent: 1/3/2024 1:25:16 PM To: "'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'" Subject: Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant We're still building with VRLA batteries...but that's just the combination of conservatism and institutional momentum. I'd look seriously at LiFePo4. For compatibility with existing rectifiers you'd look for battery packs with a charge controller and management built in. You can then disable the temperature comp, equalization, or whatever other smart/fancy stuff the rectifier would do and just let it serve as a power supply and distribution device. There's a devil on my shoulder telling me that with Lithium drop in replacements with integrated controllers I can eliminate the rectifier and just get a beefy 48V power supply and a PDU. But there's that institutional momentum thing again. -Adam -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Mark - Myakka Technologies Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 1:45 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Happy New Year I need to build a new -48v power plant. Last one I did was about 7 years ago. I know things have changed. Any recommendations on manufacturers? What are thoughts about LiFePO batteries vs the standard telcomm batteries? -- Thanks, Mark mailto:m...@mailmt.com Myakka Communications www.Myakka.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] -48v power plant
We're still building with VRLA batteries...but that's just the combination of conservatism and institutional momentum. I'd look seriously at LiFePo4. For compatibility with existing rectifiers you'd look for battery packs with a charge controller and management built in. You can then disable the temperature comp, equalization, or whatever other smart/fancy stuff the rectifier would do and just let it serve as a power supply and distribution device. There's a devil on my shoulder telling me that with Lithium drop in replacements with integrated controllers I can eliminate the rectifier and just get a beefy 48V power supply and a PDU. But there's that institutional momentum thing again. -Adam -Original Message- From: AF On Behalf Of Mark - Myakka Technologies Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2024 1:45 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: [AFMUG] -48v power plant Happy New Year I need to build a new -48v power plant. Last one I did was about 7 years ago. I know things have changed. Any recommendations on manufacturers? What are thoughts about LiFePO batteries vs the standard telcomm batteries? -- Thanks, Mark mailto:m...@mailmt.com Myakka Communications www.Myakka.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
[AFMUG] -48v power plant
Happy New Year I need to build a new -48v power plant. Last one I did was about 7 years ago. I know things have changed. Any recommendations on manufacturers? What are thoughts about LiFePO batteries vs the standard telcomm batteries? -- Thanks, Mark mailto:m...@mailmt.com Myakka Communications www.Myakka.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] EXTERNAL - Odd routing issue
48 routers On Wed, Jan 3, 2024 at 11:33 AM Kevin Neal wrote: > How many total routers do you have in the OSPF area? We ran into a > similar issue and ended up having to segregate portions of our network into > separate OSPF Areas to bring stability back. There's a wall you'll hit > when topology changes occur and the routers can't keep up with route > updates, it's not just a # of routes in a single area, it's the > combination. The symptom is that some routes aren't installed on some > routers. > > In your case it may be that the router lost its default, or, more likely > an upstream router didn't install the downstream route. We had this where > on a single router with multiple routes, some would work and others > wouldn't. > > -Kevin > -- > *From:* AF on behalf of castarritt < > castarr...@gmail.com> > *Sent:* Wednesday, January 3, 2024 9:08 AM > *To:* af@af.afmug.com > *Subject:* EXTERNAL - [AFMUG] Odd routing issue > > > CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not > click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know > the content is safe. Please report all suspicious emails to > info...@anthembusinessgroup.com as an attachment. > > Had an odd issue last night. All 'tik OSPF routed network with routers at > each tower site. Simple single area OSPF setup, no MPLS or other overlay, > about 700 internal routes. Last night, some customers on APs connected to > specific tower routers lost connection to the internet. Our monitoring > system never lost connection to any of the customer SMs or anything else in > our network, so no alarms were raised. The issue lasted a few hours > overnight and recovered on its own without any of us getting to take a look > at it. It is like the affected routers lost their dynamic default route. > The affected routers appear to be randomly scattered around our network. > They aren't all connected along the same backhaul paths, and in one case > where we had two routers at a specific site, only one of the routers was > affected. This happened at the tail end of a heavy rain storm that was > causing a lot of OSPF topology changes as microwave links went in and out > of service due to rain fade. > > Anyone else seen something like this? Is our routing table getting too > big for 'tik to handle with a single OSPF area? > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] EXTERNAL - Odd routing issue
How many total routers do you have in the OSPF area? We ran into a similar issue and ended up having to segregate portions of our network into separate OSPF Areas to bring stability back. There's a wall you'll hit when topology changes occur and the routers can't keep up with route updates, it's not just a # of routes in a single area, it's the combination. The symptom is that some routes aren't installed on some routers. In your case it may be that the router lost its default, or, more likely an upstream router didn't install the downstream route. We had this where on a single router with multiple routes, some would work and others wouldn't. -Kevin From: AF on behalf of castarritt Sent: Wednesday, January 3, 2024 9:08 AM To: af@af.afmug.com Subject: EXTERNAL - [AFMUG] Odd routing issue CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe. Please report all suspicious emails to info...@anthembusinessgroup.com as an attachment. Had an odd issue last night. All 'tik OSPF routed network with routers at each tower site. Simple single area OSPF setup, no MPLS or other overlay, about 700 internal routes. Last night, some customers on APs connected to specific tower routers lost connection to the internet. Our monitoring system never lost connection to any of the customer SMs or anything else in our network, so no alarms were raised. The issue lasted a few hours overnight and recovered on its own without any of us getting to take a look at it. It is like the affected routers lost their dynamic default route. The affected routers appear to be randomly scattered around our network. They aren't all connected along the same backhaul paths, and in one case where we had two routers at a specific site, only one of the routers was affected. This happened at the tail end of a heavy rain storm that was causing a lot of OSPF topology changes as microwave links went in and out of service due to rain fade. Anyone else seen something like this? Is our routing table getting too big for 'tik to handle with a single OSPF area? -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
[AFMUG] Odd routing issue
Had an odd issue last night. All 'tik OSPF routed network with routers at each tower site. Simple single area OSPF setup, no MPLS or other overlay, about 700 internal routes. Last night, some customers on APs connected to specific tower routers lost connection to the internet. Our monitoring system never lost connection to any of the customer SMs or anything else in our network, so no alarms were raised. The issue lasted a few hours overnight and recovered on its own without any of us getting to take a look at it. It is like the affected routers lost their dynamic default route. The affected routers appear to be randomly scattered around our network. They aren't all connected along the same backhaul paths, and in one case where we had two routers at a specific site, only one of the routers was affected. This happened at the tail end of a heavy rain storm that was causing a lot of OSPF topology changes as microwave links went in and out of service due to rain fade. Anyone else seen something like this? Is our routing table getting too big for 'tik to handle with a single OSPF area? -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
