Re: [AFMUG] Full erection..

[Jaime Solorza]

Yep...that is something to ponder...I think it's worse now unfortunately

Jaime Solorza

On Dec 7, 2017 8:57 PM, "Faisal Imtiaz"  wrote:

> Well.. .just for a moment think if you have the shemagh on when you were
> working on that job, what could / would have been the potential outcome ?
>
>
> ;)
>
> Faisal Imtiaz
> Snappy Internet & Telecom
> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>
> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>
> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>
> --
>
> *From: *"Jaime Solorza" 
> *To: *"Animal Farm" 
> *Sent: *Thursday, December 7, 2017 7:53:14 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Full erection..
>
> I think because we had letter from superintendent...
>
> Jaime Solorza
>
> On Dec 7, 2017 6:12 PM, "Faisal Imtiaz"  wrote:
>
>> Amazing how such events make us all adjust our behavior !
>>
>> At least you got an apology...
>>
>> All we got was dirty looks !..
>>
>> ;)
>>
>>
>> Faisal Imtiaz
>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>>
>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>>
>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
>> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>>
>> --
>>
>> *From: *"Jaime Solorza" 
>> *To: *"Animal Farm" 
>> *Sent: *Thursday, December 7, 2017 6:57:50 PM
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Full erection..
>>
>> That happened to us 1994 in Pflugerville Texassome one called and
>> said a.bunch of wetbacks had broken into a school.   We were installing
>> towers on certain schools for wireless links to connect campuses together.
>>  The guy on tower radioed down that bunch of police cars had parked around
>> parking lot.  Pointed gun at us when we came to roofs edge to look...asked
>> us to come down...by that time the sheriff should up and asked how we got
>> into school...showed him the keys assigned to us, the alarms codes and
>> letter from superintendent for us to show principal and security.  He
>> apologized and made officers who pointed guns at us apologize.  I didn't
>> laugh.
>>
>> Jaime Solorza
>>
>> On Dec 7, 2017 5:39 PM, "Faisal Imtiaz"  wrote:
>>
>>> LOL !...
>>>
>>> Did I tell you the story of .
>>>
>>> Myself and my business partner were working on a Roof top installing a
>>> some gear ...
>>>
>>> . Someone called the Cops on us... ..I was on a section of
>>> roof, where I could see the ground...  I witnessed the "Gathering" of
>>> approx a dozen cops / cop cars along with a few who were in almost full
>>> tactical gear... (bullet proof jackets.. hand resting on their weapons).
>>>
>>> For a few minuets they were staring at me.. and I was 'watching' the
>>> show.. (My partner was working on section of roof from where he could not
>>> see what was going on down on the ground.
>>>
>>> needless to say, they motioned me to come down... and I said something
>>> to Frank  hey there are about a dozen Cop Cars and one of them is
>>> signaling us to come down... (his reaction was somewhat like.. you better
>>> listen to them before they open fire !!!)..
>>>
>>> We went down... walked out towards them .. waving our hands in a nervous
>>> waving motion as if we were saying hello .. i.e. short of hands in the
>>> air.. saying don't shoot !!!
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>> So now I am a lot more conciseness of what I look like when I am working
>>> in the field and what is going on around
>>>
>>> :)
>>>
>>>
>>> Faisal Imtiaz
>>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>>> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>>>
>>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>>>
>>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
>>> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> *From: *"Jaime Solorza" 
>>> *To: *"Animal Farm" 
>>> *Sent: *Thursday, December 7, 2017 6:28:55 PM
>>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Full erection..
>>>
>>> Mine is tactical ...I got it a place where law enforcement and military
>>> buy gear.  I tie it different ways...my son who was in Iraq taught me.
>>> What a critical bunch
>>>
>>> Jaime Solorza
>>>
>>> On Dec 7, 2017 5:07 PM, "Cameron Crum"  wrote:
>>>
 I just know it works well in paintball to keep my bare neck from
 getting tagged. Only had to have that happen once.

 On Thu, Dec 7, 2017 at 5:00 PM, Faisal Imtiaz >>> > wrote:

> You know what is 'funny' and ironic about the Shemagh or Keffiyah.
>
> There are mental pictures ingrained in everyone's head, greatly
> dependent on the Color and how one is wearing it.
>
> For Example.
>
> Your's is a yellow and black pattern you have... typically worn by
> Western Tactical forces and not a color that is used by Arabs in the
> Middle East.
> (More of a fashion color per say)
>
> If it was White  and black pattern ... and you are covering your face
> with it.. Hollywood likes to depict Middle East Terrorists in that manner
> (That particular White with Black pattern is commo

[AFMUG] 11ghz license questions

[Tim Hardy]

Looks like we both assumed  that this was a mistake by the coordinator, and
in my view - any fee by the coordinator would have been unreasonable-
including the FCC filing fees.  Now it's clear that the coordinator did not
screw-up but a compilation of things outside of the coordinator's control
lead to this.

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 11ghz license questions
Message-ID:
<1015154841.3471621.1512702211682.javamail.zim...@snappytelecom.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Please review the question asked (my question) and the answer...

my question was in regards to transferring license...
the OP had asked a similar question, claiming a mistake made by
Coordinator..

If you are suggesting that $250 fee is unreasonable.. what would you / your
company would have charged for such a service (I am talking about x-fer not
a screw-up).
(I know you are retired.. but the question still stand :) )

:)

Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet & Telecom
http://www.snappytelecom.net

Re: [AFMUG] Conditional-use permit for tower

[Mike Hammett]

You put up a 1k' tower? Where? 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "George Skorup"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Thursday, December 7, 2017 4:16:57 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Conditional-use permit for tower 

One county we're in pulled that bullshit. We wanted to put up a 140'. They said 
nope, you're not a cell co. And we said neither is SBA that just built a tower 
2 miles away without any permits whatsoever. Or how about American Tower? Or 
the tower asset holding companies that the cell co's own? None of them are cell 
co's, yet they're allowed, or just put them up and don't give a shit. We 
thought about just building it and telling them to piss off, but figured that 
was a bad idea without an army of lawyers. Next county over, we can put up a 
1k' without any permits, engineering.. nothing. 


On 12/7/2017 1:12 PM, Adam Moffett wrote: 



In my completely unqualified opinion, they make these rules so they can hammer 
fees out of somebody. 


If you go with your hat in your hand and explain politely what you're doing 
then maybe they'll help you through the process. They might not bend any rules 
for you, but they might refrain from making it harder. 


I can think of two towns which adopted the same set of standardized rules on 
building towers. One town told aWISP, "These rules aren't really intended for 
you, they're really for cell phone towers, just apply for a building permit and 
we'll ignore the rest of it." A different town stuck to the letter of 
everything and hit the same WISP with $7000 in engineering fees, and there were 
very strong reasons for the WISP to believe that no actual engineering was 
performed. I won't name the two towns or the WISP, but this is a true story. 


-Adam 




-- Original Message -- 
From: "TJ Trout" < t...@voltbb.com > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: 12/7/2017 1:39:47 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Conditional-use permit for tower 





So i inquired about installing a "ham" tower, which is limited to 60ft in the 
county I reside, damn. They still want their use permit & fee's, it's a several 
month process with a open hearing and approval from the board of supervisors. 
Also an environmental study??!? 


On Wed, Dec 6, 2017 at 3:17 PM, Philip Rankin < wireless...@gmail.com > wrote: 



Chuck, bureaucrats are not pricks That's the best part of a man!!! They 
are the excrement that secreats from bureaucrat's ASSHOLES!!! 


Phil 


On Tue, Dec 5, 2017 at 12:46 PM, < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 






One thing about bureaucrats, they love to have all the boxes checked and all 
the pages filled out. So rather than kick against the pricks, I have learned to 
try to give them more than they ask for if there is no way around it. 




From: TJ Trout 
Sent: Tuesday, December 5, 2017 11:35 AM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: [AFMUG] Conditional-use permit for tower 




I just purchased a 7ac price of land for my primary residence and the site is a 
great location for a tower site, but the local government is asking for a 30 
page conditional use permit app with an environmental study and a public 
comment period plus approval by the board of supervisors... 

After that I have to obtain a building permit obviously. 

Any tips on filling out this application so I can receive an approval? 

Three of my competitors have a tower within 1 mile of this site and none of 
them have gone through the planning or conditional use permit nor have they 
received a building permit as far as I know. So I don't think they will be 
asking me to co locate. 

Any advice or tips? I guess this process can take as long as a year to be 
completed and I'm not sure what the cost will be but I'm sure an environmental 
impact study isn't cheap. 

Thanks, 

TJ 





-- 


Philip J. Rankin 
Wireless Telecommunications Services 
PO Box 24 
Pittsburg, KS 66762 

Re: [AFMUG] Changing PSK on ePMP

[Josh Luthman]

Cool!  Same idea I came up with :)

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Dec 7, 2017 1:58 PM, "Mathew Howard"  wrote:

> One way to do it it, would be to just enable open on everything, then turn
> off encryption on the AP, then go through and change the key on all the SMs
> and after that's all done turn encryption back on with the new key on the
> AP. That way, if you do get the key wrong on any of them SMs, you can
> always switch the AP back to open and fix it... it also should be less
> downtime than changing directly to the new key (unless you script it, or
> manage to change them all at the same time some other way).
>
> On Thu, Dec 7, 2017 at 12:50 PM, Josh Luthman  > wrote:
>
>> It is remote.  The order doesn't work - it doesn't try the second one if
>> the SSIDs are identical.  GUI should probably not allow it.
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
>> Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> 
>> Suite 1337
>> 
>> Troy, OH 45373
>> 
>>
>> On Dec 6, 2017 12:20 PM, "Steve Jones"  wrote:
>>
>>> Change the order maybe? Is this a remote migration type scenario?
>>>
>>> On Dec 6, 2017 10:58 AM, "Adam Moffett"  wrote:
>>>
 Use snimpy in a python script to change all the PSK's at the same time,
 then change the AP.


 -- Original Message --
 From: "Josh Luthman" 
 To: "af@afmug.com" 
 Sent: 12/6/2017 11:55:23 AM
 Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Changing PSK on ePMP

 No ideas? =(

 Maybe it would be a good idea to set it to the PSK and open and in the
 event they don't associate with the PSK, I can fall back to open to fix it
 remotely...


 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
 Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
 1100 Wayne St
 
 Suite 1337
 
 Troy, OH 45373
 

 On Tue, Dec 5, 2017 at 10:53 AM, Josh Luthman <
 j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:

> Looks like if you have two preferred APS with the same SSID and
> different PSK it will only try the first one.  The first one on all the 
> SMs
> is the default cam39 but the second is the PSK I wanted to change to.
>
> At this point the best idea I have is to simply delete the first and
> hope to hell I entered the new preferred AP a bunch of times.  Anyone else
> go through this and have some neat tip?
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
> Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
> 1100 Wayne St
> 
> Suite 1337
> 
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
>


>

Re: [AFMUG] Changing PSK on ePMP

[Steve Jones]

I dont know your config. But we use the same key across all APs, different
ESSIDs. our default dump file loads the key to the SM so it will connect to
any AP, we then put in the preferred AP so it doesn't roam. If we are
remote migrating, then all we need to do is remove or edit the preferred AP


On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 9:32 AM, Josh Luthman 
wrote:

> Cool!  Same idea I came up with :)
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
> Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
> 1100 Wayne St
> 
> Suite 1337
> 
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
>
> On Dec 7, 2017 1:58 PM, "Mathew Howard"  wrote:
>
>> One way to do it it, would be to just enable open on everything, then
>> turn off encryption on the AP, then go through and change the key on all
>> the SMs and after that's all done turn encryption back on with the new key
>> on the AP. That way, if you do get the key wrong on any of them SMs, you
>> can always switch the AP back to open and fix it... it also should be less
>> downtime than changing directly to the new key (unless you script it, or
>> manage to change them all at the same time some other way).
>>
>> On Thu, Dec 7, 2017 at 12:50 PM, Josh Luthman <
>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>
>>> It is remote.  The order doesn't work - it doesn't try the second one if
>>> the SSIDs are identical.  GUI should probably not allow it.
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> 
>>> Suite 1337
>>> 
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>> 
>>>
>>> On Dec 6, 2017 12:20 PM, "Steve Jones" 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Change the order maybe? Is this a remote migration type scenario?

 On Dec 6, 2017 10:58 AM, "Adam Moffett"  wrote:

> Use snimpy in a python script to change all the PSK's at the same
> time, then change the AP.
>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Josh Luthman" 
> To: "af@afmug.com" 
> Sent: 12/6/2017 11:55:23 AM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Changing PSK on ePMP
>
> No ideas? =(
>
> Maybe it would be a good idea to set it to the PSK and open and in the
> event they don't associate with the PSK, I can fall back to open to fix it
> remotely...
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
> Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
> 1100 Wayne St
> 
> Suite 1337
> 
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
>
> On Tue, Dec 5, 2017 at 10:53 AM, Josh Luthman <
> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>
>> Looks like if you have two preferred APS with the same SSID and
>> different PSK it will only try the first one.  The first one on all the 
>> SMs
>> is the default cam39 but the second is the PSK I wanted to change to.
>>
>> At this point the best idea I have is to simply delete the first and
>> hope to hell I entered the new preferred AP a bunch of times.  Anyone 
>> else
>> go through this and have some neat tip?
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
>> Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> 
>> Suite 1337
>> 
>> Troy, OH 45373
>> 
>>
>
>
>>

Re: [AFMUG] Changing PSK on ePMP

[Josh Luthman]

One key one tower.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Dec 8, 2017 11:06 AM, "Steve Jones"  wrote:

> I dont know your config. But we use the same key across all APs, different
> ESSIDs. our default dump file loads the key to the SM so it will connect to
> any AP, we then put in the preferred AP so it doesn't roam. If we are
> remote migrating, then all we need to do is remove or edit the preferred AP
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 9:32 AM, Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
>
>> Cool!  Same idea I came up with :)
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
>> Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> 
>> Suite 1337
>> 
>> Troy, OH 45373
>> 
>>
>> On Dec 7, 2017 1:58 PM, "Mathew Howard"  wrote:
>>
>>> One way to do it it, would be to just enable open on everything, then
>>> turn off encryption on the AP, then go through and change the key on all
>>> the SMs and after that's all done turn encryption back on with the new key
>>> on the AP. That way, if you do get the key wrong on any of them SMs, you
>>> can always switch the AP back to open and fix it... it also should be less
>>> downtime than changing directly to the new key (unless you script it, or
>>> manage to change them all at the same time some other way).
>>>
>>> On Thu, Dec 7, 2017 at 12:50 PM, Josh Luthman <
>>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>>
 It is remote.  The order doesn't work - it doesn't try the second one
 if the SSIDs are identical.  GUI should probably not allow it.

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
 Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
 1100 Wayne St
 
 Suite 1337
 
 Troy, OH 45373
 

 On Dec 6, 2017 12:20 PM, "Steve Jones" 
 wrote:

> Change the order maybe? Is this a remote migration type scenario?
>
> On Dec 6, 2017 10:58 AM, "Adam Moffett"  wrote:
>
>> Use snimpy in a python script to change all the PSK's at the same
>> time, then change the AP.
>>
>>
>> -- Original Message --
>> From: "Josh Luthman" 
>> To: "af@afmug.com" 
>> Sent: 12/6/2017 11:55:23 AM
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Changing PSK on ePMP
>>
>> No ideas? =(
>>
>> Maybe it would be a good idea to set it to the PSK and open and in
>> the event they don't associate with the PSK, I can fall back to open to 
>> fix
>> it remotely...
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
>> Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> 
>> Suite 1337
>> 
>> Troy, OH 45373
>> 
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 5, 2017 at 10:53 AM, Josh Luthman <
>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Looks like if you have two preferred APS with the same SSID and
>>> different PSK it will only try the first one.  The first one on all the 
>>> SMs
>>> is the default cam39 but the second is the PSK I wanted to change to.
>>>
>>> At this point the best idea I have is to simply delete the first and
>>> hope to hell I entered the new preferred AP a bunch of times.  Anyone 
>>> else
>>> go through this and have some neat tip?
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> 
>>> Suite 1337
>>> 
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>> 
>>>
>>
>>
>>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Changing PSK on ePMP

[Mathew Howard]

We do the same, except most of the time we don't enter a preferred AP at
all.

On Dec 8, 2017 10:06 AM, "Steve Jones"  wrote:

> I dont know your config. But we use the same key across all APs, different
> ESSIDs. our default dump file loads the key to the SM so it will connect to
> any AP, we then put in the preferred AP so it doesn't roam. If we are
> remote migrating, then all we need to do is remove or edit the preferred AP
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 9:32 AM, Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
>
>> Cool!  Same idea I came up with :)
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
>> Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> 
>> Suite 1337
>> 
>> Troy, OH 45373
>> 
>>
>> On Dec 7, 2017 1:58 PM, "Mathew Howard"  wrote:
>>
>>> One way to do it it, would be to just enable open on everything, then
>>> turn off encryption on the AP, then go through and change the key on all
>>> the SMs and after that's all done turn encryption back on with the new key
>>> on the AP. That way, if you do get the key wrong on any of them SMs, you
>>> can always switch the AP back to open and fix it... it also should be less
>>> downtime than changing directly to the new key (unless you script it, or
>>> manage to change them all at the same time some other way).
>>>
>>> On Thu, Dec 7, 2017 at 12:50 PM, Josh Luthman <
>>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>>
 It is remote.  The order doesn't work - it doesn't try the second one
 if the SSIDs are identical.  GUI should probably not allow it.

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
 Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
 1100 Wayne St
 
 Suite 1337
 
 Troy, OH 45373
 

 On Dec 6, 2017 12:20 PM, "Steve Jones" 
 wrote:

> Change the order maybe? Is this a remote migration type scenario?
>
> On Dec 6, 2017 10:58 AM, "Adam Moffett"  wrote:
>
>> Use snimpy in a python script to change all the PSK's at the same
>> time, then change the AP.
>>
>>
>> -- Original Message --
>> From: "Josh Luthman" 
>> To: "af@afmug.com" 
>> Sent: 12/6/2017 11:55:23 AM
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Changing PSK on ePMP
>>
>> No ideas? =(
>>
>> Maybe it would be a good idea to set it to the PSK and open and in
>> the event they don't associate with the PSK, I can fall back to open to 
>> fix
>> it remotely...
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
>> Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> 
>> Suite 1337
>> 
>> Troy, OH 45373
>> 
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 5, 2017 at 10:53 AM, Josh Luthman <
>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Looks like if you have two preferred APS with the same SSID and
>>> different PSK it will only try the first one.  The first one on all the 
>>> SMs
>>> is the default cam39 but the second is the PSK I wanted to change to.
>>>
>>> At this point the best idea I have is to simply delete the first and
>>> hope to hell I entered the new preferred AP a bunch of times.  Anyone 
>>> else
>>> go through this and have some neat tip?
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> 
>>> Suite 1337
>>> 
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>> 
>>>
>>
>>
>>>
>

[AFMUG] OT: BTC futures

[Travis Johnson]

Hey BTC is back "down" to $15k today... and the futures options 
start trading on Sunday, which I think will drive the price up 
substantially this coming week... now may be a good time to get in.


Travis

Re: [AFMUG] OT: BTC futures

[Carl Peterson]

Futures trading could just as easily drive the price down.  If Im sitting
on a 100k coin and I want to sell half of it, I short BTC to hedge against
the price dropping and then sell a bunch (which will cause the price to
drop).  I fully expect this to happen.

On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 1:27 PM, Travis Johnson  wrote:

> Hey BTC is back "down" to $15k today... and the futures options start
> trading on Sunday, which I think will drive the price up substantially this
> coming week... now may be a good time to get in.
>
> Travis
>
>


-- 

Carl Peterson

*PORT NETWORKS*

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707

Re: [AFMUG] Conditional-use permit for tower

[George Skorup]

Didn't. Just sayin, rural for rural, some counties want stupid fees and 
a height limit, while others don't want anything at all and you can do 
whatever you want.


On 12/8/2017 8:16 AM, Mike Hammett wrote:

You put up a 1k' tower? Where?



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 





*From: *"George Skorup" 
*To: *af@afmug.com
*Sent: *Thursday, December 7, 2017 4:16:57 PM
*Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Conditional-use permit for tower

One county we're in pulled that bullshit. We wanted to put up a 140'. 
They said nope, you're not a cell co. And we said neither is SBA that 
just built a tower 2 miles away without any permits whatsoever. Or how 
about American Tower? Or the tower asset holding companies that the 
cell co's own? None of them are cell co's, yet they're allowed, or 
just put them up and don't give a shit. We thought about just building 
it and telling them to piss off, but figured that was a bad idea 
without an army of lawyers. Next county over, we can put up a 1k' 
without any permits, engineering.. nothing.


On 12/7/2017 1:12 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:

In my completely unqualified opinion, they make these rules so
they can hammer fees out of somebody.

If you go with your hat in your hand and explain politely what
you're doing then maybe they'll help you through the process.
 They might not bend any rules for you, but they might refrain
from making it harder.

I can think of two towns which adopted the same set of
standardized rules on building towers.  One town told aWISP,
"These rules aren't really intended for you, they're really for
cell phone towers, just apply for a building permit and we'll
ignore the rest of it."  A different town stuck to the letter of
everything and hit the same WISP with $7000 in engineering fees,
and there were very strong reasons for the WISP to believe that no
actual engineering was performed.  I won't name the two towns or
the WISP, but this is a true story.

-Adam


-- Original Message --
From: "TJ Trout" mailto:t...@voltbb.com>>
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: 12/7/2017 1:39:47 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Conditional-use permit for tower

So i inquired about installing a "ham" tower, which is limited
to 60ft in the county I reside, damn. They still want their
use permit & fee's, it's a several month process with a open
hearing and approval from the board of supervisors. Also an
environmental study??!?

On Wed, Dec 6, 2017 at 3:17 PM, Philip Rankin
mailto:wireless...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Chuck, bureaucrats are not pricks  That's the best
part of a man!!!  They are the excrement that secreats
from bureaucrat's ASSHOLES!!!

Phil

On Tue, Dec 5, 2017 at 12:46 PM, mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote:

One thing about bureaucrats, they love to have all the
boxes checked and all the pages filled out.  So rather
than kick against the pricks, I have learned to try to
give them more than they ask for if there is no way
around it.
*From:* TJ Trout
*Sent:* Tuesday, December 5, 2017 11:35 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* [AFMUG] Conditional-use permit for tower
I just purchased a 7ac price of land for my primary
residence and the site is a great location for a tower
site, but the local government is asking for a 30 page
conditional use permit app with an environmental study
and a public comment period plus approval by the board
of supervisors...
After that I have to obtain a building permit obviously.
Any tips on filling out this application so I can
receive an approval?
Three of my competitors have a tower within 1 mile of
this site and none of them have gone through the
planning or conditional use permit nor have they
received a building permit as far as I know. So I
don't think they will be asking me to co locate.
Any advice or tips? I guess this process can take 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: BTC futures

[Steve Jones]

you guys should just cash out now, i bought my pittance amount today, which
means it will crash tomorrow

On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 1:06 PM, Carl Peterson 
wrote:

> Futures trading could just as easily drive the price down.  If Im sitting
> on a 100k coin and I want to sell half of it, I short BTC to hedge against
> the price dropping and then sell a bunch (which will cause the price to
> drop).  I fully expect this to happen.
>
> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 1:27 PM, Travis Johnson  wrote:
>
>> Hey BTC is back "down" to $15k today... and the futures options start
>> trading on Sunday, which I think will drive the price up substantially this
>> coming week... now may be a good time to get in.
>>
>> Travis
>>
>>
>
>
> --
>
> Carl Peterson
>
> *PORT NETWORKS*
>
> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
> 
>
> Baltimore, MD 21202
> 
>
> (410) 637-3707
>

Re: [AFMUG] OT: BTC futures

[CBB - Jay Fuller]

um, so how does one "buy in" ? 
i don't have $15,600 to throw around
i do have a scottrade account but - this isn't a stock



  - Original Message - 
  From: Steve Jones 
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Sent: Friday, December 8, 2017 1:32 PM
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: BTC futures


  you guys should just cash out now, i bought my pittance amount today, which 
means it will crash tomorrow


  On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 1:06 PM, Carl Peterson  
wrote:

Futures trading could just as easily drive the price down.  If Im sitting 
on a 100k coin and I want to sell half of it, I short BTC to hedge against the 
price dropping and then sell a bunch (which will cause the price to drop).  I 
fully expect this to happen.  


On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 1:27 PM, Travis Johnson  wrote:

  Hey BTC is back "down" to $15k today... and the futures options start 
trading on Sunday, which I think will drive the price up substantially this 
coming week... now may be a good time to get in.

  Travis







-- 

Carl Peterson


PORT NETWORKS

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: BTC futures

[Cameron Crum]

You can buy any dollar amount you want through an exchange like coinbase.
However if you want it fast you have to use their GDAX site which has been
having many issues the last couple days.



On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 2:18 PM, CBB - Jay Fuller 
wrote:

>
> um, so how does one "buy in" ?
> i don't have $15,600 to throw around
> i do have a scottrade account but - this isn't a stock
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> *From:* Steve Jones 
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Sent:* Friday, December 8, 2017 1:32 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: BTC futures
>
> you guys should just cash out now, i bought my pittance amount today,
> which means it will crash tomorrow
>
> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 1:06 PM, Carl Peterson 
> wrote:
>
>> Futures trading could just as easily drive the price down.  If Im sitting
>> on a 100k coin and I want to sell half of it, I short BTC to hedge against
>> the price dropping and then sell a bunch (which will cause the price to
>> drop).  I fully expect this to happen.
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 1:27 PM, Travis Johnson  wrote:
>>
>>> Hey BTC is back "down" to $15k today... and the futures options
>>> start trading on Sunday, which I think will drive the price up
>>> substantially this coming week... now may be a good time to get in.
>>>
>>> Travis
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Carl Peterson
>>
>> *PORT NETWORKS*
>>
>> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
>> 
>>
>> Baltimore, MD 21202
>> 
>>
>> (410) 637-3707 <(410)%20637-3707>
>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] OT: BTC futures

[Steve Jones]

i just bought through bitcoin.com because i dont know what im doing, was
just curious the process to buy 100 bucks worth. It sets off every account
alert you have set up, FYI, so make sure your phone is handy so any
associated accounts dont get locked

On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 2:20 PM, Cameron Crum  wrote:

> You can buy any dollar amount you want through an exchange like coinbase.
> However if you want it fast you have to use their GDAX site which has been
> having many issues the last couple days.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 2:18 PM, CBB - Jay Fuller <
> par...@cyberbroadband.net> wrote:
>
>>
>> um, so how does one "buy in" ?
>> i don't have $15,600 to throw around
>> i do have a scottrade account but - this isn't a stock
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> - Original Message -
>> *From:* Steve Jones 
>> *To:* af@afmug.com
>> *Sent:* Friday, December 8, 2017 1:32 PM
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: BTC futures
>>
>> you guys should just cash out now, i bought my pittance amount today,
>> which means it will crash tomorrow
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 1:06 PM, Carl Peterson > > wrote:
>>
>>> Futures trading could just as easily drive the price down.  If Im
>>> sitting on a 100k coin and I want to sell half of it, I short BTC to hedge
>>> against the price dropping and then sell a bunch (which will cause the
>>> price to drop).  I fully expect this to happen.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 1:27 PM, Travis Johnson  wrote:
>>>
 Hey BTC is back "down" to $15k today... and the futures options
 start trading on Sunday, which I think will drive the price up
 substantially this coming week... now may be a good time to get in.

 Travis


>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Carl Peterson
>>>
>>> *PORT NETWORKS*
>>>
>>> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
>>> 
>>>
>>> Baltimore, MD 21202
>>> 
>>>
>>> (410) 637-3707 <(410)%20637-3707>
>>>
>>
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Anyone using this?

[Bruce Robertson]

I would guess that the best application would be out in the wild, away 
from any meter grids.  That's where you're most likely to not have cell 
signal.  Plus you can get by with very little bandwidth.


On 12/7/17 5:50 PM, Robert Andrews wrote:
& people are having trouble getting a megabit with pointed antennas in 
900 against the meter grid?  Maybe it works best when there isn't any 
cell service and there aren't any homes...


On 12/07/2017 05:09 PM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
https://www.beartooth.com/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIxOSs0Zr51wIVA97ACh1AJwkkEAEYASAAEgLsXPD_BwE 



Jaime Solorza

Re: [AFMUG] alt list?

[Dev]

Right, that’s why they have high/low volume lists in other communities, 
separates out the technical from the noise. 

There are lots of places to find noise, and few to find some of the information 
on this list. 

By volume, the white noise just escalates and begets other irrelevant noise in 
some sort of asymptotic trend that doesn’t seem worth the effort to manage to 
get to what’s of interest, so it becomes a chore not to round-file the whole 
list traffic.

Seems like there’s around 5 people generating the noise source, so relevant to 
the total number of list members it’s a very, very small group generating extra 
work for the other vast majority of subscribers. If you got these five people 
in a room and let them talk, most everyone else would leave to do productive 
things.

>>
>

Sure does waste time though.

Re: [AFMUG] alt list?

[Steve Jones]

lulz

On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 3:05 PM, Dev  wrote:

> Right, that’s why they have high/low volume lists in other communities,
> separates out the technical from the noise.
>
> There are lots of places to find noise, and few to find some of the
> information on this list.
>
> By volume, the white noise just escalates and begets other irrelevant
> noise in some sort of asymptotic trend that doesn’t seem worth the effort
> to manage to get to what’s of interest, so it becomes a chore not to
> round-file the whole list traffic.
>
> Seems like there’s around 5 people generating the noise source, so
> relevant to the total number of list members it’s a very, very small group
> generating extra work for the other vast majority of subscribers. If you
> got these five people in a room and let them talk, most everyone else would
> leave to do productive things.
>
> >>
> >
>
> Sure does waste time though.
>

Re: [AFMUG] alt list?

[Adam Moffett]

If the list went low volume, I'd wonder if it was broken

-- Original Message --
From: "Dev" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 12/8/2017 4:05:38 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] alt list?

Right, that’s why they have high/low volume lists in other communities, 
separates out the technical from the noise.


There are lots of places to find noise, and few to find some of the 
information on this list.


By volume, the white noise just escalates and begets other irrelevant 
noise in some sort of asymptotic trend that doesn’t seem worth the 
effort to manage to get to what’s of interest, so it becomes a chore 
not to round-file the whole list traffic.


Seems like there’s around 5 people generating the noise source, so 
relevant to the total number of list members it’s a very, very small 
group generating extra work for the other vast majority of subscribers. 
If you got these five people in a room and let them talk, most everyone 
else would leave to do productive things.








Sure does waste time though.

[AFMUG] OT alt list

[chuck]

Huh?  You do know how to filter based on the OT in the subject line, right?
It IS an automatic thing if you want it to be.  No extra work involved.

We 5 noisy people have been partying in my basement here for 15 years.
Along with several hundred less noisy people.

Feel free to help yourself to the beer, but you can't bitch about the music.
My record player.

Everybody dance now...


-Original Message- 
From: Dev

Sent: Friday, December 8, 2017 2:05 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] alt list?

Right, that’s why they have high/low volume lists in other communities, 
separates out the technical from the noise.


There are lots of places to find noise, and few to find some of the 
information on this list.


By volume, the white noise just escalates and begets other irrelevant noise 
in some sort of asymptotic trend that doesn’t seem worth the effort to 
manage to get to what’s of interest, so it becomes a chore not to round-file 
the whole list traffic.


Seems like there’s around 5 people generating the noise source, so relevant 
to the total number of list members it’s a very, very small group generating 
extra work for the other vast majority of subscribers. If you got these five 
people in a room and let them talk, most everyone else would leave to do 
productive things.








Sure does waste time though. 

Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

[Steve Jones]

I once heard that when in Rome you should do as the Romans do. I did
accidentally put an off color response in the nanog list from this account
by mistake today thinking it was this list. damn cretin behavior sullying
up the professional group

On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 3:52 PM,  wrote:

> Huh?  You do know how to filter based on the OT in the subject line, right?
> It IS an automatic thing if you want it to be.  No extra work involved.
>
> We 5 noisy people have been partying in my basement here for 15 years.
> Along with several hundred less noisy people.
>
> Feel free to help yourself to the beer, but you can't bitch about the
> music.
> My record player.
>
> Everybody dance now...
>
>
> -Original Message- From: Dev
> Sent: Friday, December 8, 2017 2:05 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] alt list?
>
> Right, that’s why they have high/low volume lists in other communities,
> separates out the technical from the noise.
>
> There are lots of places to find noise, and few to find some of the
> information on this list.
>
> By volume, the white noise just escalates and begets other irrelevant
> noise in some sort of asymptotic trend that doesn’t seem worth the effort
> to manage to get to what’s of interest, so it becomes a chore not to
> round-file the whole list traffic.
>
> Seems like there’s around 5 people generating the noise source, so
> relevant to the total number of list members it’s a very, very small group
> generating extra work for the other vast majority of subscribers. If you
> got these five people in a room and let them talk, most everyone else would
> leave to do productive things.
>
>
>>>
>>
> Sure does waste time though.
>

Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

[chuck]

I don’t want to belong to any club that would accept me as one of its 
members... (Groucho Marx)

From: Steve Jones 
Sent: Friday, December 8, 2017 3:11 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

I once heard that when in Rome you should do as the Romans do. I did 
accidentally put an off color response in the nanog list from this account by 
mistake today thinking it was this list. damn cretin behavior sullying up the 
professional group

On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 3:52 PM,  wrote:

  Huh?  You do know how to filter based on the OT in the subject line, right?
  It IS an automatic thing if you want it to be.  No extra work involved.

  We 5 noisy people have been partying in my basement here for 15 years.
  Along with several hundred less noisy people.

  Feel free to help yourself to the beer, but you can't bitch about the music.
  My record player.

  Everybody dance now...


  -Original Message- From: Dev
  Sent: Friday, December 8, 2017 2:05 PM
  To: af@afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] alt list?

  Right, that’s why they have high/low volume lists in other communities, 
separates out the technical from the noise.

  There are lots of places to find noise, and few to find some of the 
information on this list.

  By volume, the white noise just escalates and begets other irrelevant noise 
in some sort of asymptotic trend that doesn’t seem worth the effort to manage 
to get to what’s of interest, so it becomes a chore not to round-file the whole 
list traffic.

  Seems like there’s around 5 people generating the noise source, so relevant 
to the total number of list members it’s a very, very small group generating 
extra work for the other vast majority of subscribers. If you got these five 
people in a room and let them talk, most everyone else would leave to do 
productive things.







  Sure does waste time though. 

Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

[George Skorup]

The OT stuff is fine. Whether it's marked [OT] or not, I don't really 
care. It's not hard to collapse a thread and delete it in Thunderchicken.


My one major complaint with the lists I'm on (here, various WISPA, and 
NANOG) is that some people refuse to start a new thread properly. They 
will simply do a reply to a message in an existing thread, change the 
subject and may or may not even bother wiping out the body. So, in 
Thunderchicken at least, it keeps the original thread ID or whatever 
header. Which means something I might want to see gets buried in shit I 
don't want to see and is deleted. I see this at least every other day or 
two. Is it really that difficult to start a new message to af@afmug or 
whatever@wispa?


On 12/8/2017 3:52 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
Huh? You do know how to filter based on the OT in the subject line, 
right?

It IS an automatic thing if you want it to be.  No extra work involved.

We 5 noisy people have been partying in my basement here for 15 years.
Along with several hundred less noisy people.

Feel free to help yourself to the beer, but you can't bitch about the 
music.

My record player.

Everybody dance now...


-Original Message- From: Dev
Sent: Friday, December 8, 2017 2:05 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] alt list?

Right, that’s why they have high/low volume lists in other 
communities, separates out the technical from the noise.


There are lots of places to find noise, and few to find some of the 
information on this list.


By volume, the white noise just escalates and begets other irrelevant 
noise in some sort of asymptotic trend that doesn’t seem worth the 
effort to manage to get to what’s of interest, so it becomes a chore 
not to round-file the whole list traffic.


Seems like there’s around 5 people generating the noise source, so 
relevant to the total number of list members it’s a very, very small 
group generating extra work for the other vast majority of 
subscribers. If you got these five people in a room and let them talk, 
most everyone else would leave to do productive things.








Sure does waste time though.

Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

[Seth Mattinen]

On 12/8/17 15:43, George Skorup wrote:


My one major complaint with the lists I'm on (here, various WISPA, and 
NANOG) is that some people refuse to start a new thread properly. They 
will simply do a reply to a message in an existing thread, change the 
subject and may or may not even bother wiping out the body. So, in 
Thunderchicken at least, it keeps the original thread ID or whatever 
header. Which means something I might want to see gets buried in shit I 
don't want to see and is deleted. I see this at least every other day or 
two. Is it really that difficult to start a new message to af@afmug or 
whatever@wispa?



People think replying is starting a new message because clients that 
thread properly with the References header are no longer the majority. 
Seeing a real threaded conversation display in a mail client is totally 
unknown to many.


~Seth

Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

[George Skorup]

Are you calling me old? I'll be 33 on Monday. Get off my lawn.

On 12/8/2017 5:58 PM, Seth Mattinen wrote:

On 12/8/17 15:43, George Skorup wrote:


My one major complaint with the lists I'm on (here, various WISPA, 
and NANOG) is that some people refuse to start a new thread properly. 
They will simply do a reply to a message in an existing thread, 
change the subject and may or may not even bother wiping out the 
body. So, in Thunderchicken at least, it keeps the original thread ID 
or whatever header. Which means something I might want to see gets 
buried in shit I don't want to see and is deleted. I see this at 
least every other day or two. Is it really that difficult to start a 
new message to af@afmug or whatever@wispa?



People think replying is starting a new message because clients that 
thread properly with the References header are no longer the majority. 
Seeing a real threaded conversation display in a mail client is 
totally unknown to many.


~Seth

Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

[Mathew Howard]

You're old for your age...

On Dec 8, 2017 6:06 PM, "George Skorup"  wrote:

> Are you calling me old? I'll be 33 on Monday. Get off my lawn.
>
> On 12/8/2017 5:58 PM, Seth Mattinen wrote:
>
>> On 12/8/17 15:43, George Skorup wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> My one major complaint with the lists I'm on (here, various WISPA, and
>>> NANOG) is that some people refuse to start a new thread properly. They will
>>> simply do a reply to a message in an existing thread, change the subject
>>> and may or may not even bother wiping out the body. So, in Thunderchicken
>>> at least, it keeps the original thread ID or whatever header. Which means
>>> something I might want to see gets buried in shit I don't want to see and
>>> is deleted. I see this at least every other day or two. Is it really that
>>> difficult to start a new message to af@afmug or whatever@wispa?
>>>
>>
>>
>> People think replying is starting a new message because clients that
>> thread properly with the References header are no longer the majority.
>> Seeing a real threaded conversation display in a mail client is totally
>> unknown to many.
>>
>> ~Seth
>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

[Chuck McCown]

Depressing, I have kids older than that... 
(where did I put my Metamucil)


-Original Message- 
From: George Skorup 
Sent: Friday, December 08, 2017 5:06 PM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list 


Are you calling me old? I'll be 33 on Monday. Get off my lawn.

On 12/8/2017 5:58 PM, Seth Mattinen wrote:

On 12/8/17 15:43, George Skorup wrote:


My one major complaint with the lists I'm on (here, various WISPA, 
and NANOG) is that some people refuse to start a new thread properly. 
They will simply do a reply to a message in an existing thread, 
change the subject and may or may not even bother wiping out the 
body. So, in Thunderchicken at least, it keeps the original thread ID 
or whatever header. Which means something I might want to see gets 
buried in shit I don't want to see and is deleted. I see this at 
least every other day or two. Is it really that difficult to start a 
new message to af@afmug or whatever@wispa?



People think replying is starting a new message because clients that 
thread properly with the References header are no longer the majority. 
Seeing a real threaded conversation display in a mail client is 
totally unknown to many.


~Seth

Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

[Bill Prince]

I have bunions older than that.


bp


On 12/8/2017 4:22 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Depressing, I have kids older than that... (where did I put my Metamucil)

-Original Message- From: George Skorup Sent: Friday, December 
08, 2017 5:06 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

Are you calling me old? I'll be 33 on Monday. Get off my lawn.

On 12/8/2017 5:58 PM, Seth Mattinen wrote:

On 12/8/17 15:43, George Skorup wrote:


My one major complaint with the lists I'm on (here, various WISPA, 
and NANOG) is that some people refuse to start a new thread 
properly. They will simply do a reply to a message in an existing 
thread, change the subject and may or may not even bother wiping out 
the body. So, in Thunderchicken at least, it keeps the original 
thread ID or whatever header. Which means something I might want to 
see gets buried in shit I don't want to see and is deleted. I see 
this at least every other day or two. Is it really that difficult to 
start a new message to af@afmug or whatever@wispa?



People think replying is starting a new message because clients that 
thread properly with the References header are no longer the 
majority. Seeing a real threaded conversation display in a mail 
client is totally unknown to many.


~Seth

Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

[Robert Andrews]

Mark Twain?

On 12/08/2017 02:19 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
I don’t want to belong to any club that would accept me as one of its 
members... (Groucho Marx)

*From:* Steve Jones
*Sent:* Friday, December 8, 2017 3:11 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list
I once heard that when in Rome you should do as the Romans do. I did 
accidentally put an off color response in the nanog list from this 
account by mistake today thinking it was this list. damn cretin behavior 
sullying up the professional group

On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 3:52 PM,  wrote:

Huh? You do know how to filter based on the OT in the subject line,
right?
It IS an automatic thing if you want it to be.  No extra work involved.

We 5 noisy people have been partying in my basement here for 15 years.
Along with several hundred less noisy people.

Feel free to help yourself to the beer, but you can't bitch about
the music.
My record player.

Everybody dance now...


-Original Message- From: Dev
Sent: Friday, December 8, 2017 2:05 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] alt list?

Right, that’s why they have high/low volume lists in other
communities, separates out the technical from the noise.

There are lots of places to find noise, and few to find some of the
information on this list.

By volume, the white noise just escalates and begets other
irrelevant noise in some sort of asymptotic trend that doesn’t seem
worth the effort to manage to get to what’s of interest, so it
becomes a chore not to round-file the whole list traffic.

Seems like there’s around 5 people generating the noise source, so
relevant to the total number of list members it’s a very, very small
group generating extra work for the other vast majority of
subscribers. If you got these five people in a room and let them
talk, most everyone else would leave to do productive things.




Sure does waste time though.

Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

[Chuck McCown]

I thought it was Mark Twain too until I started looking it up.

-Original Message- 
From: Robert Andrews

Sent: Friday, December 08, 2017 5:54 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

Mark Twain?

On 12/08/2017 02:19 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
I don’t want to belong to any club that would accept me as one of its 
members... (Groucho Marx)

*From:* Steve Jones
*Sent:* Friday, December 8, 2017 3:11 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list
I once heard that when in Rome you should do as the Romans do. I did 
accidentally put an off color response in the nanog list from this account 
by mistake today thinking it was this list. damn cretin behavior sullying 
up the professional group

On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 3:52 PM,  wrote:

Huh? You do know how to filter based on the OT in the subject line,
right?
It IS an automatic thing if you want it to be.  No extra work 
involved.


We 5 noisy people have been partying in my basement here for 15 years.
Along with several hundred less noisy people.

Feel free to help yourself to the beer, but you can't bitch about
the music.
My record player.

Everybody dance now...


-Original Message- From: Dev
Sent: Friday, December 8, 2017 2:05 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] alt list?

Right, that’s why they have high/low volume lists in other
communities, separates out the technical from the noise.

There are lots of places to find noise, and few to find some of the
information on this list.

By volume, the white noise just escalates and begets other
irrelevant noise in some sort of asymptotic trend that doesn’t seem
worth the effort to manage to get to what’s of interest, so it
becomes a chore not to round-file the whole list traffic.

Seems like there’s around 5 people generating the noise source, so
relevant to the total number of list members it’s a very, very small
group generating extra work for the other vast majority of
subscribers. If you got these five people in a room and let them
talk, most everyone else would leave to do productive things.




Sure does waste time though.

Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

[Robert Andrews]

LOL, I usually now check before posting for exactly the same case... 
Didn't this time  LOL


On 12/08/2017 04:56 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

I thought it was Mark Twain too until I started looking it up.

-Original Message- From: Robert Andrews
Sent: Friday, December 08, 2017 5:54 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

Mark Twain?

On 12/08/2017 02:19 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
I don’t want to belong to any club that would accept me as one of its 
members... (Groucho Marx)

*From:* Steve Jones
*Sent:* Friday, December 8, 2017 3:11 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list
I once heard that when in Rome you should do as the Romans do. I did 
accidentally put an off color response in the nanog list from this 
account by mistake today thinking it was this list. damn cretin 
behavior sullying up the professional group

On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 3:52 PM,  wrote:

Huh? You do know how to filter based on the OT in the subject line,
right?
It IS an automatic thing if you want it to be.  No extra work 
involved.


We 5 noisy people have been partying in my basement here for 15 
years.

Along with several hundred less noisy people.

Feel free to help yourself to the beer, but you can't bitch about
the music.
My record player.

Everybody dance now...


-Original Message- From: Dev
Sent: Friday, December 8, 2017 2:05 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] alt list?

Right, that’s why they have high/low volume lists in other
communities, separates out the technical from the noise.

There are lots of places to find noise, and few to find some of the
information on this list.

By volume, the white noise just escalates and begets other
irrelevant noise in some sort of asymptotic trend that doesn’t seem
worth the effort to manage to get to what’s of interest, so it
becomes a chore not to round-file the whole list traffic.

Seems like there’s around 5 people generating the noise source, so
relevant to the total number of list members it’s a very, very small
group generating extra work for the other vast majority of
subscribers. If you got these five people in a room and let them
talk, most everyone else would leave to do productive things.




Sure does waste time though.

Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

[George Skorup]

Holy shit you're old. More depressed now?



...ducking

On 12/8/2017 6:22 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Depressing, I have kids older than that... (where did I put my Metamucil)

-Original Message- From: George Skorup Sent: Friday, December 
08, 2017 5:06 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

Are you calling me old? I'll be 33 on Monday. Get off my lawn.

On 12/8/2017 5:58 PM, Seth Mattinen wrote:

On 12/8/17 15:43, George Skorup wrote:


My one major complaint with the lists I'm on (here, various WISPA, 
and NANOG) is that some people refuse to start a new thread 
properly. They will simply do a reply to a message in an existing 
thread, change the subject and may or may not even bother wiping out 
the body. So, in Thunderchicken at least, it keeps the original 
thread ID or whatever header. Which means something I might want to 
see gets buried in shit I don't want to see and is deleted. I see 
this at least every other day or two. Is it really that difficult to 
start a new message to af@afmug or whatever@wispa?



People think replying is starting a new message because clients that 
thread properly with the References header are no longer the 
majority. Seeing a real threaded conversation display in a mail 
client is totally unknown to many.


~Seth

Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list

[Mike Hammett]

Was that the start of a new thread? 

and I agree. I propose we tar and feather them. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "George Skorup"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, December 8, 2017 5:43:08 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT alt list 

The OT stuff is fine. Whether it's marked [OT] or not, I don't really 
care. It's not hard to collapse a thread and delete it in Thunderchicken. 

My one major complaint with the lists I'm on (here, various WISPA, and 
NANOG) is that some people refuse to start a new thread properly. They 
will simply do a reply to a message in an existing thread, change the 
subject and may or may not even bother wiping out the body. So, in 
Thunderchicken at least, it keeps the original thread ID or whatever 
header. Which means something I might want to see gets buried in shit I 
don't want to see and is deleted. I see this at least every other day or 
two. Is it really that difficult to start a new message to af@afmug or 
whatever@wispa? 

On 12/8/2017 3:52 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote: 
> Huh? You do know how to filter based on the OT in the subject line, 
> right? 
> It IS an automatic thing if you want it to be. No extra work involved. 
> 
> We 5 noisy people have been partying in my basement here for 15 years. 
> Along with several hundred less noisy people. 
> 
> Feel free to help yourself to the beer, but you can't bitch about the 
> music. 
> My record player. 
> 
> Everybody dance now... 
> 
> 
> -Original Message- From: Dev 
> Sent: Friday, December 8, 2017 2:05 PM 
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] alt list? 
> 
> Right, that’s why they have high/low volume lists in other 
> communities, separates out the technical from the noise. 
> 
> There are lots of places to find noise, and few to find some of the 
> information on this list. 
> 
> By volume, the white noise just escalates and begets other irrelevant 
> noise in some sort of asymptotic trend that doesn’t seem worth the 
> effort to manage to get to what’s of interest, so it becomes a chore 
> not to round-file the whole list traffic. 
> 
> Seems like there’s around 5 people generating the noise source, so 
> relevant to the total number of list members it’s a very, very small 
> group generating extra work for the other vast majority of 
> subscribers. If you got these five people in a room and let them talk, 
> most everyone else would leave to do productive things. 
> 
>>> 
>> 
> 
> Sure does waste time though.