Re: DIS: Re: BUS: (With apologies to the Horton) Vote-swap scheme.
On 11 August 2011 06:04, Pavitra celestialcognit...@gmail.com wrote: On 08/10/2011 11:52 PM, Sean Hunt wrote: On Wed, Aug 10, 2011 at 21:41, Pavitra celestialcognit...@gmail.com wrote: On 08/10/2011 11:24 PM, Sean Hunt wrote: I destroy my copy of this Promise. I'm not sure this actually works. I vaguely remember an attempt to fix this problem with legislation, which I think passed, but... R2166 (power 2): An asset generally CAN be destroyed by its owner by announcement R2337 (power 3): Creating and cashing promises is secured with power threshold 3; any other modifications to promise holdings are secured with power threshold 2. 2166 alone implies you can destroy a promise you hold. 2337 alone implies you can't. R1030 puts rule power at higher precedence than If all of the Rules in conflict explicitly say that their precedence relations are determined by some other Rule for determining precedence relations which implies that R2337's attempt to only secure at power 2 basically doesn't work. No, secured with power 2 means cannot be done except as allowed by rules with power 2 or greater. This creates no conflict, so precedence is irrelevant. All right, I'll buy that. Given that the promise, as written, seems not to work (or does it?) - it certainly doesn't do what it was supposed to, and has a typo in it which renders it malformed. Would it be an idea for the Horton to attempt to destroy all copies, and then I'll re-issue fixed versions. Arkady
Re: DIS: Failed entry into BlogNomic
On 11 August 2011 00:09, Elliott Hird penguinoftheg...@googlemail.com wrote: Agora cannot play BlogNomic without some construct in the rules allowing it to; the only affect this will have is to spam the lists. Well, obviously the game of agora, now an entity capable of taking action within itself, couldn't really do such a thing. What is my duty though, is to arrange for there to be a player named Agora in BlogNomic that acts out the will of the Agoran community. Mostly because this is the only possible way to enact my rules-imposed duty as ambassador. To start with, I intend to play the game on behalf of Agora, seeing as I was elected Ambassador. If this raises any discussion about how Agora should act in BlogNomic, we'll have to come up with some mechanism for deciding what actions I, on behalf of Agora, should take. /Tiger
Re: DIS: Failed entry into BlogNomic
On 11 August 2011 14:57, Jonatan Kilhamn jonatan.kilh...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 00:09, Elliott Hird penguinoftheg...@googlemail.com wrote: Agora cannot play BlogNomic without some construct in the rules allowing it to; the only affect this will have is to spam the lists. Well, obviously the game of agora, now an entity capable of taking action within itself, couldn't really do such a thing. What is my duty though, is to arrange for there to be a player named Agora in BlogNomic that acts out the will of the Agoran community. Mostly because this is the only possible way to enact my rules-imposed duty as ambassador. To start with, I intend to play the game on behalf of Agora, seeing as I was elected Ambassador. If this raises any discussion about how Agora should act in BlogNomic, we'll have to come up with some mechanism for deciding what actions I, on behalf of Agora, should take. I believe that I proposed allowing players to act on Agora's behalf with Agoran Consent, but I'm not sure what happened to that. This would be useful for you to get Agora to join BlogNomic, but it would hardly be easy to play BlogNomic waiting for Agoran Consent for every single action. -- Charles Walker
Re: DIS: Failed entry into BlogNomic
On 11 August 2011 15:20, Charles Walker charles.w.wal...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 14:57, Jonatan Kilhamn jonatan.kilh...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 00:09, Elliott Hird penguinoftheg...@googlemail.com wrote: Agora cannot play BlogNomic without some construct in the rules allowing it to; the only affect this will have is to spam the lists. Well, obviously the game of agora, now an entity capable of taking action within itself, couldn't really do such a thing. What is my duty though, is to arrange for there to be a player named Agora in BlogNomic that acts out the will of the Agoran community. Mostly because this is the only possible way to enact my rules-imposed duty as ambassador. To start with, I intend to play the game on behalf of Agora, seeing as I was elected Ambassador. If this raises any discussion about how Agora should act in BlogNomic, we'll have to come up with some mechanism for deciding what actions I, on behalf of Agora, should take. I believe that I proposed allowing players to act on Agora's behalf with Agoran Consent, but I'm not sure what happened to that. This would be useful for you to get Agora to join BlogNomic, but it would hardly be easy to play BlogNomic waiting for Agoran Consent for every single action. -- Charles Walker A special case may be necessary, whereby Agoran Consent with respect to BlogNomic is taken with 24 hours to give support or objection.
Re: DIS: Failed entry into BlogNomic
On 11 August 2011 16:26, Arkady English arkadyenglish+ag...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 15:20, Charles Walker charles.w.wal...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 14:57, Jonatan Kilhamn jonatan.kilh...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 00:09, Elliott Hird penguinoftheg...@googlemail.com wrote: Agora cannot play BlogNomic without some construct in the rules allowing it to; the only affect this will have is to spam the lists. Well, obviously the game of agora, now an entity capable of taking action within itself, couldn't really do such a thing. What is my duty though, is to arrange for there to be a player named Agora in BlogNomic that acts out the will of the Agoran community. Mostly because this is the only possible way to enact my rules-imposed duty as ambassador. To start with, I intend to play the game on behalf of Agora, seeing as I was elected Ambassador. If this raises any discussion about how Agora should act in BlogNomic, we'll have to come up with some mechanism for deciding what actions I, on behalf of Agora, should take. I believe that I proposed allowing players to act on Agora's behalf with Agoran Consent, but I'm not sure what happened to that. This would be useful for you to get Agora to join BlogNomic, but it would hardly be easy to play BlogNomic waiting for Agoran Consent for every single action. -- Charles Walker A special case may be necessary, whereby Agoran Consent with respect to BlogNomic is taken with 24 hours to give support or objection. I don't see why it can't be the mission of the Ambassador to act in Agora's best interest. That's pretty much what an ambassador used to be about: the guy who was entrusted to hang out in other countries and know what the people back home would want him to say. /Tiger
Re: DIS: Failed entry into BlogNomic
On 11 August 2011 15:42, Jonatan Kilhamn jonatan.kilh...@gmail.com wrote: I don't see why it can't be the mission of the Ambassador to act in Agora's best interest. That's pretty much what an ambassador used to be about: the guy who was entrusted to hang out in other countries and know what the people back home would want him to say. /Tiger In that case we would need a rule allowing the Ambassador to act on Agora's behalf in other nomics. At the moment there simply isn't a mechanism which allows it to act at all. -- Charles Walker
Re: DIS: Failed entry into BlogNomic
On 11 August 2011 17:03, Charles Walker charles.w.wal...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 15:42, Jonatan Kilhamn jonatan.kilh...@gmail.com wrote: I don't see why it can't be the mission of the Ambassador to act in Agora's best interest. That's pretty much what an ambassador used to be about: the guy who was entrusted to hang out in other countries and know what the people back home would want him to say. /Tiger In that case we would need a rule allowing the Ambassador to act on Agora's behalf in other nomics. At the moment there simply isn't a mechanism which allows it to act at all. So this: When the office of Ambassador first becomes filled, the holder SHALL as soon as possible attempt to cause Agora to become a player of BlogNomic. is kind of pointless? It allows for me to cause Agora to become a player, rather than ruling that Agora should become a player, so this far it's explicitly me on behalf of it. But yeah, there's nothing at all about Agora taking actions elsewhere, now that it is a player there. /Tiger
Re: DIS: Failed entry into BlogNomic
On 11 August 2011 16:10, Jonatan Kilhamn jonatan.kilh...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 17:03, Charles Walker charles.w.wal...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 15:42, Jonatan Kilhamn jonatan.kilh...@gmail.com wrote: I don't see why it can't be the mission of the Ambassador to act in Agora's best interest. That's pretty much what an ambassador used to be about: the guy who was entrusted to hang out in other countries and know what the people back home would want him to say. /Tiger In that case we would need a rule allowing the Ambassador to act on Agora's behalf in other nomics. At the moment there simply isn't a mechanism which allows it to act at all. So this: When the office of Ambassador first becomes filled, the holder SHALL as soon as possible attempt to cause Agora to become a player of BlogNomic. is kind of pointless? It allows for me to cause Agora to become a player, rather than ruling that Agora should become a player, so this far it's explicitly me on behalf of it. But yeah, there's nothing at all about Agora taking actions elsewhere, now that it is a player there. /Tiger I suppose this might depend on what BlogNomic considers Agora being a player of it to consist of. In Agora, legal (second-class) persons have to meet certain criteria and can only act as defined by the Rules. Does BlogNomic allow legal persons to play, or have certain restrictions in place? -- Charles Walker
Re: DIS: Failed entry into BlogNomic
I suppose this might depend on what BlogNomic considers Agora being a player of it to consist of. In Agora, legal (second-class) persons have to meet certain criteria and can only act as defined by the Rules. Does BlogNomic allow legal persons to play, or have certain restrictions in place? -- Charles Walker Not really. On registering, it just says anybody may apply to join BlogNomic by... and then, in Fair Play, A single person should not control more than one Gladiator within BlogNomic. Gladiator is the round-specific term for Player. So when registering, I said that I (the person Jonatan Kilhamn) wanted to join with the screen name Agora Nomic, playing on Agora's behalf. /Tiger
Re: DIS: Failed entry into BlogNomic
On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 09:42, Jonatan Kilhamn jonatan.kilh...@gmail.comwrote: On 11 August 2011 16:26, Arkady English arkadyenglish+ag...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 15:20, Charles Walker charles.w.wal...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 14:57, Jonatan Kilhamn jonatan.kilh...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 00:09, Elliott Hird penguinoftheg...@googlemail.com wrote: Agora cannot play BlogNomic without some construct in the rules allowing it to; the only affect this will have is to spam the lists. Well, obviously the game of agora, now an entity capable of taking action within itself, couldn't really do such a thing. What is my duty though, is to arrange for there to be a player named Agora in BlogNomic that acts out the will of the Agoran community. Mostly because this is the only possible way to enact my rules-imposed duty as ambassador. To start with, I intend to play the game on behalf of Agora, seeing as I was elected Ambassador. If this raises any discussion about how Agora should act in BlogNomic, we'll have to come up with some mechanism for deciding what actions I, on behalf of Agora, should take. I believe that I proposed allowing players to act on Agora's behalf with Agoran Consent, but I'm not sure what happened to that. This would be useful for you to get Agora to join BlogNomic, but it would hardly be easy to play BlogNomic waiting for Agoran Consent for every single action. -- Charles Walker A special case may be necessary, whereby Agoran Consent with respect to BlogNomic is taken with 24 hours to give support or objection. I don't see why it can't be the mission of the Ambassador to act in Agora's best interest. That's pretty much what an ambassador used to be about: the guy who was entrusted to hang out in other countries and know what the people back home would want him to say. /Tiger I definitely agree with the notion of the Ambassador just making decisions on Agora's behalf. If we don't like the way you're handling things, we can just elect someone else to the office.
DIS: Re: BUS: Impossible job is impossible
On 11 August 2011 19:25, omd c.ome...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 1:06 PM, Geoffrey Spear geoffsp...@gmail.com wrote: I initiate a criminal CFJ alleging that Tiger violated the power-1 Rule 2352 by failing to attempt to cause Agora to become a player of BlogNomic as soon as possible after e became Ambassador. Unfortunately, it's beyond the scope of this case to determine what would actually qualify as attempting to do this duty, since the unsuccessful attempt e did make happened more than 4 days after e was installed. I intend, with Agoran Consent, to flip the Speed to Normal. I support.
DIS: Re: BUS: Impossible job is impossible
On 11 August 2011 19:41, Jonatan Kilhamn jonatan.kilh...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 19:25, omd c.ome...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 1:06 PM, Geoffrey Spear geoffsp...@gmail.com wrote: I initiate a criminal CFJ alleging that Tiger violated the power-1 Rule 2352 by failing to attempt to cause Agora to become a player of BlogNomic as soon as possible after e became Ambassador. Unfortunately, it's beyond the scope of this case to determine what would actually qualify as attempting to do this duty, since the unsuccessful attempt e did make happened more than 4 days after e was installed. I intend, with Agoran Consent, to flip the Speed to Normal. I support. TTttPF
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Impossible job is impossible
On 11 August 2011 18:41, Jonatan Kilhamn jonatan.kilh...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 19:41, Jonatan Kilhamn jonatan.kilh...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 August 2011 19:25, omd c.ome...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 1:06 PM, Geoffrey Spear geoffsp...@gmail.com wrote: I initiate a criminal CFJ alleging that Tiger violated the power-1 Rule 2352 by failing to attempt to cause Agora to become a player of BlogNomic as soon as possible after e became Ambassador. Unfortunately, it's beyond the scope of this case to determine what would actually qualify as attempting to do this duty, since the unsuccessful attempt e did make happened more than 4 days after e was installed. I intend, with Agoran Consent, to flip the Speed to Normal. I support. TTttPF NttPF -- Charles Walker
DIS: Re: BUS: Impossible job is impossible
On 11 August 2011 19:06, Geoffrey Spear geoffsp...@gmail.com wrote: I initiate a criminal CFJ alleging that Tiger violated the power-1 Rule 2352 by failing to attempt to cause Agora to become a player of BlogNomic as soon as possible after e became Ambassador. Unfortunately, it's beyond the scope of this case to determine what would actually qualify as attempting to do this duty, since the unsuccessful attempt e did make happened more than 4 days after e was installed. I plead guilty, though I realise that I have not read the ruleset sufficiently or I would definitely have objected to the intent to set the speed to fast. I was away for seven days, and when I left the election had not even started; I believed it would actually include a voting period and thus didn't expect to have been installed when I returned. Still, all faults of mine. /Tiger
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: (With apologies to the Horton) Vote-swap scheme.
On 11 August 2011 05:16, Pavitra celestialcognit...@gmail.com wrote: On 08/09/2011 09:35 AM, Arkady English wrote: (Note: I believe this means I create 21 copies, and transfer one to each of these players: Wooble Benu ais523 BobTHJ Droowl ehird Flameshadowxeroshin G. Gondolier Math321 Murphy omd Pavitra Roujo scshunt Tanner L. Swett Tiger Turiski Walker woggle Yally ) H. Registrar, can you confirm this? Yes, this list is correct. -- Charles Walker
DIS: Re: BUS: Brakes (was Re: BUS: Impossible job is impossible)
On 11 August 2011 20:51, Aaron Goldfein aarongoldf...@gmail.com wrote: I support any attempts to flip the speed to normal, and object to any attempts to flip the speed to slow. I object to both attempts to flip the speed.
