Re: [Alsa-devel] Please add snd-ice1712 problem to "Known bugs" page
I get that "overdriven" sound using the Digital Mixer instead of PCM Out 1 and 2. On the subject of xruns, which IRQ did you end up with??? Jan On Tue, 2003-09-09 at 22:59, Sam wrote: > On Tue, 2003-09-09 at 10:37, Ross Vandegrift wrote: > > This is a feature! > > > > envy24control does a much better job than just three settings - the volume > > sliders in the Analog Volume tab lets you set it to any values, not just > > three pre-chosen values. Then, of course, you can mix different routes > > with the sliders next to the level meters. Between these, the volume > > with ALSA is far more flexible than with Windows. It just takes a bit > > to get used to it. > > Oh, oh... oh! I see! > > I was feeling the sinking "I'm getting 90% of functionality with Linux > because hardware companies don't see the light yet, sigh" and now it's > been replaced with the less frequent feeling of "the Linux version does > it better. Yeah!" > > Cool, thanks for setting me straight. I brought down the analog signal > to 110 (from 127) and it has improved the problem significantly, though > not solved it completely. I chose 110 by doing A/B comparisons with my > DVD player to try to match the volume. Unfortunately, there's still a > slight buzzing/clicking sometimes with the Delta 44 that I don't hear > from my Pioneer DVD player playing the same music, and it cost me less > than the Delta 44. :-( I also don't hear the problem using the same > source file through a Logitech DAC. > > On Tue, 2003-09-09 at 00:44, Jaroslav Kysela wrote: > > I think that your problems are probably caused by underruns (system does > > not deliver samples to the DMA buffer for your card in time). The analog > > levels can be changed using alsamixer or envy24control (use analog > > section). The driver fully supports your hardware and yes, it is difficult > > to make reliable sound output for the ICE1712 chip with the standard linux > > kernels. Look for lowlatency patches. > > Thanks for the suggestion; I've already tried both low latency and > preemptible kernel patches. > > I noticed that the sound card was sharing an interrupt with three other > devices, so I swapped PCI cards around until the sound card got its own > IRQ. This didn't help. > > The problem is subtle enough that if this were (for example) a Creative > Labs sound card, I'd dismiss it. It's the fact that I was trying to > purchase my last sound card (get that part of my life "handled", like > the guy in Fight Club with his sofa) that's causing me to be bothered by > this. > > Though I'm no expert I'm guessing that because it's so subtle it's not a > driver problem. Perhaps when I get a paycheck again I'll play roulette > and try a different high-end sound card. > > Thanks for your help and suggestions (and for writing these great > drivers). > > Sam > > > > > --- > This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek > Welcome to geek heaven. > http://thinkgeek.com/sf > ___ > Alsa-devel mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/alsa-devel --- This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek Welcome to geek heaven. http://thinkgeek.com/sf ___ Alsa-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/alsa-devel
Re: [Alsa-devel] Please add snd-ice1712 problem to "Known bugs" page
On Wed, Sep 10, 2003 at 01:17:33PM -0700, Sam wrote: > Chances are M-Audio put some thought into the +4dBu, > Consumer, and -10dbV presets. Does anyone know how we could map these > to the corresponding 7 bit values? I could probably patch envy24control > to add analog signal presets so we could have the best of both features. That would ultimately be the best route - we'd keep maximum flexability, but people would be able to quickly set to standard values as well. I'd probably never use it, since I'm already much to used to having a whole range of values to choose from... -- Ross Vandegrift [EMAIL PROTECTED] A Pope has a Water Cannon. It is a Water Cannon. He fires Holy-Water from it.It is a Holy-Water Cannon. He Blesses it. It is a Holy Holy-Water Cannon. He Blesses the Hell out of it. It is a Wholly Holy Holy-Water Cannon. He has it pierced.It is a Holey Wholly Holy Holy-Water Cannon. He makes it official. It is a Canon Holey Wholly Holy Holy-Water Cannon. Batman and Robin arrive. He shoots them. --- This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek Welcome to geek heaven. http://thinkgeek.com/sf ___ Alsa-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/alsa-devel
Re: [Alsa-devel] Please add snd-ice1712 problem to "Known bugs" page
Sam wrote: On Wed, 2003-09-10 at 05:06, Paul Davis wrote: although it makes me happy to see you feeling this way, i felt compelled to add that i'm not necessarily sure that the linux way *is* better. its more flexible, that's true. but the two different standards for "input maximum signal level" are just that - standards - and the fader to control this makes it much harder to switch between the two levels that all of my equipment uses. This is a good point. Maybe my sound problem is only my poor skill at setting the output signal level appropriately. Chances are M-Audio put some thought into the +4dBu, Consumer, and -10dbV presets. Does anyone know how we could map these to the corresponding 7 bit values? I could probably patch envy24control to add analog signal presets so we could have the best of both features. Sam I think this highlights a particular problem with the current alsa mixer. It might have a value from 0 to 100%. Percent of what? I think that this should all be changed to signed values, with a max and a min setting. With a value of 0 being equivalent to no-gain, no-attenuation. Each alsa-driver would then convert this signed value into a value actually written to the hardware register via a lookup table. Cheers James --- This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek Welcome to geek heaven. http://thinkgeek.com/sf ___ Alsa-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/alsa-devel
Re: [Alsa-devel] Please add snd-ice1712 problem to "Known bugs" page
On Wed, 2003-09-10 at 05:06, Paul Davis wrote: > although it makes me happy to see you feeling this way, i felt > compelled to add that i'm not necessarily sure that the linux way *is* > better. its more flexible, that's true. but the two different > standards for "input maximum signal level" are just that - standards - > and the fader to control this makes it much harder to switch between > the two levels that all of my equipment uses. This is a good point. Maybe my sound problem is only my poor skill at setting the output signal level appropriately. Chances are M-Audio put some thought into the +4dBu, Consumer, and -10dbV presets. Does anyone know how we could map these to the corresponding 7 bit values? I could probably patch envy24control to add analog signal presets so we could have the best of both features. Sam --- This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek Welcome to geek heaven. http://thinkgeek.com/sf ___ Alsa-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/alsa-devel
Re: [Alsa-devel] Please add snd-ice1712 problem to "Known bugs" page
At Wed, 10 Sep 2003 08:06:59 -0400, Paul Davis wrote: > > >Oh, oh... oh! I see! > > > >I was feeling the sinking "I'm getting 90% of functionality with Linux > >because hardware companies don't see the light yet, sigh" and now it's > >been replaced with the less frequent feeling of "the Linux version does > >it better. Yeah!" > > although it makes me happy to see you feeling this way, i felt > compelled to add that i'm not necessarily sure that the linux way *is* > better. its more flexible, that's true. but the two different > standards for "input maximum signal level" are just that - standards - > and the fader to control this makes it much harder to switch between > the two levels that all of my equipment uses. that's true - but i'd like to say that it's a design problem of mixer application, not the whole audio infrastructure. for my eyes, a good-looking, user-friendly and (still) fully functional mixer is the biggest missing feature on linux audio. it's quite hard to achieve a perfect "all-purpose" mixer. there is no such one on windows nor macos. each hardware vendor provides their own mixer application to control their cards fully. > > i'm just nitpicking really, we all love linux, once we get it > working :) hehe, working how well? :) Takashi --- This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek Welcome to geek heaven. http://thinkgeek.com/sf ___ Alsa-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/alsa-devel
Re: [Alsa-devel] Please add snd-ice1712 problem to "Known bugs" page
>Oh, oh... oh! I see! > >I was feeling the sinking "I'm getting 90% of functionality with Linux >because hardware companies don't see the light yet, sigh" and now it's >been replaced with the less frequent feeling of "the Linux version does >it better. Yeah!" although it makes me happy to see you feeling this way, i felt compelled to add that i'm not necessarily sure that the linux way *is* better. its more flexible, that's true. but the two different standards for "input maximum signal level" are just that - standards - and the fader to control this makes it much harder to switch between the two levels that all of my equipment uses. i'm just nitpicking really, we all love linux, once we get it working :) --p --- This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek Welcome to geek heaven. http://thinkgeek.com/sf ___ Alsa-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/alsa-devel
Re: [Alsa-devel] Please add snd-ice1712 problem to "Known bugs" page
On Tue, 2003-09-09 at 10:37, Ross Vandegrift wrote: > This is a feature! > > envy24control does a much better job than just three settings - the volume > sliders in the Analog Volume tab lets you set it to any values, not just > three pre-chosen values. Then, of course, you can mix different routes > with the sliders next to the level meters. Between these, the volume > with ALSA is far more flexible than with Windows. It just takes a bit > to get used to it. Oh, oh... oh! I see! I was feeling the sinking "I'm getting 90% of functionality with Linux because hardware companies don't see the light yet, sigh" and now it's been replaced with the less frequent feeling of "the Linux version does it better. Yeah!" Cool, thanks for setting me straight. I brought down the analog signal to 110 (from 127) and it has improved the problem significantly, though not solved it completely. I chose 110 by doing A/B comparisons with my DVD player to try to match the volume. Unfortunately, there's still a slight buzzing/clicking sometimes with the Delta 44 that I don't hear from my Pioneer DVD player playing the same music, and it cost me less than the Delta 44. :-( I also don't hear the problem using the same source file through a Logitech DAC. On Tue, 2003-09-09 at 00:44, Jaroslav Kysela wrote: > I think that your problems are probably caused by underruns (system does > not deliver samples to the DMA buffer for your card in time). The analog > levels can be changed using alsamixer or envy24control (use analog > section). The driver fully supports your hardware and yes, it is difficult > to make reliable sound output for the ICE1712 chip with the standard linux > kernels. Look for lowlatency patches. Thanks for the suggestion; I've already tried both low latency and preemptible kernel patches. I noticed that the sound card was sharing an interrupt with three other devices, so I swapped PCI cards around until the sound card got its own IRQ. This didn't help. The problem is subtle enough that if this were (for example) a Creative Labs sound card, I'd dismiss it. It's the fact that I was trying to purchase my last sound card (get that part of my life "handled", like the guy in Fight Club with his sofa) that's causing me to be bothered by this. Though I'm no expert I'm guessing that because it's so subtle it's not a driver problem. Perhaps when I get a paycheck again I'll play roulette and try a different high-end sound card. Thanks for your help and suggestions (and for writing these great drivers). Sam --- This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek Welcome to geek heaven. http://thinkgeek.com/sf ___ Alsa-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/alsa-devel
Re: [Alsa-devel] Please add snd-ice1712 problem to "Known bugs" page
On Mon, Sep 08, 2003 at 06:07:14PM -0700, Sam wrote: > I'm disappointed because I spent extra money on this card to get good > quality playback for my music. I would not have purchased it had I > known this is a problem. Please make it clear on the Known bugs page or > Soundcard Matrix so no one else makes the same mistake. This is a feature! envy24control does a much better job than just three settings - the volume sliders in the Analog Volume tab lets you set it to any values, not just three pre-chosen values. Then, of course, you can mix different routes with the sliders next to the level meters. Between these, the volume with ALSA is far more flexible than with Windows. It just takes a bit to get used to it. -- Ross Vandegrift [EMAIL PROTECTED] A Pope has a Water Cannon. It is a Water Cannon. He fires Holy-Water from it.It is a Holy-Water Cannon. He Blesses it. It is a Holy Holy-Water Cannon. He Blesses the Hell out of it. It is a Wholly Holy Holy-Water Cannon. He has it pierced.It is a Holey Wholly Holy Holy-Water Cannon. He makes it official. It is a Canon Holey Wholly Holy Holy-Water Cannon. Batman and Robin arrive. He shoots them. --- This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek Welcome to geek heaven. http://thinkgeek.com/sf ___ Alsa-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/alsa-devel
Re: [Alsa-devel] Please add snd-ice1712 problem to "Known bugs" page
On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, Sam wrote: > Hi, > > I purchased a Delta 44 for playback with my consumer grade Sony ES > receiver. Installation of ALSA went smoothly, and I can hear music > okay, but it sometimes clips. I believe this is because the analog > signal level is set inappropriately and there's no way using Linux > software for me to fix it. Here's an excerpt from the Delta 44 manual: > > The Delta 44 Digital Recording Interface's analog inputs and > outputs are compatible with a wide variety of audio products. > The Delta Control Panel software allows you to configure the > signal levels of each input individually, and all outputs as a > group. Signal level settings of +4/Consumer/-10 are available. > Selecting the +4 radio button configures the channel(s) for use > with +4dBu signal levels, compatible with most musical > instruments and professional mixers. Selecting the -10 setting > sets up the channel(s) for -10dBV nominal signal levels, > commonly used with consumer equipment such as CD, MiniDisc, > cassette tape and DAT players. The Consumer setting is > preferred for semi-pro audio equipment and some consumer > equipment that is too hot for the -10 setting. The Consumer > setting offers approximately 6dB more headroom than does the -10 > setting. Semi-pro and consumer devices signal levels vary from > manufacturer-to-manufacturer and even product-to-product, so a > little experimentation between Consumer and -10 settings may be > required for optimal results. > > The screen shot of the Windows driver shows the choices for +4dBu, > Consumer, and -10dbV. I was unable to find any way of setting these > using Linux software, including envy24control, and don't see any mention > of them in the ice1712 source code. > > I'm disappointed because I spent extra money on this card to get good > quality playback for my music. I would not have purchased it had I > known this is a problem. Please make it clear on the Known bugs page or > Soundcard Matrix so no one else makes the same mistake. I think that your problems are probably caused by underruns (system does not deliver samples to the DMA buffer for your card in time). The analog levels can be changed using alsamixer or envy24control (use analog section). The driver fully supports your hardware and yes, it is difficult to make reliable sound output for the ICE1712 chip with the standard linux kernels. Look for lowlatency patches. Jaroslav - Jaroslav Kysela <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Linux Kernel Sound Maintainer ALSA Project, SuSE Labs --- This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek Welcome to geek heaven. http://thinkgeek.com/sf ___ Alsa-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/alsa-devel
[Alsa-devel] Please add snd-ice1712 problem to "Known bugs" page
Hi, I purchased a Delta 44 for playback with my consumer grade Sony ES receiver. Installation of ALSA went smoothly, and I can hear music okay, but it sometimes clips. I believe this is because the analog signal level is set inappropriately and there's no way using Linux software for me to fix it. Here's an excerpt from the Delta 44 manual: The Delta 44 Digital Recording Interface's analog inputs and outputs are compatible with a wide variety of audio products. The Delta Control Panel software allows you to configure the signal levels of each input individually, and all outputs as a group. Signal level settings of +4/Consumer/-10 are available. Selecting the +4 radio button configures the channel(s) for use with +4dBu signal levels, compatible with most musical instruments and professional mixers. Selecting the -10 setting sets up the channel(s) for -10dBV nominal signal levels, commonly used with consumer equipment such as CD, MiniDisc, cassette tape and DAT players. The Consumer setting is preferred for semi-pro audio equipment and some consumer equipment that is too hot for the -10 setting. The Consumer setting offers approximately 6dB more headroom than does the -10 setting. Semi-pro and consumer devices signal levels vary from manufacturer-to-manufacturer and even product-to-product, so a little experimentation between Consumer and -10 settings may be required for optimal results. The screen shot of the Windows driver shows the choices for +4dBu, Consumer, and -10dbV. I was unable to find any way of setting these using Linux software, including envy24control, and don't see any mention of them in the ice1712 source code. I'm disappointed because I spent extra money on this card to get good quality playback for my music. I would not have purchased it had I known this is a problem. Please make it clear on the Known bugs page or Soundcard Matrix so no one else makes the same mistake. Thanks, Sam --- This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek Welcome to geek heaven. http://thinkgeek.com/sf ___ Alsa-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/alsa-devel
