Re: [android-developers] Where should I place the EULA check?

[rich friedel]

I'm with treking and mark... It is just not worth the headache ATM. 
My philosophy is that if corporations such as Adobe, Microsoft, etc.., who 
are (collectively) way more badass than I am (individually) cannot secure 
their software then I don't have an ice cube's chance in hell of doing it 
either.

Now this is not to say that if they fixed LVL up and made it less 
cumbersome, thus less effort in applying it, I wouldn't consider it as a 
viable option. Kinda like a lock... it's only there to keep honest people 
honest ;)

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Re: [android-developers] Where should I place the EULA check?

[Jim Graham]

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 11:54:20AM -0500, TreKing wrote:

> I never said nobody uses it - I said *I* don't and don't plan to.

Yeah, I read too much into that.  Sorry.

> I've seen many posts here from people discussing using the library,
> particularly when it was first introduced. Perhaps searching through
> the group will yield helpful information.

Nope.  I've got three devs (you, Mark Murphy, and one other via
private e-mail) telling me it's just not worth the effort.  Given
the fact that, had I known that, I could have had my app published
and (hopefully) making money last week, I have to agree, 100%.
It's just frustrating that nobody said that back when I first started
asking for help with it.  But, as I said in a response to Mark, that's
not worth worrying about now, as I can't exactly get those days back
anyways.  So I'm tossing all of that, grabbing my pre-lvl backup, and
moving forward.  :-)

Thanks again for setting me straight.
   --jim

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Re: [android-developers] Where should I place the EULA check?

[Jim Graham]

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 12:40:58PM -0400, Mark Murphy wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 12:33 PM, Jim Graham  wrote:

> (and if somebody is, cough twice in a reply)

Nope, no gun to my head.  Besides, if that had been the case, the
bastard would be dead now.

> > And why does the Dev Guide say to use it?
> 
> It doesn't, any more than it says to use ArrayList, the NDK, or
> Traceview. You do not have to use every platform capability in every
> app.

I see now.  Even the checklist only says "Consider adding "

I'd made a faulty assumption:  that licensing was the norm here.

Now, my question is this:  why didn't someone tell me this when I
first started asking questions about it?  No, don't bother to answer
that.  It's a pointless question now, anyways...I can't exactly get
the last several days back, can I?

Still, IMHO, the docs should at least present a working solution,
but that's my almost worthless (here) opinion.  :-)

Thanks for setting me straight.  Now, I can just pull out the
pre-LVL backup I made of my main activity, add the Eula check, and
move forward.

Later,
   --jim

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Re: [android-developers] Where should I place the EULA check?

[TreKing]

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 11:33 AM, Jim Graham  wrote:

> So why even HAVE the LVL in the first place?
>

Because some people feel it's worth the effort and it's a convenient way for
most developers to get that functionality without rolling their own
solutions. Not using it is my choice and that it's not worth the effort is
my opinion for my app - it's up to each developer to make that determination
for him- or herself.


> And why does the Dev Guide say to use it?
>

I haven't looked, but Mark says that's not case - I tend to believe him.


> AND, why doesn't the code from the Dev Guide work?
>

IDK, never tried it.


> Or is it, as you say, that nobody uses the LVL in the first place?
>

I never said nobody uses it - I said *I* don't and don't plan to. I've seen
many posts here from people discussing using the library, particularly when
it was first introduced. Perhaps searching through the group will yield
helpful information.

-
TreKing  - Chicago
transit tracking app for Android-powered devices

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Re: [android-developers] Where should I place the EULA check?

[Jim Graham]

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 11:09:55AM -0500, TreKing wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 11:03 AM, Jim Graham  wrote:
> 
> > Ok, then, any suggestions on what I SHOULD be using for paid apps?
> 
> In terms of license validation? I do the easiest and simplest: "nothing" :-)
> 
> IMO the time and effort to implement the LVL (especially given the number of
> posts you have on difficulty with the thing), or any licensing for that
> matter, can be better directed to making your app better. If someone wants
> to pirate your app, they will, one way or another, if they are determined
> enough.

So why even HAVE the LVL in the first place?  And why does the Dev
Guide say to use it?  AND, why doesn't the code from the Dev Guide
work?  Or is it, as you say, that nobody uses the LVL in the first
place?  And if that's the case, repeat the first two questions
Seriously, I don't understand why the developer's guide would say
to use it if nobody does.  Wouldn't it (shouldn't it) be updated to
reflect that?

Later,
   --jim

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Re: [android-developers] Where should I place the EULA check?

[Mark Murphy]

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 12:33 PM, Jim Graham  wrote:
> So why even HAVE the LVL in the first place?

Because not everyone agrees with TreKing's opinion. I happen to, but
there are plenty of others who wish to enforce license management
schemes. LVL exists for them. Nobody is pointing a gun at your head to
use it.

(and if somebody is, cough twice in a reply)

> And why does the Dev Guide say to use it?

It doesn't, any more than it says to use ArrayList, the NDK, or
Traceview. You do not have to use every platform capability in every
app.

> Seriously, I don't understand why the developer's guide would say
> to use it if nobody does.

It doesn't say to use it. It says that is available to those who wish to use it:

"Android Market *offers* a licensing service that lets you enforce
licensing policies for paid applications that you publish through
Android Market."

"Any application that you publish through Android Market *can* use the
Android Market Licensing service."

Etc.

(emphases mine)

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Re: [android-developers] Where should I place the EULA check?

[TreKing]

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 11:03 AM, Jim Graham  wrote:

> Ok, then, any suggestions on what I SHOULD be using for paid apps?


In terms of license validation? I do the easiest and simplest: "nothing" :-)

IMO the time and effort to implement the LVL (especially given the number of
posts you have on difficulty with the thing), or any licensing for that
matter, can be better directed to making your app better. If someone wants
to pirate your app, they will, one way or another, if they are determined
enough.

-
TreKing  - Chicago
transit tracking app for Android-powered devices

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Re: [android-developers] Where should I place the EULA check?

[Jim Graham]

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 10:56:10AM -0500, TreKing wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 10:03 AM, Jim Graham  wrote:
> 
> > Ok, any idea what might be going on with the license checker?  That's the
> > major issue now.
> 
> No. I have not used it, nor will I ever.

Ok, then, any suggestions on what I SHOULD be using for paid apps?

Thanks,
   --jim

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Re: [android-developers] Where should I place the EULA check?

[TreKing]

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 10:03 AM, Jim Graham  wrote:

> Ok, any idea what might be going on with the license checker?  That's the
> major issue now.
>

No. I have not used it, nor will I ever.

-
TreKing  - Chicago
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Re: [android-developers] Where should I place the EULA check?

[Jim Graham]

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 10:01:08AM -0500, TreKing wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 9:56 AM, Jim Graham  wrote:
> 
> > > Entirely up to you, but I would do the quicker showEULADialog() method
> >
> > I might have, if I'd even known it existed.
> 
> 
> To clarify, this is not some method that actually exists - I made up the
> name as one that would be in your own code to show your EULA.

Ok, any idea what might be going on with the license checker?  That's
the major issue now.

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Re: [android-developers] Where should I place the EULA check?

[TreKing]

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 9:56 AM, Jim Graham  wrote:

> > Entirely up to you, but I would do the quicker showEULADialog() method
>
> I might have, if I'd even known it existed.


To clarify, this is not some method that actually exists - I made up the
name as one that would be in your own code to show your EULA.

-
TreKing  - Chicago
transit tracking app for Android-powered devices

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Re: [android-developers] Where should I place the EULA check?

[Jim Graham]

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 09:43:24AM -0500, TreKing wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 6:35 AM, Jim Graham  wrote:
> 
> Entirely up to you, but I would do the quicker showEULADialog() method

I might have, if I'd even known it existed.  But what I have now is at
least working, unlike the check license code, even after I realized my
earlier mistake (which happened after nobody helped clarify my confusion
regarding the documentation), and is now hanging on "Check license"
regardless of what I have my test account (my dev. account) set for.

That's the brick wall I've run into now.

Later,
   --jim

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Re: [android-developers] Where should I place the EULA check?

[TreKing]

On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 6:35 AM, Jim Graham  wrote:

> Which of the two places I marked above does it belong in?


Entirely up to you, but I would do the quicker showEULADialog() method first
then spawn an AsyncTask for the license check so it happens in the
background, giving the user something to do while it finishes (even if it's
just clicking "Accept" without reading anything). Plus, if they don't accept
the EULA, then the whole thing is a moot point, so might as well get that
done first.

-
TreKing  - Chicago
transit tracking app for Android-powered devices

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