Re: [Apertium-stuff] A question about Apertium Kazakh and Tatar packages
Jonathan Washington čálii: > As to Andrey's question concerning kaz-rus not working because of a > missing .t4x file, that sounds like a legit packaging error, which I'm > not sure how to fix (I really should learn...) That was fixed in https://github.com/apertium/apertium-kaz-rus/commit/7bd16ebbd005838988fd9c0d47a31e2564921b07 but if i understand correctly there needs to be a "data change" for a rebuild to happen: https://apertium.projectjj.com/apt/logs/apertium-kaz-rus/rebuild.log … so commit a new word and check again tomorrow? > In the meantime, Andrey, you should be able to just clone the pair and > compile from source (`apertium-get kaz-rus`), which will fix the > missing file issue.¹ This gets around the missing modes as well,² and > will be more future-proof given what Kevin and Tino are discussing. Modes files don't change very often, so if the goal is to use the newest packages without having to recompile all the time you could (as a temporary workaround) manually make a file /usr/share/apertium/modes/kaz-rus-biltrans.mode containing the same as /usr/share/apertium/modes/kaz-rus.mode but without the bits after autobil.bin (I made https://github.com/apertium/apertium/issues/132 to track/discuss installing debug modes, subscribe to that if you want notification when that's possible.) signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ Apertium-stuff mailing list Apertium-stuff@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/apertium-stuff
Re: [Apertium-stuff] A question about Apertium Kazakh and Tatar packages
As to Andrey's question concerning kaz-rus not working because of a missing .t4x file, that sounds like a legit packaging error, which I'm not sure how to fix (I really should learn...) In the meantime, Andrey, you should be able to just clone the pair and compile from source (`apertium-get kaz-rus`), which will fix the missing file issue.¹ This gets around the missing modes as well,² and will be more future-proof given what Kevin and Tino are discussing. ¹ missing file issue resolved: apertium-kaz-rus$ echo сәлем деген сөз сөздікте жоқ екен, бірақ басқа сөздер аударылады ғой | apertium -d . kaz-rus @сәлем сказать базар в словаре @жоқ #, но #иной базары #Поднимать ² missing modes resolved: apertium-kaz-rus$ echo сөздер | apertium -d . kaz-rus-biltrans ^сөз/базар/слово$ ^е/$^./.$ I realise the translation is terrible, and I have no idea off the top of my head why сөз is mapped to базар in the dictionary, but yeah. Otherwise, does this help? -- Jonathan 2 sen 2021, C.a. tarixində 04:23 tarixində Tino Didriksen yazdı: > > On Thu, 2 Sept 2021 at 09:53, Kevin Brubeck Unhammer > wrote: >> >> However – there are people who want to use debug modes but would rather >> not want to compile a pair and manually >> `git pull && make && make test || revert-to-last-working-revision`. >> >> Would it make sense to install debug-modes to a debug-modes folder? Put >> stuff like -biltrans etc. in /usr/share/apertium/debug-modes, and then >> `apertium -l` only shows translation /modes while `apertium -L` shows >> both /modes and /debug-modes? (And `apertium kaz-rus-biltrans` works >> without any special switches because why not, while `apertium >> nonexistent` runs `apertium -l` and gives a hint to use `-L` to show the >> rest.) > > > > That's a good idea, but some debug modes require files that are not normally > installed. We shouldn't clutter end-user installs with these files. > > But we could install everything to 2 packages: A main package > apertium-zzz-xxx for end-users and another apertium-zzz-xxx-corpus (or > whatever bikeshed -name we come up with) with the extras. That would also > lead nicely into the spellers going into a separate package, as people who > just want spellers probably don't care about anything else. > > -- Tino Didriksen > > ___ > Apertium-stuff mailing list > Apertium-stuff@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/apertium-stuff ___ Apertium-stuff mailing list Apertium-stuff@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/apertium-stuff
Re: [Apertium-stuff] A question about Apertium Kazakh and Tatar packages
On Thu, 2 Sept 2021 at 09:53, Kevin Brubeck Unhammer wrote: > However – there are people who want to use debug modes but would rather > not want to compile a pair and manually > `git pull && make && make test || revert-to-last-working-revision`. > > Would it make sense to install debug-modes to a debug-modes folder? Put > stuff like -biltrans etc. in /usr/share/apertium/debug-modes, and then > `apertium -l` only shows translation /modes while `apertium -L` shows > both /modes and /debug-modes? (And `apertium kaz-rus-biltrans` works > without any special switches because why not, while `apertium > nonexistent` runs `apertium -l` and gives a hint to use `-L` to show the > rest.) > That's a good idea, but some debug modes require files that are not normally installed. We shouldn't clutter end-user installs with these files. But we could install everything to 2 packages: A main package apertium-zzz-xxx for end-users and another apertium-zzz-xxx-corpus (or whatever bikeshed -name we come up with) with the extras. That would also lead nicely into the spellers going into a separate package, as people who just want spellers probably don't care about anything else. -- Tino Didriksen ___ Apertium-stuff mailing list Apertium-stuff@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/apertium-stuff
Re: [Apertium-stuff] A question about Apertium Kazakh and Tatar packages
Tino Didriksen čálii: > The monolingual packages install many more modes, because they are used for > further development. So you can get morph from those. But biltrans is not > normal to want if you aren't a developer, and thus building from source. The reasoning is that - people who want to use Apertium for translation only care about installing pairs - `apertium -l` lists all available modes of installed apertium packages - we shouldn't clutter that list for people who want to use Apertium for translation So kaz-rus shouldn't be installing biltrans, because an end-user would find it confusing/annoying and have more trouble finding what's useful to them in that list. However – there are people who want to use debug modes but would rather not want to compile a pair and manually `git pull && make && make test || revert-to-last-working-revision`. Would it make sense to install debug-modes to a debug-modes folder? Put stuff like -biltrans etc. in /usr/share/apertium/debug-modes, and then `apertium -l` only shows translation /modes while `apertium -L` shows both /modes and /debug-modes? (And `apertium kaz-rus-biltrans` works without any special switches because why not, while `apertium nonexistent` runs `apertium -l` and gives a hint to use `-L` to show the rest.) signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ Apertium-stuff mailing list Apertium-stuff@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/apertium-stuff
Re: [Apertium-stuff] A question about Apertium Kazakh and Tatar packages
G'day, and CC'ing the apertium-stuff mailing list, Firstly, I recommend getting in the Apertium IRC channel for live support and developer feedback. We're on irc.oftc.net #apertium ( https://wiki.apertium.org/wiki/Contact#IRC ). As to your question, then those are debug modes. If you look in e.g. https://github.com/apertium/apertium-tat-rus/blob/master/modes.xml then you can see which modes are marked install="yes" - those are the only modes that "make install" will install. Debug modes often depend on temporary files that aren't installed either. The installed modes are what the language/pair developers consider useful for end-users. It is thus not really an issue or bug if a given debug mode isn't installed - it's usually an informed choice. If anything, I would say it's a bug that rus-kaz installs the debug modes that it does - and indeed, such a bug is filed: https://github.com/apertium/apertium-kaz-rus/issues/1 The monolingual packages install many more modes, because they are used for further development. So you can get morph from those. But biltrans is not normal to want if you aren't a developer, and thus building from source. But it's all what people are used to, so I'd expect the particular pair developers are open for discussion and looking at new use-cases. Hence the CC to the mailing list, as I am not a language pair developer. -- Tino Didriksen On Wed, 1 Sept 2021 at 18:58, Андрей Клочко wrote: > Dear Tino Didriksen, > My name is Andrew and I'm a developer of web-platform Lingvodoc ( > http://lingvodoc.ispras.ru/). We have an idea to use some of Apertium > linguistic packages in our system to implement the ability of performing > automatical morphological analysis and translation to Russian (now I'm > working on Kazakh and Tatar languages support). I use apertium-tat-rus and > apertium-kaz-rus packages with modes "biltrans" and "morph" and they work > well if these packages are built from Github sources, though I face with > some problems while trying to use them from APT repository ( > https://apertium.projectjj.com/apt/install-nightly.sh): > The output of > $ echo "Сәлем!" | apertium kaz-rus > is > $ Error: can't stat file > '/usr/share/apertium/apertium-kaz-rus/apertium-kaz-rus.kaz-rus.t4x' > showing that an important file is absent in the apertium-kaz-rus DEB > package. > Modes "kaz-rus-morph", "kaz-rus-biltrans", "tat-rus-morph", > "tat-rus-biltrans" don't exist among Apertium modes after apertium-tat, > apertium-kaz, apertium-rus, apertium-kaz-rus, apertium-tat-rus packages > installation, all available modes are listed below: > kaz_Arab-gener > kaz_Cyrl-gener > kaz-disam > kaz-gener > kaz-lexc > kaz-morph > kaz-rus > kaz-spell > kaz-tagger > kaz-tokenise > kaz-twol > rus-disam > rus-gener > rus-kaz-biltrans > rus-kaz-interchunk > rus-kaz > rus-kaz-postchunk-and-cleanup > rus-kaz-postchunk > rus-kaz-transfer > rus-morph > rus-tagger > tat-disam > tat-gener > tat-morph > tat-rus > tat-spell > tat-tagger > tat-tokenise > tat-twol > Is it possible to fix this issue? > Best regards, > Andrew. > ___ Apertium-stuff mailing list Apertium-stuff@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/apertium-stuff
