Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Just My 2 cents. It is the cables electrical properties that should be looked at, do these change in time, only to very small degree and for the distances we talk about in consumer audio, any effect is likely to be minimal and imperceivable. Funny thing is the electrical properties of top high end cables are rarely significantly different from relatively cheap cables like Belden and Mogami. I am obviously in the skeptics camp, I am happy to concede there are small differences between cables, but differences are largely not price reflective. Money spent on cables, can be much better directed to other areas of the system, particularly speakers, room treatments, and components. -- dlite dlite's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4885 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Mark Lanctot;214080 Wrote: Isn't that like going to a car dealership and asking the salesman if he recommends you should go with one of his vehicles or keep driving your '92 Ford Taurus? Replacing your cables every 1000 hours = a good strategy to ensure repeat/ongoing sales. The audacity! To sell this hideously overpriced stuff in the first place, then to GET THE CUSTOMER TO DO IT AGAIN IN A FEW YEARS! BTW oxidation tends to form its own barrier. It will thoroughly coat the bare metal, then the rate of corrosion will slow as it tends to insulate the rest of the metal from the elements. This is why copper roofing is still structurally sound long after it's turned green (it's good for many decades). This is also why aluminum doesn't appear to suffer from oxidation - in reality the reaction is so fast that the aluminum is thoroughly coated with oxide as it is being cast. After the entire surface is oxidized, the metal is insulated and further oxidation occurs much, much slower. Also look at the thickness of the corrosion versus the thickness of the metal. Even heavily-oxidized copper wire contains a very thin layer of corrosion, at least in comparison to the metal thickness. It is orders of magnitude thinner than the remaining copper. And finally, any cable with insulation that allows the copper inside to oxidize is poorly-designed or defective. If you've done any home remodelling and stripped any older wire sealed with PVC, the wire inside is pristine. It sure should be, oxidized home wiring is dangerous as it can arc. I think you may be mixing a few posts together. I think the original post in the thread related to if cables have a burn-in period, then do they have a life span? (1,000 hours was probably chosen randomly to illustrate the point). At no point did any person or company -- including DH Labs -- say you should replace cables every 1,000 hours. So in answer to your question, DH labs' input is totally valid for this discussion. What's wrong with asking the experts? I did not ask them about THEIR cables nor did I ask if their cables need to be replaced after x hours of use. It was just a general question about the effects of copper oxidation in audio cable. I could have asked the same question to any audio cable manufacturer. So using the car analogy, it was more like calling and asking about catalytic converters not the strengths and weaknesses of specific make/models. And FWIW, DH Labs is one of the few manufacturers out there that don't try to rip people off with insanely priced cable (some of their cables retail for as low as $1.00 per ft.). They have a pretty big following in the DIYer community for this reason and you can order most of their products in bulk and terminate them yourself. -- Videodrome Two-channel System: SB3, into Musiland MD-10 DAC; Outlaw 970 Pre/Pro; McCormack DNA-125 amplifier; Quad 11L speakers; Sota Sapphire ttbl. w/ Grado Ref. Platinum Cart. into Rolls Bellari VP-129 tube phono stage; Marantz 10b; Nakamichi RX505; Cables Used: DH Labs, Van den Hul, Distech, Monster, many more. Videodrome's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=11727 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Mark Lanctot;214296 Wrote: Someone on this board (Phil Leigh? Pat Farell?) has repeatedly stated that merely unplugging and re-plugging cables/interconnects makes an audible difference and so does contact cleaners. It was P Floding, I believe. Since we're talking stranded wire, wouldn't the individual strands have their own skin effect, resulting in perfect transmission even if the outer strands are green? -- Skunk Skunk's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2685 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Skunk;214301 Wrote: It was P Floding, I believe. Since we're talking stranded wire, wouldn't the individual strands have their own skin effect, resulting in perfect transmission even if the outer strands are green? It was indeed Mr Floding...although I happen to agree with him - every three months or so I unplug all my connections and clean the phono's...every year I clean the mains pins. -- Phil Leigh You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it ain't what you'd call minimal... ...SB3+TACT+Altmann+MF DACXV3/Linn tri-amped Aktiv 5.1 system and some very expensive cables ;o) Phil Leigh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=85 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Mark Lanctot;214296 Wrote: But the skin effect is most pronounced at VHF and microwave frequencies. MHz or GHz, not kHz unless it's undersized. Crack detection frequencies for eddy current skin effect tend to be in the low to mid 100KHz, the lower the frequency, the deeper it goes. There are a number of research papers around on this topic, but it certainly doesn't need MHz to demonstrate voltage fluctuations with cracks in materials due to flexing and manufacturing. -- CardinalFang CardinalFang's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=962 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
But still, at 100 kHz you're far from impacting audible frequencies. It's not like your speakers could even reproduce it, or that you could even hear it (not even dogs can hear this high). -- Mark Lanctot 'Sean Adams' Response-O-Matic checklist, patent pending!' (http://forums.slimdevices.com/showpost.php?p=200910postcount=2) Mark Lanctot's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2071 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Mark Lanctot;214328 Wrote: But still, at 100 kHz you're far from impacting audible frequencies. It's not like your speakers could even reproduce it, or that you could even hear it (not even dogs can hear this high). The point is that the lower the frequency, the deeper the skin effect, so a 10KHz signal exhibits a skin effect too, just a deeper skin. The speaker might reproduce 100KHz too, just at a very low level dictated by the response curve - it doesn't necessarily go to zero at very high KHz frequencies. -- CardinalFang CardinalFang's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=962 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Mark Lanctot;214296 Wrote: Yeah but a stranded wire is pretty simple mechanically. Just long pieces of metal. No moving parts, no liquid components that can evaporate like capacitors. But the skin effect is most pronounced at VHF and microwave frequencies. MHz or GHz, not kHz unless it's undersized. It's the connections that are critical. These rely on contact and any oxidation here will directly affect the resistance of the connection. Someone on this board (Phil Leigh? Pat Farell?) has repeatedly stated that merely unplugging and re-plugging cables/interconnects makes an audible difference and so does contact cleaners. This makes sense. True. That's why there have been products like Cramolin, Tweak and Caig to clean surface crud on the connectors. Yes, it definitely helps. And to some extent, puliing the connector on and off scrubs the connection point a bit. But getting back to our friend the oxidized cable, Would the connector really tell the whole story? Could not oxidation affect resistance in the cable itself? I think the integrity of the cable needs to be looked at in its totality. Taken to it's logical conclusion, I could dig an old, rusty coat hanger out of the backyard, stick it between two connectors and, so long as it passed a signal, I'd have a cable just as good as those designed specifically for audio applications. I don't know what the exact frequency range is for skin effect. However, DH Labs also mentioned non-linearity, which I don't think is the same animal. That was identified as a culprit in the audible range that would be compromised by oxidation. Whew, anyone remember how we got started on this? Anyway, I'm about ready to power down for the weekend and head home. I hope everyone has a great weekend and has a chance to listen to their SB! Best, - VD -- Videodrome Two-channel System: SB3, into Musiland MD-10 DAC; Outlaw 970 Pre/Pro; McCormack DNA-125 amplifier; Quad 11L speakers; Sota Sapphire ttbl. w/ Grado Ref. Platinum Cart. into Rolls Bellari VP-129 tube phono stage; Marantz 10b; Nakamichi RX505; Cables Used: DH Labs, Van den Hul, Distech, Monster, many more. Videodrome's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=11727 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Videodrome, thanks for keeping it civil. Too often threads like this degenerate into flame wars. Videodrome;214340 Wrote: Taken to it's logical conclusion, I could dig an old, rusty coat hanger out of the backyard, stick it between two connectors and, so long as it passed a signal, I'd have a cable just as good as those designed specifically for audio applications. Believe it or not, this has been suggested before, and tried I believe, although the cable wasn't oxidized. Still, as long as there is a sufficient effective gauge remaining, there does not seem to be a clear physical mechanism explaining how oxidized conductors could affect the sound. I'm not an expert on the skin effect, so I'll let CardinalFang's statements stand. However it doesn't sound like a large-scale effect to me. -- Mark Lanctot 'Sean Adams' Response-O-Matic checklist, patent pending!' (http://forums.slimdevices.com/showpost.php?p=200910postcount=2) Mark Lanctot's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2071 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Lol :) I'm just waiting for someone to suggest that they degrade over time and need replacing - and that they can't just replace the whole chip because 'they don't make them like they used to'! -- AndyC_772 AndyC_772's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10472 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Videodrome;213715 Wrote: I'm not sure that's an apples to apples comparison. You're talking about delivering raw voltage -- it's either on or off. Presuming of course you're in the camp that believes there are discernable differences between cables, would you agree that how various components of the cable may be perceived as affecting the sound, including, perhaps, the conditions of the metals within, are much more nuanced? Aren't the 1's and 0's on or off too? Actually High Tension wires are AC so it's actually not just on it's up and down. Or does oxidation make electricity flow slower or differently some how? -- mswlogo Thinkpad XP SS Cat5 SB3 SPDIF-COAX Meridian 861V4 (Trifield, Room corrected, Upsampled) DSP5500 Mains, DSP5500HC Center, DSP33 Rears mswlogo's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=9090 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
But at any rate, the AC comparison was tough for me to buy into, because I think a simple on/off test is not a particularly comparable test for audio cable performance. The way I see it, so long as oxidation/corrosion to the copper in the AC connection does not reach the point of total failure, the lights are on. What goes on in an audio cable is far more complex. As I would not be the best person to explain what those complexities are, and how they do or do not compare to AC power, I called DH Labs. According to the technician I spoke with, oxidation would definitely degrade audio performance. For starters, the cables at the power station only carry a specific and very limited frequency across the copper. The cable diameter is also much greater. By comparison, audio cables carry wide frequency ranges, and are much are thinner (thus succumbing to the effects of oxidation much sooner). Once the oxidation infiltrated the copper in the cable, it would cause the audio signals to flow in a non-linear fashion -- especially high frequency information. He said this can actually be shown on an oscilloscope. I did not ask how and when the listener would perceive this, but suffice it to say, I've given up the idea of selling those old Monster Cables on Audiogon. -- Videodrome Two-channel System: SB3, into Musiland MD-10 DAC; Outlaw 970 Pre/Pro; McCormack DNA-125 amplifier; Quad 11L speakers; Sota Sapphire ttbl. w/ Grado Ref. Platinum Cart. into Rolls Bellari VP-129 tube phono stage; Marantz 10b; Nakamichi RX505; Cables Used: DH Labs, Van den Hul, Distech, Monster, many more. Videodrome's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=11727 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Videodrome;214051 Wrote: I called DH Labs. Isn't that like going to a car dealership and asking the salesman if he recommends you should go with one of his vehicles or keep driving your '92 Ford Taurus? Replacing your cables every 1000 hours = a good strategy to ensure repeat/ongoing sales. The audacity! To sell this hideously overpriced stuff in the first place, then to GET THE CUSTOMER TO DO IT AGAIN IN A FEW YEARS! BTW oxidation tends to form its own barrier. It will thoroughly coat the bare metal, then the rate of corrosion will slow as it tends to insulate the rest of the metal from the elements. This is why copper roofing is still structurally sound long after it's turned green (it's good for many decades). This is also why aluminum doesn't appear to suffer from oxidation - in reality the reaction is so fast that the aluminum is thoroughly coated with oxide as it is being cast. After the entire surface is oxidized, the metal is insulated and further oxidation occurs much, much slower. Also look at the thickness of the corrosion versus the thickness of the metal. Even heavily-oxidized copper wire contains a very thin layer of corrosion, at least in comparison to the metal thickness. It is orders of magnitude thinner than the remaining copper. And finally, any cable with insulation that allows the copper inside to oxidize is poorly-designed or defective. If you've done any home remodelling and stripped any older wire sealed with PVC, the wire inside is pristine. It sure should be, oxidized home wiring is dangerous as it can arc. -- Mark Lanctot 'Sean Adams' Response-O-Matic checklist, patent pending!' (http://forums.slimdevices.com/showpost.php?p=200910postcount=2) Mark Lanctot's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2071 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
I'm surprised no one's said this yet, but 1000 hours = 41 days. I bet the cable you buy every 4 weeks has sat on the shelf longer than that... Also if you use the $100/ft stuff, that's a ridiculously huge ongoing investment. Even the cheap Home Depot stuff would sure add up if you replaced it 8 times a year. -- Mark Lanctot 'Sean Adams' Response-O-Matic checklist, patent pending!' (http://forums.slimdevices.com/showpost.php?p=200910postcount=2) Mark Lanctot's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2071 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Like everything audiophile there is a certain amount of placebo effect going on. Yes they say that cables need to break in, amps need to warm up, etc, but in years of listening to audiophile kit in various guises, i have to say that i now beleive that its a human syndrome - we are made to beleive something sounds better if we do this or that, and so we think it really does sound better. IMO the only really audible differences come from the source and the speakers. Things like cables, equipment stands, special power supplies and all the other upgrading parephanalia doesnt have that much - if any effect on the sound. But thats just an opinion! Leave your cables be! -- russj1975 russj1975's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=12290 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
mswlogo;213610 Wrote: Do you think high tension wires from power stations have to clean the oxidation off the wires every so often? I'm not sure that's an apples to apples comparison. You're talking about delivering raw voltage -- it's either on or off. Presuming of course you're in the camp that believes there are discernable differences between cables, would you agree that how various components of the cable may be perceived as affecting the sound, including, perhaps, the conditions of the metals within, are much more nuanced? -- Videodrome Two-channel System: SB3, into Musiland MD-10 DAC; Outlaw 970 Pre/Pro; McCormack DNA-125 amplifier; Quad 11L speakers; Sota Sapphire ttbl. w/ Grado Ref. Platinum Cart. into Rolls Bellari VP-129 tube phono stage; Marantz 10b; Nakamichi RX505; Cables Used: DH Labs, Van den Hul, Distech, Monster, many more. Videodrome's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=11727 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
russj1975;213681 Wrote: Like everything audiophile there is a certain amount of placebo effect going on. Yes they say that cables need to break in, amps need to warm up, etc, but in years of listening to audiophile kit in various guises, i have to say that i now beleive that its a human syndrome - we are made to beleive something sounds better if we do this or that, and so we think it really does sound better. IMO the only really audible differences come from the source and the speakers. Things like cables, equipment stands, special power supplies and all the other upgrading parephanalia doesnt have that much - if any effect on the sound. But thats just an opinion! Leave your cables be! I guess I'm one of those hardcore believers, as I have witnessed time and again chnages to my system based on what cables I have used. Case in point: I recently swapped out the aforementioned Van den Hul silvers from my Squeezebox -- Musiland MD10 and replaced them with a comparably old pair of Audio Quest Lapis. The Lapis sounds much, much better. The silver interconnect was just too fatiguing and strident on the digital source. And you could tell right away when the AQ were slapped on that a huge digital edge was taken off the music and your ears went ah. Now, is that because the Van den Huls have deteriorated, or there just not the best choice for that source (or is it a combination of both)? I don't know, but trust me it was an immediate improvement. And regarding the psychological influcence, it was quite the opposite. I really, really wanted the silver interconnect to work there. They are a very short pair that will not fit anywhere else in the system. That coupled with the fact they they were so pricey, has made it especially painful to put them back in a drawer. -- Videodrome Two-channel System: SB3, into Musiland MD-10 DAC; Outlaw 970 Pre/Pro; McCormack DNA-125 amplifier; Quad 11L speakers; Sota Sapphire ttbl. w/ Grado Ref. Platinum Cart. into Rolls Bellari VP-129 tube phono stage; Marantz 10b; Nakamichi RX505; Cables Used: DH Labs, Van den Hul, Distech, Monster, many more. Videodrome's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=11727 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Unless the surface oxidation gets between the connector and the wire. The Green won't do anything to the sound. Do you think high tension wires from power stations have to clean the oxidation off the wires every so often? -- mswlogo Thinkpad XP SS Cat5 SB3 SPDIF-COAX Meridian 861V4 (Trifield, Room corrected, Upsampled) DSP5500 Mains, DSP5500HC Center, DSP33 Rears mswlogo's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=9090 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
corbey;213145 Wrote: Therefore, sooner or later, the cables will run out of electrons and you'll need new ones. ...Unless they're the type that use two AA batteries. What I want to know is when do I need to replace the circuit board traces on my electronics? -- Skunk Skunk's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2685 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Based on my own observations, I think there is a life span to these products, but it does not have anything to do with how many hours a signal has passed through them, but instead, relates to how long they've been just sitting there -- whether in use, or not in use. I have many pairs of cables that are closing in on the 20-year mark. Some still sound amazing, even compared to modern products. On the other hand, I have seen several cables (particularly old, 10 ga. Monster Cable speaker wire) turn green with oxidation. I'm not an electrical engineer, but that has got to have deleterious effect on the sound. Similarly, I have a pair of Van den Hul silver interconnects that started life with nice, translucent jackets, and clearly marked, red lettering that now have turned a weird gold color and the lettering has oozed together and a faded red band that is competely illegible. You've got to wonder what horrors lurk beneath the surface. And frankly, I don't think the cable sounds as good as it used to. But they were so damned expensive, I can't bear to throw them out. Lastly, it's not uncommon that cables that have been unplugged / plugged / bent / twisted / stepped on, etc. over a span of years can begin to have problems where you have intermittent drops in signal flow. I've certainly had that happen with a pair of Audio Quest composite video cables -- sometimes the picture's there, sometimes it isn't. Considering how fickle most audiophiles are, it's doubtful many of us would keep the same cables for such extended periods of time. But from my own experience, they do suffer the effects of age and, eventually, need to be tossed. What we need is the Dorian Gray cable that never ages. Instead, a picture of the cable takes all the wear and tear. Van den Hul, are you listening? - VD -- Videodrome Two-channel System: SB3, into Musiland MD-10 DAC; Outlaw 970 Pre/Pro; McCormack DNA-125 amplifier; Quad 11L speakers; Sota Sapphire ttbl. w/ Grado Ref. Platinum Cart. into Rolls Bellari VP-129 tube phono stage; Marantz 10b; Nakamichi RX505; Cables Used: DH Labs, Van den Hul, Distech, Monster, many more. Videodrome's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=11727 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Videodrome;213205 Wrote: ...On the other hand, I have seen several cables (particularly old, 10 ga. Monster Cable speaker wire) turn green with oxidation. I'm not an electrical engineer, but that has got to have deleterious effect on the sound. Rule of thumb... Green stuff growing in garden == GOOD Green stuff growing on bread == BAD Green stuff growing on Cu cables == BAD -- JimC JimC's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=9428 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
JimC;213217 Wrote: Rule of thumb... Green stuff growing in garden == GOOD Green stuff growing on bread == BAD Green stuff growing on Cu cables == BAD ummm - good rule, to which one might add Green stuff growing in wallet == GOOD Green stuff growing in shower == BAD -- Phil Leigh You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it ain't what you'd call minimal... ...SB3+TACT+Altmann+MF DACXV3/Linn tri-amped Aktiv 5.1 system and some very expensive cables ;o) Phil Leigh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=85 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Here's what Nelson Pass has to say about his amplifiers wearing out: In fifteen years the electrolytic power supply capacitors will get old. Depending on usage, you will begin to have semiconductor and other failures between 10 and 50 years after date of manufacture. Later, the sun will cool to a white dwarf, and after that the universe will experience heat death. - from the Pass Aleph 30 Owner's Manual -- WilCox SB3 - PS Audio Digital Link III - Dynaudio BM 6A Mk II WilCox's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10508 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Oh god! does this mean i have to re-wire my house every couple or years so i can get optimum power out of my sockets?!?! ;) -- funkstar funkstar's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2335 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
I guess you could argue the same for all components, not just cables. Even more so for those with moving parts:- speakers, CD transports. -- Ian_F Ian_F's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=8308 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Start with changing your ears weekly... -- Havoc Havoc's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=5064 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
mswlogo;213047 Wrote: It seems the experts believe break in is neccessary for cables and components. This implies things are constantly changing and wearing. If thats the case why not recommend replacement after so many hours. I don't know of anything in the physical world that wears when in operation and knows to stop wearing past its peak. How does the device know to stop wearing and when? At one point in time, the experts thought the Earth was the center of the solar system, that the Earth was flat, and various and sundry other bits of absurdum. As a general rule, when the experts argue stridently to convince you they are correct, it is a pretty good indicator they are neither. -= Jim -- JimC JimC's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=9428 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Well it is certainly true that electrolytic capacitors need to form when new...and then after a while (years) they start to die...just like rechargeable batteries... Not sure this applies to wires though - never seen one die except from corrosion caused by exposure to moisture. -- Phil Leigh You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it ain't what you'd call minimal... ...SB3+TACT+Altmann+MF DACXV3/Linn tri-amped Aktiv 5.1 system and some very expensive cables ;o) Phil Leigh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=85 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
funkstar;213056 Wrote: Oh god! does this mean i have to re-wire my house every couple or years so i can get optimum power out of my sockets?!?! ;) As a matter of fact, you do. Every 50-ish years. With the change in technology, power requirements change, as well as safety code. So it is a good idea to do. Oh, and BTW, those who decide to replace their cables after 1000 hrs, should know that there's very special procedure required to recycle them properly . Otherwise, they may explode and blow into your face. Also, that contributes a great deal to the global warming. However, luckily for you, no reason to worry, I'll do it for you for a small fee. K -- slimkid The sound stage will open up, bass will tighten and the imaging will improve. DVD performance will also increase substantially. slimkid's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=8881 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Havoc;213069 Wrote: Start with changing your ears weekly... If I rotate them daily do you think i could stretch to two weeks? Of course I get the golden ears and they ain't cheap given they are in short supply as everyone seems to have that model. -- mswlogo Thinkpad XP SS Cat5 SB3 SPDIF-COAX Meridian 861V4 (Trifield, Room corrected, Upsampled) DSP5500 Mains, DSP5500HC Center, DSP33 Rears mswlogo's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=9090 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Should I replace my cables every 1000 hours
Audiophile cables are usually marked with arrows to indicate directionality. According to the laws of physics, this means that all the electrons are flowing in one direction only. Therefore, sooner or later, the cables will run out of electrons and you'll need new ones. -- corbey My two-channel system: - SB-3 through a CIAudio VDA-2 DAC (and using Nokia N800 as a remote) - Sony SCD-1 CD/SACD player - WyeTech Labs Jade tubed preamp - Chord SPM 1200C power amp - Basis 2001 turntable w/ Graham Arm Lyra Helikon cartridge - Klyne phono stage - Proac 2.5 speakers corbey's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=11286 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=36658 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
