[Newbies] another test please ignore
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[Newbies] this is a test please ignore
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Re: [Newbies] How would I save an object to disk separately and load it when needed?
pay attention Monticello only save "programs" (class method definition) not objects (instance of classes). Stef On Jun 10, 2009, at 12:27 AM, Paul DeBruicker wrote: Hi Frank, I've worked through that tutorial. Look to chapter 14 for how to save the object definitions. The tool that does that is called Monticello. To backup Gemstone itself you can just make a backup of the extent0.dbf file by clicking the Admin button in the GemTools Launcher window and then selecting Backup Repository. It will create a backup of the data and object definitions in I think /opt/gemstone/product/seaside/data/backups/ folder. I'm not sure how to just save the object data separately from the definitions. The backup file can be loaded into another image on another machine and you should be able to pick up where you left off. Also, for Gemstone specific questions you should join the Beta mailing list for Gemstone here: http://seaside.gemstone.com/mailman/listinfo/beta I've cc'd your question to that list and imagine that someone there will correct me if I've misled you or improve my answer as I'm sure its not complete. Good luck Paul On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Frank Church wrote: I am practicing the seaside.gemstone.com tutorial and I want to know how to save just the object definitions and their data to a seperate file, then load it again, or even into a different image and run the website again. It sounds like very newbie question, but I would be very much obliged. /vfclists ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Where to ask questions - Squeak Beginners and Squeak Dev?
Hi frank I battled a lot to impose this mailing-list because I felt that newbies were afraid asking questions. And this mailing-list is wonderful. Feel free to post here or on squeak-dev. There is no specific rules. This mailing-list was just created so that you feel free to ask any question you have but you can post to the other two. I think that the people answering all the questions are doing an excellent job! Chapeau bas messieurs ;) Stef On Jun 17, 2009, at 5:00 PM, Frank Church wrote: What sort of questions are appropriate to each group (really means which questions should you not ask on Squeak Developers)? As I understand it Squeak is a variant of Smalltalk, so is Squeak beginners the proper place to ask about Smalltalk Proper and the IDE, with Squeak developers the place to ask questions about libraries and the implementation? The developers list has a lot more activity and it makes me wonder if most questions are better asked there even if a newbie. I would assume newbie means people new to programming rather than Smalltalk or its environments and libraries in general. -- Frank Church === devblog.brahmancreations.com ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Equivalent of Ruby's YAML::load in smalltalk
On Jun 17, 2009, at 5:16 PM, Frank Church wrote: Is there a smalltalk command that can load YAML into a Smalltalk array? Frank, what is YAML::load? Knowing it may help people answering the question. -- Frank Church === devblog.brahmancreations.com ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] squeak locks up on windows / help me debug it...
On Jan 10, 2009, at 12:19 PM, Herbert König wrote: Hello Cameron, CS> I see that another Windows user has reported a lock-up on this forum just CS> last month. Perhaps I will back up and see if 3.9 is a better starting CS> point. 3.8? Squeak should be a stable development System for many people. For historical reasons I use 3.8 and I'm using it for hours without saving. I even use it in trains on my laptop without the accumulator inserted, and if the power fails I just recover my last steps from the changes file. As there are so many developers on Squeak dev, they must have similar experience with the current versions. I guess the Pharo people do development in Pharo, so they must have a stable Pharo development environment too. Yes do and developing a lot of other stuff. And lukas is developing seaside on it. Now most of us are on macs. All this aside, the youngest entry in the changes file might show your last action (if it wasn't a click) so this might give us a clue. At a customer of mine we had to exclude Squeak from the virus scanning, we didn't experience crashes but it was dreadfully slow. IIRC the reason was that the scanner slowed the access to the changes file. Have you ever tried on another computer? IMHO this is not Squeak but Squeak + something else in your System. -- Cheers, Herbert ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] squeak locks up on windows / help me debug it...
On Jan 10, 2009, at 12:19 PM, Herbert König wrote: Hello Cameron, CS> I see that another Windows user has reported a lock-up on this forum just CS> last month. Perhaps I will back up and see if 3.9 is a better starting CS> point. 3.8? Squeak should be a stable development System for many people. For historical reasons I use 3.8 and I'm using it for hours without saving. I even use it in trains on my laptop without the accumulator inserted, and if the power fails I just recover my last steps from the changes file. As there are so many developers on Squeak dev, they must have similar experience with the current versions. I guess the Pharo people do development in Pharo, so they must have a stable Pharo development environment too. Yes do and developing a lot of other stuff. And lukas is developing seaside on it. Now most of us are on macs. All this aside, the youngest entry in the changes file might show your last action (if it wasn't a click) so this might give us a clue. At a customer of mine we had to exclude Squeak from the virus scanning, we didn't experience crashes but it was dreadfully slow. IIRC the reason was that the scanner slowed the access to the changes file. Have you ever tried on another computer? IMHO this is not Squeak but Squeak + something else in your System. -- Cheers, Herbert ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Re: Which environment
On Jan 10, 2009, at 3:15 PM, Stephan Eggermont wrote: I would think synchronizing with SBE would make sense. Yes you could use the SBE image. Because we got a lot of problem with the IDE changes in squeak-dev and friends. I don't know what they are planning, but would guess they're waiting for the Pharo 1.0. What we are planning is the following: - we are happily writing quite cool chapters for the second volume (I asked my co-authors that we publish the early versions but apparently we got distracted). We have seaside, regex, exception, metaprog., installer and others chapters as well. - we will probably write Pharo by Example volume two and update Squeak by Example as Pharo by Example volume one but we will see. Stef Stephan ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] keyboard shortcuts in OmniBrowser
if you load polymorph (UI enhancements - pay attention to read the web install pages to uncomment a method) you get tab and can use the browser and navigate using keys. Stef On Oct 4, 2008, at 11:13 PM, Mark Volkmann wrote: Is it possible to use OmniBrowser without using a mouse? For example, is there a keystroke that moves the focus to the different panes within the brower? --- Mark Volkmann ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] custom halos
You are facing the nonOOP aspect of certain ugly parts of queak. The fact that halosmorph cannot be defined per class is striking. Nice to have a kind of global var, this is were squeak lost OOP. Once someone fixed that but it was never integrated (probably in 3.7 or 3.8 days). For my book I wanted special halos and I had to hack the global system. :( Terribly sad. Stef On Oct 6, 2008, at 12:24 AM, Aidan Gauland wrote: K. K. Subramaniam wrote: On Saturday 04 Oct 2008 10:55:28 am Aidan Gauland wrote: K. K. Subramaniam wrote: For adding a new button called BBB, you need to 1. add a halospec for addBBBHandle to Preferences class (see senders of addScriptorHandle: for the list) How can I do (and undo) this programmatically? I don't know of any simple way to do this. The specs are in a method, not in a global variable. So you will have to recompile the method to add new specs. I think I might have found out how: run PreferencesClass>>installHaloSpecsFromArray: passing it an array in the same format as the one that Preferences class>>customHaloSpecs or PreferencesClass>>classicHaloSpecs retruns. This way, you can include halos in a package. (I think, I don't know about removing them later.) Thanks for the pointers (or references, in Smalltalk). -Aidan ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Porting an old app to a recent image
this is really strange. can you select one class of your app and fileout it and send it? stef On Oct 9, 2008, at 3:37 PM, Matthias Korn wrote: Hi, I already tried to fileIn a minimal part (one Morph class) of the application I want to port and started resolving the errors in the debugger one by one. Still, now I am stuck with the following error: Metaclass(Object)>>doesNotUnderstand: #category (the full Stack Trace is attached) Were there some changes in the Metaclass between V2 and V3 that explain this error? Thanks for the hint, though Karl. I didn't know about that possibility. Regards, Matthias Am Wed, 8 Oct 2008 18:07:55 +0200 schrieb Karl Ramberg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: Matthias Korn wrote: Hi all, is there some documentation, help, tools, etc. to port a Squeak app written in SqueakV2.sources to a recent image? fileOut -> fileIn gives me all sorts of error messages I cannot understand/debug. I actually just want to port parts of the app to re-use the code. But it proofs really difficult for me Hi, in FileList you can try to look at the code with the CodeBrowser. Select the file you want to load, press the code button, or select browse code from the context menu. This will load the code in a temporary way and you can browse it and see the methods that change, and file in the parts you want. Karl < Metaclass_category.txt>___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] coverage tool
there was christo. stef On Sep 28, 2008, at 3:10 AM, Mark Volkmann wrote: Is there a code coverage tool for Squeak? When I run my suite of unit tests, I want to know if there is any code within the classes in category I'm testing that wasn't executed by the tests. --- Mark Volkmann ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
[Newbies] new Smalltalk videos
Hello I started to redo my old Smalltalk videos and I would like to get some feedback before putting a soundtrack in french and english. I will be looking for somebody with a good english accent and a mac to help for the english soundtracks. http://stephane.ducasse.free.fr/Videos/2008-SmalltalkVideos/ Stef ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] SAR Files
Hi It seems that speech is already in 3.9 Pay attention that klatt does not work with frnech like language :) Luciano sent me some more files so if you need I can dig on my HD. Stef On May 24, 2008, at 2:37 AM, Jeffery Billing wrote: I am interested in using the 'Speech' package. These are in SAR files. How do I convert these files and then install them into squeak (vers 3.9) so that I can use them in a project? I am a complete newbie!! Jeff Billing ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Remove old instances of a Class
You can also use trick like each become: String new to swap references to empty object that will be garbaged. On May 24, 2008, at 11:54 PM, Claus Kick wrote: why not just do MyClass allInstances do:[:i | i := nil]. Smalltalk unusedMemory. (Cannot recall if unusedMemory triggers a GC in Squeak, or even exists). Anyways, the first should nil all of your instances and then get them gc'ed. -- Claus Kick "Wenn Sie mich suchen: Ich halte mich in der Nähe des Wahnsinns auf. Genauer gesagt auf der schmalen Linie zwischen Wahnsinn und Panik. Gleich um die Ecke von Todesangst, nicht weit weg von Irrwitz und Idiotie." "If you are looking for me: I am somewhere near to lunacy. More clearly, on the narrow path between lunacy and panic. Right around the corner of fear of death, not far away from idiotism and insanity." ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Mac OS X... proper installation?
Hi aaron you can take the seaside distribution If you click on it and ask show contents... you will see the image and the source and the package folder. Else you can take 3.9 full. stef On May 21, 2008, at 10:40 PM, Aaron Broad wrote: Hi, I'm new to smalltalk/squeak. Trying to learn seaside. I want to use the web development image but i can't seem to get it to work. I have mac os x leopard on macbook pro. I have tried the following each with failure: * I installed squeak via darwin ports but it just hangs if i try to load the web image using the following squeak -vm-display-Quartz sq3webdev.image *I downloaded and installed the MacOSX universal app from squeak homepage. It will load the web dev image but has visual errors i'm guessing from wrong version incompatibilities?? there are text artifacts and errors throughout So my question is how does everyone else install on mac os x. I'm a beginner at squeak but not computer science/unix/etc. I'm looking to install it the proper way and in a way where i can choose which image gets loaded at the start, because I started learning seaside with the oneclick installer but i messed up that image to the point where it crashes 5 seconds after loading. Unfortunately this is halfway through the todoapp tutorial, so i have to start it over when i do get it working. thanks, Aaron ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] ActiveRecord?
I totally agree. Upfront vs practical. For my dead stupid data I want a dead stupid way of storing them in postgrs stef On Apr 3, 2008, at 7:57 AM, Ramon Leon wrote: Sure, for simple stuff, one-class-is-one-table might make sense, but pay attention to the other kinds of mapping styles. Lots of power in there. It's how an ORM *should* be done. -- Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - Rails has made it pretty clear that *most* apps really are that simple since it only supports direct mapping. Glorp is absurdly powerful in its ability to map objects to tables, *assuming* that mapping is the correct answer of course. As powerful as Glorp is, most people will end up spending a lot of time wrestling with mappings, probably far more than they want. Glorp is an expert framework for experts, but those who don't grok mapping patterns in general will be baffled by it. Rob, if you don't need to scale too big, check out the SandstoneDb package on SqueakSource, it should be familiar to anyone who likes ActiveRecord. Ramon Leon http://onsmalltalk.com ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] ActiveRecord?
still it would be good to have a layer on top of Glorp, I'm amazed by the quantity of code we should write (See HPI seaside tutorial). It would be good that a reflective or meta description approach would be proposed by default and that if people want to have something that can do it (as it is now). I do not see the value of paying in advance functionality I do not need. Glorp start up is too high from my perspective (I'm lazy and proud of it).] Stef On Apr 3, 2008, at 6:37 AM, Randal L. Schwartz wrote: "Rob" == Rob Rothwell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: Rob> Has anyone written anything like the ActiveRecord for Glorp? Using something like ActiveRecord for Glorp would be like buying an airplane just to taxi around the airport without ever lifting off the ground. The big plus in Glorp that I'm seeing is that you can do more than DirectMapping... you can describe tables on one side, model-objects on the other, and then produce an almost arbitrary mapping between the two. Sure, for simple stuff, one-class-is-one-table might make sense, but pay attention to the other kinds of mapping styles. Lots of power in there. It's how an ORM *should* be done. -- Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/> Perl/Unix/security consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc. See PerlTraining.Stonehenge.com for onsite and open-enrollment Perl training! ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Collection subclasses
normally initialize instance side method is automatically invoked when you send the message new. Now for some collections this behavior has been optimized because it was not doing what it should do (unnnecessary initialization). Stef On Apr 3, 2008, at 4:31 AM, Rob Rothwell wrote: If I create a simple object subclassed from Collection, SequenceableCollection, or ArrayedCollection called CollectionObject, with CollectionObject>>#initialize self halt. and execute: CollectionObject new. the halt is executed. Whereas, if I subclass CollectionObject from: Set Dictionary OrderedCollection Array It does not. Is one not supposed to make subclasses of these classes, and if so, why not? I have an object that is most naturally a Dictionary-like object with various subclasses, but I can not initialize it... Thank you; I feel I am missing something very basic in my understanding! Rob Rothwell ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] SBE and Squeak versions out-of-sync?
This is strange that the novice mode was on on the sqeuak-dev image. Can you check on your original image that it was the case? Can you also tell us what is the default browser? Stef On Mar 29, 2008, at 6:02 AM, David Finlayson wrote: I'm on vacation and learning Smalltalk is how I'm spending my evenings (family is young and goes to bed early). I downloaded a copy of Squeak by Example (Version 2008-3-10) and the latest squeak for OS X: Squeak3.9-7067mac vm 3.8.18beta1U With the recommended dev-image: sq3.9.1-7075dev08.03.1 Considering the date of the most recent update to the book, I was surprised (and very confused by) a number of major differences between the Squeak image described in the book and the one on my computer. I've waisted a lot of my spare time trying to figure out what the heck is going on. The main problems are differences between the World menu (completely reorganized, apparently), expert vs novice mode (no "Do it" in novice mode but this was the default mode) and what looks like some major changes in the System Browser (for example, the need for packages before defining a class, the lack of a second window for editing class comments, etc. Right now, I can't define a new method as described in Section 2.2 the method template doesn't show up when I click on -- all -- in the protocols pane. Doubtless it is user error, but I'd like to get back on track (maybe I downloaded something I shouldn't have?). Any suggestions? I checked the on-line errata for the book and it does not mention any of these interface changes I'm seeing. Thought that I would post here rather than waist more time flailing around. Sorry so long winded. David ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Design best practice : put state-independent methodsonclass side?
Hi ramon I agree with you. Now just without reading the complete thread, and for more complex situations here is my guideline to use singleton: I use one when I need one object "at a time" and not a single access point. Often people confuse time and access. If you can get rid of a singleton just by adding an iv to you domain and adding a reference to point to your "singleton" then it was not a singleton but a global object access. Is it difficult to write that in a mail, a good singleton is a object representing really the fact that you cannot have two objects of the same class at the same time. Stef On Mar 25, 2008, at 10:44 PM, Ramon Leon wrote: (forgot to copy the list) Classes are certainly well known, but not the only way to get a well known object. My pragmatic issue with using class side methods for Singletons is that it is a bunch of work to refactor the class side behavior to instance side later. Look at the original PWS server for a squeak specific example. Maybe it used to be, but it's a simple refactoring at the moment, refactor method >> move to instance side. Secondly, I'll worry about later... later, i.e. YAGNI, classes are nice singletons and it seems like useless work to manually implement a singleton when singleton is a built in feature. My design issue is that classes are for making instances (technically for defining behavior of instances). Making them the building block of the program means that I'm giving them extra responsibility. I like to keep the responsibility list as small as possible. Classes are objects too, just because most classes build instances doesn't mean they all have to. You might not want a class doing both, but I see no reason it can't do one *or* the other. Serving as a singleton works well when it's needed and keeps code simple. Saying a class should only create instances seems a rather arbitrary restriction to place upon your designs. (Someone walked off with my Design Patterns Smalltalk Companion, which wrote about these issues better than I can.) I'd love to see the arguments if you do recall them because so far, I just don't agree. Ramon Leon http://onsmalltalk.com ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Installation Scripts
note that if you use Monticello you always have all your packages stored in your defautl folder as a cache so you cannot lose anything if you publish on squeaksource, and do a backup of your disc since your cache will cotnain all your packages. stef On Mar 21, 2008, at 11:38 PM, Rob Rothwell wrote: Can someone give me a "primer" on writing installation scripts? I have trying to proactively prepare for disaster recovery, and am now able to do something like: packageCache:='C:\Documents and Settings\robr\My Documents\proj \squeak\development packages\'. Installer installFile: packageCache,'ODBC-rjriv.1.cs'. Which, of course, assumes that my packages are in a directory I can get to from my machine. However, I know other options are available to me, such as grabbing packages directly from the network and automating answers to any Requests. Any tips? Thanks, Rob ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [squeak-dev] Re: [Newbies] Seaside vs. AIDA
Rob have a look at the seaside mailing-list archive! I'm not sure that it is possible to get more support and feedback than there is **any** mailing-list. Stef On Mar 20, 2008, at 11:06 PM, Rob Rothwell wrote: Leon, I am both "new" to Smalltalk (been staring at an "empty" browser for a couple of years!) and to Aida, but believed in the ability of Smalltalk to be the right tool for the job to build some tools I need in a Healthcare Environment. I didn't know which to choose either! As a new Smalltalker, I couldn't understand Seaside to the point where I could figure out how things worked and how to do something with it WITHOUT following a tutorial line by line--and yet it felt very "meta-capable." Just beyond me! However, I have no doubt it can do great things. It just feels very theory-based for a newcomer. I felt like I HAD to understand web programming and HTML just to make it work. Aida, I got. Very down to earth. Almost like "PRINT 'Hello'". It seems to abstract the web aspect a little better (for me). While I still have to ask for help, I'm usually "almost there" on my own. It just seems to "make sense" to me. I think I have actually been able to turn a major Smalltalk learning curve because of Aida. I like the strong Model-View relationship it forces you to use, and, indeed, supports what I am calling the "Model-View-Design" triad whereby (if I actually knew more CSS) it is relatively straightforward to restyle your site separate from your view and from your model. (I am SURE Seaside does this too...again...how?!). I'm not trying to make a pitch either way, I just followed the "keep it simple" motto and went with what I could understand, and yet I still worry about my choice occasionally because of the very large Seaside bandwagon--Will there be more examples available? Will I be able to get more help with Seaside? All that stuff. I guess what I'm trying to say is that even if the objective facts pointed out that Seaside was better, smarter, faster...it still wouldn't work for ME right now because I can't make it work. Aida could be that way for you--I would go with whichever fits YOU better (or your team), because they both seem like mature products that will be around for a while. Rob On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 2:14 PM, Leon Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I don't want to start a war here, but I have been through the first steps with both Seaside and AIDA/Web, enough to build the start of a web site. Before I make the commitment to one or the other, I wonder if anyone has done a recent, objective comparison between the two ? They both seem very capable. I felt like I turned out a better looking product a little easier with AIDA, but I sense that Seaside has a much larger following. I also wonder if continuations are that important to me. They also have a great many similarities. To the point where I think I could change AIDA to use a lot of Seaside if not the other way around. Any real experiences between the two will be most appreciated. This is a major decision point for me. Leon -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/Seaside-vs.-AIDA-tp16185376p16185376.html Sent from the Squeak - Beginners mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
[Newbies] Re: [squeak-dev] [ANN] An Introduction to Seaside
Lukas and me are finishing also a seaside book (with David and Rick). It will be open-source and creative common based. It will be also published by squarebracket associates and available via lulu. Dear all, We would like to announce that we are about to publish an extended and improved version of our Seaside tutorial as a printed volume via Lulu. We plan the book "An Introduction to Seaside" to be finished by mid- April. Thanks to everyone who provided feedback and suggestions for improvement! Michael Perscheid on behalf of the HPI Software Architecture Group -- Psst! Geheimtipp: Online Games kostenlos spielen bei den GMX Free Games! http://games.entertainment.gmx.net/de/entertainment/games/free ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] TestFailure: Assertion failed in first practice from Squeak by Example
Hi Eric
On 10 déc. 07, at 21:48, Eric Eisaman wrote:
Hell Squeakers,
At home I went through the first half of the Squeak by Example
book. The guided practice went without a hitch however, when I
worked through the first practice of writing a simple String method
at work, on a different image, I ran into this problem. Why am I
receiving an 'Assertion failed' message?
testShout
self assert: ('oh no' shout = 'OH NO!')
where the shout method is defined?
In String?
shout
^ self asUppercase , '!'
TestFailure: Assertion failed
Regards,
Eric Eisaman
___
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Re: [Newbies] traits question
On 6 nov. 07, at 19:39, itsme213 wrote: Can method names be re-mapped when I apply a trait? How? you can use aliasing but it just introduce a new name for the method (it is not a rename sends are not renamed). Also, if yes, can the same trait be used multiple times to the came class (with different mappings)? No Thanks - Sophie ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
[Newbies] Re: Delete translations
On 23 oct. 07, at 16:00, Bert Freudenberg wrote: Per-package translation files can provide translations for a specific class category. This overrides the default translation file provided with the system. We are testing this with DrGeoII in fact, we made a DrGeoII.mo file and place that next to the etoys.mo file containing the system translations, and translations from the new file will get picked up for all classes in the DrGeoII-* categories. Ok I would have to really have a look to understand. With hilaire we always wanted to have translations attached to packages. This work is not finished and integrated yet, but supporting independent translations for add-on packages has been a design requirement from the beginning, since we do want to support those additions as well as possible. To get features like this into the squeak.org version, someone would have to take on the task of "harvesting" interesting things from the OLPC etoys update stream. yes I would like to do this task if I participate to the 3.11 Now I was wondering how I could keep tracks of this (besides reading the changesets) - Bert - On Oct 23, 2007, at 7:35 , stephane ducasse wrote: Bert How do you store the translations? Because it would be cool to get them per packages as ressources package. I know that OLPC does not have mc but it would be good for Squeak. I would like to see a merge or flow from OLPC new features to Squeak. What would be the process to make sure that nothing is lost for squeak? Stef Actually, we do not use NLT anymore for OLPC. We exported all translations to po files: https://translations.launchpad.net/etoys/first-deployment/+pots/ etoys This lets use use the "gettext" translation tools that are the standard in Linux. It is very easy to add languages, merge, etc, but I do not find how to delete one of them. Another question: Which is Babel function? Not sure what the question is. - Bert - ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Delete translations
Bert How do you store the translations? Because it would be cool to get them per packages as ressources package. I know that OLPC does not have mc but it would be good for Squeak. I would like to see a merge or flow from OLPC new features to Squeak. What would be the process to make sure that nothing is lost for squeak? Stef Actually, we do not use NLT anymore for OLPC. We exported all translations to po files: https://translations.launchpad.net/etoys/first-deployment/+pots/etoys This lets use use the "gettext" translation tools that are the standard in Linux. It is very easy to add languages, merge, etc, but I do not find how to delete one of them. Another question: Which is Babel function? Not sure what the question is. - Bert - ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Morphic event-handling confusion
could you sahre your result? May be publish it on Squeaksource.com? Stef On 18 mars 07, at 07:27, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks, I already got it working, which was in fact a very satisfying experience. My previous failure was using a "handlesMousedown" method, rather than "handlesMouseDown:evt" method. An important distinction. Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile -Original Message- From: Michael van der Gulik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2007 17:45:07 To:"A friendly place to get answers to even the most basic questions aboutSqueak." Subject: Re: [Newbies] Morphic event-handling confusion Max OrHai wrote: handlesMouseStillDown: evt ^ true mouseStillDown: evt self position: evt hand position. These apparently don't do anything. But, that's OK, because I can, as Bert suggested, just send "evt hand #grabMorph: self". Except, oops, that's NOT OK, because now mouseUp: apparently never gets sent to my Morph. So, I still need help. Thank you both very much. They "worked for me" - I was dragging a Morph around, and had readouts for the start and end positions of the dragging. Try making a completely fresh subclass of Morph with only the methods I suggested. I used Squeak 3.9. If I was going to implement momentum, I'd take the current position on mouseUp: and the position received by the very latest mouseStillDown:, and work out which vector the puck should travel in from that. I suppose you'd also need the times of those two events as well to calculate the velocity vector. Michael. ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Morphic event-handling confusion
here is an example of drag and drop and repel :) DragAndDropRepel.3.cs Description: Binary data Have fun On 15 mars 07, at 07:31, Max OrHai wrote: I'm trying to use Morphic, in Squeak 3.9, to make a very simple "physics model" I call a HockeyPuck. The idea is that it's a CircleMorph subclass that one should be able to pick up with the Hand and "throw", and have it bounce off the World edge (and then, hopefully, other such Pucks). I've got the "step" animation thing figured out pretty well, and I have some idea how to compute the motion and bounces and such, but I'm stumped as to how to properly handle the mouse events. On Eddie Cottongim's suggestion, at http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/2477 , I tried using "self on: #startDrag send: #beginThrow to: self" (in my initialize method) but that seems a little weird, and doesn't seem to allow the default dragging behavior to go through. I also tried the approach of overriding handlesMouseDown and mouseDown, and sending "super mouseDown" in the latter, but that doesn't seem to work any better, although it makes a little more sense to me. There's a two-step sequence of messages I'd like my Puck to receive while still doing the normal getting-moved-by-the-Hand stuff. The first is #beginThrow, to be sent either on a mouseDown or (preferably) on a startDrag event. The second is #endThrow, to be sent on the subsequent mouseUp. How can I make this happen? Thank you very much for your time. ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] BlockClosure>>fork problem
On 20 févr. 07, at 21:55, Bert Freudenberg wrote: On Feb 20, 2007, at 21:28 , George Herolyants wrote: Thanks for this answer, Ron. But actually I'm not confused with order in wich '1' and '2' presents in result line. I can't understand why in some cases this code results ten '1' and ten '2' and in some cases it results ten '2' and only nine '1'? Oh, that's indeed a bug. Transcript is unreliable when called from different processes. The mutex inside the Transcript only protects the change reporting but not the actual stream writing. Bert what do you mean by change reporting? Stef - Bert - ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Ralph Johnson video lectures on Smalltalk
The videos are copyrighted by the university so ralph cannot give them for free. Now he was teaching in VW and switched to Squeak recently Stef On 9 févr. 07, at 23:25, Michael Davies wrote: I've just found a link to a set of videos and lecture notes from Ralph Johnson's lectures on Smalltalk (based on VisualWorks I believe): http://st-www.cs.uiuc.edu/users/johnson/cs497/notes98/online- course.html The lecture notes are accessible, but the video links seem to be dead. Does anyone know if they are still accessible anywhere? ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] I want my old adult Squeak back
Do not say it too loud! We should not have fun we are serious programmers. Real programmers like complex languages. :) Stef On 20 janv. 07, at 16:37, Henry Lenzi wrote: On 1/20/07, stephane ducasse <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Don't let kids play with Squeak! This is an adult software! Stef We also have your "robot factory" installed, Stephane. :-)) Last night I taught her looping, and she learned about variables, too. We had great fun! Cheers, Henry ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] I want my old adult Squeak back
Don't let kids play with Squeak! This is an adult software! Stef On 19 janv. 07, at 22:42, Henry Lenzi wrote: Hi all -- My old adult Squeak has gone! My niece has been fooling around with it. I'd like to have my flap with all the standard adult smalltalk tools in it. Even my World menu looks different. Any ideas? TIA. Henry ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Frequency of saving changes to Monticello?
In Squeak, the system logs ***every*** code you edit and compile. You can have a look at what you did by opening the "recover last changes" So normally you should never lose any code. Now it is a good practice to commit each time you broke and fix your test. Usually I write tests (red), then make them green and commit. :) But this is in the great days of hacking. Stef On 10 janv. 07, at 19:28, Grant Rettke wrote: Hi, With Subversion the motto is "commit frequently". I commit after nearly every change, no matter how small. What is the motto/approach/style for committing to Monticello your changes to your classes? Regards, Grant ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Creating a Form Editor
instance methods are sent to objects: ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) x x is an instance method sent to a point @ is an instance method sent to 10 Now have a look at the class side (press the button class) on the class Form apparently there is a method extent: aPoint This method is a method that will be executed when a class receives the message extent: Not that conceptually Form new extent: aPoint apparently there is no instance method name extent: but if you try (Form new setExtent: [EMAIL PROTECTED] depth: 1) you will get a form but set* may indicate that this is a method that you should not direcly invoke (as explained in the book of Beck or Smalltalk by Example) Stef On 5 janv. 07, at 05:56, Bruce Prior wrote: Hi Squeakers, I have been reading Adele Goldberg's classic text, "Smalltalk-80 The Interactive Programming Environment," and came across this in Chapter 7, "How to make Pictures." Adele states, "Create a Form Editor by evaluating an expression of the form, (Form new extent: 300 @ 400) edit" It didn't work for me in Squeak 3.8 (on my Macintosh). Further down, Adele says, "The message edit can be sent to any instance of Form." But when I checked with my browser I found that Form has a class method extent: but not an instance method extent:. So I tried (Form extent: 300 @ 400) edit and the Form Editor appeared as desired. Is this because Smalltalk and Squeak are different somehow, or is there a mistake in the text, or? Squeak has 26 years more :) If the text is correct, then I still don't fully appreciate the difference between class and instance methods. Bruce Prior (still looking for "ah - ha!" and I think it's close) ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Squeak speed under Mac OS X
note that there is one patch missing in 3.9 for font caching. Stef On 3 janv. 07, at 16:18, Stephen Austin wrote: What version of Squeak are you using? I found the DejaVu fonts made the GUI unusably slow using 3.8 - I haven't tried them in 3.9, and I don't know if this problem has been resolved. But out of the box both 3.8 and 3.9 are very fast, and I get nowhere near 100% CPU load. (Another) Steve On 1/3/07, Aleksandr Skobelev <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: ... And I see that GUI responsiveness is too low and the such basic operations as changing a window size or moving it (with fastDragWindowForMorphic disaibled) load CPU upto 100%. And after I've installed DejaVu fonts, I need to wait upto 4 seconds everytime I change size of the SqueakMap Package Loader window. ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] How to persist my preferences?
You can save a little class with some class method and invoke your change MySetup install. And you can version that in MC. Note that you could use the class initialization initialize method (which is automatically invoked when the class is loaded) but pay attention that reloading in MC does not execute class initialize methods if they are already in the image. Stef On 2 janv. 07, at 00:34, Grant Rettke wrote: Hi, I've tweaked my font settings and other preferences. How do I persist those to a file for if I want to reapply them to a fresh image? Regards, Grant ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Monticell or Changesets?
Monticello! We manage everything (even if we got some problems with managing squeak itself) I think that for system build with monticello (ie not monolithic such as Squeak) you will get no problem. Have a look inside there is a short presentation http://stephane.ducasse.free.fr/Teaching/CoursAnnecy/0506-M1-OOP/ OOPAvance.pdf you can also watch my videos at http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~ducasse/ Videos/ Stef On 1 janv. 07, at 19:57, Grant Rettke wrote: Hi, Coming from Subversion I'm trying to understand if I should be learning Monticello, Changesets, or both, for version control. Please advise. Regards, Grant ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] transferring .image from mac to pc
Hi jacob I do not understand what you are doing. Normally try to do the following. Close the file list or other tools that would be point to a file in one of your machine. Zip the image and the change file (do not rename them). Tranfer the files and drop the image ont he vm. It should work. I did all the image and distribution for my book on a mac and for pc I just include another VM on the zip file. Stef On 28 déc. 06, at 17:33, jacob remin wrote: yes, the copy was drag-and-drop via USB stick. the versions im running are: for windows: Squeak3.9-final-7067.image for mac: squeak3.8-6665full.image this is information from the file names... where can i actually see the build/version information? i think its quite peculiar that the crash.dmp writes: "Version: Squeak 3.7.1 (release) from Sep 23 2004", since this version was not involved at any point? i see now that the latest stable version is 3.7.1. is it better to stick to that one, when just starting out? best, /j Kyle Hamilton wrote: If you did a drag-and-drop file copy, it's unlikely that any conversion would take place. What are the versions and builds of the VMs you're using on the Mac and Windows? -Kyle H On 12/28/06, jacob remin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: what do you mean? i have just copied the files from one computer to the other. can any convertion happen during that action? /j Kyle Hamilton wrote: > Make sure that you transfer the file without converting carriage > returns to CRLF -- i.e., in binary mode, not text mode. > > -Kyle H > ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] indenting code
You can find some hints in the book of kent Beck Best smalltalk practices. He stresses the idea to have recognizable block. I like the following. Damien Pollet did Gutenberg a new pretty printer for squeak. Giving him feedback is the best way to see it improved. fooMethod "my comment" (self foo) ifTrue: [ self bar ] barMethod "my comment" (self foo) ifTrue: [ self bar. self grumbleAtBit. self done ] ifFalse: [] ... ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] >> notation
Dave normally >> is not part of a method definition. Just the what is after it. in the browser. >> is used by authors to give contextual information. Now in Squeak you can do Point>>#x to get the compiled method x of class Point but this is query the meta information of classes. Stef On 30 nov. 06, at 06:32, Another Dave wrote: (nil asTraitComposition) print it returns a MessageNotUnderstood dialog. (Object>>#doesNotUnderstand:) print it returns a System Window (3891), and a CompiledMethod dialog. I'm probably being too literal, or too dense? -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/%3E%3E-notation- tf2729086.html#a7613900 Sent from the Squeak - Beginners mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] fromClass: including Traits in Squeak 3.9g ?
TTrait named: #TPoint
fromClass: Point
includeSuperUnit: nil
uses: {}
category: 'Traits-Temp'
The authors say "When generating a trait from an existing class,
the system automatically replaces instance variable accesses
through accessor methods."
Moreover they say the class serves as a source.
I'm one of the authors and this features was experimental and since
adrian rewrote entirely traits to have them
much better implemented we did not provide that functionality but it
should be easy to reimplement with a bit of metaprog magic.
But we will not do it because too busy.
Exactly the same thing I would like to do in Squeak 3.9final, too.
But I don't know how to do it.
If the people, who are doing the research on Traits, included this
functionality in March 2003, why isn't there in 2006 ?
Because in march 2003 we were brainstorming and nathanael hacked and
pacthed squeak to make traits worked. and in 2006
everything was reimplemented and this is much better. :)
Stef
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Re: [Newbies] including Traits in Squeak 3.9g ?
How can I create a trait from a class in Squeak 3.9 final ?
What do you mean?
If this is taking a class and turning it into a trait. Basically you
cannot. It was never the case or I do not understand what
you mean.
In previous version I could use e.g. "fromClass: Class1".
(http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~schaerli/smalltalk/traits/
traitsPrototype.htm)
In 3.9 final this message is not recognized anymore.
Best regards,
Warakorn
stephane ducasse <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Traits are in
3.9 final.
Stef
On 18 nov. 06, at 01:25, Warakorn Paphrawat wrote:
> Hi !
>
> I would like to work with Traits in Squeak 3.9g, too.
> The current VM and Image run very stabble.
>
> The Traits researcher form Bern provide an image 3.9a where Traits
> are included. But this image is terribly unstable and I am
> accustomed now to 3.9g.
> I want to port the Traits functionality to Squeal 3.9g.
> How can I do that ?
>
> The thing is, I read that Traits are included in Squeak 3.9g. I can
> find the Trait classes and categories. But I cannot create
> Traits...the Browser doesn't recognize the term Trait oder named or
> fromClass
> e.g.
> Trait named: #TsomeTrait
> fromClass: someClass
> uses: {something}
> category: 'some_category'
>
> SqueakMap always complains when I want to install Traits.
> I read sth. about loading .mcz files, but the FileList Browser
> doesn't let me to load.
>
> What can I do to make it work ?
> Sponsored Link
>
> $200,000 mortgage for $660/mo - 30/15 yr fixed, reduce debt, home
> equity - Click now for info
>
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Re: [Newbies] including Traits in Squeak 3.9g ?
Traits are in 3.9 final.
Stef
On 18 nov. 06, at 01:25, Warakorn Paphrawat wrote:
Hi !
I would like to work with Traits in Squeak 3.9g, too.
The current VM and Image run very stabble.
The Traits researcher form Bern provide an image 3.9a where Traits
are included. But this image is terribly unstable and I am
accustomed now to 3.9g.
I want to port the Traits functionality to Squeal 3.9g.
How can I do that ?
The thing is, I read that Traits are included in Squeak 3.9g. I can
find the Trait classes and categories. But I cannot create
Traits...the Browser doesn't recognize the term Trait oder named or
fromClass
e.g.
Trait named: #TsomeTrait
fromClass: someClass
uses: {something}
category: 'some_category'
SqueakMap always complains when I want to install Traits.
I read sth. about loading .mcz files, but the FileList Browser
doesn't let me to load.
What can I do to make it work ?
Sponsored Link
$200,000 mortgage for $660/mo - 30/15 yr fixed, reduce debt, home
equity - Click now for info
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Re: [Newbies] Question on where the new method is define
On 15 nov. 06, at 01:37, Mitt Cooper wrote: I'm very new to smalltalk and squeak. I'm having trouble understanding where/how is the "new" method is defined. I was messing around with morphs; I tried CurveMorph new. CurveMorph new openInWorld Nothing happened so I started walking back through the parents of CurveMorph looking for the method "new". I got all the way to the top (ProtoObject) and to my bewilderment... no "new". I used the method finder and found the "new" method in the Behavoir class. How are these related? It seems like something with a class being a real object and descending from behavior, but I can't seem to wrap my mind around that. Any help and insights would be appreciated. Have a look at: http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~scg/Teaching/Smalltalk/index.html in understanding metaclasses Thanks. ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Disappointed
Hi jeff Not everybody read this mailing-list. So post also in squeak-dev your question. And people are also busy. BTW: you should have repeated your question Stef PS: I read nearly 120 mails per day and I have to reply to 25% at least. On 8 nov. 06, at 06:28, Jeff wrote: I'm pretty disappointed with this list at the moment. My last post, "beginners questions" talked about how beginners often don't get their questions answered and pointed out that often when the experts see that an answer, ANY answer, was given they then assume the question was answered, so they don't offer anything more. Now I do appreciate Matthias's honest attempt to answer the question, so I don't want this to be misconstrued as an attack on him. But he obviously misread it. And, well, once people saw that the question of how to make a wonderland actor move in response to mouse clicks had been answered, I didn't get any more help. The question I asked was how to move a wonderland actor with the arrow keys, and I need to do that without the actor having the focus. Unfortunately, since it's been taking so many hours for the messages I've tried to send to get posted on here, (I think I had screwed up joining the list somehow, and redid it so hopefully that problem is solved), it took me a full day to get my question asked and now another full day to explain that the answer I got was to a different question. By the by, I've been spending about 10 hours a day for 5 days now trying to solve this problem. It's getting quite frustrating for me and making me want to give up on squeak. No banners. No pop-ups. No kidding. Make My Way your home on the Web - http://www.myway.com ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Disappointed
On 8 nov. 06, at 07:10, Andrew Burton wrote: Jeff wrote: I'm pretty disappointed with this list at the moment. For what it's worth: I wish I could help you. At the moment, I'm pretty puzzled/stumped by Squeak myself. I started getting into this in an attempt to wrap my head around Croquet by wrapping my head around Squeak. At the moment I've had to go back and start over by wrapping my head around Smalltalk. (Which isn't even talking about real life stuff; trying to learn Smalltalk while working with PHP and Perl during the day is a great way to forget everything you've learned the night before.) may be the best is to try seaside in that case :) I've just about got objects down, and hopefully will get to the Wonderland stuff this weekend. If I find anything useful regarding keyboard controls, I'll be sure to post! (Though, I get the feeling you're likely to figure it out before I even start on Wonderland.) Good luck. -- Andrew Burton [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://utilitarian.us - A Guide to Esoteric Technology in Paragon City http://jarodrussell.livejournal.com/ - Take a guess. ;) ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] The Path From eToys To Squeak To SmallTalk - Or The Other Way
Thanks I hope to restart to work on the next one... http://smallwiki.unibe.ch/botsinc/ On 6 nov. 06, at 00:13, Gene Venable wrote: I'm enjoying "Squeak: Learn Programming with Robots," by Stephane Ducasse. It certainly seems to be a decent place to start. - Original Message From: Greg Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org Sent: Sunday, November 5, 2006 2:44:37 PM Subject: [Newbies] The Path From eToys To Squeak To SmallTalk - Or The Other Way I've been a would be programmer for many years. I'm one of those people who just "does not get it". I understand things like eToys and other visual "programming" environments but have much difficulty making the transition to true programming languages, since they are not visual and usually not very natural, (intuitive), to a visual thinker. I know that learning SmallTalk would be the next step for me, but there does not seem to be any documentation for the absolute beginner who knows nothing about programming and programming terminology, (classes, methods, functions, etc.). Since SmallTalk makes its claim of being a _/truly/_ object oriented language, and it is at the heart of Squeak, it makes sense for me to move in that direction. Where does the complete beginner begin with SmallTalk? Too bad that eToys doesn't take the exercise a step further and also take the user from visual programmatic thinking into visual programmatic programming, with learning SmallTalk as its goal. Thank you, Greg Smith ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] squeak wiki software
Thanks keith this is was what missing to Pier. ESUg was planning to ask lukas and netstyle for some features (back end) and to give it to the community. But these guys are working too much :) Stef On 24 oct. 06, at 17:56, keith hodges wrote: Hi Gary, I have uploaded a preloaded image for pier. It is available on www.squeak.org site in the downloads section. Now that most of the features of pier can be controlled via a web- gui I think that it is ready to have a go and see what you think. 1. gui for creating and renaming pier instances. 2. gui for managing users and groups. 3. gui for switching persistency schemes. (Null by default). 4. Clickable text scripts for starting and stopping the server (you can edit the scripts to change the port) Just download and go, should be less than 3 mins install time! If you wish to customise the stylesheet then there is a how-to provided with the image. One known issue is that if you have any problems with this image freezing inexplicably then use a 3.6 VM. (this appears to be a problem with my specific linux instalation) Do let us know how you get on. Why not join the smallwiki mailing list. best regards Keith Send instant messages to your online friends http:// uk.messenger.yahoo.com ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] squeak wiki software
use swiki for now pier is not ready for 3min install. :) Stef On 23 oct. 06, at 22:14, Gary Frederick wrote: Howdy all, I just started using squeak. I am interested in running a squeak wiki on a Linux server. I see that there are various versions that I can install. Can I get some input on the benefits of using swiki, pier and any other choices? We will be using the wiki to collaborate with kids that are learning about computers. Gary ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] please help
so there are french teacher teaching langages that they do not understand... really strange. Can you tell us more? where are you? There are lot of books on web about smalltalk that you can read and there is even a french book on squeak and free columns so you can get a lot of information. Look at my web page http://www.univ-savoie.fr/Portail/Groupes/LISTIC/membres/ Stephane.Ducasse/index.html Stef On 13 oct. 06, at 16:30, Jerem' wrote: Hi , we're french guys and , at school , we're just learning "Squeak" > > and searching some examples to help us. > > > > Our teachers doesn't know this language that's why we ask it to you !! > > > > Would you be so kind as to send us a little script of a squeak > > application!! > > > > Remenber we're novices Thankfully > > ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Question about inheritance
Hi dennis two points: - aClass new returns an instance of that class - super represents the receiver of the message but the lookup of the method in the superclass of the class that contains the super call. Once the method is found it is applied to the original receiver. So now Monster class>> new ^ super new initialize is executed when you do Monster new what is the receiver of the message new => Monster. So super new is looked up in the super class of Monster and once found applied on Monster, then point 1 makes that you get back an instance of the receiver of the message new. Stef On 13 oct. 06, at 15:57, dennis petrocelli wrote: Greetings smalltalkers, I'm a newbie trying to get my head around inheritance. I'm puzzled by the following example. It seems to do what I mean, but not what I type ;) This is a good thing, but I'd get further if I understood the semantics a bit better. from http://www.cosc.canterbury.ac.nz/wolfgang.kreutzer/cosc205/ smalltalk1.html Class: Monster Superclass: Object Category: Sesame Street Instance variables: colour tummy initialization initialize self colour: #green. self tummy: Bag new "There is only a single class method and no class variables." creation new ^ super new initialize What I don't understand is this: Monster new returns an instance of Monster, what you'd want it to. But Monster new executes "^ super new" which to my mind should return an instance of Object, not Monster. Just to confuse myself further, I typed: Monster superclass new and got an Object. It seems to me that "super new" and "superclass new" should do the same thing. Any points to clarify my confusion would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Dennis Petrocelli Do you Yahoo!? Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail. ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Question about inheritance
On 13 oct. 06, at 16:22, Lukas Renggli wrote: Any points to clarify my confusion would be greatly appreciated. This is an interesting question that is often asked at exams ;-) :-) Dennis who is your prof :) Stef ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
[Newbies] Using MessageTally primer by andreas
https://lists.wisc.edu/read/messages?id=1411189 ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] SqueakSource vs SqueakMap
SqueakSource = Sourceforge Squeakmap = catalog to deploy app So use SqueakSource and MC to develop with multiple people and you can deploy if you want using SqueakMap Stef On 2 oct. 06, at 20:51, Simon Guest wrote: Hi, Please could someone characterise the different intended use of SqueakSource.com as compared with SqueakMap? Is SqueakMap now a legacy thing, and new projects should be done in Monticello format on SqueakSource? cheers, Simon ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Squeak for kids - eToys, Scratch, Alice ?
http://smallwiki.unibe.ch/botsinc but more for 9 or 10 stef On 2 oct. 06, at 16:15, itsme213 wrote: What are the options to get kids (7-10) using Squeak? I have see eToys, Scratch, Alice. Are there others? Any recommendations on which to choose? I want something that they can start with easily, but that will grow with them at least for a while. Thanks. ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Changing system fonts without reopening windows
so far I do not think so but this is not a technical problem just that nobody spent the time to do it. On 25 sept. 06, at 18:13, Petr Fischer wrote: Hi, is it possible to change system fonts without closing and reopening active windows (browsers, monticelo, sticked menus, transcript...)? If I change "rounding window corners" option, window corners are redrawn immediately on all opened windows. Thanks, pf ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] RE: Why Squeak is so sloooow?
can you report that on squeak-dev? On 21 sept. 06, at 21:07, David Shaffer wrote: Milan Zimmermann wrote: On 2006 September 21 11:55, David Shaffer wrote: You're certainly right Brad but let me add that the Squeak 3.9 image is unbearably slow on my linux-based laptop (2Ghz Pentium 4M, 1Gb RAM). I've even tried VM's from 3.8 to Ian's recent 3.9 release. It is too slow for simple window operations and causes a gastly amount of CPU utilization even under lite GUI use. David, This is suprising, on my: - old Athlon 2400 - SuSE9.3 - VM Squeak3.9alpha of 4 July 2005 [latest update: #7021], - latest 3.9 gama 7058 image - 1280x960 I was just recently thinking "this is best speed I have seen since 3.7". When doing simple windows operations (moving around, resizing etc) top reports below 30%, always for a very brief period when doing the work (typically below 20%). [EMAIL PROTECTED] ~/Squeak/Squeak3.9g-7055 $ squeak -version 3.9-7 #1 Mon Sep 4 17:01:02 EDT 2006 gcc 3.4.6 Squeak3.9alpha of 4 July 2005 [latest update: #7021] Linux localhost 2.6.17-gentoo-r4 #1 PREEMPT Thu Aug 24 18:31:06 EDT 2006 i686 Mobile Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 - M CPU 2.00GHz GNU/Linux default plugin location: /usr/local/lib/squeak/3.9-7/*.so Yoshiki's test (higlight, alt-p) | a b | a := FloatArray new: (16 * 1024*1024). b := FloatArray new: (16 * 1024*1024). [a += b] timeToRun. 268 Under 3.9g-7055 I get numbers in the hundreds. Average of about 157 ms. David or Antonio, if you would like to compare: (higlight, alt-p) [ 1 to: 10 do: [ :i | XYPlotter example1 plot asMorph openInWorld. XYPlotter example2 plot asMorph openInWorld. XYPlotter example3 plot asMorph openInWorld. XYPlotter example4 plot asMorph openInWorld. XYPlotter example5 plot asMorph openInWorld. XYPlotter example6 plot asMorph openInWorld. ] ] timeToRun. ===> RESULT 17295 (hardware as above) There is no XYPlotter in my 3.9g-7055 image. I tried loading Plot Morph and Plot Morph 2 from SqueakMap. Neither worked so I'm guessing that's not the source of this class for 3.9. I'd be happy to run this benchmark on the off chance it will lead to some information about why things are sluggish. I'm guessing, though, that it is a dead-end. "feels slow" is often hard to track down in benchmarks. Probably something that does window manipulation would reveal the problem... David ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] RE: Why Squeak is so sloooow?
Hi antonio You should pay attention that some aspects of morphic are slow. Lot of events are generated Now squeak is reasonably fast (much faster than python and ruby in general). Can you tell us more about the kind of game you want to build. You can also use VisualWorks non commercial which is quite fast. Stef On 21 sept. 06, at 17:22, Antonio San. wrote: I haven't any game, indeed I'm going to look for a good environment for game-develop learning ... and I think that squeak could be a very very useful project for spending efforts and time. But I have done the test with the "games" inside squeak: BouncingAtoms and Blob. Only 1 BouncingAtoms and 3 Blobs are enough for getting an important slowdown in all objets in the screen (Centrino 1.8 Ghz with 512Mb RAM) It would be interesting check if the high CPU use continues when you enter in an other project giving in background blobs working. But I don't know how to do that, because when I enter in an other project blobs stop. PD. How can I do for getting my reply under the same topic in the list and not in other thread? Hi Antonio, Do you have any of these games to test? I have been using Squeak on Linux without any slowness problem. Cheers, Offray __ LLama Gratis a cualquier PC del Mundo. Llamadas a fijos y móviles desde 1 céntimo por minuto. http://es.voice.yahoo.com ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] RE: Why Squeak is so sloooow?
Hi david this is really strange because 3.9 is much snappier than 3.8 on our machines. This is strange. Do you use a special settings (such as some strange smallland setup?) Stef On 21 sept. 06, at 17:55, David Shaffer wrote: Brad Fuller wrote: Maybe you should do some proper scientific tests on your specific needs. What type of game are you going to create? You're certainly right Brad but let me add that the Squeak 3.9 image is unbearably slow on my linux-based laptop (2Ghz Pentium 4M, 1Gb RAM). I've even tried VM's from 3.8 to Ian's recent 3.9 release. It is too slow for simple window operations and causes a gastly amount of CPU utilization even under lite GUI use. Antonio might be reflecting on this same perception of slowness and frankly I'm sure that any amount of "proper scientific testing" is going to reveal that it feels like walking though mud ;-) Anyway I'm still using a 3.7 image for development. Nice and snappy. David ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Problems with do:
this is what I thought but I did not dare changing the code :) ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Problems with do:
this is free mathieu. This is a pattern. Use it :) stef On 17 sept. 06, at 19:51, Mathieu wrote: Ralph Johnson a écrit : You could do something like [aFileStream atEnd] whileFalse: [line := aFileStream nextLine. Transcipt show: line: cr.] Alternatively, you could convert your stream of characters into a stream of lines. I described something similar in http://wiki.cs.uiuc.edu/PatternStories/FunWithStreams but it created a stream of words instead of a stream of lines. Read that, and you should be able to make a LineStream pretty easily. -Ralph Johnson ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners Thanks Very cool :) Do you mind if I use it for reading token in the NewCompiler? Math ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] re: final image
If you need material to teach smalltalk just ask! You can already have all my lecture in full access but if you need the source just ask Stef On 17 sept. 06, at 18:23, Chuck Smith wrote: Thanks Stephane will do. I can really teach with the help this list provides. Thanks All Chuck Smith ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] problems with SqueakMap account
Hi dave I'm sure that goran will reply and help you. Now I suggest you to use monticello and squeaksoruce to manage your code have a look at my video to get a step by step video of the process http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~ducasse/Videos/ Stef On 14 sept. 06, at 01:51, Dave Raymer wrote: Gentlebeings, I'm not sure if this is the correct place for this question ... but given that I'm a Squeak beginner it seems like the first place to start. I've tried to create a SqueakMap account, and much like building a castle in a swamp -- it fell over. That is, I got a simple "an error has occurred" message. So I tried it again, and guess what, it fell over too. I am now the proud owner of 2 SqueakMap accounts for which I never received the initial login email. I tried the 'mainteiners' [sic] link -- but got an email in spanish that seemed to indicate that the email address for the 'mainteiners' was not good (but my spanish is rotten ...). Any suggestions or guidance would be greatly appreciated. br, Dave ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Re: [Newbies] Monticello -- where is it?
have a look at my videos: http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~ducasse/Videos/ they show step by step how to create a package and publish code on sqeuaksource using Monticello stef On 12 sept. 06, at 18:08, Aleksej wrote: Hello May be a silly question. The are about hundred classes in "Monticello-xxx" categories. But how to use it? What is "Monticello browser" and how to run it? Good luck. Aleksej ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners ___ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
