Re: CFMail Alternatives
How do you handle undeliverable mail. I have been doing it manually, but it is time to automate it.. Is there a regex that can break out the ones that have to be deleted vs. the ones that just are temporarily down? Here are a few samples of what I mean: these can be deleted: Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 551 not our customer Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 5.1.1 [EMAIL PROTECTED]... User unknown Failed Recipient:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 Requested action not taken: mailbox unavailable Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 554 delivery error: dd This user doesn't have a yahoo.com account ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [0] - mta651.mail.mud.yahoo.com But these have to be looked into: Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 550 Dynamic/zombied/spam IPs blocked. Write [EMAIL PROTECTED] Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 Account temporarily suspended due to inactivity. User must login to reactivate mailbox Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 This user's mailbox is full ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) - Try again later Note that code 550 sometimes means no such user and other times means that we are being blocked.. they should have a standard coding system to make it easy:) At 11:44 PM 10/17/2008, Matt Robertson wrote: as maddening as it is, fast mail is a problem as opposed to a solution it seems. I've used a mail trickler to get around this for years. http://mysecretbase.com/Slowing_Down_CFMail_2004.cfm It is far from perfect, but it works. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Janitor, The Robertson Team ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314087 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CFMail Alternatives
This is how I did it about a year ago... http://jeremiahx.com/2007/08/12/how-to-email-bounce-management/ -J.J. On Sat, Oct 18, 2008 at 7:59 AM, Al Musella, DPM [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How do you handle undeliverable mail. I have been doing it manually, but it is time to automate it.. Is there a regex that can break out the ones that have to be deleted vs. the ones that just are temporarily down? Here are a few samples of what I mean: these can be deleted: Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 551 not our customer Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 5.1.1 [EMAIL PROTECTED]... User unknown Failed Recipient:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 Requested action not taken: mailbox unavailable Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 554 delivery error: dd This user doesn't have a yahoo.com account ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [0] - mta651.mail.mud.yahoo.com But these have to be looked into: Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 550 Dynamic/zombied/spam IPs blocked. Write [EMAIL PROTECTED] Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 Account temporarily suspended due to inactivity. User must login to reactivate mailbox Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 This user's mailbox is full ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) - Try again later Note that code 550 sometimes means no such user and other times means that we are being blocked.. they should have a standard coding system to make it easy:) At 11:44 PM 10/17/2008, Matt Robertson wrote: as maddening as it is, fast mail is a problem as opposed to a solution it seems. I've used a mail trickler to get around this for years. http://mysecretbase.com/Slowing_Down_CFMail_2004.cfm It is far from perfect, but it works. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Janitor, The Robertson Team ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314088 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4
RE: CFMail Alternatives
Check out Boogiebounce - http://www.boogietools.com We use it with iMS mailserver. Helge -Original Message- From: Al Musella, DPM [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 18. oktober 2008 14:59 To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CFMail Alternatives How do you handle undeliverable mail. I have been doing it manually, but it is time to automate it.. Is there a regex that can break out the ones that have to be deleted vs. the ones that just are temporarily down? Here are a few samples of what I mean: these can be deleted: Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 551 not our customer Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 5.1.1 [EMAIL PROTECTED]... User unknown Failed Recipient:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 Requested action not taken: mailbox unavailable Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 554 delivery error: dd This user doesn't have a yahoo.com account ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [0] - mta651.mail.mud.yahoo.com But these have to be looked into: Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 550 Dynamic/zombied/spam IPs blocked. Write [EMAIL PROTECTED] Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 Account temporarily suspended due to inactivity. User must login to reactivate mailbox Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 This user's mailbox is full ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) - Try again later Note that code 550 sometimes means no such user and other times means that we are being blocked.. they should have a standard coding system to make it easy:) At 11:44 PM 10/17/2008, Matt Robertson wrote: as maddening as it is, fast mail is a problem as opposed to a solution it seems. I've used a mail trickler to get around this for years. http://mysecretbase.com/Slowing_Down_CFMail_2004.cfm It is far from perfect, but it works. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Janitor, The Robertson Team ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314089 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CFMail Alternatives
Al Musella, DPM wrote: Note that code 550 sometimes means no such user and other times means that we are being blocked.. they should have a standard coding system to make it easy:) We have a standard system. From RFC 2822: 5yz Permanent Negative Completion reply The command was not accepted and the requested action did not occur. The SMTP client is discouraged from repeating the exact request (in the same sequence). (..) x5z Mail system: These replies indicate the status of the receiver mail system vis-a-vis the requested transfer or other mail system action. (..) 550 Requested action not taken: mailbox unavailable (e.g., mailbox not found, no access, or command rejected for policy reasons) So in both cases the action your server requested from the other server is rejected and you are requested not to try it again. Jochem ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314096 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CFMail Alternatives
True, but in the case of : Failed Recipient: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reason: Remote host said: 550 550 Dynamic/zombied/spam IPs blocked. Write [EMAIL PROTECTED] I don't want to delete this person from my newsletter automatically.. I want to be made aware of the situation and correct it, then resend the newsletter. The newsletter I send has potentially life saving information (it is a brain cancer newsletter and there are a lot of exciting things happening in that field right now!) By the way - the people at earthlink are very nice.. You write to them, they reply with an autoresponder, then you reply back to that and a real person responds quickly and they unblocked us. My point is that there should be a 500 code only for permanent errors. The spam blocking thing should be a different code. At 02:34 PM 10/18/2008, you wrote: So in both cases the action your server requested from the other server is rejected and you are requested not to try it again. ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314098 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CFMail Alternatives
Are there any side effects to turn off the spooler? How does it treat the mail then? Does it just send it directly to the mail server each time the cfmail tag is processed? -Original Message- From: Mike Chabot [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, October 17, 2008 12:52 AM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CFMail Alternatives If you are certain that the ColdFusion spooling process is the source of the slowness then turn off that feature. -Mike Chabot On Fri, Oct 17, 2008 at 12:03 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes I am sure it is the spooler. I sit there and watch it. -Original Message- From: Raymond Camden [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2008 9:33 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CFMail Alternatives Are you sure it is the spooler? All you said was that it took a long for mail to get delivered. The slowdown could be anywhere. On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 5:57 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think it would be much more cost effective to buy a mail tag than to shell out the $ for Enterprise though. Even if you tell it to use different mail servers it is still using the CF spooler. My mail server isn't the issue the cf spooler is :( ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314049 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CFMail Alternatives
How can I control sending mail to the cf spooler or not from the cfmail tag itself? This seems like it would be the best option. -Original Message- From: Mike Chabot [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2008 10:19 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CFMail Alternatives I worked on a site that sent many hundreds of thousands of emails every day using CF 7 Enterprise and it was fine. The thing we had to do though was to use two different mail servers, one optimized for immediate mail delivery, like new account setup emails, and one optimized for bulk newsletter emails. When we only had one mail server it would get bogged down during the mass emails and the emails that people expected to receive immediately got delayed. The mail server was the bottleneck. You can configure CF so that it doesn't spool emails by unchecking the box in CFAdmin, if you think spooling is the problem as opposed to the speed of the mail server. I personally like the spooling feature. You can also override the settings in CFAdmin in a cfmail tag, so maybe the mass mails use the spooler and others get sent directly to the mail server. Maybe the hard drive speed is the spooling bottleneck and that an alternative won't be any faster because it would be subject to the same bottleneck. It is hard to tell. -Mike Chabot On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 6:57 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think it would be much more cost effective to buy a mail tag than to shell out the $ for Enterprise though. Even if you tell it to use different mail servers it is still using the CF spooler. My mail server isn't the issue the cf spooler is :( -Original Message- From: Raymond Camden [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2008 5:54 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CFMail Alternatives Last I heard, CF Enterprise could send an insane amount of email very quickly. I think maybe 50k per hour? I don't think 10k would be a problem. Of course, what about using multiple mail servers? You can have one client use mail server x, another one use y, etc. On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 4:40 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have clients with large newsletters and if more than 1 of them send them at a time it could potentially send over 10k emails to the cfmail spooler. So naturally I have other clients that are complaining about how long it takes the mail to get delivered. I know there are alternatives out there to CFMAIL so does anyone out there have experience with them? I need something that can send mail in bulk to my mail server. ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314050 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4
Re: CFMail Alternatives
The cfmail attribute is spoolenable=no which you set for emails that should go out immediately with no spooling delay. It would help if you sent these emails to a server that is set up to handle instant email delivery. If you have one mail server that is handling bulk emails, company emails, and real-time site emails, then that email server could get backed up and the instant delivery won't work the way you want. With this option turned off it sends the email directly to the mail server. Most mail servers have a configurable spool/queue feature of their own. A downside with turning off CF spooling is there is less protection if something goes wrong. If the mail server goes offline and you have CF spooling turned on, all the emails accumulate and you can easily respool them. Without this protection, if the mail server is offline I believe CF would throw an error without retaining a copy of the email that it failed to send. This is an assumption. -Mike Chabot On Fri, Oct 17, 2008 at 12:25 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How can I control sending mail to the cf spooler or not from the cfmail tag itself? This seems like it would be the best option. -Original Message- From: Mike Chabot [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2008 10:19 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CFMail Alternatives I worked on a site that sent many hundreds of thousands of emails every day using CF 7 Enterprise and it was fine. The thing we had to do though was to use two different mail servers, one optimized for immediate mail delivery, like new account setup emails, and one optimized for bulk newsletter emails. When we only had one mail server it would get bogged down during the mass emails and the emails that people expected to receive immediately got delayed. The mail server was the bottleneck. You can configure CF so that it doesn't spool emails by unchecking the box in CFAdmin, if you think spooling is the problem as opposed to the speed of the mail server. I personally like the spooling feature. You can also override the settings in CFAdmin in a cfmail tag, so maybe the mass mails use the spooler and others get sent directly to the mail server. Maybe the hard drive speed is the spooling bottleneck and that an alternative won't be any faster because it would be subject to the same bottleneck. It is hard to tell. -Mike Chabot On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 6:57 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think it would be much more cost effective to buy a mail tag than to shell out the $ for Enterprise though. Even if you tell it to use different mail servers it is still using the CF spooler. My mail server isn't the issue the cf spooler is :( -Original Message- From: Raymond Camden [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2008 5:54 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CFMail Alternatives Last I heard, CF Enterprise could send an insane amount of email very quickly. I think maybe 50k per hour? I don't think 10k would be a problem. Of course, what about using multiple mail servers? You can have one client use mail server x, another one use y, etc. On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 4:40 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have clients with large newsletters and if more than 1 of them send them at a time it could potentially send over 10k emails to the cfmail spooler. So naturally I have other clients that are complaining about how long it takes the mail to get delivered. I know there are alternatives out there to CFMAIL so does anyone out there have experience with them? I need something that can send mail in bulk to my mail server. ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314051 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CFMail Alternatives
Can't slowly unspooling emails also be attributed to a mail server thats slow in accepting them? I know I have that problem with my SmarterMail-based mail server, although I can live with it because my CF-originating traffic is not all that time-critical. Surprised no one has recommended iMS from CoolFusion. It hasn't been updated in years but I'd be surprised if it needed an update when it comes down to it. The thing always hauled ass for me... but as people have said, ColdFusion improved its mail performance years ago. Don't dismiss what people are saying about CF's mail handling performance. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Janitor, The Robertson Team mysecretbase.com ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314063 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CFMail Alternatives
I also am using SmarterMail Enterprise. The main reason I don't think it is SmarterMail is because I have sent mail to that same mail server from an enterprise version of CF and it went out plenty fast. I have also sent mail to that same Mail Server from ListServ products and it also goes out plenty fast. -Original Message- From: Matt Robertson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, October 17, 2008 4:21 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CFMail Alternatives Can't slowly unspooling emails also be attributed to a mail server thats slow in accepting them? I know I have that problem with my SmarterMail-based mail server, although I can live with it because my CF-originating traffic is not all that time-critical. Surprised no one has recommended iMS from CoolFusion. It hasn't been updated in years but I'd be surprised if it needed an update when it comes down to it. The thing always hauled ass for me... but as people have said, ColdFusion improved its mail performance years ago. Don't dismiss what people are saying about CF's mail handling performance. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Janitor, The Robertson Team mysecretbase.com ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314068 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4
Re: CFMail Alternatives
Welp, iMS_SE is only $250. And they have a single-threaded free version you can try. Or at least they used to. Check their site. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Janitor, The Robertson Team mysecretbase.com On Fri, Oct 17, 2008 at 2:10 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I also am using SmarterMail Enterprise. The main reason I don't think it is SmarterMail is because I have sent mail to that same mail server from an enterprise version of CF and it went out plenty fast. I have also sent mail to that same Mail Server from ListServ products and it also goes out plenty fast. ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314072 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4
Re: CFMail Alternatives
I also use smartermail.. and I think that it is the mail server slowing down the process.. not the cf spooler. The cf spooler looks like it is slow because it is waiting for the mail server. I also think this is a good thing.. I have to do strange things to intentionally slow down the sending of mail. When I send mail out at full speed, I get blocked by a lot of isps. Does anyone else have that problem? I send out a newsletter (opt -in - follows the rules - definitely not spam) to 10,000 email addresses every day.. and spread it out over about 6 hours by sending 150 every 5 minutes.. I also intertwine mail to various domains so there aren't too many to aol in each batch for example.. I have found that any faster than that results in a lot of bounced emails. At 04:20 PM 10/17/2008, you wrote: Can't slowly unspooling emails also be attributed to a mail server thats slow in accepting them? I know I have that problem with my SmarterMail-based mail server, although I can live with it because my CF-originating traffic is not all that time-critical. ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314085 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4
Re: CFMail Alternatives
as maddening as it is, fast mail is a problem as opposed to a solution it seems. I've used a mail trickler to get around this for years. http://mysecretbase.com/Slowing_Down_CFMail_2004.cfm It is far from perfect, but it works. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Janitor, The Robertson Team mysecretbase.com On Fri, Oct 17, 2008 at 8:01 PM, Al Musella, DPM wrote: I have to do strange things to intentionally slow down the sending of mail. When I send mail out at full speed, I get blocked by a lot of isps. Does anyone else have that problem? ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314086 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CFMail Alternatives
Last I heard, CF Enterprise could send an insane amount of email very quickly. I think maybe 50k per hour? I don't think 10k would be a problem. Of course, what about using multiple mail servers? You can have one client use mail server x, another one use y, etc. On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 4:40 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have clients with large newsletters and if more than 1 of them send them at a time it could potentially send over 10k emails to the cfmail spooler. So naturally I have other clients that are complaining about how long it takes the mail to get delivered. I know there are alternatives out there to CFMAIL so does anyone out there have experience with them? I need something that can send mail in bulk to my mail server. ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314020 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CFMail Alternatives
What version of Coldfusion are you using? Older versions of CF could take a long time to send spooled messages. It used to do on 100 every 15 seconds. I've tested CF8 and it does thousands every 15 seconds. We used to use CF_mail which was a wrapper for cfx_activemail on the old CF version. Now we just use CFMAIL. Wil Genovese On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 4:40 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have clients with large newsletters and if more than 1 of them send them at a time it could potentially send over 10k emails to the cfmail spooler. So naturally I have other clients that are complaining about how long it takes the mail to get delivered. I know there are alternatives out there to CFMAIL so does anyone out there have experience with them? I need something that can send mail in bulk to my mail server. ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314021 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CFMail Alternatives
I think it would be much more cost effective to buy a mail tag than to shell out the $ for Enterprise though. Even if you tell it to use different mail servers it is still using the CF spooler. My mail server isn't the issue the cf spooler is :( -Original Message- From: Raymond Camden [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2008 5:54 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CFMail Alternatives Last I heard, CF Enterprise could send an insane amount of email very quickly. I think maybe 50k per hour? I don't think 10k would be a problem. Of course, what about using multiple mail servers? You can have one client use mail server x, another one use y, etc. On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 4:40 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have clients with large newsletters and if more than 1 of them send them at a time it could potentially send over 10k emails to the cfmail spooler. So naturally I have other clients that are complaining about how long it takes the mail to get delivered. I know there are alternatives out there to CFMAIL so does anyone out there have experience with them? I need something that can send mail in bulk to my mail server. ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314023 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CFMail Alternatives
8 Standard Edition. -Original Message- From: Wil Genovese [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2008 6:00 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CFMail Alternatives What version of Coldfusion are you using? Older versions of CF could take a long time to send spooled messages. It used to do on 100 every 15 seconds. I've tested CF8 and it does thousands every 15 seconds. We used to use CF_mail which was a wrapper for cfx_activemail on the old CF version. Now we just use CFMAIL. Wil Genovese On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 4:40 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have clients with large newsletters and if more than 1 of them send them at a time it could potentially send over 10k emails to the cfmail spooler. So naturally I have other clients that are complaining about how long it takes the mail to get delivered. I know there are alternatives out there to CFMAIL so does anyone out there have experience with them? I need something that can send mail in bulk to my mail server. ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314024 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4
Re: CFMail Alternatives
Are you sure it is the spooler? All you said was that it took a long for mail to get delivered. The slowdown could be anywhere. On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 5:57 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think it would be much more cost effective to buy a mail tag than to shell out the $ for Enterprise though. Even if you tell it to use different mail servers it is still using the CF spooler. My mail server isn't the issue the cf spooler is :( ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314030 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CFMail Alternatives
I worked on a site that sent many hundreds of thousands of emails every day using CF 7 Enterprise and it was fine. The thing we had to do though was to use two different mail servers, one optimized for immediate mail delivery, like new account setup emails, and one optimized for bulk newsletter emails. When we only had one mail server it would get bogged down during the mass emails and the emails that people expected to receive immediately got delayed. The mail server was the bottleneck. You can configure CF so that it doesn't spool emails by unchecking the box in CFAdmin, if you think spooling is the problem as opposed to the speed of the mail server. I personally like the spooling feature. You can also override the settings in CFAdmin in a cfmail tag, so maybe the mass mails use the spooler and others get sent directly to the mail server. Maybe the hard drive speed is the spooling bottleneck and that an alternative won't be any faster because it would be subject to the same bottleneck. It is hard to tell. -Mike Chabot On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 6:57 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think it would be much more cost effective to buy a mail tag than to shell out the $ for Enterprise though. Even if you tell it to use different mail servers it is still using the CF spooler. My mail server isn't the issue the cf spooler is :( -Original Message- From: Raymond Camden [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2008 5:54 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CFMail Alternatives Last I heard, CF Enterprise could send an insane amount of email very quickly. I think maybe 50k per hour? I don't think 10k would be a problem. Of course, what about using multiple mail servers? You can have one client use mail server x, another one use y, etc. On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 4:40 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have clients with large newsletters and if more than 1 of them send them at a time it could potentially send over 10k emails to the cfmail spooler. So naturally I have other clients that are complaining about how long it takes the mail to get delivered. I know there are alternatives out there to CFMAIL so does anyone out there have experience with them? I need something that can send mail in bulk to my mail server. ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314031 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: CFMail Alternatives
Yes I am sure it is the spooler. I sit there and watch it. -Original Message- From: Raymond Camden [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2008 9:33 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CFMail Alternatives Are you sure it is the spooler? All you said was that it took a long for mail to get delivered. The slowdown could be anywhere. On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 5:57 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think it would be much more cost effective to buy a mail tag than to shell out the $ for Enterprise though. Even if you tell it to use different mail servers it is still using the CF spooler. My mail server isn't the issue the cf spooler is :( ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314034 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: CFMail Alternatives
If you are certain that the ColdFusion spooling process is the source of the slowness then turn off that feature. -Mike Chabot On Fri, Oct 17, 2008 at 12:03 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes I am sure it is the spooler. I sit there and watch it. -Original Message- From: Raymond Camden [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2008 9:33 PM To: cf-talk Subject: Re: CFMail Alternatives Are you sure it is the spooler? All you said was that it took a long for mail to get delivered. The slowdown could be anywhere. On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 5:57 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think it would be much more cost effective to buy a mail tag than to shell out the $ for Enterprise though. Even if you tell it to use different mail servers it is still using the CF spooler. My mail server isn't the issue the cf spooler is :( ~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:314035 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: cfmail alternatives
We have CFMX 6.1 Standard, and we send quite a fair amount of email (sometimes 10's of thousand of messages per day). You don't expect people here to help you improve your spamming application, do you? ;-) -- ___ REUSE CODE! Use custom tags; See http://www.contentbox.com/claude/customtags/tagstore.cfm (Please send any spam to this address: [EMAIL PROTECTED]) Thanks. ~| Discover CFTicket - The leading ColdFusion Help Desk and Trouble Ticket application http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=48 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:209785 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
RE: cfmail alternatives
It's a 100% opt-in list. We host political campaigns and have clients with pretty large opt-in lists, and when a couple of them decide to send an email at the same time, it get a little problematic. Russ -Original Message- From: Claude Schneegans [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 9:06 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: cfmail alternatives We have CFMX 6.1 Standard, and we send quite a fair amount of email (sometimes 10's of thousand of messages per day). You don't expect people here to help you improve your spamming application, do you? ;-) -- ___ REUSE CODE! Use custom tags; See http://www.contentbox.com/claude/customtags/tagstore.cfm (Please send any spam to this address: [EMAIL PROTECTED]) Thanks. ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:209786 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: cfmail alternatives
Maybe you can set up a linux box with one of the many mailers installed to handle JUST the emails. Then your cf app could kick off the process on the remote machine. Surely there is some sort of solution like this which would take the burden off of your web server... --ferg Russ wrote: It's a 100% opt-in list. We host political campaigns and have clients with pretty large opt-in lists, and when a couple of them decide to send an email at the same time, it get a little problematic. Russ -Original Message- From: Claude Schneegans [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 9:06 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: cfmail alternatives We have CFMX 6.1 Standard, and we send quite a fair amount of email (sometimes 10's of thousand of messages per day). You don't expect people here to help you improve your spamming application, do you? ;-) ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:209788 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: cfmail alternatives
iMS-Lite is free and can send your volume of mail with no problem: http://www.coolfusion.com/imslite iMS-SE is $250 and has 5x the processing power of iMS-Lite and also includes delivery status and bounced message handling which is particularly useful for list mail processing. Also, all iMS products can operate with or without an external email server. Direct mail sending greatly simplifies and speeds up the mail sending process. iMS comes with a CFX tag that handles email from ColdFusion queries and from other ODBC queries directly (you can also download our freeware CF_MAIL tag set which allows you to use CFMAIL-like syntax when using iMS). FYI - iMS powers all of the houseoffusion.com email lists. Regards, -- Howie Hamlin - inFusion Project Manager On-Line Data Solutions, Inc. - www.CoolFusion.com inFusion Mail Server (iMS) - The Award-winning, Intelligent Mail Server PrismAV - Virus scanning for ColdFusion and BlueDragon applications Find out how iMS Stacks up to the competition: http://www.coolfusion.com/imssecomparison.cfm iMS-Lite - the completely free mail server solution for applications and application servers http://www.coolfusion.com/iMSLite --- On Friday, June 17, 2005 12:44 AM, Russ scribed: --- We have CFMX 6.1 Standard, and we send quite a fair amount of email (sometimes 10's of thousand of messages per day). This takes a very long time on CFMX Standard, and I know Enterprise has huge gains over it, but it's just not worth it for us to upgrade just for the mail. Is there an alternative to get emails out fast? BlueDragon? Java class? Something cheap or free would obviously be preferable. Russ ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:209816 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
RE: cfmail alternatives
How does this compare with ASPQMail, and something like CF_ASPMAIL? Does anyone have scaling comparisons? I'd be interested in using one of these out-of-process mail delivery mechanisms for my mass mailings Thanks -Dov -Original Message- From: Howie Hamlin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 11:26 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: cfmail alternatives iMS-Lite is free and can send your volume of mail with no problem: http://www.coolfusion.com/imslite iMS-SE is $250 and has 5x the processing power of iMS-Lite and also includes delivery status and bounced message handling which is particularly useful for list mail processing. Also, all iMS products can operate with or without an external email server. Direct mail sending greatly simplifies and speeds up the mail sending process. iMS comes with a CFX tag that handles email from ColdFusion queries and from other ODBC queries directly (you can also download our freeware CF_MAIL tag set which allows you to use CFMAIL-like syntax when using iMS). FYI - iMS powers all of the houseoffusion.com email lists. Regards, -- Howie Hamlin - inFusion Project Manager On-Line Data Solutions, Inc. - www.CoolFusion.com inFusion Mail Server (iMS) - The Award-winning, Intelligent Mail Server PrismAV - Virus scanning for ColdFusion and BlueDragon applications Find out how iMS Stacks up to the competition: http://www.coolfusion.com/imssecomparison.cfm iMS-Lite - the completely free mail server solution for applications and application servers http://www.coolfusion.com/iMSLite --- On Friday, June 17, 2005 12:44 AM, Russ scribed: --- We have CFMX 6.1 Standard, and we send quite a fair amount of email (sometimes 10's of thousand of messages per day). This takes a very long time on CFMX Standard, and I know Enterprise has huge gains over it, but it's just not worth it for us to upgrade just for the mail. Is there an alternative to get emails out fast? BlueDragon? Java class? Something cheap or free would obviously be preferable. Russ ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:209817 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
RE: cfmail alternatives
This looks very good... I am interested as well to find out what the performance of this is compared to CF standard and CF Enterprise. Also about iMS-SE, does it use/include BoogieBounce? If that's true then we made a mistake buying the boogiebounce api, since it was about the same price I believe. -Original Message- From: Howie Hamlin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 11:26 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: cfmail alternatives iMS-Lite is free and can send your volume of mail with no problem: http://www.coolfusion.com/imslite iMS-SE is $250 and has 5x the processing power of iMS-Lite and also includes delivery status and bounced message handling which is particularly useful for list mail processing. Also, all iMS products can operate with or without an external email server. Direct mail sending greatly simplifies and speeds up the mail sending process. iMS comes with a CFX tag that handles email from ColdFusion queries and from other ODBC queries directly (you can also download our freeware CF_MAIL tag set which allows you to use CFMAIL-like syntax when using iMS). FYI - iMS powers all of the houseoffusion.com email lists. Regards, -- Howie Hamlin - inFusion Project Manager On-Line Data Solutions, Inc. - www.CoolFusion.com inFusion Mail Server (iMS) - The Award-winning, Intelligent Mail Server PrismAV - Virus scanning for ColdFusion and BlueDragon applications Find out how iMS Stacks up to the competition: http://www.coolfusion.com/imssecomparison.cfm iMS-Lite - the completely free mail server solution for applications and application servers http://www.coolfusion.com/iMSLite --- On Friday, June 17, 2005 12:44 AM, Russ scribed: --- We have CFMX 6.1 Standard, and we send quite a fair amount of email (sometimes 10's of thousand of messages per day). This takes a very long time on CFMX Standard, and I know Enterprise has huge gains over it, but it's just not worth it for us to upgrade just for the mail. Is there an alternative to get emails out fast? BlueDragon? Java class? Something cheap or free would obviously be preferable. Russ ~| Find out how CFTicket can increase your company's customer support efficiency by 100% http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=49 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:209824 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: cfmail alternatives
iMS-Lite / iMS-SE are direct mail engines as opposed to ASPQMail which requires an external email server. The purpose of ASPQMail is to provide a queueing mechanism for ASPMail which allows the ASP page to complete without waiting for the mail to be completely sent (this is similar to the way that CFMAIL operates). CF_ASPMail is simply a wrapper for ASPMail. A good overview of how iMS-Lite (iMS-SE operates similarly) is here: http://www.coolfusion.com/imslite/sendingmail.cfm Regards, Howie --- On Friday, June 17, 2005 11:50 AM, Katz, Dov B (IT) scribed: --- How does this compare with ASPQMail, and something like CF_ASPMAIL? Does anyone have scaling comparisons? I'd be interested in using one of these out-of-process mail delivery mechanisms for my mass mailings Thanks -Dov ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:209826 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: cfmail alternatives
--- On Friday, June 17, 2005 12:37 PM, Russ scribed: --- This looks very good... I am interested as well to find out what the performance of this is compared to CF standard and CF Enterprise. iMS-SE is capable of sending hundreds of thousands of email per day. In addition, you get immediate delivery status, bounce processing, etc. The houseoffusion.com lists are using iMS-Pro which can send millions of mails per day. Also about iMS-SE, does it use/include BoogieBounce? If that's true then we made a mistake buying the boogiebounce api, since it was about the same price I believe. We provide a freeway CFX tag that uses BoogieBounce for bounce processing. The tag works with iMS 2.7 or above. The tag requires a valid BoogieBounce license as well. The tag is not included with the iMS installer but is available as a separate download on our web site. Regards, Howie ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:209827 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: cfmail alternatives
ActivMail is excellent: http://www.cfdev.com/activmail ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:209771 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: CFMAIL Alternatives
Hi Sean, Look at iMS server from www.coolfusion.com It's cheap, if you just want the 'post' server. Otherwise,there is a COM on serverobjects.com for sending mail.I haven't used this though... ~Justin MacCarthy - Original Message - From: Sean Daniels [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Cf-Talk@Houseoffusion. Com [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, June 05, 2000 7:00 PM Subject: CFMAIL Alternatives Hello all, I am lookig for an alternate solution to cfmail that will allow my site to send larger quantities of email more efficiently. For example, a newsletter to all of our customers will go out to about 12,000 people. This currently takes CFMAIL a hell of a long time to send out - like about 5-6 hours. Does anyone have any experience with alternatives? I remember a discussion a while back about a product that was an intergrated SMTP server and CF tag. Could someone point me in the right direction and give me some stats on that (like emails per minute?) TIA - Sean Sean Daniels Manager, Engineering Marketplace Technologies [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.dealstream.com http://www.mergernetwork.com tel: 207.439.6030 cel: 978.764.0779 -- Archives: http://www.eGroups.com/list/cf-talk To Unsubscribe visit http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=listsbody=lists/cf_talk or send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with 'unsubscribe' in the body. -- Archives: http://www.eGroups.com/list/cf-talk To Unsubscribe visit http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=listsbody=lists/cf_talk or send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with 'unsubscribe' in the body.
