[cfaussie] Re: Where have all the CF developers gone?
all this cfscript talk... can I just have a step debugger...and breakpointsand watches pretty please? On 5/9/06, Gary Menzel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Damn good suggestion. I had previously suggested the idea of having another CFSETTING attribute (something like lang) to set it as a default for CFSCRIPT. There are dozens of ways they COULD implement it and not BREAK previous versions. Gary On 5/9/06, Chris Velevitch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 5/9/06, Mark Stanton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - ECMA compliance will break existing cfscript MM/Adobe won't break backward compatibility in CF. It might be better get Adobe to update the cfscript tag to include lang=ecmascript that way it opens to door to lang=java or whatever your favourite language that has a java compiler for it. Thus by default lang=cfscript and then you're open to mix and match scripting languages to you hearts content. Chris -- Chris Velevitch Manager - Sydney Flash Platform Developers Group www.flashdev.org.au --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups cfaussie group. To post to this group, send email to cfaussie@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cfaussie -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[cfaussie] Re: Where have all the CF developers gone?
It might be better get Adobe to update the cfscript tag to include lang=ecmascript that way it opens to door to lang=java or whatever your favourite language that has a java compiler for it. Thus by default lang=cfscript and then you're open to mix and match scripting languages to you hearts content. I've heard this suggestion before too... Cool so now we have cfm, cfscript, server-side actionscript (whatever the hell that is), mxml, cfECMAscript... I know I'd just love to support all that if I was Adobe. Intertestingly enough Sun are working on allowing php, python, ruby etc... to also run on the JVM (http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2006/02/02/LAMP-Java-Sun), maybe we can also get all of this in CF? That way you could pick languages like you pick underwear (hopefully one for each day of the week). -- Mark Stanton Gruden Pty Ltd http://www.gruden.com --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups cfaussie group. To post to this group, send email to cfaussie@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cfaussie -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[cfaussie] Re: Where have all the CF developers gone?
You can do (almost) anything.NET, so in the same vein, if they do make java bytecode compilers for other languanges, I think they could wire those in just fine. Support wise, the API documentation for different languages could be auto generated... I'm sure javadoc would make short work out of it. Plus, there's the community support process that macrobe already has in place... (although the unofficial lists seem to get more useful traffic?) I've heard this suggestion before too... Cool so now we have cfm, cfscript, server-side actionscript (whatever the hell that is), mxml, cfECMAscript... I know I'd just love to support all that if I was Adobe. Intertestingly enough Sun are working on allowing php, python, ruby etc... to also run on the JVM (http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2006/02/02/LAMP-Java-Sun), maybe we can also get all of this in CF? That way you could pick languages like you pick underwear (hopefully one for each day of the week). --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups cfaussie group. To post to this group, send email to cfaussie@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cfaussie -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[cfaussie] Re: Where have all the CF developers gone?
That is an unreasonable comment, Mark.We aren't asking for something new to be added - we are just asking for something that already (almost) exists to be made standard.MM introduced CFSCRIPT in the first place (maybe it was because someone asked for it - I dont know) - but they should now SUPPORT what is there and make it standard. Regards,GaryOn 5/9/06, Mark Stanton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It might be better get Adobe to update the cfscript tag to include lang=ecmascript that way it opens to door to lang=java or whatever your favourite language that has a java compiler for it. Thus by default lang=cfscript and then you're open to mix and match scripting languages to you hearts content.I've heard this suggestion before too...Cool so now we have cfm, cfscript, server-side actionscript (whatever the hell that is), mxml,cfECMAscript... I know I'd just love tosupport all that if I was Adobe.Intertestingly enough Sun are working on allowing php, python, rubyetc... to also run on the JVM( http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2006/02/02/LAMP-Java-Sun),maybe we can also get all of this in CF? That way you could picklanguages like you pick underwear (hopefully one for each day of theweek). --Mark StantonGruden Pty Ltdhttp://www.gruden.com --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups cfaussie group. To post to this group, send email to cfaussie@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cfaussie -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[cfaussie] Re: Where have all the CF developers gone?
Agreed. One of the problems with CFSCRIPT is that it is not ECMAScript compliant. When switching between JavaScript and CFSCRIPT, it can often get confusing - especially when you are dealing with conditions. I imagine this will be the same case with developers who shift between AS3 and CFSCRIPT. One of the Adobe engineers at WebDU hinted that operators were being looked at in the new version of ColdFusion, so perhaps we are edging closer. Darryl On 5/9/06, Gary Menzel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That is an unreasonable comment, Mark. We aren't asking for something new to be added - we are just asking for something that already (almost) exists to be made standard. MM introduced CFSCRIPT in the first place (maybe it was because someone asked for it - I dont know) - but they should now SUPPORT what is there and make it standard. Regards, Gary On 5/9/06, Mark Stanton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It might be better get Adobe to update the cfscript tag to include lang=ecmascript that way it opens to door to lang=java or whatever your favourite language that has a java compiler for it. Thus by default lang=cfscript and then you're open to mix and match scripting languages to you hearts content. I've heard this suggestion before too... Cool so now we have cfm, cfscript, server-side actionscript (whatever the hell that is), mxml, cfECMAscript... I know I'd just love to support all that if I was Adobe. Intertestingly enough Sun are working on allowing php, python, ruby etc... to also run on the JVM ( http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2006/02/02/LAMP-Java-Sun), maybe we can also get all of this in CF? That way you could pick languages like you pick underwear (hopefully one for each day of the week). -- Mark Stanton Gruden Pty Ltd http://www.gruden.com --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups cfaussie group. To post to this group, send email to cfaussie@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cfaussie -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[cfaussie] Re: Where have all the CF developers gone?
That way you could picklanguages like you pick underwear (hopefully one for each day of theweek).Now now Mark, don't you know ya can wear underwear 4 times before washing, frontwards, backwards, inside-out frontwards, inside-out backwards. M@Who can't quite remember what song/thing that comes from. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups cfaussie group. To post to this group, send email to cfaussie@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cfaussie -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[cfaussie] Re: [OT] Flex2 Beta 3
I think a lot of the reason we haven't "seen much" Flex/Flash work out there was the high cost for Flex (1). Flex 2's pricing model should help there quite a bit. There are still a lot of people under the impression that "flex will cost". It's not quite true. If you want to, you will be able to do most everything you could want entirely free in the final Flex 2 release. Ben did a good job clarifying the frequent misconceptions in a blog entry yesterday: Free Flex, Get Your Hot Fresh FREE Flex! http://www.forta.com/blog/index.cfm/2006/5/8/Free-Flex-Get-Your-Hot-Fresh-FREE-Flex That said, I'm sure M@ would also agree that there may be instances where Flash/Flex still won't cut it for interfaces, and there we may see Ajax (or .NET's Atlas) helping to show another path to RIAs. Either way, it's interesting times ahead I think. /charlie From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of M@ BourkeSent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 12:32 AMTo: cfaussie@googlegroups.comSubject: [cfaussie] Re: [OT] Flex2 Beta 3 I had a brief dab/look over the sample appsstill am yet to run accross a flash app that I think is better then an html app to be honest.back in 2001 I thought flash was gunna be the be all and end all of everything but from my perspectice (someone who doesn't follow flash) it hasn't done anything in the last 5 years except for flash video of which I actually love. Now I'm sure it has done heaps... But.. there is nothing that has caught my eye and made me think "w0w now its finally the must use"although I'm sure there would be a lot of really good intranet apps out there done in flex. M@ --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups cfaussie group. To post to this group, send email to cfaussie@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cfaussie -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[cfaussie] Re: Coldfusion Developer Melbourne
Dale,Money isn't everything bro. At this point flexibility is my biggest hurdle. There's plenty of work in Australia at the moment. Heck there is a CF7 install contract going in Brissy. Very tempting. There's plenty of work out there, not all of it is on the boards either. $60k contract and a four day week and I'm sold. I'll move to Melbourne tommorrow. The market is sitting around $70-80k for a senior CF/SQL analyst programmer. That's what I've found lately. Cheers,Chris Dawes On 08/05/06, Dale Fraser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: $90k hands up all CF developers earning 90k+ I wan't someone who wants a good job, not a huge pay packet, your obviously only interested in money. Regards Dale Fraser From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto: cfaussie@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Dawesi Sent: Saturday, 6 May 2006 6:07 PM To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com Subject: [cfaussie] Re: Coldfusion Developer Melbourne Maybe you should make the pay rate a little higher.Say if it was $70+ you would get some bites, $80+ you would have my interest, $90+ I would come to an interview. Cheers, Chris Dawes On 5/3/06, Dale Fraser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm probably going to annoy lots of people by posting here as there is a jobs topic. But I've had no response from that one and am unsure how many people are subscribed so I'm giving this topic a shot. ColdFusion Developer Melbourne ColdFusion Developer Melbourne Melbourne CBD An exciting opportunity exists to join a development team utilising your ColdFusion Skills. To be considered for this position, you must have the following experience. 2+ Years Experience with ColdFusion Experience with CFC's Experience with SQL Server 2000 or 2005 Outstanding Communication Skills Experience Working with a Software Development Team If you have this experience and are looking for a new opportunity then this could be the role for you! Applications via seek only. Please state your salary expectations. Salary $50k-$60 depending on experience. Apply through seek. http://www.seek.com.au/users/apply/index.ascx?JobID=6759002 Regards Dale Fraser Regards Dale Fraser --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups cfaussie group. To post to this group, send email to cfaussie@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cfaussie -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[cfaussie] Whats so bad about the tag syntax ? was: where have all the cf developers gone ?
I have to say i dont mind using the tag-based syntax for writing code. I would argue rather than making CF script ECMA compliant they should make the tag-based syntax XML valid! Who wants to write in the ugly Perl-like syntax of Php ? And its not so much writing it as it is reading other people's code who dont know how to comment correctly. CF is not the only tag-based language out there. .NET has custom tags java has taglibs. They are a good way of writing simple logic as part of a tag-based page.What i think is missing from CF (and can someone confirm this is possible with JRun / CF Enterprise ) is a way of writing java objects and deploying them to the server on the fly just as you would write a CFC ? If so, then its just a matter of providing some Java APIs to the existing CF functions/tags in a java syntax (which would already exist id say, but just arent documented) If all of that was available then the workflow would be like this:1. CFM pages with tag-based syntax for presenting HTML content.2. POJO's for where you would currently use CFC's (but with the advantage of them being instantly deployable, rather than code-complie-deploy) Pat --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups cfaussie group. To post to this group, send email to cfaussie@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cfaussie -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[cfaussie] Re: Whats so bad about the tag syntax?
Two things wrong with Tag based code.
1. Other developers when they see ColdFusion code hate it and immediately
dismiss it as not a real language
2. You need to write about double the amount of code every time
cfloop index=i from=1 to=10
/cfloop
for (i=1; i=10; i++) {
}
See the differences in the amount of characters typed in this simple
example.
Regards
Dale Fraser
From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of Patrick Branley
Sent: Wednesday, 10 May 2006 09:10 AM
To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
Subject: [cfaussie] Whats so bad about the tag syntax ? was: where have all
the cf developers gone ?
I have to say i dont mind using the tag-based syntax for writing code. I
would argue rather than making CF script ECMA compliant they should make the
tag-based syntax XML valid! Who wants to write in the ugly Perl-like syntax
of Php ? And its not so much writing it as it is reading other people's code
who dont know how to comment correctly.
CF is not the only tag-based language out there. .NET has custom tags java
has taglibs. They are a good way of writing simple logic as part of a
tag-based page.
What i think is missing from CF (and can someone confirm this is possible
with JRun / CF Enterprise ) is a way of writing java objects and deploying
them to the server on the fly just as you would write a CFC ? If so, then
its just a matter of providing some Java APIs to the existing CF
functions/tags in a java syntax (which would already exist id say, but just
arent documented)
If all of that was available then the workflow would be like this:
1. CFM pages with tag-based syntax for presenting HTML content.
2. POJO's for where you would currently use CFC's (but with the advantage of
them being instantly deployable, rather than code-complie-deploy)
Pat
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To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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[cfaussie] Re: Whats so bad about the tag syntax?
everything has its place, and the tag syntax does make some tasks allot
easier. That sais, for those people who prefer the script syntax it does
make it a pain when you have to break out of the script block to do
something and then open it up again to keep going.
Anything you do with tag code you should be able to do with script
just on a side note, while I was writing this email I was going to write an
example of looping over a list using cfscript and how much of a pain it was
until I thought I would try something.
don't know if anyone knew this but you can use for-in loops with lists. for
example :-
cfscript
list = a,b,c,d,e,f,g;
for (I in list) {
writeOutput(i br);
}
/cfscript
this was tested in cf7 so don't know if it has always been able to do this
or not.
Steve
-Original Message-
From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Dale Fraser
Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 10:26 AM
To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
Subject: [cfaussie] Re: Whats so bad about the tag syntax?
Two things wrong with Tag based code.
1. Other developers when they see ColdFusion code hate it and immediately
dismiss it as not a real language
2. You need to write about double the amount of code every time
cfloop index=i from=1 to=10
/cfloop
for (i=1; i=10; i++) {
}
See the differences in the amount of characters typed in this simple
example.
Regards
Dale Fraser
From: cfaussie@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of Patrick Branley
Sent: Wednesday, 10 May 2006 09:10 AM
To: cfaussie@googlegroups.com
Subject: [cfaussie] Whats so bad about the tag syntax ? was: where have all
the cf developers gone ?
I have to say i dont mind using the tag-based syntax for writing code. I
would argue rather than making CF script ECMA compliant they should make the
tag-based syntax XML valid! Who wants to write in the ugly Perl-like syntax
of Php ? And its not so much writing it as it is reading other people's code
who dont know how to comment correctly.
CF is not the only tag-based language out there. .NET has custom tags java
has taglibs. They are a good way of writing simple logic as part of a
tag-based page.
What i think is missing from CF (and can someone confirm this is possible
with JRun / CF Enterprise ) is a way of writing java objects and deploying
them to the server on the fly just as you would write a CFC ? If so, then
its just a matter of providing some Java APIs to the existing CF
functions/tags in a java syntax (which would already exist id say, but just
arent documented)
If all of that was available then the workflow would be like this:
1. CFM pages with tag-based syntax for presenting HTML content.
2. POJO's for where you would currently use CFC's (but with the advantage of
them being instantly deployable, rather than code-complie-deploy)
Pat
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To post to this group, send email to cfaussie@googlegroups.com
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[cfaussie] Re: Where have all the CF developers gone?
I should have been more specific..ECMA compliant syntactically.So - I think we are on the same page.I actually don't really go in for the compliance at that object level (as not all environments would be able to support all the same objects). If they did - we would only need one language! So - I guess I am a cherry picker. I will take what I like and throw away what I dont like. Which is why I persist with CFSCRIPT because (despite the few short-comings) it matches more closely with the JS/Java/C/C++/C# work that I do. Regards,GaryOn 5/10/06, Mark Stanton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey GaryI have no experience writing language parsers so I could be way offthe mark here, but with all due respect I think ECMA compliance is notjust a matter of making something that exists standard or standards compliant.A conforming implementation of ECMAScript must provide and supportall the types, values, objects, properties, functions, and programsyntax and semantics described in this specification. My reading of this is that there is a heap of stuff in ECMAScript thatdoes not exist in CF at all or directly conflicts with the way thingsare done in CF. The Null type, support for finally in try/catch blocks, date handling, arrays starting at 0, etc..I'm all for cfscript getting ECMA style operators like ++, , and soon, but I think that this is worlds apart from ECMA compliance.--Mark Stanton Gruden Pty Ltdhttp://www.gruden.com --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups cfaussie group. To post to this group, send email to cfaussie@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cfaussie -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
