[c-nsp] Dell VLT to Cisco VSS

2016-01-18 Thread Nick Cutting
I'm told Dell VLT is very similar to Nexus VPC.
I plan to connect 2 Dell S4820T switches to a VSS'ed 6500 (QSFP+ breakout 
cables)
It would be similar to 2 nexus5/7k's connected to a VSS pair.

Or am I a mad man, dancing with inter-vendor prop tech - and would be better 
off with a normal LACP port channel to one 6500, for each switch?

Does anyone have an field experience doing this?

Thanks, 
Nick

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Re: [c-nsp] loop guard still useful?

2016-01-18 Thread Michele Bergonzoni
>  Using the dispute mechanism included in the IEEE 802.1D-2004 RSTP
> standard... I'm wondering if there's any reason to keep loop guard configured

I think the dispute mechanism can detect unidirectionality where data out of 
the designated bridge is lost (which is enough to prevent loops), not the 
unidirectionality in the other direction.

So the dispute does half of what UDLD does, if I got it right.

Loop guard is different, it protects only from self-looped ports. I don't know 
if the wording of RSTP are written in a way to protect you from that, but I'm 
sure that the original STP standard was written in such a way that any 
compliant implementation was unable to block the loop caused by a self-looped 
port.

Most vendors quietly worked around this, and I don't know if 802.1d corrected 
this error in the previous standard. I know that it is very unlikely to find a 
switch whose STP can't protect you from such a situation.

So I bet that if you use RSTP you can disable loopguard, and if you like UDLD 
there is still a reason to use it. My personal best practice when using this 
errdisable features is to always enable auto recovery after a suitable time.

Cheers,
   Bergonz



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Re: [c-nsp] 1000BASE-ZX/LH multi-manufacturer interconnection

2016-01-18 Thread Michele Bergonzoni
> equipments of different vendors using 1000BASE-ZX/LH. Since 1000BASE-ZX
> isn`t standardized by IEEE, ... Can I connect 2 equipments of different 
> manufactures
> using their own manufactured transceiver?

We do it all the time and never had any problem. Of course you have to comply 
with minumum attenuation requirements (don't test them with a short patch, you 
could damage your receivers).

I too am curious to hear about stories of such incompatibilities, if any.

The lack of a standard means that if it actually doesn't work, you will have a 
hard time to blame it on vendors. I'm afraid you have to accept this risk.

Regards,
   Bergonz

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Re: [c-nsp] Dell VLT to Cisco VSS

2016-01-18 Thread Paul
VSS is single control plane so it's all one big chassis, the dell switch 
would have no idea it isn't connected to a single 6500 and should work 
without issues.
VPC is dual control planes using mLAG which is still transparent to the 
LAG partner
as long as the control protocol is standard (802.1ax w/ LACP for 
example)  there *should* be no issues.
stritcly talking about link aggregation here, whatever else you might be 
running is another story

as with everything... test it first :)



On 1/18/2016 3:12 AM, Nick Cutting wrote:

I'm told Dell VLT is very similar to Nexus VPC.
I plan to connect 2 Dell S4820T switches to a VSS'ed 6500 (QSFP+ breakout 
cables)
It would be similar to 2 nexus5/7k's connected to a VSS pair.

Or am I a mad man, dancing with inter-vendor prop tech - and would be better 
off with a normal LACP port channel to one 6500, for each switch?

Does anyone have an field experience doing this?

Thanks,
Nick

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Re: [c-nsp] Dell VLT to Cisco VSS

2016-01-18 Thread Nick Cutting
I am familiar with the theory

I was wondering If anyone had actually done this, and if there are any real 
world caveats.

I will be testing this week, however the kit is in Hong Kong, so it's a bit 
"remote handsy"

-Original Message-
From: Paul [mailto:p...@gtcomm.net] 
Sent: 18 January 2016 09:38
To: Nick Cutting; cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: Re: [c-nsp] Dell VLT to Cisco VSS

VSS is single control plane so it's all one big chassis, the dell switch would 
have no idea it isn't connected to a single 6500 and should work without issues.
VPC is dual control planes using mLAG which is still transparent to the LAG 
partner as long as the control protocol is standard (802.1ax w/ LACP for
example)  there *should* be no issues.
stritcly talking about link aggregation here, whatever else you might be 
running is another story as with everything... test it first :)



On 1/18/2016 3:12 AM, Nick Cutting wrote:
> I'm told Dell VLT is very similar to Nexus VPC.
> I plan to connect 2 Dell S4820T switches to a VSS'ed 6500 (QSFP+ 
> breakout cables) It would be similar to 2 nexus5/7k's connected to a VSS pair.
>
> Or am I a mad man, dancing with inter-vendor prop tech - and would be better 
> off with a normal LACP port channel to one 6500, for each switch?
>
> Does anyone have an field experience doing this?
>
> Thanks,
> Nick
>
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[c-nsp] PPPoE on ASR1000

2016-01-18 Thread Murat Kaipov
Hello Folks!

I need IOS-XE suggestion for PPPoE termination on Cisco ASR1004. I have
nearly 5k sessions. Now we use Cisco IOS XE Software, Version 03.11.04.S. 

On this ASR1000 the following services are configured:

PPPoE termination

IPoE termination

ISG

 

Thanks in advance.

Murat Kaipov 

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Re: [c-nsp] loop guard still useful?

2016-01-18 Thread Saku Ytti
On 18 January 2016 at 10:57, Michele Bergonzoni  wrote:

Hey,

> So the dispute does half of what UDLD does, if I got it right.

Ethernet with autonegotiation on should detect unidirectional links
automatically and go down on both ends at RTT/2 delay.

On A-B link, where A=>B works but A<=B does not, A will go down and A
will assert RFI or remote fault indicator on the line. B will receive
this, and go down as well.

Some platforms can assert this RFI for non-fault reasons, like port
might be configured to assert RFI if xconnect/l2circuit goes down, so
client will see port physically down, if EoMPLS fails.


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Re: [c-nsp] ASR920 "console" port....ugh

2016-01-18 Thread Phil Mayers

On 17/01/16 11:10, Saku Ytti wrote:

On 17 January 2016 at 04:04, Erik Sundberg  wrote:


Nah... The next model will be console via bluetooth.


I would hope people include in their RFPs true OOB as requirement. I
think only one in networking market doing that is Cisco in their
products with CMP. So Nexus7k RP1, SUP2T, RSP880?


As I'm sure you know, Cisco ditched this in N7k sup-2, because "customer 
didn't want it". So evidently, no, people aren't putting this in RFPs :o(

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Re: [c-nsp] 1000BASE-ZX/LH multi-manufacturer interconnection

2016-01-18 Thread Livio Zanol Puppim
Well, I need manufacturers warranty for every piece of the equipment,
including the optical transceiver... That's the reason. Also, I don't know
what manufacturer will win the RFP/buying processes for each equipment

Thanks for your reply!

2016-01-16 9:34 GMT-02:00 Nick Hilliard :

> Livio Zanol Puppim wrote:
> > *So my question is: Can I connect 2 equipments of different manufactures
> > using their own manufactured transceiver? Will there be a problem in this
> > connection?*
>
> it's nearly certain to work fine - almost all transceivers use wide-band
> receivers.
>
> But why on earth are you buying vendor transceivers?  Reputable third
> party transceivers work just as well and there are several vendors with
> transceiver programmers.  Vendor transceivers are mostly a waste of money.
>
> Nick
>
>


-- 
[]'s

Lívio Zanol Puppim
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Re: [c-nsp] 1000BASE-ZX/LH multi-manufacturer interconnection

2016-01-18 Thread Livio Zanol Puppim
Michele,

Thanks for your reply!

From which manufacturers do you interconnect equipments with EX/ZX (or
ER/ZR)?

I'm worried because of the different Wavelenght Range of the transceivers...


2016-01-18 7:23 GMT-02:00 Michele Bergonzoni :

> > equipments of different vendors using 1000BASE-ZX/LH. Since 1000BASE-ZX
> > isn`t standardized by IEEE, ... Can I connect 2 equipments of different
> manufactures
> > using their own manufactured transceiver?
>
> We do it all the time and never had any problem. Of course you have to
> comply with minumum attenuation requirements (don't test them with a short
> patch, you could damage your receivers).
>
> I too am curious to hear about stories of such incompatibilities, if any.
>
> The lack of a standard means that if it actually doesn't work, you will
> have a hard time to blame it on vendors. I'm afraid you have to accept this
> risk.
>
> Regards,
>Bergonz
>
> --
> Ing. Michele Bergonzoni - Laboratori Guglielmo Marconi S.p.a.
> Phone:+39-051-6781926 e-mail: berg...@labs.it
> alt.advanced.networks.design.configure.operate
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-- 
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Re: [c-nsp] 1000BASE-ZX/LH multi-manufacturer interconnection

2016-01-18 Thread Michele Bergonzoni
> From which manufacturers do you interconnect equipments with EX/ZX (or
> ER/ZR)?

I've seen working links among Cisco, Juniper and Extreme networks.

Bye,
 Bergonz

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Re: [c-nsp] loop guard still useful?

2016-01-18 Thread Michele Bergonzoni
> On A-B link, where A=>B works but A<=B does not, A will go down and A
> will assert RFI or remote fault indicator on the line. B will receive
> this, and go down as well.

You're right as usual. I actually happened to see a 1000baseLX port in dispute 
a few years ago, so you made me dig through old emails and tickets.

It was a 6500 facing a 3750, and it was because MSTP BPDUs where incorrectly 
tagged, probably due to CSCta17209, we fixed upgrading the 3750.

Probably UDLD wouldn't have helped either.

Thanks,
Bergonz


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Re: [c-nsp] 1000BASE-ZX/LH multi-manufacturer interconnection

2016-01-18 Thread Phil Mayers

On 18/01/16 11:23, Livio Zanol Puppim wrote:

Well, I need manufacturers warranty for every piece of the equipment,
including the optical transceiver... That's the reason. Also, I don't know
what manufacturer will win the RFP/buying processes for each equipment


You can get manufacturer warranty on 3rd party transceivers - from the 
transceiver vendor.


Nick is right, equipment vendor transceivers are overpriced and not 
better quality, as well as offering a narrower choice of optics. It is 
(almost) always better to get reputable 3rd party transceivers which can 
be recoded for "compatibility".


But it's your choice, of course
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Re: [c-nsp] 1000BASE-ZX/LH multi-manufacturer interconnection

2016-01-18 Thread Gert Doering
Hi,

On Mon, Jan 18, 2016 at 12:00:47PM +, Phil Mayers wrote:
> But it's your choice, of course

Don't talk too many people out of buying vendor optics - if that source
of revenue is no longer working, they will have to compensate by introducing
silly extra license fees, etc.

gert
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Re: [c-nsp] Cisco ASR920-24SZ-IM BVI Feature Limitations

2016-01-18 Thread Darin Herteen
Thanks everyone for the responses as they have been quite informative. 

QoS strategies/testing was next/last on my list to hammer out this week so the 
behavior mentioned below is especially helpful.

Regards,

Darin


From: cisco-nsp  on behalf of James Jun 

Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2016 10:15 AM
To: cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: Re: [c-nsp] Cisco ASR920-24SZ-IM BVI Feature Limitations

On Sat, Jan 16, 2016 at 03:54:01PM +0200, Mark Tinka wrote:
>
> On 16/Jan/16 13:57, Eric Van Tol wrote:
>
> >
> > We've been pretty happy with the ASR, especially the models with 4x10G 
> > on-board. The cost is significantly less than an ME3600, even with a full 
> > suite of licenses (Advanced IP Metro, all 10G ports, all GE ports), and the 
> > footprint is much smaller (well, more shallow).
>
> +1.
>
> We've started rolling them out since last December, and so far so good.
>

+1 also, we have several ASR920-24SZ-IM's and 24SZ-M's out in the field and 
we're very happy with them.

Aside from LAG limitations (workaround solution was to not use them :-S), the 
only other issue I've run into is that default port buffer/queue sizes (48KB?) 
are rather small.  This is a slight annoyance since typical deployment of 920 
has at least 2x 10GE feeding the 1GE revenue ports on the box.  As I 
understand, 920 only has 12MB shared buffer space so that probably explains it, 
but on default queue sizes, almost every 1GE end-user port (no traffic-shaping 
on user ports, just full-rate 1G port with 10G uplink) excessively collects 
output drops on practically most trivial IMIX usage.

For example, a FreeBSD box sitting with 1GE behind ASR920 just doing wget from 
a download mirror 50ms away records output drops on 920; whereas a 1GE port off 
of ASR9K or MX80 would not collect output drops for this type of usage.  Sure, 
it is reasonable to expect an end-user running Speedtest.net or watching 
Netflix spamming multiple flows to cause output drops, but not on single flow 
of download.

As a workaround, raising the queue-limit to 512 KB per 1G port dramatically 
gets rid of output drops for trivial traffic.  You should still see drops for 
longhaul bursty traffic overwhelming a 1GE interface when stepping down from 
10G uplink, but that's pretty much a reasonable congestion at that point, so 
dropping packet is better.

512KB seems to be reasonable; 24x1GE * 512KB = 12.2MB, so we don't 
oversubscribe the global buffer space, and it's roughly ~4ms of output buffer 
per port.

!
class-map match-any cos_all
 match cos  0  1  2  3  4  5  6  7
policy-map MC_1G_512kb
 class cos_all
  bandwidth percent 100
  queue-limit 512000 bytes
!


James
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Re: [c-nsp] Cisco ASR920-24SZ-IM BVI Feature Limitations

2016-01-18 Thread Tassos Chatzithomaoglou via cisco-nsp
--- Begin Message ---
Not exactly related to BVI, but we have many cases where the ASR920
(different sw releases) stops forwarding/responding-to packets without
any apparent trigger and a reboot is required in order to return to
normal operation. Installation environment is 10G access rings using
mostly EoMPLS/VPLS & various carrier ethernet features.

Cisco is still trying to figure out the root cause, unsuccessfully until
now.

--
Tassos

Darin Herteen wrote on 18/1/2016 3:34 μμ:
> Thanks everyone for the responses as they have been quite informative. 
>
> QoS strategies/testing was next/last on my list to hammer out this week so 
> the behavior mentioned below is especially helpful.
>
> Regards,
>
> Darin
>
> 
> From: cisco-nsp  on behalf of James Jun 
> 
> Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2016 10:15 AM
> To: cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
> Subject: Re: [c-nsp] Cisco ASR920-24SZ-IM BVI Feature Limitations
>
> On Sat, Jan 16, 2016 at 03:54:01PM +0200, Mark Tinka wrote:
>> On 16/Jan/16 13:57, Eric Van Tol wrote:
>>
>>> We've been pretty happy with the ASR, especially the models with 4x10G 
>>> on-board. The cost is significantly less than an ME3600, even with a full 
>>> suite of licenses (Advanced IP Metro, all 10G ports, all GE ports), and the 
>>> footprint is much smaller (well, more shallow).
>> +1.
>>
>> We've started rolling them out since last December, and so far so good.
>>
> +1 also, we have several ASR920-24SZ-IM's and 24SZ-M's out in the field and 
> we're very happy with them.
>
> Aside from LAG limitations (workaround solution was to not use them :-S), the 
> only other issue I've run into is that default port buffer/queue sizes 
> (48KB?) are rather small.  This is a slight annoyance since typical 
> deployment of 920 has at least 2x 10GE feeding the 1GE revenue ports on the 
> box.  As I understand, 920 only has 12MB shared buffer space so that probably 
> explains it, but on default queue sizes, almost every 1GE end-user port (no 
> traffic-shaping on user ports, just full-rate 1G port with 10G uplink) 
> excessively collects output drops on practically most trivial IMIX usage.
>
> For example, a FreeBSD box sitting with 1GE behind ASR920 just doing wget 
> from a download mirror 50ms away records output drops on 920; whereas a 1GE 
> port off of ASR9K or MX80 would not collect output drops for this type of 
> usage.  Sure, it is reasonable to expect an end-user running Speedtest.net or 
> watching Netflix spamming multiple flows to cause output drops, but not on 
> single flow of download.
>
> As a workaround, raising the queue-limit to 512 KB per 1G port dramatically 
> gets rid of output drops for trivial traffic.  You should still see drops for 
> longhaul bursty traffic overwhelming a 1GE interface when stepping down from 
> 10G uplink, but that's pretty much a reasonable congestion at that point, so 
> dropping packet is better.
>
> 512KB seems to be reasonable; 24x1GE * 512KB = 12.2MB, so we don't 
> oversubscribe the global buffer space, and it's roughly ~4ms of output buffer 
> per port.
>
> !
> class-map match-any cos_all
>  match cos  0  1  2  3  4  5  6  7
> policy-map MC_1G_512kb
>  class cos_all
>   bandwidth percent 100
>   queue-limit 512000 bytes
> !
>
>
> James
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--- End Message ---
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[c-nsp] EEM not triggering on IOS-XE 3.11.1S

2016-01-18 Thread Stephen Fulton

Hi all,

I'm working on an EEM script which is triggered by an IP SLA down state 
on an ASR1000 running IOS-XE 3.11.1S.  While the IP SLA entry detects 
the state properly, the EEM does not trigger.  I'm not finding anything 
relevant on the bug toolkit, and I am not seeing anything with my Google-fu.


Here's the configuration:

ip sla 1
 icmp-echo 1.1.1.1 source-ip 1.1.1.2
 vrf GREEN
 tag SITE-DOWN
 frequency 5
ip sla schedule 1 life forever start-time now
!
event manager applet SITE-DOWN
 description Site 1.1.1.1 is down
 event ipsla operation-id 1
 action 1.0 syslog priority critical msg "ALERT: Site 1.1.1.1 is down"
!

And here is what I see when I look the status of the IP SLA entry and 
the EEM entry.  IP SLA looks fine, the EEM isn't triggering despite 
being registered.



rtr5#sh ip sla statistics 1
IPSLAs Latest Operation Statistics

IPSLA operation id: 1
Latest RTT: NoConnection/Busy/Timeout
Latest operation start time: 11:42:21 EST Mon Jan 18 2016
Latest operation return code: Timeout
Number of successes: 0
Number of failures: 301
Operation time to live: Forever
!
rtr5#sh event manager policy registered
No.  Class TypeEvent Type  Trap  Time Registered 
   Name
1appletuseripsla   Off   Mon Jan 18 11:24:46 
2016  SITE-DOWN

 operation-id {1}
 maxrun 20.000
 action 1.0 syslog priority critical msg "ALERT: Site 1.1.1.1 is down"
!
rtr5sh event manager statistics policy

   AverageMaximum
No.  Class Triggered   Suppressed  Run Time   Run Time   Name
---
1applet0   0   0.000  0.000 
SITE-DOWN

 event {} ipsla


Any ideas?  I'm at a loss at this point.  Upgrading to a newer version 
of IOS-XE is in the cards, but won't happen immediately.


Thanks,

-- Stephen
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Re: [c-nsp] loop guard still useful?

2016-01-18 Thread Lee
Thanks for the response.

On 1/18/16, Michele Bergonzoni  wrote:
>>  Using the dispute mechanism included in the IEEE 802.1D-2004 RSTP
>> standard... I'm wondering if there's any reason to keep loop guard
>> configured
>
> I think the dispute mechanism can detect unidirectionality where data out of
> the designated bridge is lost (which is enough to prevent loops), not the
> unidirectionality in the other direction.

Which is my point .. or question - enable RSTP on all the switches in
the network and you don't need loop guard.  Correct?


> So the dispute does half of what UDLD does, if I got it right.
>
> Loop guard is different, it protects only from self-looped ports.

My understanding is that it keeps stp blocked ports blocking if the
other side stops sending BPDUs:

  
http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/support/docs/lan-switching/spanning-tree-protocol/10596-84.html

  The loop guard feature makes additional checks. If BPDUs are not
received on a non-designated port, and loop guard is enabled, that
port is moved into the STP loop-inconsistent blocking state, instead
of the listening / learning / forwarding state. Without the loop guard
feature, the port assumes the designated port role. The port moves to
the STP forwarding state and creates a loop.

and a lot further down

  loop guard does not work on shared links or in situations where the
link has been unidirectional since the link-up.


So it seems like loop guard isn't needed if rstp is enabled.


> I don't
> know if the wording of RSTP are written in a way to protect you from that,
> but I'm sure that the original STP standard was written in such a way that
> any compliant implementation was unable to block the loop caused by a
> self-looped port.

If self-looped means the port sends a frame and then receives the same
frame, you're right, stp doesn't protect you from that.

> Most vendors quietly worked around this, and I don't know if 802.1d
> corrected this error in the previous standard. I know that it is very
> unlikely to find a switch whose STP can't protect you from such a
> situation.
>
> So I bet that if you use RSTP you can disable loopguard, and if you like
> UDLD there is still a reason to use it.

No, I don't like UDLD at all - too many bad experiences with it.  It
was a necessary evil with cat5500s and 100Mb fiber connections, but
you don't need UDLD on 1Gb fiber links.

Thanks,
Lee
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Re: [c-nsp] loop guard still useful?

2016-01-18 Thread Lee
On 1/18/16, Saku Ytti  wrote:
> On 18 January 2016 at 10:57, Michele Bergonzoni  wrote:
>
> Hey,
>
>> So the dispute does half of what UDLD does, if I got it right.
>
> Ethernet with autonegotiation on should detect unidirectional links
> automatically and go down on both ends at RTT/2 delay.

I remember 100Mb fiber connections on cat5500s could have
unidirectional links, but a quick search gives me this

  
http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/support/docs/lan-switching/spanning-tree-protocol/10591-77.html
  Most recently, fiber FastEthernet hardware implementations have Far
End Fault Indication (FEFI) functions in order to bring the link down
on both sides in these situations.

so apparently 100Mb fiber doesn't have that problem any more.  I don't
think 1 or 10Gb fiber ever did..

Lee
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[c-nsp] virtual router on a cat4500

2016-01-18 Thread Eli Kagan via cisco-nsp
--- Begin Message ---
Hi all,I need community feedback about carving a virtual router instance out of 
Cat4507r+e Sup7-e. Let me explain. I have a pair of said Cat4507 running as 
distribution switches. I need to add two new routers to terminate MPLS VPN 
connection. Currently this connection terminates on a firewall, which is not 
ideal and I would like to change it. Hence, two new routers. And then I 
thought, why not create a vrf on the catalyst and use it as my CE. All I need 
is two interfaces, BGP and OSPF. So physically I would still have same Cat4507 
but logically it would be   [L3 distribution] --- [ firewall ] --- [ mpls ce 
]where distribution is the default VRF on the Cat4507 and CE is the new VRF on 
the same Catalyst.Any reasons why I should not do it?One concern I have is 
running OSPF between these two VRFs.Any insight would be greatly 
appreciated.Thanks,Eli--- End Message ---
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Re: [c-nsp] loop guard still useful?

2016-01-18 Thread Saku Ytti
On 18 January 2016 at 21:22, Lee  wrote:
> so apparently 100Mb fiber doesn't have that problem any more.  I don't
> think 1 or 10Gb fiber ever did..


I believe if you implement autonego, you have to implement RFI. But
I'm not 100% sure about that.

IEEE 802.3 standard isn't exactly easiest standard to read. But there
are quite many surprising goodies in autonego which are usually not
known, not just RFI. Autonego can assert when link is configured
operationally down, meaning far-end could produce syslog information
about link going down, because far end was configured down, which
would help lot with troubleshooting, when you can know if far-side is
intentionally down or not.
My understanding of reading hardware specs is that this feature is
even supported in typical PHY, however I've NEVER seen software using
this feature.

I'd love recommendation on good, modern book about 802.3, with
irrelevant bits not addressed, relevant bit discussed and practical
view offered on how things are actually implemented in modern, common
hardware. So far any book I've read, does not even discuss autonego in
satisfactory detail, and I fear what else am I missing due to my
unwillingness to weed through 802.3.

-- 
  ++ytti
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Re: [c-nsp] loop guard still useful?

2016-01-18 Thread Michele Bergonzoni
First of all, I have to admit that I confused loop guard with keepalives (the 
one that errdisables self looped switchport interfaces, and then people do "no 
keepalives"). Sorry.

> So it seems like loop guard isn't needed if rstp is enabled.

I have no operational experience with loop guard, but from the description it 
seems to me that in order to trigger it the interface must become 
unidirectional *after* link up. Thus, if your Joe Average while troubleshooting 
does a shut/no shut, he actually gets the loop.

So it will protect you on the other unidirectionality side, but not in all 
possible sequences of events.

If you are operating an all-cisco net you might take a look at bridge 
assurance. I have no operational experience with it as well (apart from 
disabling it in the nexus), but looks much more like a bidirectional keepalive 
at the STP layer. It is proprietary and violates the standard as I understand 
it.

> No, I don't like UDLD at all - too many bad experiences with it

In fact after what Saku said I would consider trusting the layer 1, but I 
usually work in a multivendor environment, YMMV.

Bye,
Bergonz

-- 
Ing. Michele Bergonzoni - Laboratori Guglielmo Marconi S.p.a.
Phone:+39-051-6781926 e-mail: berg...@labs.it
alt.advanced.networks.design.configure.operate
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Re: [c-nsp] Dell VLT to Cisco VSS

2016-01-18 Thread Paul
Haven't tested it with Dell(force10 stuffs), but have with several other 
vendors and never had a problem with LAG implementation using the 
standard so I'd assume it would work but you just never know, different 
hardware versions, code versions, etc.. bugs..



On 1/18/2016 5:10 AM, Nick Cutting wrote:

I am familiar with the theory

I was wondering If anyone had actually done this, and if there are any real 
world caveats.

I will be testing this week, however the kit is in Hong Kong, so it's a bit "remote 
handsy"

-Original Message-
From: Paul [mailto:p...@gtcomm.net]
Sent: 18 January 2016 09:38
To: Nick Cutting; cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: Re: [c-nsp] Dell VLT to Cisco VSS

VSS is single control plane so it's all one big chassis, the dell switch would 
have no idea it isn't connected to a single 6500 and should work without issues.
VPC is dual control planes using mLAG which is still transparent to the LAG 
partner as long as the control protocol is standard (802.1ax w/ LACP for
example)  there *should* be no issues.
stritcly talking about link aggregation here, whatever else you might be 
running is another story as with everything... test it first :)



On 1/18/2016 3:12 AM, Nick Cutting wrote:

I'm told Dell VLT is very similar to Nexus VPC.
I plan to connect 2 Dell S4820T switches to a VSS'ed 6500 (QSFP+
breakout cables) It would be similar to 2 nexus5/7k's connected to a VSS pair.

Or am I a mad man, dancing with inter-vendor prop tech - and would be better 
off with a normal LACP port channel to one 6500, for each switch?

Does anyone have an field experience doing this?

Thanks,
Nick

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Phone: 1-514-907-0050 x 215
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Re: [c-nsp] loop guard still useful?

2016-01-18 Thread Lee
On 1/18/16, Saku Ytti  wrote:
> On 18 January 2016 at 21:22, Lee  wrote:
>> so apparently 100Mb fiber doesn't have that problem any more.  I don't
>> think 1 or 10Gb fiber ever did..
>
>
> I believe if you implement autonego, you have to implement RFI. But
> I'm not 100% sure about that.
>
> IEEE 802.3 standard isn't exactly easiest standard to read. But there
> are quite many surprising goodies in autonego which are usually not
> known, not just RFI. Autonego can assert when link is configured
> operationally down, meaning far-end could produce syslog information
> about link going down, because far end was configured down, which
> would help lot with troubleshooting, when you can know if far-side is
> intentionally down or not.
> My understanding of reading hardware specs is that this feature is
> even supported in typical PHY, however I've NEVER seen software using
> this feature.
>
> I'd love recommendation on good, modern book about 802.3, with
> irrelevant bits not addressed, relevant bit discussed and practical
> view offered on how things are actually implemented in modern, common
> hardware. So far any book I've read, does not even discuss autonego in
> satisfactory detail, and I fear what else am I missing due to my
> unwillingness to weed through 802.3.

If you get any off-list replies please post a summary.  I haven't seen
any good books about ethernet in ages, but I haven't really been
looking either.

Lee
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Re: [c-nsp] virtual router on a cat4500

2016-01-18 Thread Arie Vayner
This should work with no major issues.

I would consider making the firewall a layer 3 hop, and use something like
VRRP for redundancy and maybe use BGP as the routing protocol... But these
are just options. I personally don't like layer 2 firewalls, and there
might be design complications due to spanning tree in a redundant mode...

Another interesting approach for easy redundancy is to make the pair of
4500's a logical VSS node.
https://supportforums.cisco.com/document/124626/virtual-switching-system-vss-configuration-cisco-4500-series-switches

If you intend to run OSPF with VRF-lite, you need to enable "capability
vrf-lite"
http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/td/docs/switches/lan/catalyst4500/12-2/20ew/configuration/guide/config/vrf.html

HTH
Arie


On Mon, Jan 18, 2016 at 11:41 AM Eli Kagan via cisco-nsp <
cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net> wrote:

> Hi all,I need community feedback about carving a virtual router instance
> out of Cat4507r+e Sup7-e. Let me explain. I have a pair of said Cat4507
> running as distribution switches. I need to add two new routers to
> terminate MPLS VPN connection. Currently this connection terminates on a
> firewall, which is not ideal and I would like to change it. Hence, two new
> routers. And then I thought, why not create a vrf on the catalyst and use
> it as my CE. All I need is two interfaces, BGP and OSPF. So physically I
> would still have same Cat4507 but logically it would be   [L3 distribution]
> --- [ firewall ] --- [ mpls ce ]where distribution is the default VRF on
> the Cat4507 and CE is the new VRF on the same Catalyst.Any reasons why I
> should not do it?One concern I have is running OSPF between these two
> VRFs.Any insight would be greatly appreciated.Thanks,Eli
>
>
> -- Forwarded message --
> From: Eli Kagan via cisco-nsp 
> To: "cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net" 
> Cc:
> Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2016 14:41:31 -0500 (EST)
> Subject: [c-nsp] virtual router on a cat4500
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Re: [c-nsp] loop guard still useful?

2016-01-18 Thread James Ventre via cisco-nsp
--- Begin Message ---
On Mon, Jan 18, 2016 at 3:57 PM, Lee  wrote:

>
> If you get any off-list replies please post a summary.  I haven't seen
> any good books about ethernet in ages, but I haven't really been
> looking either.



FWIW:  Cisco Live Doc ​BRKDCT-2333 goes over on BA, UDLD, and auto-neg link
failure detection.
--- End Message ---
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Re: [c-nsp] loop guard still useful?

2016-01-18 Thread Lee
On 1/18/16, Michele Bergonzoni  wrote:

>> So it seems like loop guard isn't needed if rstp is enabled.
>
> I have no operational experience with loop guard, but from the description
> it seems to me that in order to trigger it the interface must become
> unidirectional *after* link up.

Right

> Thus, if your Joe Average while
> troubleshooting does a shut/no shut, he actually gets the loop.

I'm not sure about shut/no shut but a reboot after the link goes
unidirectional -- yes, you get a loop.

> So it will protect you on the other unidirectionality side, but not in all
> possible sequences of events.
>
> If you are operating an all-cisco net you might take a look at bridge
> assurance. I have no operational experience with it as well (apart from
> disabling it in the nexus), but looks much more like a bidirectional
> keepalive at the STP layer. It is proprietary and violates the standard as I
> understand it.

Sounds like loop guard except there's now edge, normal and network
port types with network ports going into blocking/inconsistent state
if they don't see BPDUs.   Loop guard puts a port into
blocking/inconsistent state if it _stops_ seeing BPDUs on a port.

>> No, I don't like UDLD at all - too many bad experiences with it
>
> In fact after what Saku said I would consider trusting the layer 1, but I
> usually work in a multivendor environment, YMMV.

Right - it does sound like rstp might be good enuf.

Regards,
Lee
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Re: [c-nsp] EEM not triggering on IOS-XE 3.11.1S

2016-01-18 Thread Arie Vayner
Stephen,

I think you are missing a bit more specifics on your event definition... It
just doesn't match a reaction event from IP SLA.

If you look here:
http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/td/docs/ios-xml/ios/eem/command/eem-cr-book/eem-cr-e1.html#wp2241131084

You can see that there are quite a few options to set what exactly you want
to trigger on with regards to IP SLA.
I think you have to define reactions or triggers to match on IP SLA related
events (events being state transitions... up to down, down to up, threshold
limits, etc)

To be honest, I got best results from EEM and IP SLA by EEM matching on the
syslog messages IP SLA produces...

Tnx
Arie

On Mon, Jan 18, 2016 at 8:46 AM Stephen Fulton  wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I'm working on an EEM script which is triggered by an IP SLA down state
> on an ASR1000 running IOS-XE 3.11.1S.  While the IP SLA entry detects
> the state properly, the EEM does not trigger.  I'm not finding anything
> relevant on the bug toolkit, and I am not seeing anything with my
> Google-fu.
>
> Here's the configuration:
>
> ip sla 1
>   icmp-echo 1.1.1.1 source-ip 1.1.1.2
>   vrf GREEN
>   tag SITE-DOWN
>   frequency 5
> ip sla schedule 1 life forever start-time now
> !
> event manager applet SITE-DOWN
>   description Site 1.1.1.1 is down
>   event ipsla operation-id 1
>   action 1.0 syslog priority critical msg "ALERT: Site 1.1.1.1 is down"
> !
>
> And here is what I see when I look the status of the IP SLA entry and
> the EEM entry.  IP SLA looks fine, the EEM isn't triggering despite
> being registered.
>
>
> rtr5#sh ip sla statistics 1
> IPSLAs Latest Operation Statistics
>
> IPSLA operation id: 1
> Latest RTT: NoConnection/Busy/Timeout
> Latest operation start time: 11:42:21 EST Mon Jan 18 2016
> Latest operation return code: Timeout
> Number of successes: 0
> Number of failures: 301
> Operation time to live: Forever
> !
> rtr5#sh event manager policy registered
> No.  Class TypeEvent Type  Trap  Time Registered
> Name
> 1appletuseripsla   Off   Mon Jan 18 11:24:46
> 2016  SITE-DOWN
>   operation-id {1}
>   maxrun 20.000
>   action 1.0 syslog priority critical msg "ALERT: Site 1.1.1.1 is down"
> !
> rtr5sh event manager statistics policy
>
> AverageMaximum
> No.  Class Triggered   Suppressed  Run Time   Run Time   Name
>
> ---
> 1applet0   0   0.000  0.000
> SITE-DOWN
>   event {} ipsla
>
>
> Any ideas?  I'm at a loss at this point.  Upgrading to a newer version
> of IOS-XE is in the cards, but won't happen immediately.
>
> Thanks,
>
> -- Stephen
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Re: [c-nsp] loop guard still useful?

2016-01-18 Thread Lukas Tribus
Hello list,



tl;dr rapid-pvst and autonegotiation will fail you, use UDLD and loop guard.



> So I'm wondering if there's any reason to keep loop guard configured
> on a switch?
> Any current hardware that doesn't support rapidSTP? Some other reason?

Whatever is documented on CCO, it will *NOT* prevent layer 2 loops
in redundant layer 2 networks in all situations, at least with rapid-pvst.

I don't think this is actually implemented in Cisco rapid-pvst, but it may be
in MST.



> Ethernet with autonegotiation on should detect unidirectional links
> automatically and go down on both ends at RTT/2 delay.

Ethernet autonegotiation will let you down if the HW or SW fails, you
need control plane features to detect unidirectional links and that is
also the case for directly connected switches on point-to-point
dark-fibers with autonegotiation.



> On A-B link, where A=>B works but A<=B does not, A will go down and A
> will assert RFI or remote fault indicator on the line. B will receive
> this, and go down as well.

This assumption breaks when you have some kind of RX or TX stall, which
I saw first-hand on a 7600 linecard that suddenly became faulty (and
caused a major layer 2 loop because the links had neither UDLD nor loop
guard, just plain old rapid-pvst and autonegotiation).

Also, all of this is not true if you have EoMPLS, EoSDH, radio-links and
other nasty stuff that can suddenly break a single direction and/or both
directions without RFI'ing the failure end-to-end.

Unless you operate a network exclusively on dark-fibers or passive WDM,
you can't assume that everything will go physically down nice and easy.

You carriers layer 2 circuit signaled RFI once? That doesn't mean it
will continue to do so after (or within) the next maintenance window or
if the carrier has a different kind of failure within his network.

Would you deploy a routed or MPLS switched network without BFD and
without IGP hello timeout, just relying on the interfaces operational
state?

I can't accept a layer 2 loop because of a single hardware defect. I need
the control plane to protect me from that and this is what UDLD and loop
guard can do.


Thats why:
> In fact after what Saku said I would consider trusting the layer 1

You can trust layer 1 so long that you trust that you will never ever
have a single hardware defect, a single NP stall or ASIC freeze.


Yes, both HW and SW defects can always cause layer 2 problems even with
UDLD and loop-guard, but those cases are unrelated to STP and much less
common (you can only migrate to layer 3 to eliminate that factor, because
neither FabricPath, nor TRILL nor VPLS can fix fundamental layer 2 issues).



> No, I don't like UDLD at all - too many bad experiences with it. It
> was a necessary evil with cat5500s and 100Mb fiber connections, but
> you don't need UDLD on 1Gb fiber links.

UDLD had bugs, so did STP, RSTP, MST and even autonegotiation, but if
your IOS image is younger than 6 years, those bugs have probably been
fixed.



> So it seems like loop guard isn't needed if rstp is enabled.

I strongly disagree.

Another example where loop guard will help you and where both UDLD
and RSTP fail is this (no unidirectional link needed for this):

Suppose two switches are interconnected with a primary and a backup
EoWHATEVER link, and the backup link doesn't signal RFI:

- backup links goes down (both directions, not unidirectional)
- switches don't see each others BPDUs on the backup link, so they go
  into forwarding
- backup links comes back up, and formes a loop right away (STP status is
  forwarding on all ports of all links)
- when the BPDU is retransmitted (once every 2 seconds in rapid-pvst),
  there's already a loop on the circuit overloading the links capacity,
  so that the BPDU that are supposed to fix the problem are lost
- because the primary link is also overloaded, BPDU will be lost on that
  link as well
- you have to manually interrupt the loop to restore the service


Loop guard will prevent the switch from making the stupid decision to
move the port from blocking to forwarding, because it doesn't receive any
BPDUs from the other switch anymore (Discarding -> Learning -> Forwarding
in rapid-pvst). Instead, it will block the traffic indefinitely until
BPDUs arrive again on that Vlan (this is per stp instance, so per vlan in
rapid-pvst).


One could argue that BPDUs need to be prioritized on all links, including
Layer 2 Ethernet poing-to-point links, but thats besides the point, because
you would still get a loop in the example mentioned above (until STP
converges); also this is often difficult/not doable on layer 2 circuits.



>> so apparently 100Mb fiber doesn't have that problem any more. I don't
>> think 1 or 10Gb fiber ever did..
> I believe if you implement autonego, you have to implement RFI. But
> I'm not 100% sure about that.

I can tell that at least single-fiber 100BASE-BX10 (such as these [1])
don't do autonegotiation (in fact unidirectional links in 100BAS

Re: [c-nsp] EEM not triggering on IOS-XE 3.11.1S

2016-01-18 Thread Lukas Tribus
Hello!


> I'm working on an EEM script which is triggered by an IP SLA down state
> on an ASR1000 running IOS-XE 3.11.1S. While the IP SLA entry detects
> the state properly, the EEM does not trigger.

A state is not an event.
A state *change* is an event.

So I suspect the script will trigger when the state CHANGES from UP to
DOWN, but it won't continuously trigger WHILE the state is DOWN.



> rtr5#sh ip sla statistics 1
> IPSLAs Latest Operation Statistics
>
> IPSLA operation id: 1
> Latest RTT: NoConnection/Busy/Timeout
> Latest operation start time: 11:42:21 EST Mon Jan 18 2016
> Latest operation return code: Timeout
> Number of successes: 0
> Number of failures: 301
> Operation time to live: Forever

0 successes, so there never was a state change.

Bring that sla probe to success at least once, then make it fail.



Regards,

Lukas

  
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Re: [c-nsp] Dell VLT to Cisco VSS

2016-01-18 Thread David Wilkinson

Hi Nick,

I haven't done with Cisco VSS, however I have linked a pair of Dell F10 
MXL-10/40GbEs with a pair of Cisco Nexus N3Ks

On the Cisco Nexus end I used VPC and VLT on the Dell F10 side.

Both sides were setup with LACP and worked fine without issues. As far 
as each side was concerned they were in a port channel with a single 
switch running LACP


Hope that helps.

Regards

David


On 18/01/2016 19:56, Paul wrote:
Haven't tested it with Dell(force10 stuffs), but have with several 
other vendors and never had a problem with LAG implementation using 
the standard so I'd assume it would work but you just never know, 
different hardware versions, code versions, etc.. bugs..



On 1/18/2016 5:10 AM, Nick Cutting wrote:

I am familiar with the theory

I was wondering If anyone had actually done this, and if there are 
any real world caveats.


I will be testing this week, however the kit is in Hong Kong, so it's 
a bit "remote handsy"


-Original Message-
From: Paul [mailto:p...@gtcomm.net]
Sent: 18 January 2016 09:38
To: Nick Cutting; cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: Re: [c-nsp] Dell VLT to Cisco VSS

VSS is single control plane so it's all one big chassis, the dell 
switch would have no idea it isn't connected to a single 6500 and 
should work without issues.
VPC is dual control planes using mLAG which is still transparent to 
the LAG partner as long as the control protocol is standard (802.1ax 
w/ LACP for

example)  there *should* be no issues.
stritcly talking about link aggregation here, whatever else you might 
be running is another story as with everything... test it first :)




On 1/18/2016 3:12 AM, Nick Cutting wrote:

I'm told Dell VLT is very similar to Nexus VPC.
I plan to connect 2 Dell S4820T switches to a VSS'ed 6500 (QSFP+
breakout cables) It would be similar to 2 nexus5/7k's connected to a 
VSS pair.


Or am I a mad man, dancing with inter-vendor prop tech - and would 
be better off with a normal LACP port channel to one 6500, for each 
switch?


Does anyone have an field experience doing this?

Thanks,
Nick

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Re: [c-nsp] Cisco ASR920-24SZ-IM BVI Feature Limitations

2016-01-18 Thread michalis.bersimis
Hello,

Irrelevant of BVI feature, one another limitation also is the lack of support 
of mVPN (Draft-rosen model) and only mldp feature is supported at least prior 
to the IOS 3.17. Although, 3.17 CCO says that it supports the feature, during 
testing, there as some issues, such as no pim neighborship over VRF which seems 
the ASR920 cannot perform neighborship with the other PE, although the other 
PEs see the ASR920 as a neighbor.

The above, can be "fix" with the selection of  SDM video profile, that enables 
the neighborship over VRF to be working does come up, but no mcast traffic is 
flowing. We have an open case with TAC for this. Also in 3.17 the IPv4 scale 
witth SDP IP profile is increased from 20k to 24k but it decreases some others 
eg. VPLS instances etc.

Michalis Bersimis
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Re: [c-nsp] Cisco ASR920-24SZ-IM BVI Feature Limitations

2016-01-18 Thread Mark Tinka


On 19/Jan/16 08:22, michalis.bersi...@hq.cyta.gr wrote:

> Hello,
>
> Irrelevant of BVI feature, one another limitation also is the lack of support 
> of mVPN (Draft-rosen model) and only mldp feature is supported at least prior 
> to the IOS 3.17. Although, 3.17 CCO says that it supports the feature, during 
> testing, there as some issues, such as no pim neighborship over VRF which 
> seems the ASR920 cannot perform neighborship with the other PE, although the 
> other PEs see the ASR920 as a neighbor.
>
> The above, can be "fix" with the selection of  SDM video profile, that 
> enables the neighborship over VRF to be working does come up, but no mcast 
> traffic is flowing. We have an open case with TAC for this. Also in 3.17 the 
> IPv4 scale witth SDP IP profile is increased from 20k to 24k but it decreases 
> some others eg. VPLS instances etc.

The ASR920 supports NG-MVPN, and we tested this.

Are you testing NG-MVPN or Rosen?

Mark.
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Re: [c-nsp] Cisco ASR920-24SZ-IM BVI Feature Limitations

2016-01-18 Thread michalis.bersimis
I am testing draft rosen model, as stated here for IOS XE 3.17 
(http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/td/docs/routers/asr920/release/notes/ASR920_rel_notes/new_features.html#pgfId-1085169
 )  

Michalis


-Original Message-
From: Mark Tinka [mailto:mark.ti...@seacom.mu] 
Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2016 8:36 AM
To: Μπερσίμης Μιχάλης (900356); cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: Re: [c-nsp] Cisco ASR920-24SZ-IM BVI Feature Limitations



On 19/Jan/16 08:22, michalis.bersi...@hq.cyta.gr wrote:

> Hello,
>
> Irrelevant of BVI feature, one another limitation also is the lack of support 
> of mVPN (Draft-rosen model) and only mldp feature is supported at least prior 
> to the IOS 3.17. Although, 3.17 CCO says that it supports the feature, during 
> testing, there as some issues, such as no pim neighborship over VRF which 
> seems the ASR920 cannot perform neighborship with the other PE, although the 
> other PEs see the ASR920 as a neighbor.
>
> The above, can be "fix" with the selection of  SDM video profile, that 
> enables the neighborship over VRF to be working does come up, but no mcast 
> traffic is flowing. We have an open case with TAC for this. Also in 3.17 the 
> IPv4 scale witth SDP IP profile is increased from 20k to 24k but it decreases 
> some others eg. VPLS instances etc.

The ASR920 supports NG-MVPN, and we tested this.

Are you testing NG-MVPN or Rosen?

Mark.
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Re: [c-nsp] Cisco ASR920-24SZ-IM BVI Feature Limitations

2016-01-18 Thread Mark Tinka


On 19/Jan/16 08:40, michalis.bersi...@hq.cyta.gr wrote:

> I am testing draft rosen model, as stated here for IOS XE 3.17 
> (http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/td/docs/routers/asr920/release/notes/ASR920_rel_notes/new_features.html#pgfId-1085169
>  )  

Waris and others might want to comment, but I have a feeling Rosen might
be broken on the ASR920, in favour of NG-MVPN.

I could be wrong...

Mark.
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