Re: Stus-List Baby stay vs Cunningham?

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

Doesn't the cunngham assist the halyard in moving draft forward?

-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dave S via 
CnC-List
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2017 10:43 PM
To: C&c Stus List
Cc: Dave S
Subject: Stus-List Baby stay vs Cunningham?

Both depower the main  Does the adjustable baby stay (mast bend) make the 
Cunningham (luff tension) redundant?
I have an adjustable baby stay, is adding a Cunningham a waste of time?

Thanks , Dave
33-2

Sent from my iPhone
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Stus-List 33-2 shroud tensions

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

Does anybody have numbers for shroud tension on 33-2 using Loos Rt-10?

Thanks

Mike
For Colmonel
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Re: Stus-List Baby stay vs Cunningham?

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

Cunningham does flatten the sail but simply due to luff tension.

If a baby stay is able to pull the belly of the mast forward then the luff
is also pulled forward and the resulting shape of the sail is flatter.

Josh

On Thu, May 18, 2017, 8:18 AM Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List 
wrote:

> Doesn't the cunngham assist the halyard in moving draft forward?
>
> -Original Message-
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dave S
> via CnC-List
> Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2017 10:43 PM
> To: C&c Stus List
> Cc: Dave S
> Subject: Stus-List Baby stay vs Cunningham?
>
> Both depower the main  Does the adjustable baby stay (mast bend) make
> the Cunningham (luff tension) redundant?
> I have an adjustable baby stay, is adding a Cunningham a waste of time?
>
> Thanks , Dave
> 33-2
>
> Sent from my iPhone
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
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Re: Stus-List Baby stay vs Cunningham?

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

And bending mast would also open leech

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Josh Muckley 
via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 9:52 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Josh Muckley
Subject: Re: Stus-List Baby stay vs Cunningham?


Cunningham does flatten the sail but simply due to luff tension.

If a baby stay is able to pull the belly of the mast forward then the luff is 
also pulled forward and the resulting shape of the sail is flatter.

Josh

On Thu, May 18, 2017, 8:18 AM Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
Doesn't the cunngham assist the halyard in moving draft forward?

-Original Message-
From: CnC-List 
[mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On 
Behalf Of Dave S via CnC-List
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2017 10:43 PM
To: C&c Stus List
Cc: Dave S
Subject: Stus-List Baby stay vs Cunningham?

Both depower the main  Does the adjustable baby stay (mast bend) make the 
Cunningham (luff tension) redundant?
I have an adjustable baby stay, is adding a Cunningham a waste of time?

Thanks , Dave
33-2

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: Stus-List Baby stay vs Cunningham?

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

There is a difference between the amount of max draft and the location of
max draft.

Mast bend affects the amount of maximum draft.  Luff tension or cunningham
affects the location of maximum draft.

For a headsail, headstay sag affects the amount of maximum draft.  Halyard
tension affects the location of maximum draft.

Dennis C.
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Re: Stus-List 33-2 shroud tensions

[John McKay via CnC-List]

MikeThe guage will give a recommended tension for the rod diameter. I would 
started with this.
I just started to use the Loos guage last fall so not much experience with the 
guage really.
John on EnterpriseSarnia Ontario 

On Thursday, May 18, 2017 8:19 AM, "Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List" 
 wrote:
 

  Does 
anybody have numbers for shroud tension on 33-2 using Loos Rt-10?    Thanks    
Mike For Colmonel ___

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Re: Stus-List 33-2 shroud tensions

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

Does anyone know off hand the diameter of the rod used on 33-2 
upper/lower/intermediates?

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of John McKay 
via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 10:16 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: John McKay
Subject: Re: Stus-List 33-2 shroud tensions

Mike
The guage will give a recommended tension for the rod diameter. I would started 
with this.

I just started to use the Loos guage last fall so not much experience with the 
guage really.

John on Enterprise
Sarnia Ontario

On Thursday, May 18, 2017 8:19 AM, "Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List" 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:

Does anybody have numbers for shroud tension on 33-2 using Loos Rt-10?

Thanks

Mike
For Colmonel
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Stus-List 33-2 shroud tensions

[robert via CnC-List]

I use the Loos RT 10 to tension my rig.our rigs are different so 
numbers may be irrelevant.without the gauge, I would be guessing and 
from experience, that's not a very accurate way to know how much tension 
is on the shrouds.


If you have rod rigging, the tension should never exceed 20% of the 
breaking strength of the rod.  My uppers are tensioned around 15% , 
lowers around 13% of the rod's breaking strength.


Rob Abbott
AZURA
C&C 32 - 84
Halifax, N.S.



On Thursday, May 18, 2017 8:19 AM, "Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List" 
 wrote:



Does anybody have numbers for shroud tension on 33-2 using Loos Rt-10?
Thanks
Mike
For Colmonel
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___

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Stus-List 33-2 shroud tensions

[robert via CnC-List]

Mike:

The Loos RT 10 gauge can measure the diameter of the rod.

Rob

On 2017-05-18 10:19 AM, Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List wrote:


Does anyone know off hand the diameter of the rod used on 33-2 
upper/lower/intermediates?


*From:*CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of 
*John McKay via CnC-List

*Sent:* Thursday, May 18, 2017 10:16 AM
*To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
*Cc:* John McKay
*Subject:* Re: Stus-List 33-2 shroud tensions

Mike

The guage will give a recommended tension for the rod diameter. I 
would started with this.


I just started to use the Loos guage last fall so not much experience 
with the guage really.


John on Enterprise

Sarnia Ontario

On Thursday, May 18, 2017 8:19 AM, "Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List" 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:


Does anybody have numbers for shroud tension on 33-2 using Loos Rt-10?

Thanks

Mike

For Colmonel

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you wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: 
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Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

[Jim Reinardy via CnC-List]

Curious about those who have an RT-10 gauge, did you find a deal?  I see prices on those at about $500, which I am having trouble justifying.Jim ReinardyC&C 30-2 "Firewater"Milwaukee, WI






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Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

There are no deals on those.  Looked on kijiji, ebay and elsewhere.  Very 
expensive

Three of us split the cost of one.  Tartan Thomas 35, C&C 33-2, Frers 33

Really hard to justify the cost

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Jim Reinardy 
via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 11:56 AM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: firewa...@reinardy.us
Subject: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

Curious about those who have an RT-10 gauge, did you find a deal?  I see prices 
on those at about $500, which I am having trouble justifying.

Jim Reinardy
C&C 30-2 "Firewater"
Milwaukee, WI

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Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

[Chuck Borge via CnC-List]

Newport Nautical Supply, a consignment shop in Newport RI had one this
winter for $250
I picked one up last year there for just under that.

Nice to have for peace-of-mind.

Chuck B
C&C 34 Elusive
Somerset, MA




*Chuck Borge*

*508-642-3557*

On Thu, May 18, 2017 at 11:00 AM, Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> There are no deals on those.  Looked on kijiji, ebay and elsewhere.  Very
> expensive
>
>
>
> Three of us split the cost of one.  Tartan Thomas 35, C&C 33-2, Frers 33
>
>
>
> Really hard to justify the cost
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Jim
> Reinardy via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Thursday, May 18, 2017 11:56 AM
> *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> *Cc:* firewa...@reinardy.us
> *Subject:* Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge
>
>
>
> Curious about those who have an RT-10 gauge, did you find a deal?  I see
> prices on those at about $500, which I am having trouble justifying.
>
>
>
> Jim Reinardy
>
> C&C 30-2 "Firewater"
>
> Milwaukee, WI
>
>
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

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Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

[Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List]

Their model 90 is substantially cheaper. If you are a rigger, you probably want 
the better model RT-10. But for checking the tension of you rig, a model 90 
(there are two types (A and B) and you have to figure out which one would work 
for you) should be sufficient. And they cost around $100.

Marek

From: Jim Reinardy via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 10:57
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: firewa...@reinardy.us
Subject: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

Curious about those who have an RT-10 gauge, did you find a deal?  I see prices 
on those at about $500, which I am having trouble justifying.

Jim Reinardy
C&C 30-2 "Firewater"
Milwaukee, WI

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Stus-List Battery compartment and battery boxes

[David Knecht via CnC-List]

I have finished my rewiring project and everything seems to be working fine.  I 
ended up putting a Blue Sea Si-ACR to control charging inside the battery 
compartment as I could find no other accessible space for it.  It is not pretty 
crowded inside that area with wires, two batteries, and the ACR.  The 
compartment is a solid bottom fiberglass area with a wood top panel for access 
and a strap that goes through slots on the bottom of the compartment.  The 
batteries are sealed AGM.  I am considering removing the two battery boxes that 
the batteries sit inside of inside the compartment as they seem redundant to me 
with sealed batteries.  I can strap down the batteries instead of strapping 
down the battery boxes.  This will give me a bit more room and flexibility in 
the compartment.  Is there any safety reason I should not do this?  Thanks- Dave

Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT



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Stus-List Fun Race Last Night

[RANDY via CnC-List]

It was a good night for a C&C 30 MK I on Chatfield Reservoir last night - 
blowing 20mph. My competition was depowering, but I flew my 150 :) Grenadine 
did round up once on the way to the windward mark, but other than that the 
amount of weather helm was about right - tiller about five degrees above 
centerline. Managed to get a rail in the water for the first time and don't 
know why - I've sailed in stronger wind with the same amount of sail - must've 
had more rail meat those times. 

Anyway, Grenadine was second across the starting line. Only tacked once, and 
overtook the leader, before rounding the windward mark. Had the thrill of 
leading the fleet from there, and took line honors. Beat the next boat, a Cal 
22, by 73 seconds in a 30-minute race, but he has a gift PHRF of 246 and should 
correct over me by a few seconds. 

Saw 8 knots on the knotmeter but don't trust its calibration and didn't verify 
with GPS. However I hit 7.6 knots on GPS last year with a fixed 2-blade prop. I 
think she can break 8 knots with her new folding prop; I can tell she's faster. 

Offseason projects paying off; wanted to share the joy. 

Cheers, 
Randy Stafford 
S/V Grenadine 
C&C 30-1 #7 
Ken Caryl, CO 
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Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

The model 90 is for cable not rod

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek 
Dziedzic via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 1:04 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Marek Dziedzic
Subject: Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

Their model 90 is substantially cheaper. If you are a rigger, you probably want 
the better model RT-10. But for checking the tension of you rig, a model 90 
(there are two types (A and B) and you have to figure out which one would work 
for you) should be sufficient. And they cost around $100.

Marek

From: Jim Reinardy via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 10:57
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: firewa...@reinardy.us
Subject: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

Curious about those who have an RT-10 gauge, did you find a deal?  I see prices 
on those at about $500, which I am having trouble justifying.

Jim Reinardy
C&C 30-2 "Firewater"
Milwaukee, WI

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Re: Stus-List Battery compartment and battery boxes

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

My gel batteries are not in boxes. You can cut them in half and they would not 
leak.

Joe
Coquina

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of David Knecht 
via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 12:06 PM
To: CnC CnC discussion list 
Cc: David Knecht 
Subject: Stus-List Battery compartment and battery boxes

I have finished my rewiring project and everything seems to be working fine.  I 
ended up putting a Blue Sea Si-ACR to control charging inside the battery 
compartment as I could find no other accessible space for it.  It is not pretty 
crowded inside that area with wires, two batteries, and the ACR.  The 
compartment is a solid bottom fiberglass area with a wood top panel for access 
and a strap that goes through slots on the bottom of the compartment.  The 
batteries are sealed AGM.  I am considering removing the two battery boxes that 
the batteries sit inside of inside the compartment as they seem redundant to me 
with sealed batteries.  I can strap down the batteries instead of strapping 
down the battery boxes.  This will give me a bit more room and flexibility in 
the compartment.  Is there any safety reason I should not do this?  Thanks- Dave

Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT

[cid:image001.png@01D2CFD5.367D2300]

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Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

[Jim Reinardy via CnC-List]

Mike,I think you are correct, yes.  I do see some indication that the PT series works for rod though.  Anybody using one of those?  That would be more in that $100 range as well.http://loosnaples.com/tension-gauges/professional-modelsJim


 Original Message 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge
From: "Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List" 
Date: Thu, May 18, 2017 9:33 am
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Cc: "Hoyt, Mike" 

The model 90 is for cable not rod     From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 1:04 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Marek Dziedzic Subject: Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge    Their model 90 is substantially cheaper. If you are a rigger, you probably want the better model RT-10. But for checking the tension of you rig, a model 90 (there are two types (A and B) and you have to figure out which one would work for you) should be sufficient. And they cost around $100.       Marek  From: Jim Reinardy via CnC-ListSent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 10:57   To: cnc-list@cnc-list.comCc: firewa...@reinardy.usSubject: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge   Curious about those who have an RT-10 gauge, did you find a deal?  I see prices on those at about $500, which I am having trouble justifying.       Jim Reinardy   C&C 30-2 "Firewater"   Milwaukee, WI  ___

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All Contributions are greatly appreciated!




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Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

Bought mine for ~$500.  There are ways to tune the rig without but I like
the consistency and scientific order to doing it with a tension gauge.  My
understanding is that you need an RT-10 or RT-11 for rod rigging.  The
important factor being that rod is naturally more rigid than wire thus the
scale is different.
After tuning, the boat no longer has a pronounced favoritism for a port
tack.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD

On May 18, 2017 10:57 AM, "Jim Reinardy via CnC-List" 
wrote:

> Curious about those who have an RT-10 gauge, did you find a deal?  I see
> prices on those at about $500, which I am having trouble justifying.
>
> Jim Reinardy
> C&C 30-2 "Firewater"
> Milwaukee, WI
>
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

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Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

[Jim Reinardy via CnC-List]

Josh,I am guessing you are right, but I sent a note to Loos about using the PT series and will share anything I get back. Thanks,Jim


 Original Message 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge
From: Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
Date: Thu, May 18, 2017 11:01 am
To: "C&C List" 
Cc: Josh Muckley 

Bought mine for ~$500.  There are ways to tune the rig without but I like the consistency and scientific order to doing it with a tension gauge.  My understanding is that you need an RT-10 or RT-11 for rod rigging.  The important factor being that rod is naturally more rigid than wire thus the scale is different.After tuning, the boat no longer has a pronounced favoritism for a port tack.Josh MuckleyS/V Sea Hawk1989 C&C 37+Solomons, MDOn May 18, 2017 10:57 AM, "Jim Reinardy via CnC-List"  wrote:Curious about those who have an RT-10 gauge, did you find a deal?  I see prices on those at about $500, which I am having trouble justifying.Jim ReinardyC&C 30-2 "Firewater"Milwaukee, WI ___  This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  All Contributions are greatly appreciated!  ___

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Re: Stus-List Fun Race Last Night

[Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List]

Congratulations Randy!  Now enjoy the snowstorm!
Chuck Gilchrest 

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 18, 2017, at 12:21 PM, RANDY via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> It was a good night for a C&C 30 MK I on Chatfield Reservoir last night - 
> blowing 20mph.  My competition was depowering, but I flew my 150 :)  
> Grenadine did round up once on the way to the windward mark, but other than 
> that the amount of weather helm was about right - tiller about five degrees 
> above centerline.  Managed to get a rail in the water for the first time and 
> don't know why - I've sailed in stronger wind with the same amount of sail - 
> must've had more rail meat those times.
> 
> Anyway, Grenadine was second across the starting line.  Only tacked once, and 
> overtook the leader, before rounding the windward mark.  Had the thrill of 
> leading the fleet from there, and took line honors.  Beat the next boat, a 
> Cal 22, by 73 seconds in a 30-minute race, but he has a gift PHRF of 246 and 
> should correct over me by a few seconds.
> 
> Saw 8 knots on the knotmeter but don't trust its calibration and didn't 
> verify with GPS.  However I hit 7.6 knots on GPS last year with a fixed 
> 2-blade prop.  I think she can break 8 knots with her new folding prop; I can 
> tell she's faster.
> 
> Offseason projects paying off; wanted to share the joy.
> 
> Cheers,
> Randy Stafford
> S/V Grenadine
> C&C 30-1 #7
> Ken Caryl, CO
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List Baby stay vs Cunningham?

[Sam Salter via CnC-List]

They both "depower" the main‎ but it's not the same thing going on:
As the wind builds it pushes the max draft in the ‎main aft. This increases 
drag until it slows the boat and increases heel. The Cunningham brings the max. 
draft forward again to make the aerofoil more effective. It increases lift and 
reduces drag. Making more of the lift available in the forward vector.
‎It's more effective than tensioning the main halliard as the main halliard 
also tensions the leech, cupping it and reducing speed by increasing drag 
again. The Cunningham, mostly tensions just the luff.
The baby stay will just flatten the main to reduce lift by increasing the cord 
lenth of the aerofoil (as far as it can bend our thick masts) 
As said before, it also stops the mast pumping, which the Cunningham obviously 
doesn't.
You need both!‎ 

sam :-)
C&C 26 Liquorice 
Ghost Lake Alberta 

  Original Message  
From: Dave S via CnC-List
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2017 7:43 PM
To: C&c Stus List
Reply To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Dave S
Subject: Stus-List Baby stay vs Cunningham?

Both depower the main Does the adjustable baby stay (mast bend) make the 
Cunningham (luff tension) redundant?
I have an adjustable baby stay, is adding a Cunningham a waste of time?

Thanks , Dave
33-2

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: Stus-List Fun Race Last Night

[David Knecht via CnC-List]

Theoretical hull speed of a C&C 30 is 6.7 knots (based on 25’ water line).  How 
are you hitting 7.6-8?  Foils?  Dave

Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT



> On May 18, 2017, at 2:29 PM, Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Congratulations Randy!  Now enjoy the snowstorm!
> Chuck Gilchrest 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On May 18, 2017, at 12:21 PM, RANDY via CnC-List  > wrote:
> 
>> It was a good night for a C&C 30 MK I on Chatfield Reservoir last night - 
>> blowing 20mph.  My competition was depowering, but I flew my 150 :)  
>> Grenadine did round up once on the way to the windward mark, but other than 
>> that the amount of weather helm was about right - tiller about five degrees 
>> above centerline.  Managed to get a rail in the water for the first time and 
>> don't know why - I've sailed in stronger wind with the same amount of sail - 
>> must've had more rail meat those times.
>> 
>> Anyway, Grenadine was second across the starting line.  Only tacked once, 
>> and overtook the leader, before rounding the windward mark.  Had the thrill 
>> of leading the fleet from there, and took line honors.  Beat the next boat, 
>> a Cal 22, by 73 seconds in a 30-minute race, but he has a gift PHRF of 246 
>> and should correct over me by a few seconds.
>> 
>> Saw 8 knots on the knotmeter but don't trust its calibration and didn't 
>> verify with GPS.  However I hit 7.6 knots on GPS last year with a fixed 
>> 2-blade prop.  I think she can break 8 knots with her new folding prop; I 
>> can tell she's faster.
>> 
>> Offseason projects paying off; wanted to share the joy.
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> Randy Stafford
>> S/V Grenadine
>> C&C 30-1 #7
>> Ken Caryl, CO
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
>> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
>> 
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

[Jim Reinardy via CnC-List]

Here is the reply from Loos:"PT gauges are for wire rope only, there is no conversion for rod. The statement on the web site only infers that we make both kinds."I guess it is RT series or nothing.  I have contacted the store in Newport, we will see if that pans out.  Thanks for all the help!Jim


 Original Message 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge
From: Jim Reinardy via CnC-List 
Date: Thu, May 18, 2017 11:21 am
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: firewa...@reinardy.us

Josh,I am guessing you are right, but I sent a note to Loos about using the PT series and will share anything I get back. Thanks,Jim    Original Message  Subject: Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge From: Josh Muckley via CnC-List  Date: Thu, May 18, 2017 11:01 am To: "C&C List"  Cc: Josh Muckley   Bought mine for ~$500.  There are ways to tune the rig without but I like the consistency and scientific order to doing it with a tension gauge.  My understanding is that you need an RT-10 or RT-11 for rod rigging.  The important factor being that rod is naturally more rigid than wire thus the scale is different.After tuning, the boat no longer has a pronounced favoritism for a port tack.Josh MuckleyS/V Sea Hawk1989 C&C 37+Solomons, MDOn May 18, 2017 10:57 AM, "Jim Reinardy via CnC-List"  wrote:Curious about those who have an RT-10 gauge, did you find a deal?  I see prices on those at about $500, which I am having trouble justifying.Jim ReinardyC&C 30-2 "Firewater"Milwaukee, WI ___  This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  All Contributions are greatly appreciated!  ___  This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  All Contributions are greatly appreciated!   ___

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Re: Stus-List Baby stay vs Cunningham?

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

Mike I believe you are correct but isn't that simply a side effect?  Leech
tension and sail twist should be controlled by the mail sheet and vang.  In
fact I think the opening of the leech is experienced more with changes in
backstay tension as a result of changing the position of the masthead.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think that your statement is metaphorically
equivalent to saying, "The backstay controls main sheet tension."  True the
backstay can affect main sheet tension, but that's not its purpose.
Likewise, bending the mast can open the leech but that's not its purpose
and the components designed to control the leech (vang and mainsheet) are
still available to "close" it.  Kind of a does the tail wag the dog
situation.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD



On May 18, 2017 9:00 AM, "Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List" 
wrote:

And bending mast would also open leech



*From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Josh
Muckley via CnC-List
*Sent:* Thursday, May 18, 2017 9:52 AM
*To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
*Cc:* Josh Muckley
*Subject:* Re: Stus-List Baby stay vs Cunningham?



Cunningham does flatten the sail but simply due to luff tension.

If a baby stay is able to pull the belly of the mast forward then the luff
is also pulled forward and the resulting shape of the sail is flatter.

Josh



On Thu, May 18, 2017, 8:18 AM Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List 
wrote:

Doesn't the cunngham assist the halyard in moving draft forward?

-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dave S
via CnC-List
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2017 10:43 PM
To: C&c Stus List
Cc: Dave S
Subject: Stus-List Baby stay vs Cunningham?

Both depower the main  Does the adjustable baby stay (mast bend) make
the Cunningham (luff tension) redundant?
I have an adjustable baby stay, is adding a Cunningham a waste of time?

Thanks , Dave
33-2

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: Stus-List Fun Race Last Night

[RANDY via CnC-List]

I'm just as surprised as anyone. I know that 1.34 times the square root of 
24.75 (Grenadine's waterline in feet) is 6.67 knots. But apparently that's only 
a very general rule - see 
http://www.boats.com/reviews/crunching-numbers-hull-speed-boat-length and 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hull_speed . At 9,000 pounds displacement I 
guarantee I'm not planing :) 

But I assume GPS doesn't lie. On June 22nd last year I was using RaceQs during 
a race. I forgot to switch it off after finishing, so it recorded Grenadine 
sailing for fun in the 25-33mph gusts that piped up after the race, under full 
main and 150% genoa (which tore that night, before I could get a rail in the 
water). If you watch this replay from 19:42:50-19:43:00 local time, you'll see 
Grenadine going 7.5 knots over ground according to RaceQs GPS-based iPhone app: 

http://raceqs.com/tv-beta/tv.htm#userId=1032518&divisionId=41508&updatedAt=2016-06-23T03:05:38Z&dt=2016-06-22T18:08:05-06:00..2016-06-22T21:05:54-06:00&boat=Grenadine
 

I'm not one to look a gift horse in the mouth :) Maybe at 25 degrees of heel my 
waterline length is appreciably longer than 24.75 feet. Or maybe I just have to 
give credit to George Cassian, George Cuthbertson, and Rob Ball for designing a 
faster-than-predicted hull form. 

Cheers, 
Randy 

- Original Message -

From: "David Knecht via CnC-List"  
To: "CnC CnC discussion list"  
Cc: "David Knecht"  
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 1:25:19 PM 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Fun Race Last Night 

Theoretical hull speed of a C&C 30 is 6.7 knots (based on 25’ water line). How 
are you hitting 7.6-8? Foils? Dave 

Aries 
1990 C&C 34+ 
New London, CT 





On May 18, 2017, at 2:29 PM, Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List < 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com > wrote: 

Congratulations Randy! Now enjoy the snowstorm! 
Chuck Gilchrest 

Sent from my iPhone 

On May 18, 2017, at 12:21 PM, RANDY via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com > 
wrote: 




It was a good night for a C&C 30 MK I on Chatfield Reservoir last night - 
blowing 20mph. My competition was depowering, but I flew my 150 :) Grenadine 
did round up once on the way to the windward mark, but other than that the 
amount of weather helm was about right - tiller about five degrees above 
centerline. Managed to get a rail in the water for the first time and don't 
know why - I've sailed in stronger wind with the same amount of sail - must've 
had more rail meat those times. 

Anyway, Grenadine was second across the starting line. Only tacked once, and 
overtook the leader, before rounding the windward mark. Had the thrill of 
leading the fleet from there, and took line honors. Beat the next boat, a Cal 
22, by 73 seconds in a 30-minute race, but he has a gift PHRF of 246 and should 
correct over me by a few seconds. 

Saw 8 knots on the knotmeter but don't trust its calibration and didn't verify 
with GPS. However I hit 7.6 knots on GPS last year with a fixed 2-blade prop. I 
think she can break 8 knots with her new folding prop; I can tell she's faster. 

Offseason projects paying off; wanted to share the joy. 

Cheers, 
Randy Stafford 
S/V Grenadine 
C&C 30-1 #7 
Ken Caryl, CO 





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Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

I'm sure somebody might be willing to let you borrow one for the cost of
shipping...

On May 18, 2017 3:35 PM, "Jim Reinardy via CnC-List" 
wrote:

> Here is the reply from Loos:
>
> "PT gauges are for wire rope only, there is no conversion for rod. The
> statement on the web site only infers that we make both kinds."
>
> I guess it is RT series or nothing.  I have contacted the store in
> Newport, we will see if that pans out.  Thanks for all the help!
>
> Jim
>
>  Original Message 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge
> From: Jim Reinardy via CnC-List 
> Date: Thu, May 18, 2017 11:21 am
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: firewa...@reinardy.us
>
> Josh,
>
> I am guessing you are right, but I sent a note to Loos about using the PT
> series and will share anything I get back.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim
>
>  Original Message 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge
> From: Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
> Date: Thu, May 18, 2017 11:01 am
> To: "C&C List" 
> Cc: Josh Muckley 
>
> Bought mine for ~$500.  There are ways to tune the rig without but I like
> the consistency and scientific order to doing it with a tension gauge.  My
> understanding is that you need an RT-10 or RT-11 for rod rigging.  The
> important factor being that rod is naturally more rigid than wire thus the
> scale is different.
> After tuning, the boat no longer has a pronounced favoritism for a port
> tack.
>
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C&C 37+
> Solomons, MD
>
> On May 18, 2017 10:57 AM, "Jim Reinardy via CnC-List" <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>> Curious about those who have an RT-10 gauge, did you find a deal?  I see
>> prices on those at about $500, which I am having trouble justifying.
>>
>> Jim Reinardy
>> C&C 30-2 "Firewater"
>> Milwaukee, WI
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>>
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
>> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>>
>> --
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
> --
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
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Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

[Harry Hallgring Jr via CnC-List]

Who needs a Loos gauge?  I have one to lend

Harry
Newport, RI
Sent from my iPhone 8 beta

> On May 18, 2017, at 17:11, Josh Muckley via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> I'm sure somebody might be willing to let you borrow one for the cost of 
> shipping... 
> 
>> On May 18, 2017 3:35 PM, "Jim Reinardy via CnC-List"  
>> wrote:
>> Here is the reply from Loos:
>> 
>> "PT gauges are for wire rope only, there is no conversion for rod. The 
>> statement on the web site only infers that we make both kinds."
>> 
>> I guess it is RT series or nothing.  I have contacted the store in Newport, 
>> we will see if that pans out.  Thanks for all the help!
>> 
>> Jim
>>  Original Message 
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge
>> From: Jim Reinardy via CnC-List 
>> Date: Thu, May 18, 2017 11:21 am
>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
>> Cc: firewa...@reinardy.us
>> 
>> Josh,
>> 
>> I am guessing you are right, but I sent a note to Loos about using the PT 
>> series and will share anything I get back. 
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> 
>> Jim
>>  Original Message 
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge
>> From: Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
>> Date: Thu, May 18, 2017 11:01 am
>> To: "C&C List" 
>> Cc: Josh Muckley 
>> 
>> Bought mine for ~$500.  There are ways to tune the rig without but I like 
>> the consistency and scientific order to doing it with a tension gauge.  My 
>> understanding is that you need an RT-10 or RT-11 for rod rigging.  The 
>> important factor being that rod is naturally more rigid than wire thus the 
>> scale is different.
>> After tuning, the boat no longer has a pronounced favoritism for a port tack.
>> 
>> Josh Muckley
>> S/V Sea Hawk
>> 1989 C&C 37+
>> Solomons, MD
>> 
>>> On May 18, 2017 10:57 AM, "Jim Reinardy via CnC-List" 
>>>  wrote:
>>> Curious about those who have an RT-10 gauge, did you find a deal?  I see 
>>> prices on those at about $500, which I am having trouble justifying.
>>> 
>>> Jim Reinardy
>>> C&C 30-2 "Firewater"
>>> Milwaukee, WI
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> 
>>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you 
>>> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
>>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>> 
>>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
>> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: 
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>> 
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
>> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: 
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>> 
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
>> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>> 
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
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> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

[Jim Reinardy via CnC-List]

 
Harry,
 
I would take you up on that if you are willing to ship.  I would happily pay 
freight and a rental charge!
 
Jim Reinardy
 
 
- Original Message - Subject: Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod 
tension gauge
From: "Harry Hallgring Jr via CnC-List" 
Date: 5/18/17 2:54 pm
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: "Harry Hallgring Jr" 

 Who needs a Loos gauge?  I have one to lend

Harry
Newport, RI
 Sent from my iPhone 8 beta


On May 18, 2017, at 17:11, Josh Muckley via CnC-List  
wrote:


  I'm sure somebody might be willing to let you borrow one for the cost of 
shipping... 

 On May 18, 2017 3:35 PM, "Jim Reinardy via CnC-List"  
wrote:
   Here is the reply from Loos:
 
"PT gauges are for wire rope only, there is no conversion for rod. The 
statement on the web site only infers that we make both kinds."
 
I guess it is RT series or nothing.  I have contacted the store in Newport, we 
will see if that pans out.  Thanks for all the help!
 
Jim
  Original Message 
 Subject: Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge
 From: Jim Reinardy via CnC-List 
 Date: Thu, May 18, 2017 11:21 am
 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
 Cc: firewa...@reinardy.us
 
 Josh,
 
I am guessing you are right, but I sent a note to Loos about using the PT 
series and will share anything I get back. 
 
Thanks,
 
Jim
  Original Message 
 Subject: Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge
 From: Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
 Date: Thu, May 18, 2017 11:01 am
 To: "C&C List" 
 Cc: Josh Muckley 
 
 Bought mine for ~$500.  There are ways to tune the rig without but I like the 
consistency and scientific order to doing it with a tension gauge.  My 
understanding is that you need an RT-10 or RT-11 for rod rigging.  The 
important factor being that rod is naturally more rigid than wire thus the 
scale is different. After tuning, the boat no longer has a pronounced 
favoritism for a port tack.
 
Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD


 On May 18, 2017 10:57 AM, "Jim Reinardy via CnC-List"  
wrote:
   Curious about those who have an RT-10 gauge, did you find a deal?  I see 
prices on those at about $500, which I am having trouble justifying.
 
Jim Reinardy
C&C 30-2 "Firewater"
Milwaukee, WI
  
 

___
 
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to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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 All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
  

___
 
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 All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
 ___
 
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to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to: 
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
 
 All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
 

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to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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 All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
  


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 ___ This list is supported by the 
generous donations of our members. If you wish to make a contribution to offset 
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greatly appreciated!
___

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Re: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

[Jake Brodersen via CnC-List]

I picked mine up from another lister at a hefty discount.  Score!

 

Jake

 

Jake Brodersen

C&C 35 Mk-III “Midnight Mistress”

Hampton VA



 

 

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Jim Reinardy 
via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 10:56
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: firewa...@reinardy.us
Subject: Stus-List Loos RT-10 rod tension gauge

 

Curious about those who have an RT-10 gauge, did you find a deal?  I see prices 
on those at about $500, which I am having trouble justifying.

 

Jim Reinardy

C&C 30-2 "Firewater"

Milwaukee, WI

 

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Re: Stus-List Baby stay vs Cunningham?

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

Ultimately, to answer your question, IMO the Cunningham is a valuable
addition.

For me adjusting halyard tension is more difficult than adjusting
Cunningham.  My Cunningham is a 5 to 1 fiddle block arrangement which pulls
down on a pennant that passes through the luff cringle (2 to 1) resulting
in a compounded 10 to 1 purchase system.

With my tides marine strong track system I can nearly raise the mainsail
bare handed.  In a hurry I can close the jammer and yank on the Cunningham
and have a good luff tension.  Given a little more time, a quick crank on a
winch and the sail is set.  On upwind runs when trying to move the draft
forward I can harden up on the cunningham and the outhaul.  If I need to
further flatten the sail or keep the mast from pumping I haul on the baby
stay.  As I round the mark for the down wind run I release the cunningham
to move the draft back.  Release the outhaul to increase the draft overall
and easy the babystay as long as there is no pumping or rough chop.

Long story short - all jammers, all hand tightened, none of that requires a
winch... Or anybody getting out of the cockpit.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD


On May 17, 2017 9:43 PM, "Dave S via CnC-List" 
wrote:

> Both depower the main  Does the adjustable baby stay (mast bend) make
> the Cunningham (luff tension) redundant?
> I have an adjustable baby stay, is adding a Cunningham a waste of time?
>
> Thanks , Dave
> 33-2
>
> Sent from my iPhone
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