Re: [CGUYS] ATT DSL ok? Update
you don't have to change your setup, you can set the dsl modem up in DMZ mode...essentially making it a straight passthru device like a cable modem. Mike On Dec 12, 2007 6:38 PM, Paula Minor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The box with my DSL ATT stuff arrived today and Im not sure I'm going to even try to install it. I hadn't realized that their modem was also the wireless box. I have NO intention of redoing my wireless network again. I just bought...and lovean Airport extreme and want to use it. According to the instructions in the box, I have to use the ATT modem and set up wireless thru that. No way. Does anyone know if I can keep using the modem I currently use for Comcast and plug the DSL cable into that? It's much more complicated than I had anticipated just because I'm not new to this and want to keep my equipment the way it is now. Thanks guys. Paula IN/USA Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, wine in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming WOO HOO what a ride! Have a wonderful day! * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] USB WiFi adapter for Indigo iMac
Betty, I am looking at the Rokland RoakAir USB model at http://www.rokland.com for my TiBook, which says it does not have an airport card (died?). It says it is backwards compatible to USB 1.1 and 802.11 g or b (OS 10.3 or 10.4) - does that the iMac? Thank you, Mark Snyder -Original Message- I'm picking up a G3/500MHz iMac that doesn't have an airport card. It needs to be part of a wireless network. There are several USB WiFi adapters that work with these old iMacs. Which ones/brand/model? Is there an 802.11g model that will work? thx * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] ATT DSL ok? Update
That is also what I had to do with my DSL modem (Westel) and it worked like a charm afterwards. You have to find the right tech person to help you, or look up the settings in the book. Stewart At 07:43 AM 12/13/2007, you wrote: I had a similar situation and I was able to put the DSL modem into bridge mode and bypass its router/firewall functions entirely. Of course, I had my own router/firewall I used in its place. Finding out how to get the modem into bridge mode did take some research. on Wed, 12 Dec, Paula Minor wrote: The box with my DSL ATT stuff arrived today and Im not sure I'm going to even try to install it. I hadn't realized that their modem was also the wireless box. I have NO intention of redoing my wireless network again. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Prince of Peace Ozark, AL SL 82 * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] External hard drives bkup/ online vaulting
Being a belt and suspenders sort of guy- I would suggest both a regular hard drive rotation and on line vaulting. The hard drive rotation backups will get your system up and running faster but it is likely to miss work in progress. An automatic on line vaulting solution is more likely to save your bacon on an important project that is still in progress. There may be a feature in a home server that would backup on the fly as well. On Dec 12, 2007 4:59 PM, db [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Good point. I was assuming the users know where their critical data is. A very unrealistic assumption. I think it would take less time to sort out their data into critical and not critical then back up online than to spend time regularly trying to reliably back up everything locally. But that would be a rational approach when the world really only behaves rationally occasionally ... :) db John DeCarlo wrote: On Dec 12, 2007 2:48 PM, db [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While average people have a lot of voluminous but not time critical data such as digital photos, usually the people's critical addressbook, encrypted password list, banking, personal biz data, email etc. isn't that substantial. I would think backing up and restoring such online would be realistically do-able. ? Depends on what you mean. 1. If I, as a careful and meticulous user, have identified the most important data on a day-to-day basis, and have a way of backing up and restoring just that data, then I could probably back it up and restore it across the Internet. 2. If I, as a regular user, just backup all my hard drive and don't really know what is most critical - how many of my PowerPoint files at 10-40 MB each do I really need to restore today? - then I probably need to rely on restoring all of it. Then online restore isn't that practical. 3. If I, as a regular user, had something transparently backing up all my data, and could restore on an as-needed basis - so that when I click on a video file of my wedding, or on a document, it tells me it hasn't restored yet, but could do so in about 20 seconds (or 1 hour for the wedding video maybe) - then I could do an effective restore over the Internet. Of course, this assumes that I can reinstall the OS and all the applications locally. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- John Duncan Yoyo ---o) * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] ATT DSL ok? Update
I had a similar situation and I was able to put the DSL modem into bridge mode and bypass its router/firewall functions entirely. Of course, I had my own router/firewall I used in its place. Finding out how to get the modem into bridge mode did take some research. on Wed, 12 Dec, Paula Minor wrote: The box with my DSL ATT stuff arrived today and Im not sure I'm going to even try to install it. I hadn't realized that their modem was also the wireless box. I have NO intention of redoing my wireless network again. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Mac OS question
Steve Rigby wrote: I want to upgrade the OS 10.3.9 on my eMac 1.25 gigahertz machine. This computer can run 10.5 Leopard, but it is marginal in terms of horsepower compared to newer machines that run faster. Would Leopard cause this particular computer to bog down and perform sluggishly as opposed to how it would run under Tiger 10.4? Bear in mind that this eMac is at the bottom of Apple computers that can accept Leopard. Leopard seems nice, but I'd rather not have a sluggish machine if that would be the price I'd have to pay. Steve What is it you want to do, that it won't do now under 10.39 ? (Besides run slower ?) John * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Windows to Apple migration?
This sounds good and thanks to all who responded. I have passed this info along to the requester who will be getting the MacBook next week. One day, I'll be lucky enough to make the move to Mac also (read $). Richard P. wrote: I bought a MacBook 2.16MHz Core Duo in September. I upgraded the RAM a few weeks ago. Both slots are easy to access once you remove the battery and 3 screws to remove the cover plate. There's a lever that you move to pop the RAM out. According to Other World, http://eshop.macsales.com/Reviews/Framework.cfm?page=/Tips/macbookcore23gb/macbookcore23gb.html, that MacBook can recognize up to 3GB of RAM--I have 2GB. The MacBook is designed so that you can swap out hard drives fairly easily too without removing too much of the case--I haven't done that yet. Tutorial: http://www.macinstruct.com/node/130 I have the mid-range MacBook with a 120GB HD and superdrive. I think it was only $100 more than the base model, and well worth the extra $$. Specs and comparisons: http://www.apple.com/macbook/specs.html. Battery life is usually at least 4 hours. Betty The stock battery in the current laptops is fine. When it gets old, there are third party companies that will sell you a replacement that exceeds original specs. If you are comfortable working within the confines of a laptop (opening the case) and replacing a hard drive to increase its capacity, then no upgrade issues. You will also need to know how to move the data to the larger drive. If not, then you may be wise to upgrade it to a larger capacity drive when you buy. Last I looked the laptops have two memory slots and upgrading memory is pretty easy. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Mac OS question
Actually, you are more like 1.45 x the minimum, which is .867 Ghz. As someone who is even closer to the minimum, I can tell you that you won't see much if any difference in speed doing the same things you are doing now. It has been documented that Leopard is slightly slower than Tiger, but Tiger was faster than its predecessors, so you may not see any change at all (or even an improvement) moving from 10.3.9 to 10.5.1. Where you may see speed issues is with some of the features you didn't have before. The main issue for me is with the Cover Flow file view. It is fairly slow for me, not tremendously useable, whereas it is really slick when I've tried it on a machine at an Apple store. I don't really have speed issues with any other Leopard feature. Aside from Cover Flow file view, unless I am doing something really memory- and processor-intensive, I don't see any difference at all from when I used Tiger. By the way, I have a 1Ghz powerbook with 1GB RAM. and I sometimes use my son's machine, a 1.33 Ghz iBook with .5 GB RAM, and I don't notice problems with it either. David On Dec 13, 2007, at 12:00 AM, COMPUTERGUYS-L automatic digest system wrote: From:Steve Rigby [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Mac OS question I want to upgrade the OS 10.3.9 on my eMac 1.25 gigahertz machine. This computer can run 10.5 Leopard, but it is marginal in terms of horsepower compared to newer machines that run faster. Would Leopard cause this particular computer to bog down and perform sluggishly as opposed to how it would run under Tiger 10.4? Bear in mind that this eMac is at the bottom of Apple computers that can accept Leopard. Leopard seems nice, but I'd rather not have a sluggish machine if that would be the price I'd have to pay. Steve * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
[CGUYS] iPod Recommendations?
I have just found out that my wife would like (read: is expecting), an iPod for Christmas. I know next to nothing about them other than that they store and play music. In looking at the Apple website, I would think that something like the iPod Nano would suffice; something that would handle a decent amount of songs and is able to select songs if wanted. No video involved at this point. I just don't know what's involved in the process of getting music into the iPod , and/or is there a better one than others as far as ease of use and so on. Any thoughts, reviews or recommendations will be welcome. Thanks in advance. Richard P. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations?
I'm ashamed to say I can't leave home without my 30GB video iPod. I've got my entire CD collection (about 180 CD's--2185 songs, plus 1 movie 3 video games) on it. I've still got 17GB free. It was about $250 when I bought it 2 years ago. The Nano ($150) does have a video screen, but it's so small I don't think it's worth it. A Shuffle is about $80, no video can hold about 240 songs. You can import songs through the free iTunes software (Mac PC), either from the store or your CD's. It's pretty easy. david David Turk Manager, Preservation Imaging Services Indiana Historical Society 450 W. Ohio St. Indianapolis, IN 46202 (317) 232-4592 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Computer Guys Announcements and Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Richard P. Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 12:51 PM To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Subject: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations? I have just found out that my wife would like (read: is expecting), an iPod for Christmas. I know next to nothing about them other than that they store and play music. In looking at the Apple website, I would think that something like the iPod Nano would suffice; something that would handle a decent amount of songs and is able to select songs if wanted. No video involved at this point. I just don't know what's involved in the process of getting music into the iPod , and/or is there a better one than others as far as ease of use and so on. Any thoughts, reviews or recommendations will be welcome. Thanks in advance. Richard P. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations?
You can start preparing for the purchase by downloading iTunes- It is freeware. http://www.apple.com/itunes/download/ Yo can now start to transfer your CD collection to a hard drive. This will take a long time if you have a large collection so cherry pick her favorites to do first. I have a PC with a CD and DVD drive so I rotate through alternating the drives so it goes a bit faster. The good news is that iTunes is pretty good at attaching titles to the files so it isn't that much work. When I gave my wife her iPod (4 GB Nano) last year I had it fully charged and full of Christmas music and other music. I would throw on an audio book she would really like to hear as well. Don't forget to get a case and a method to play in the car. -- John Duncan Yoyo ---o) * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
[CGUYS] USB Wifi adapter
I'm looking at this USB adapter, http://snipurl.com/1v8ex, and was wondering if the internal WiFi card in a Mac can be disabled with software to be able to use an external USB WiFi adapter instead. [Buffalo Wireless-G High Gain USB 2.0 Adapter]. Also what is this lawsuit from Australia against Buffalo that claims ownership of the patent for WiFi?? How well does a USB2 WiFi card work with a computer that has only USB1? Betty * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations?
On Dec 13, 2007, at 12:51 PM, Richard P. wrote: I have just found out that my wife would like (read: is expecting), an iPod for Christmas. I know next to nothing about them other than that they store and play music. In looking at the Apple website, I would think that something like the iPod Nano would suffice; something that would handle a decent amount of songs and is able to select songs if wanted. No video involved at this point. I just don't know what's involved in the process of getting music into the iPod , and/or is there a better one than others as far as ease of use and so on. Any thoughts, reviews or recommendations will be welcome. Thanks in advance. Richard P. In addition to storing all or selected choices your of music, (CDs, vinyl, even tapes) you canalso download podcasts through ITunes and other selected sites, most for free. Podcasts are recorded selections and segments of broadcast programs, many from NPR. These podcasts can be subscribed too and downloaded automatically each day, or week (example: The News of Lake Wobegon segment from Prairie Home Companion, after each broadcast). You can then sync your Ipod with new material. In addition to the broadcast podcasts, ITunes offers ITunes U, a collection of college level lectures from institutions all over the country Many of these have video of the lectures as well. For long trips in the car or plane, and being your own programming director, or listening to missed broadcasts away from your computer, you and our wife are making a great choice. Also there are downloadable books on tape from audible.com and other sites. Bill L'Hommedieu * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations?
David, Are you saving your music as AAC or Apple Lossless? I ask because the Nano or Shuffle can only process AAC. The iPod Classic on the other hand can play Apple Lossless. Bart - Original Message - From: David Turk [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 1:31 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations? I'm ashamed to say I can't leave home without my 30GB video iPod. I've got my entire CD collection (about 180 CD's--2185 songs, plus 1 movie 3 video games) on it. I've still got 17GB free. It was about $250 when I bought it 2 years ago. The Nano ($150) does have a video screen, but it's so small I don't think it's worth it. A Shuffle is about $80, no video can hold about 240 songs. You can import songs through the free iTunes software (Mac PC), either from the store or your CD's. It's pretty easy. david David Turk Manager, Preservation Imaging Services Indiana Historical Society 450 W. Ohio St. Indianapolis, IN 46202 (317) 232-4592 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Computer Guys Announcements and Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Richard P. Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 12:51 PM To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Subject: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations? I have just found out that my wife would like (read: is expecting), an iPod for Christmas. I know next to nothing about them other than that they store and play music. In looking at the Apple website, I would think that something like the iPod Nano would suffice; something that would handle a decent amount of songs and is able to select songs if wanted. No video involved at this point. I just don't know what's involved in the process of getting music into the iPod , and/or is there a better one than others as far as ease of use and so on. Any thoughts, reviews or recommendations will be welcome. Thanks in advance. Richard P. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations?
my apple nano plays lossless...not that i ever do. Mike On Dec 13, 2007 2:35 PM, Site Guy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David, Are you saving your music as AAC or Apple Lossless? I ask because the Nano or Shuffle can only process AAC. The iPod Classic on the other hand can play Apple Lossless. Bart - Original Message - From: David Turk [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 1:31 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations? I'm ashamed to say I can't leave home without my 30GB video iPod. I've got my entire CD collection (about 180 CD's--2185 songs, plus 1 movie 3 video games) on it. I've still got 17GB free. It was about $250 when I bought it 2 years ago. The Nano ($150) does have a video screen, but it's so small I don't think it's worth it. A Shuffle is about $80, no video can hold about 240 songs. You can import songs through the free iTunes software (Mac PC), either from the store or your CD's. It's pretty easy. david David Turk Manager, Preservation Imaging Services Indiana Historical Society 450 W. Ohio St. Indianapolis, IN 46202 (317) 232-4592 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Computer Guys Announcements and Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Richard P. Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 12:51 PM To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Subject: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations? I have just found out that my wife would like (read: is expecting), an iPod for Christmas. I know next to nothing about them other than that they store and play music. In looking at the Apple website, I would think that something like the iPod Nano would suffice; something that would handle a decent amount of songs and is able to select songs if wanted. No video involved at this point. I just don't know what's involved in the process of getting music into the iPod , and/or is there a better one than others as far as ease of use and so on. Any thoughts, reviews or recommendations will be welcome. Thanks in advance. Richard P. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in
Re: [CGUYS] Firefox runaway web page problem ?
You can save all the open tabs. Go to bookmarks and three down the list is Bookmark all tabs. This will let store all the bookmarks in one folder. You can then choose the option to open all the files in that folder. On Dec 13, 2007 4:10 PM, db [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have a large number of web pages that I am working with via Firefox 1.5xx to do various research and they get re-opened (Restore Session) every time I reboot my XP Pro computer. Today I opened a blog page that ran away and crashed Firefox (from looking at Task Manager/ Performance the problem is excessive RAM draw apparently) and now if I restart and choose Restore Session it starts opening web pages Ok apparently until it gets to that page and then runs aways again before I can find that web page's window and close it. I don't want to Start a new session and sacrifice my collection of working web pages in order to get around this problem. Can anybody solution a solution path that will allow me to close that particular Firefox window without killing the Firefox application ? db * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- John Duncan Yoyo ---o) * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations?
I LOVE my iPod nano!! I have a 20GB iPod; my husband offers to lend me his 80GB video iPod, but I really like the Nano. It's small, light, and is the last pink one sold before the new ones were released. If I were buying a new iPod, I'd get the 8GB video Nano or the iPod touch for web, photos, video AND music and podcasts. I like the flash memory better than the hard drive. It's faster, and much easier to fast forward and go back in podcasts. The size of the Nano is perfect for me, although I wish I had video. The only color I'd consider is red; the others are too boring. I'll have to borrow my son's iPod touch when he gets his soon [I won't be bored with that, either]. Go to the Apple Store and play with the iPods. The Nano screen is remarkably clear and easy to see, although small. You can still get the 2nd gen Nanos online; they do audio and photos but no video. Install iTunes, select the iPod when it mounts, set prefs for sync or not. Easy. From iTunes, go to the iTunes store to find some podcasts. Many web sites also have links to their own podcasts. Betty I have just found out that my wife would like (read: is expecting), an iPod for Christmas. I know next to nothing about them other than that they store and play music. In looking at the Apple website, I would think that something like the iPod Nano would suffice; something that would handle a decent amount of songs and is able to select songs if wanted. No video involved at this point. I just don't know what's involved in the process of getting music into the iPod , and/or is there a better one than others as far as ease of use and so on. Any thoughts, reviews or recommendations will be welcome. Thanks in advance. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations?
Just want to clarify this statement. My first reading was that AAC is the ONLY mode which the Nano or Shuffle can handle. But I think you only meant Lossless is not. Certainly they can handle MP3 formats as well. Also, if you have ripped CDs in the WMA format (i.e. you used Windows Media Player before), iTunes will automatically convert to AAC when you use File == Add Folder to Library. Site Guy wrote: David, Are you saving your music as AAC or Apple Lossless? I ask because the Nano or Shuffle can only process AAC. The iPod Classic on the other hand can play Apple Lossless. Bart * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations?
My bad, you are correct! It's the shuffle that Apple Lossless will not play on. Sorry Bart - Original Message - From: mike [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 5:09 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations? my apple nano plays lossless...not that i ever do. Mike On Dec 13, 2007 2:35 PM, Site Guy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David, Are you saving your music as AAC or Apple Lossless? I ask because the Nano or Shuffle can only process AAC. The iPod Classic on the other hand can play Apple Lossless. Bart - Original Message - From: David Turk [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 1:31 PM Subject: Re: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations? I'm ashamed to say I can't leave home without my 30GB video iPod. I've got my entire CD collection (about 180 CD's--2185 songs, plus 1 movie 3 video games) on it. I've still got 17GB free. It was about $250 when I bought it 2 years ago. The Nano ($150) does have a video screen, but it's so small I don't think it's worth it. A Shuffle is about $80, no video can hold about 240 songs. You can import songs through the free iTunes software (Mac PC), either from the store or your CD's. It's pretty easy. david David Turk Manager, Preservation Imaging Services Indiana Historical Society 450 W. Ohio St. Indianapolis, IN 46202 (317) 232-4592 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Computer Guys Announcements and Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Richard P. Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 12:51 PM To: COMPUTERGUYS-L@LISTSERV.AOL.COM Subject: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations? I have just found out that my wife would like (read: is expecting), an iPod for Christmas. I know next to nothing about them other than that they store and play music. In looking at the Apple website, I would think that something like the iPod Nano would suffice; something that would handle a decent amount of songs and is able to select songs if wanted. No video involved at this point. I just don't know what's involved in the process of getting music into the iPod , and/or is there a better one than others as far as ease of use and so on. Any thoughts, reviews or recommendations will be welcome. Thanks in advance. Richard P. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Firefox runaway web page problem ?
Tried it. I have many windows open with multiple tabs.It looks to be unmanageable. It seems like I would have to do that for each window's tabs and firefox gets to that problem website and bogs down before I can even get started. I wonder if Safe mode would disable the mechanism of whatever is on that one website that is grabbing my computers resources so I could go to that pages tab and close it. ... ? db John Duncan Yoyo wrote: You can save all the open tabs. Go to bookmarks and three down the list is Bookmark all tabs. This will let store all the bookmarks in one folder. You can then choose the option to open all the files in that folder. On Dec 13, 2007 4:10 PM, db [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have a large number of web pages that I am working with via Firefox 1.5xx to do various research and they get re-opened (Restore Session) every time I reboot my XP Pro computer. Today I opened a blog page that ran away and crashed Firefox (from looking at Task Manager/ Performance the problem is excessive RAM draw apparently) and now if I restart and choose Restore Session it starts opening web pages Ok apparently until it gets to that page and then runs aways again before I can find that web page's window and close it. I don't want to Start a new session and sacrifice my collection of working web pages in order to get around this problem. Can anybody solution a solution path that will allow me to close that particular Firefox window without killing the Firefox application ? db * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Firefox runaway web page problem ?
I don't know if this will work for sure but it should. Disconnect the internet from the computer and then open firefox. Restore session. Bookmark all the pages using the bookmark all tabs option. If you get this far then everything should be fine. Quit firefox, reconnect to the net and then open the groups one by one until you find the trouble maker(s). On Dec 13, 2007 5:42 PM, db [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tried it. I have many windows open with multiple tabs.It looks to be unmanageable. It seems like I would have to do that for each window's tabs and firefox gets to that problem website and bogs down before I can even get started. I wonder if Safe mode would disable the mechanism of whatever is on that one website that is grabbing my computers resources so I could go to that pages tab and close it. ... ? db John Duncan Yoyo wrote: You can save all the open tabs. Go to bookmarks and three down the list is Bookmark all tabs. This will let store all the bookmarks in one folder. You can then choose the option to open all the files in that folder. On Dec 13, 2007 4:10 PM, db [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have a large number of web pages that I am working with via Firefox 1.5xx to do various research and they get re-opened (Restore Session) every time I reboot my XP Pro computer. Today I opened a blog page that ran away and crashed Firefox (from looking at Task Manager/ Performance the problem is excessive RAM draw apparently) and now if I restart and choose Restore Session it starts opening web pages Ok apparently until it gets to that page and then runs aways again before I can find that web page's window and close it. I don't want to Start a new session and sacrifice my collection of working web pages in order to get around this problem. Can anybody solution a solution path that will allow me to close that particular Firefox window without killing the Firefox application ? db * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- John Duncan Yoyo ---o) * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Firefox runaway web page problem ?
Here's an off the top of my head idea. Use your firewall to temporarily block the offending web site then restore your Firefox session. The offending page should come up with an error message instead of the runaway code. Howard db wrote: Tried it. I have many windows open with multiple tabs.It looks to be unmanageable. It seems like I would have to do that for each window's tabs and firefox gets to that problem website and bogs down before I can even get started. I wonder if Safe mode would disable the mechanism of whatever is on that one website that is grabbing my computers resources so I could go to that pages tab and close it. ... ? db John Duncan Yoyo wrote: You can save all the open tabs. Go to bookmarks and three down the list is Bookmark all tabs. This will let store all the bookmarks in one folder. You can then choose the option to open all the files in that folder. On Dec 13, 2007 4:10 PM, db [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have a large number of web pages that I am working with via Firefox 1.5xx to do various research and they get re-opened (Restore Session) every time I reboot my XP Pro computer. Today I opened a blog page that ran away and crashed Firefox (from looking at Task Manager/ Performance the problem is excessive RAM draw apparently) and now if I restart and choose Restore Session it starts opening web pages Ok apparently until it gets to that page and then runs aways again before I can find that web page's window and close it. I don't want to Start a new session and sacrifice my collection of working web pages in order to get around this problem. Can anybody solution a solution path that will allow me to close that particular Firefox window without killing the Firefox application ? db * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Firefox runaway web page problem ?
Why aren't you using Firefox 2.0.0.11 or whatever the latest is now? Maybe this is a bug that has been fixed? Try increasing the size of the system swap file by a whole lot. Maybe Firefox doesn't know how to handle the situation of running out of swap file? (Maybe all programs don't? After all, what does a program do when the loaded data exceeds the available memory? Only a few text editors know how to page through a file and edit the current sector, and splice a new sector into the file. They were back in the days of CP/M and maybe early DOS.) Get a 4GB (or even larger) flash drive and use all of it for the swap file. Fred Holmes At 04:10 PM 12/13/2007, db wrote: I have a large number of web pages that I am working with via Firefox 1.5xx to do various research and they get re-opened (Restore Session) every time I reboot my XP Pro computer. Today I opened a blog page that ran away and crashed Firefox (from looking at Task Manager/ Performance the problem is excessive RAM draw apparently) and now if I restart and choose Restore Session it starts opening web pages Ok apparently until it gets to that page and then runs aways again before I can find that web page's window and close it. I don't want to Start a new session and sacrifice my collection of working web pages in order to get around this problem. Can anybody solution a solution path that will allow me to close that particular Firefox window without killing the Firefox application ? db * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] ATT DSL ok? Update
Rev. Stewart Marshall Let me correct myself DSL modems are different than Cable modems. Why doesn't he just remove the antennas? -- Take care | This clown speaks for himself, his job doesn't Wayne D. | supply this, at least not directly Measure with micrometer, mark with chalk, cut with axe * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
[CGUYS] Windows to Apple migration?
Is this not the proper instruction set for the MacBook in question? http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=303721 hs -- Forwarded Message From: Tom Piwowar [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 14:04:53 -0500 Subject: Re: Windows to Apple migration? How difficult is it to get to the hard-to-get-to memory slot? Does it require taking apart more of the case or is it just difficult to access through the main opening? Major disassembly. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- End of Forwarded Message * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations?
The only color I'd consider is red; the others are too boring. I'll have to borrow my son's iPod touch when he gets his soon [I won't be bored with that, either]. Go to the Apple Store and pl Woman after my own heart. I love color everywhere and having to choose between black or white really didn't thrill me. My video iPod had a wardrobe of exciting colors and patterned cases! I gave my son-in-law the new Nano for his birthday and he loves it. Tho small, the screen is sharp and clear. OH...and besides the audio books I mentioned earlier and tons of music, I also have a lot of photos, a number of video tutorials for photoshop, some tv shows and my address book and reminders on it. This version does it allalmost. Paula IN/USA Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, wine in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming WOO HOO what a ride! Have a wonderful day! * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] iPod Recommendations?
I'm ashamed to say I can't leave home without my 30GB video iPod. I've got my entire CD collect I never leave home without my 60 gb video iPod, either...and I only have 10gb left! If you get your wife a gift cert. for Audible.com she'll get hooked on audio books too. I think now you have to get what they call the Classic ipod to get a similar one. I was really wanting an iPOd touch before they came out but they don't have nearly enough storage on them and no buttons that enable you to turn it on and off or go back and forward without looking at the screen. So, I'll stick with what I have. Paula IN/USA Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, wine in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming WOO HOO what a ride! Have a wonderful day! * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Firefox runaway web page problem ?
Fred, Thanks for the idea . increasing the swap file from 768 to 2GB did the trick. Page file topped out at 1.5 GB and then I was able to close the offending geeky website and page filing plummeted to 453 MB. I am not updating Firefox etc. while I am procrastinating re: all the work that it will take to transition to a new computer that I purchased db Fred Holmes wrote: Why aren't you using Firefox 2.0.0.11 or whatever the latest is now? Maybe this is a bug that has been fixed? Try increasing the size of the system swap file by a whole lot. Maybe Firefox doesn't know how to handle the situation of running out of swap file? (Maybe all programs don't? After all, what does a program do when the loaded data exceeds the available memory? Only a few text editors know how to page through a file and edit the current sector, and splice a new sector into the file. They were back in the days of CP/M and maybe early DOS.) Get a 4GB (or even larger) flash drive and use all of it for the swap file. Fred Holmes At 04:10 PM 12/13/2007, db wrote: I have a large number of web pages that I am working with via Firefox 1.5xx to do various research and they get re-opened (Restore Session) every time I reboot my XP Pro computer. Today I opened a blog page that ran away and crashed Firefox (from looking at Task Manager/ Performance the problem is excessive RAM draw apparently) and now if I restart and choose Restore Session it starts opening web pages Ok apparently until it gets to that page and then runs aways again before I can find that web page's window and close it. I don't want to Start a new session and sacrifice my collection of working web pages in order to get around this problem. Can anybody solution a solution path that will allow me to close that particular Firefox window without killing the Firefox application ? db * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
[CGUYS] CompUSA closing down
http://tinyurl.com/329zg5 An orderly and expedited wind down and asset sale process is the best option for CompUSA and its creditors at this juncture, Mr. Weinstein said. We are focused on assuring that CompUSA's creditors, landlords and other key constituents are treated properly during this process. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] IT Managers
Tom has mentioned it before but this article confirms what he is talking about with IT managers. How many managers does it take to screw in a lightbulb? If the troops don't know what they are doing the enterprise falls to pieces. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] Windows to Apple migration?
Is this not the proper instruction set for the MacBook in question? http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=303721 Yes. I was wrong. (About a Mac no less.) I missed the news that the new laptops had a major change. This eliminates a major problem that the previous models had. Sorry. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] IT Managers
Lies, damn lies and...well you know. Mike On Dec 13, 2007 5:33 PM, Rev. Stewart Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tom has mentioned it before but this article confirms what he is talking about with IT managers. http://earthlink.com.com/2100-1022_3-6222631.html?part=earthlink Stewart Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Prince of Peace Ozark, AL SL 82 * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] ATT DSL ok? Update
Paula Minor Wayne D: Why doesn't he just remove the antennas? I think you're talking to me, Wayne. There are no antennas to remove on the ATT modem. An ATT guy came today to check my line and turn snip Well that answers that question ... nothing to remove. -- Take care | This clown speaks for himself, his job doesn't Wayne D. | supply this, at least not directly Be vewy vewy quiet...I'm hunting tagwines! * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] ATT DSL ok? Update
Rev. Stewart Marshall Because it is still acting as a router and can interfere with another router/wireless access point. What needs to be done is turn the routing function off in the DSL modem and set it as bridge so it gets logged in by the router (ppoe?) and then the router handles all assignments of IP#'s wired and wireless. But doesn't the antenna removal pretty much kill the wireless portion? Without a doubt, setting the right configuration is the best solution unless this is a temporary kind of deal. -- Take care | This clown speaks for himself, his job doesn't Wayne D. | supply this, at least not directly Be vewy vewy quiet...I'm hunting tagwines! * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
