Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
>Yes, if you subsidize an air line you can have great service at a >reasonable price by not charging customers what the service costs. >That is called soaking the taxpayer for services they are not using. >I will pass thank you. You make a huge illogical leap here. The world is full of "subsidizes." As soon as you pull out of your driveway you are "soaking the taxpayer for services they are not using" because most taxpayers will never drive on the road in front of your house. Your logic would not have that road. Or any road. Or much of anything elas. Actually using the word "subsidy" is inaccurate and misleading. This really is people acting collectively for the greater benefit of everyone. (Another word for this is "civilization.") We live in a world full of collective goods. Each taxpayer benefits from some and not from others. However, collectively we all benefit. Without civilization we would all be much less well off. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
>Cable companies have to meet thousands of standards to do business in >each municipality. (it is even worse as the local kickbacks that >have to be paid - not illegal they are called franchise fees) The problem was allowing local companies to be rolled up into huge conglomerates. That caused a problem that did not previously exist and then the greedy corporations that caused the problem started to bellyache about regulation. A locally owned utility following local standards would have no such problem. And I bet the local citizens in most localities would be better served (and of course there would be a few bad apples that greedy corporations would hold up as exemplary.) * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
>What we need is more competition (no more assigned monopolies), not >more regulation. Yes, assigned monopolies can turn out to be a very bad idea. At the time the idea was originally floated CATV monopolies were sold using the concept of public utility. But these utilities were not sufficiently regulated so we got a very bad result. It is probably always true that assigned monopolies need to be heavily regulated. However, it is not logical to set "competition" and "regulation" in opposition. "Competition" is in no way the antithesis of "regulation." One does not go up as the other goes down. In fact it is well demonstrated that a lack of regulation can lead to a lack of competition. Even Ulimiate Fighting has some rules and a referee. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads -- baseball and "level playing fields"
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Yes but those "administration fees" (or kickback or whatever you > want to call them) of some of the profits doesn't make the > government the party who wanted, proposed and ultimately benefits the > most from the creation of a monopoly. Here's an analogy: If money > could influence the fundamental regulating rules of baseball, some > wealthy/ advertising market rich team, like Steinbrunner's Yankees, > would propose that they deserved to have more players on the field > than a poorer / smaller media market team. Dan--did you know that Major League Baseball pays no taxes, although the teams do? MLB is a tax-exempt entity under Internal Revenue Code Section 501(c)(6), with the tax returns as open, public documents. The tax exempt status is the reason why there were hearings in Congress regarding illegal steroid use. Bad analogy. The government is all over MLB with oversight. Maybe not so for MLS, NBA or NFL? Baseball isn't a sport, it's a pastime. Shouldn't TV, cable, satellite companies pay for the frequencies that they use since those are owned by the general public? Even cable receives satellite communications over publicly owned frequencies. There seems to be a misunderstanding of the commons, i.e., publicly owned property, and the rights of the owners [us] vs. use by private companies with little or no reimbursement to us, and often great profit to them. And sports franchises have the nerve to demand that cities pay huge sums to build new stadiums resulting in big profits for the teams, and little revenue to the cities--sometimes even a net loss. No wonder cities like LA aren't in any hurry to attract a new football team. We don't appreciate Maryland giving money to the Orioles or Ravens when they hardly have anything left of our tax revenue to send to rural counties. The government is NOT a business. It exists to serve the people. If you don't have good public servants, you have voted for the wrong people. > Business, like sports, only works if all teams/ business are > guaranteed a level playing field and a fair chance to compete and > that depends on a neutral umpire/ governance to regulate and enforce > the rules that are made to protect everyone's common interest rather > than the individual's ability to maximize profit or wins. There's no "level playing field" in communications since the Fairness Doctrine was thrown out. There's no "level playing field" in the energy industry as long as coal and petro get almost free resources on public lands and they, along with nuclear, get $billions in subsidies, while renewables had no subsidies at all for years and now get $millions in contrast to the others' $billions. Oil that's pumped out of the ground in Saudi Arabia for $4/barrel sells here for $100/barrel on what "level playing field"? Where's the "level playing field" in broadband where service is down while prices continue to go up? Competition--not. Cartels are more like it--deliberate or not. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
Yes but those "administration fees" (or kickback or whatever you want to call them) of some of the profits doesn't make the government the party who wanted, proposed and ultimately benefits the most from the creation of a monopoly. Here's an analogy: If money could influence the fundamental regulating rules of baseball, some wealthy/ advertising market rich team, like Steinbrunner's Yankees, would propose that they deserved to have more players on the field than a poorer / smaller media market team. They would do so because the object of the sport is superficially to win more games and with more players on the field, that would happen. Since winning all the time and losing none is the ultimate goal, the ultimate goal would be to outnumber the opposing team in number of players by a 99.99 to .01 ratio. But what would happen to the sport of baseball if that was allowed? For everyone but the Yankees, it wouldn't be an enjoyable sport anymore and no one would want to watch so baseball as a sport would die and sports fans would watch a sport that was fun to watch ... a true sport whose rules regulated the game fairly to make sure that it remained a true competition. And even the Yankees would be out of business in that scenario. Business, like sports, only works if all teams/ business are guaranteed a level playing field and a fair chance to compete and that depends on a neutral umpire/ governance to regulate and enforce the rules that are made to protect everyone's common interest rather than the individual's ability to maximize profit or wins. Matthew Taylor wrote: Because the business interests agree to give the government some of the take in the case of things like cable franchise fees? On Mar 28, 2008, at 1:17 PM, db wrote: What is the motivation for a government to want a monopoly of business? Government ends up granting monopolies after business... who has the maximation of profit/ cornering the market motivation ... eventually gets its way through much lobbying/ dispensing of campaign funds to government etc... It's the businesses that have the motivation and are constantly proposing mergers, not the other way around... db Matthew Taylor wrote: Um, no. Until government stuck its hand in and granted exclusive access via regulation, multiple cable companies had the option of entering a market. Stupid government regulators and politicians bought the false argument that absent a monopoly no one would try to build a system. On Mar 28, 2008, at 11:49 AM, db wrote: Effective regulation IS what prevents monopolies. "Assigned" monopolies have come to be because business interests now fund politicians' elections so they get their way. Bigger and fewer companies makes business more money ... at least in the short term. db Matthew Taylor wrote: Would that it were so easy. I have cable. My choice is that, or dial-up or satellite download dial-up upload. I am too far out in the country for DSL to happen any time soon. What we need is more competition (no more assigned monopolies), not more regulation. I don't think I have a right to a fast net connection. I am willing to pay for one, but currently no one has an incentive to sell me one. On Mar 28, 2008, at 9:41 AM, Tom Piwowar wrote: Anyone who has cable today ought to be searching for and lobbying for getting something in the future that offers a fixed rate. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
On Mar 28, 2008, at 12:58 PM, Rev. Stewart Marshall wrote: OK than why were there are more doctors, and more CT scan machines and MRI scan machines per capita than any other nation we pay more for our health care? Because we want those services on demand, whether we actually need them or not, since the consumers are largely not the payers, and the providers have every incentive to order every test they can get paid for. In many areas we have more Doctors per person than many other nations. (In urban areas, rural is another story) Yet again we pay more than any other nation. And our Dr's are paid better than most, offsetting in part their costs of education and costs of doing business. It is not always the case that when the government sticks their hand in it is worse or better. Never said it was. There are things gov't does best. Managing markets is not one of them. For Cable and media such as this you must have a common backbone and an infrastructure. No. You must have an interconnected infrastructure - not the same thing at all. Many of our folks do not build fiber optic lines, someone else does and the companies lease from them. Same with Cell towers etc. Yup. Why is this a problem? When it comes to local cable systems and Telephone systems one infrastructure is needed. Who will pay for it? No - see above. The potential users should pay for it naturally. If one company pays for the infrastructure your damn straight they will demand a certain percentage of return from it. Of course. They should not be guaranteed this return by the government unless the government is the principal user. In the early days of telephone the Government gave AT&T (the old one) a monopoly to run wires across the US to build a phone system. No, they did not to my knowledge. There were lots of mom & pop local phone companies. At one time ours was the best in the world. Largely because the rest of the world had had thier infrastructure leveled by WWII or had previously lacked the infrastructure to build the tools to build one. Then we broke up monopolies (Which had very strict government regulations governing them) and we complain all the time about our phone service. We complain mostly about the price, not about its working, even though costs for the same level of service are way, way down. Capitalism doe not always work, but neither does full governmental control. How do you define work? It must be a balanced approach that takes into account Mr. & Mrs. Smith no matter what their socio-economic status and what needs to be provided at a minimum. There is the catch - "what needs to be provided at a minimum". Who decides, the government or the market? Matthew * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
Because the business interests agree to give the government some of the take in the case of things like cable franchise fees? On Mar 28, 2008, at 1:17 PM, db wrote: What is the motivation for a government to want a monopoly of business? Government ends up granting monopolies after business... who has the maximation of profit/ cornering the market motivation ... eventually gets its way through much lobbying/ dispensing of campaign funds to government etc... It's the businesses that have the motivation and are constantly proposing mergers, not the other way around... db Matthew Taylor wrote: Um, no. Until government stuck its hand in and granted exclusive access via regulation, multiple cable companies had the option of entering a market. Stupid government regulators and politicians bought the false argument that absent a monopoly no one would try to build a system. On Mar 28, 2008, at 11:49 AM, db wrote: Effective regulation IS what prevents monopolies. "Assigned" monopolies have come to be because business interests now fund politicians' elections so they get their way. Bigger and fewer companies makes business more money ... at least in the short term. db Matthew Taylor wrote: Would that it were so easy. I have cable. My choice is that, or dial-up or satellite download dial-up upload. I am too far out in the country for DSL to happen any time soon. What we need is more competition (no more assigned monopolies), not more regulation. I don't think I have a right to a fast net connection. I am willing to pay for one, but currently no one has an incentive to sell me one. On Mar 28, 2008, at 9:41 AM, Tom Piwowar wrote: Anyone who has cable today ought to be searching for and lobbying for getting something in the future that offers a fixed rate. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
What is the motivation for a government to want a monopoly of business? Government ends up granting monopolies after business... who has the maximation of profit/ cornering the market motivation ... eventually gets its way through much lobbying/ dispensing of campaign funds to government etc... It's the businesses that have the motivation and are constantly proposing mergers, not the other way around... db Matthew Taylor wrote: Um, no. Until government stuck its hand in and granted exclusive access via regulation, multiple cable companies had the option of entering a market. Stupid government regulators and politicians bought the false argument that absent a monopoly no one would try to build a system. On Mar 28, 2008, at 11:49 AM, db wrote: Effective regulation IS what prevents monopolies. "Assigned" monopolies have come to be because business interests now fund politicians' elections so they get their way. Bigger and fewer companies makes business more money ... at least in the short term. db Matthew Taylor wrote: Would that it were so easy. I have cable. My choice is that, or dial-up or satellite download dial-up upload. I am too far out in the country for DSL to happen any time soon. What we need is more competition (no more assigned monopolies), not more regulation. I don't think I have a right to a fast net connection. I am willing to pay for one, but currently no one has an incentive to sell me one. On Mar 28, 2008, at 9:41 AM, Tom Piwowar wrote: Anyone who has cable today ought to be searching for and lobbying for getting something in the future that offers a fixed rate. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
OK than why were there are more doctors, and more CT scan machines and MRI scan machines per capita than any other nation we pay more for our health care? In many areas we have more Doctors per person than many other nations. (In urban areas, rural is another story) Yet again we pay more than any other nation. It is not always the case that when the government sticks their hand in it is worse or better. For Cable and media such as this you must have a common backbone and an infrastructure. Many of our folks do not build fiber optic lines, someone else does and the companies lease from them. Same with Cell towers etc. When it comes to local cable systems and Telephone systems one infrastructure is needed. Who will pay for it? If one company pays for the infrastructure your damn straight they will demand a certain percentage of return from it. In the early days of telephone the Government gave AT&T (the old one) a monopoly to run wires across the US to build a phone system. At one time ours was the best in the world. Then we broke up monopolies (Which had very strict government regulations governing them) and we complain all the time about our phone service. Capitalism doe not always work, but neither does full governmental control. It must be a balanced approach that takes into account Mr. & Mrs. Smith no matter what their socio-economic status and what needs to be provided at a minimum. Stewart At 11:41 AM 3/28/2008, you wrote: Um, no. Until government stuck its hand in and granted exclusive access via regulation, multiple cable companies had the option of entering a market. Stupid government regulators and politicians bought the false argument that absent a monopoly no one would try to build a system. Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
How about we don't have that myriad of regulations in the first place? Yes, if you subsidize an air line you can have great service at a reasonable price by not charging customers what the service costs. That is called soaking the taxpayer for services they are not using. I will pass thank you. On Mar 28, 2008, at 12:00 PM, Rev. Stewart Marshall wrote: In this case what is needed is a monopoly with standards set nationally not locally. Also what will be needed is subsidy tog et it out to the areas where it cannot get to right now. One of the biggest problems any commercial enterprise will run into is the myriad of regulations they have to face. (See Supreme Court decision re: New Yorks Passenger rights) If there was one standard set high enough for everyone to reach, and the means given by where they can provide that standard it would be great. Many of the European enterprise started off as government run and owned enterprises. They were at one time subsidized by the government but had to meet only one standard. Why do you think British Airways, Air France, and Lufthansa are always rated as one of the better airlines? They are all subsidized by the government and have to meet their standard plus international (Which their government meets or exceeds already) It has only been within the last few years that more than one telephone company existed in many of these counties. Only after they set up the infrastructure and set the standards. And by the way I am not saying that is bad. I think in many ways it is good. I think one of the problems here in America we have is way too much independent sprit that gets in the way of cooperation and innovation. Why is our educational system in such a disarray. You can blame no child left behind, but it goes deeper than that. (As someone who has moved between states) Each state has its own standards. When we moved from Wisconsin to Tennessee, they would not let my kids attend school until I had gone to the local Health department and had my kids shot records transferred over to the state standard form. Luckily my children were just beginning High School or they would have had to go an extra year, as the course structure and standards for graduation were different. When we moved to Alabama the same thing again. Only this time my one son had to double up on a few courses as he had not taken courses required for graduation in Alabama but not required in Tennessee. Phone companies have to meet 50 different standards to do business in each state. Cable companies have to meet thousands of standards to do business in each municipality. (it is even worse as the local kickbacks that have to be paid - not illegal they are called franchise fees) So I am all for setting of national standards to be met by all the companies offering Internet service. Set them and help those locals that are removed or far off meet them. (In Canada and even in the US, some communities are offering tax incentives for Doctors to locate in their area. Even giving them free rent etc. to serve their area.) Stewart At 08:54 AM 3/28/2008, you wrote: Would that it were so easy. I have cable. My choice is that, or dial-up or satellite download dial-up upload. I am too far out in the country for DSL to happen any time soon. What we need is more competition (no more assigned monopolies), not more regulation. I don't think I have a right to a fast net connection. I am willing to pay for one, but currently no one has an incentive to sell me one. Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
Um, no. Until government stuck its hand in and granted exclusive access via regulation, multiple cable companies had the option of entering a market. Stupid government regulators and politicians bought the false argument that absent a monopoly no one would try to build a system. On Mar 28, 2008, at 11:49 AM, db wrote: Effective regulation IS what prevents monopolies. "Assigned" monopolies have come to be because business interests now fund politicians' elections so they get their way. Bigger and fewer companies makes business more money ... at least in the short term. db Matthew Taylor wrote: Would that it were so easy. I have cable. My choice is that, or dial-up or satellite download dial-up upload. I am too far out in the country for DSL to happen any time soon. What we need is more competition (no more assigned monopolies), not more regulation. I don't think I have a right to a fast net connection. I am willing to pay for one, but currently no one has an incentive to sell me one. On Mar 28, 2008, at 9:41 AM, Tom Piwowar wrote: Anyone who has cable today ought to be searching for and lobbying for getting something in the future that offers a fixed rate. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
In this case what is needed is a monopoly with standards set nationally not locally. Also what will be needed is subsidy tog et it out to the areas where it cannot get to right now. One of the biggest problems any commercial enterprise will run into is the myriad of regulations they have to face. (See Supreme Court decision re: New Yorks Passenger rights) If there was one standard set high enough for everyone to reach, and the means given by where they can provide that standard it would be great. Many of the European enterprise started off as government run and owned enterprises. They were at one time subsidized by the government but had to meet only one standard. Why do you think British Airways, Air France, and Lufthansa are always rated as one of the better airlines? They are all subsidized by the government and have to meet their standard plus international (Which their government meets or exceeds already) It has only been within the last few years that more than one telephone company existed in many of these counties. Only after they set up the infrastructure and set the standards. And by the way I am not saying that is bad. I think in many ways it is good. I think one of the problems here in America we have is way too much independent sprit that gets in the way of cooperation and innovation. Why is our educational system in such a disarray. You can blame no child left behind, but it goes deeper than that. (As someone who has moved between states) Each state has its own standards. When we moved from Wisconsin to Tennessee, they would not let my kids attend school until I had gone to the local Health department and had my kids shot records transferred over to the state standard form. Luckily my children were just beginning High School or they would have had to go an extra year, as the course structure and standards for graduation were different. When we moved to Alabama the same thing again. Only this time my one son had to double up on a few courses as he had not taken courses required for graduation in Alabama but not required in Tennessee. Phone companies have to meet 50 different standards to do business in each state. Cable companies have to meet thousands of standards to do business in each municipality. (it is even worse as the local kickbacks that have to be paid - not illegal they are called franchise fees) So I am all for setting of national standards to be met by all the companies offering Internet service. Set them and help those locals that are removed or far off meet them. (In Canada and even in the US, some communities are offering tax incentives for Doctors to locate in their area. Even giving them free rent etc. to serve their area.) Stewart At 08:54 AM 3/28/2008, you wrote: Would that it were so easy. I have cable. My choice is that, or dial-up or satellite download dial-up upload. I am too far out in the country for DSL to happen any time soon. What we need is more competition (no more assigned monopolies), not more regulation. I don't think I have a right to a fast net connection. I am willing to pay for one, but currently no one has an incentive to sell me one. Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Prince of Peace www.princeofpeaceozark.org Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
Effective regulation IS what prevents monopolies. "Assigned" monopolies have come to be because business interests now fund politicians' elections so they get their way. Bigger and fewer companies makes business more money ... at least in the short term. db Matthew Taylor wrote: Would that it were so easy. I have cable. My choice is that, or dial-up or satellite download dial-up upload. I am too far out in the country for DSL to happen any time soon. What we need is more competition (no more assigned monopolies), not more regulation. I don't think I have a right to a fast net connection. I am willing to pay for one, but currently no one has an incentive to sell me one. On Mar 28, 2008, at 9:41 AM, Tom Piwowar wrote: Anyone who has cable today ought to be searching for and lobbying for getting something in the future that offers a fixed rate. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
Would that it were so easy. I have cable. My choice is that, or dial-up or satellite download dial-up upload. I am too far out in the country for DSL to happen any time soon. What we need is more competition (no more assigned monopolies), not more regulation. I don't think I have a right to a fast net connection. I am willing to pay for one, but currently no one has an incentive to sell me one. On Mar 28, 2008, at 9:41 AM, Tom Piwowar wrote: Anyone who has cable today ought to be searching for and lobbying for getting something in the future that offers a fixed rate. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
>In my case, there isn't always enough pie to go around. >In the last 6 months, my cablemodem connection that I have had for >years, now gets drug down at certain times of day or night to pokey >speeds by a bunch of local 20 somethings... Well I won't be resentful of their youth. I also don't think you should be resentful of their being ahead of the technological curve. Using the Internet to move large video files is the future. Heck, just a decade ago they were saying the same thing about moving large *audio* files. Remember when people were complaining about Napster clogging up the Internet? This ties into the "Why not the US?" thread... >John--I'm not giving the banks a pass on this, but I've grown weary of the >violin strings played for adults who didn't even begin to have the resources >or were in any sort of position to buy a house, but absolutely had to have a >house, well, because everyone else was getting one. If you want to make >excuses for people who got in over their heads with something they didn't >understand or didn't try to understand, but did anyway, be my guest. The theme here is buying "something they didn't understand." Specifically, buying cable. Getting cable is in a way similar to getting an ARM. They get you in with low teaser rates (high bandwidth), but after a while the terms get less favorable (you get "pokey speeds"). So don't blame the "20 somethings." The pokey speeds is inherent in how cable works. Just like some argued on this list last week that cable is the only game in town, the folks who got the ARMs did it because it was the only way to get the house. Both figured that the future would turn out more rosey than it did. In both cases, understanding the nuts and bolts of how things worked would have avoided the current unpleasantness. Anyone who has cable today ought to be searching for and lobbying for getting something in the future that offers a fixed rate. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
So you are angry that they are using what they are paying for? Be angry at the right person, your cable provider. If you want to be angry at them for pirating that's fine too, but for just using their connnection I'm not sure I could care. How fast are you paying for? How fast are you getting? I pay for 1.5 and get 1 constantly and that's on DSL. I'd not assume you'd be better off without cable. Also point of fact, if they were using BT to download things I doubt it would be just at certain times of day, BT is meant to be run all the time. I'm curious how you 'identified the problem' ? Mike On Tue, Mar 25, 2008 at 10:42 AM, db <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > In my case, there isn't always enough pie to go around. > > In the last 6 months, my cablemodem connection that I have had for > years, now gets drug down at certain times of day or night to pokey > speeds by a bunch of local 20 somethings who live nearby and who > download a lot of pirated movies. We've identified the problem but > there is nothing we can do about it but pay more to switch ourselves to > DSL and abandon cablemodem to them I guess. > > At first, I was outraged when I read Comcast was trickily disrupting the > bit torrent movie downloading streams ... now, that I have been > affected by the movie downloaders I cheer them on. > > Not only are the bit torrent movie downloaders pirating and defrauding > artists/ the moviemakers etc. but they, while being relatively few in > numbers, are hogging the majority of our shared bandwidth to do so and > depriving the many of us of the small amount of bandwidth we use, pay > for and depend on to do business and other legitimate personal uses. > > g... > > > > > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
In my case, there isn't always enough pie to go around. In the last 6 months, my cablemodem connection that I have had for years, now gets drug down at certain times of day or night to pokey speeds by a bunch of local 20 somethings who live nearby and who download a lot of pirated movies. We've identified the problem but there is nothing we can do about it but pay more to switch ourselves to DSL and abandon cablemodem to them I guess. At first, I was outraged when I read Comcast was trickily disrupting the bit torrent movie downloading streams ... now, that I have been affected by the movie downloaders I cheer them on. Not only are the bit torrent movie downloaders pirating and defrauding artists/ the moviemakers etc. but they, while being relatively few in numbers, are hogging the majority of our shared bandwidth to do so and depriving the many of us of the small amount of bandwidth we use, pay for and depend on to do business and other legitimate personal uses. g... db Tom Piwowar wrote: Should I get your pie because you are not eating it at the moment? If there is more than enough pie to go around, why not? Is you pie less tasty because you see somebody eating their pie faster than you are? * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
Tom - I'm a lurker (do folks still use this term?) . I've been on the list for many years . I ran across this message by accident , and I have to say it's probably the most obscure computer advice I've ever seen . I'm an old guy who dates back to Cobal and Fortran - this must be in a code I don't understand - A good laugh, Tom Tom Piwowar wrote: Should I get your pie because you are not eating it at the moment? If there is more than enough pie to go around, why not? Is you pie less tasty because you see somebody eating their pie faster than you are? * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
>Should I get your pie because you are not eating it at the moment? If there is more than enough pie to go around, why not? Is you pie less tasty because you see somebody eating their pie faster than you are? * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
>No, it's a burgeoning problem ... there isn't enough bandwidth to >support lots of people downloading movies. It only works when while >there have been fewThat's why Comcast started playing tricks with >the bit torrent down-loaders... Comcast didn't expect such a problem when >they designed their service contracts and got caught out by it. Actually there is plenty of capacity and technology is keeping well ahead of the growth of traffic. Changing the equipment on the ends of existing fiber achieves huge increases in capacity without any changes to the existing fiber. The cable company problem, is just a cable company problem caused by their network topology. The cable vs DSL/fiber contest is much like the contest between Ethernet and Token-Ring networks of 20 years ago. Token-Ring networks connected everybody in a common loop (as did early Ethernet and as cable does now). With the advent of 10Base-T, Ethernet was able to move to a home-run topology. Then the price of switches came down so low that nobody uses a regular hub anymore. So a 100 Mbps private connection now costs about $25 to implement. Not much more for Gigabit and 100 Gigabit is in the works. Token-Ring networks could not do that and were discarded. Same will happen to cable. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
No, it's a burgeoning problem ... there isn't enough bandwidth to support lots of people downloading movies. It only works when while there have been few. Kind of like the situation with automobiles. No one imagined autos would be anything but great and they were great when there were limited numbers ... now everyone has one or more and there are traffic, jams and no parking problems and the US can't keep up with its bridge repair... That's why Comcast started playing tricks with the bit torrent down-loaders. Comcast didn't expect such a problem when they designed their service contracts and got caught out by it. db Tom Piwowar wrote: If everyone started downloading 4 GB movies, could the current internet handle the capacity? If not, is this something we really want or need? That is why it is estimated that 1/3 of the Internet's bandwidth is used for such uses. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
If everyone started downloading 4 GB movies, could the current internet handle the capacity? If not, is this something we really want or need? That is why it is estimated that 1/3 of the Internet's bandwidth is used for such uses. But not by 1/3 of the users. Which isn't necessarily bad, but I happen to think that you should get what you pay for, not what others pay for. Should I get your pie because you are not eating it at the moment? If I can't have your uneaten pie, won't a lot of pie go to waste? Or should I pay you directly for your pie, with a commission to the baker... * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
http://www.archive.org/index.php I wonder how long it will take me to download "Night of the Living Dead" (4.1gb mpg2) from them? I tested this by downloading "The Nazis Strike" (episode two of "Why We Fight"). 1.83 GB, MPEG2, 3 mbps DSL. One hour, 32 minutes. Transfer speed 349 KB/sec, which is not quite 3.0 mbps, more like 2.8 mbps. Still pretty fast, and no speed variation. Very consistent with this hookup. So your 4.1 GB would take about 206 minutes, or three hours and 26 minutes. The qualiity is very good, for a WWII propaganda film... And if it's horror you're into, it's a lot scarier than "Night of the Living Dead." * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
>If everyone started downloading 4 GB movies, could the current >internet handle the capacity? If not, is this something we really want or >need? That is why it is estimated that 1/3 of the Internet's bandwidth is used for such uses. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
It is done all the time. Usenet is full of this type of stuff. Stewart At 07:22 PM 3/24/2008, you wrote: Maybe it's warranted when it is for something that is not readily available from traditional sources. If everyone started downloading 4 GB movies, could the current internet handle the capacity? If not, is this something we really want or need? - John Rev. Stewart A. Marshall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Prince of Peace Ozark, AL SL 82 * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
Around 6-1/2 hours with FiOS... * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
>I wonder how long it will take me to download "Night of the Living Dead" >(4.1gb mpg2) from them? Depends on whether Comcast is your ISP. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
Now we're getting somewhere. These guys have links to download the movies alongside a viewer. I wonder how long it will take me to download "Night of the Living Dead" (4.1gb mpg2) from them? If I read it correctly, their mpeg2 files are at full DVD resolution also. On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 4:59 AM, rocky lee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > http://www.archive.org/index.php * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
http://www.archive.org/index.php Date:Sat, 22 Mar 2008 22:06:58 -0400 From:Tony B Subject: classic movie downloads I was helping a neighbor with her new broadband today and she's into classic movies. So I started telling her about the internet. But everything we could scare up on a Google search seems to want you to watch stuff on their site. Is anyone aware of any sites that are geared toward downloading and burning DVDs? I'm not talking about warez here; just public domain classic movies. - Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
Yesterday when I was with the client I had her google "free movie downloads" and "public domain movies" and we had no problem finding lots of classic movies. Try it. But I couldn't see any way to easily burn them to DVD. On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 12:12 PM, Robert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I'm curious to know what movies are in the public domain. Copyright > lasts 90 years, so these movies would be made before 1918, the silent > era. If a silent movie were remade with a music track added, then the > copyright begins at the date of the remake. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
Tony B wrote: I was helping a neighbor with her new broadband today and she's into classic movies. So I started telling her about the internet. But everything we could scare up on a Google search seems to want you to watch stuff on their site. Is anyone aware of any sites that are geared toward downloading and burning DVDs? I'm not talking about warez here; just public domain classic movies. I'm curious to know what movies are in the public domain. Copyright lasts 90 years, so these movies would be made before 1918, the silent era. If a silent movie were remade with a music track added, then the copyright begins at the date of the remake. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
That's what Apple tv is for...or mythtv or media center from MS. I do have a computer hooked up to my tv as well as a 24" widescreen on my main system. I watch dvds all the time on the 24 and stream all kinds of podcasts and other videos to my computer behind the tv. I've also got a large HD in there so all the kids dvds are on the HD and there is no digging them out of dvd cases. Very handy. Mike On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 6:43 AM, Tony B <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > See, that's the problem all the plethora of current services seem to > be ignoring in a big way. Presumably we're supposed to hook our > computer to our TV. While many people do that, I bet many more don't, > and would like not just the freedom to archive the material, but to be > able to move it from room to room in the house. > > Again, this is only for free legal downloads. > > > On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 8:40 AM, Judy Cosler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > if you can't burn them to DVD, how do you watch them? on your computer > > monitor > > > > > > > > Jim wrote: > > > Montgomery County Public Library has free movie downloads if your > > > friend has access to a library card from there. Downloads are good > > > for 7 day then they self delete. Limit of 10 a week. Cannot burn > > > them to DVD however. Just re-download. Since they are always > > > available there is really no need to burn this selection. It is a > > > Windows only service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mar 22, 2008, at 10:06 PM, Tony B wrote: > > >> I was helping a neighbor with her new broadband today and she's into > > >> classic movies. So I started telling her about the internet. But > > >> everything we could scare up on a Google search seems to want you to > > >> watch stuff on their site. > > >> > > >> Is anyone aware of any sites that are geared toward downloading and > > >> burning DVDs? I'm not talking about warez here; just public domain > > >> classic movies. > > > * > ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** > ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** > * > * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
See, that's the problem all the plethora of current services seem to be ignoring in a big way. Presumably we're supposed to hook our computer to our TV. While many people do that, I bet many more don't, and would like not just the freedom to archive the material, but to be able to move it from room to room in the house. Again, this is only for free legal downloads. On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 8:40 AM, Judy Cosler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > if you can't burn them to DVD, how do you watch them? on your computer > monitor > > > > Jim wrote: > > Montgomery County Public Library has free movie downloads if your > > friend has access to a library card from there. Downloads are good > > for 7 day then they self delete. Limit of 10 a week. Cannot burn > > them to DVD however. Just re-download. Since they are always > > available there is really no need to burn this selection. It is a > > Windows only service. > > > > > > > > > > On Mar 22, 2008, at 10:06 PM, Tony B wrote: > >> I was helping a neighbor with her new broadband today and she's into > >> classic movies. So I started telling her about the internet. But > >> everything we could scare up on a Google search seems to want you to > >> watch stuff on their site. > >> > >> Is anyone aware of any sites that are geared toward downloading and > >> burning DVDs? I'm not talking about warez here; just public domain > >> classic movies. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
if you can't burn them to DVD, how do you watch them? on your computer monitor Jim wrote: Montgomery County Public Library has free movie downloads if your friend has access to a library card from there. Downloads are good for 7 day then they self delete. Limit of 10 a week. Cannot burn them to DVD however. Just re-download. Since they are always available there is really no need to burn this selection. It is a Windows only service. On Mar 22, 2008, at 10:06 PM, Tony B wrote: I was helping a neighbor with her new broadband today and she's into classic movies. So I started telling her about the internet. But everything we could scare up on a Google search seems to want you to watch stuff on their site. Is anyone aware of any sites that are geared toward downloading and burning DVDs? I'm not talking about warez here; just public domain classic movies. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] classic movie downloads
Montgomery County Public Library has free movie downloads if your friend has access to a library card from there. Downloads are good for 7 day then they self delete. Limit of 10 a week. Cannot burn them to DVD however. Just re-download. Since they are always available there is really no need to burn this selection. It is a Windows only service. On Mar 22, 2008, at 10:06 PM, Tony B wrote: I was helping a neighbor with her new broadband today and she's into classic movies. So I started telling her about the internet. But everything we could scare up on a Google search seems to want you to watch stuff on their site. Is anyone aware of any sites that are geared toward downloading and burning DVDs? I'm not talking about warez here; just public domain classic movies. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http:// www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
[CGUYS] classic movie downloads
I was helping a neighbor with her new broadband today and she's into classic movies. So I started telling her about the internet. But everything we could scare up on a Google search seems to want you to watch stuff on their site. Is anyone aware of any sites that are geared toward downloading and burning DVDs? I'm not talking about warez here; just public domain classic movies. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
