Re: [CGUYS] External hard drives bkup/ online vaulting
1. If I, as a careful and meticulous user, have identified the most important data on a day-to-day basis, and have a way of backing up and restoring just that data, then I could probably back it up and restore it across the Internet. Should not the computer be able to figure this out by monitoring your file access patterns? Something as simple as any file opened more than once a day or anything in a folder that meets the previous rule should do the job. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive from 1/1/2000 is on the MARC http://marc.info/?l=computerguys-l * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] External hard drives bkup/ online vaulting
Being a belt and suspenders sort of guy- I would suggest both a regular hard drive rotation and on line vaulting. The hard drive rotation backups will get your system up and running faster but it is likely to miss work in progress. An automatic on line vaulting solution is more likely to save your bacon on an important project that is still in progress. There may be a feature in a home server that would backup on the fly as well. On Dec 12, 2007 4:59 PM, db [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Good point. I was assuming the users know where their critical data is. A very unrealistic assumption. I think it would take less time to sort out their data into critical and not critical then back up online than to spend time regularly trying to reliably back up everything locally. But that would be a rational approach when the world really only behaves rationally occasionally ... :) db John DeCarlo wrote: On Dec 12, 2007 2:48 PM, db [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While average people have a lot of voluminous but not time critical data such as digital photos, usually the people's critical addressbook, encrypted password list, banking, personal biz data, email etc. isn't that substantial. I would think backing up and restoring such online would be realistically do-able. ? Depends on what you mean. 1. If I, as a careful and meticulous user, have identified the most important data on a day-to-day basis, and have a way of backing up and restoring just that data, then I could probably back it up and restore it across the Internet. 2. If I, as a regular user, just backup all my hard drive and don't really know what is most critical - how many of my PowerPoint files at 10-40 MB each do I really need to restore today? - then I probably need to rely on restoring all of it. Then online restore isn't that practical. 3. If I, as a regular user, had something transparently backing up all my data, and could restore on an as-needed basis - so that when I click on a video file of my wedding, or on a document, it tells me it hasn't restored yet, but could do so in about 20 seconds (or 1 hour for the wedding video maybe) - then I could do an effective restore over the Internet. Of course, this assumes that I can reinstall the OS and all the applications locally. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived -- John Duncan Yoyo ---o) * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] External hard drives bkup/ online vaulting
At some point, I imagine most all backup will be done online because of the obvious advantages. Currently Amazon's S3 online backup service is one that I am aware of. Below are S3's rates. Can anyone recommend others? db *United States * */Storage/ *$0.15 per GB-Month of storage used */Data Transfer/ *$0.10 per GB - all data transfer in $0.18 per GB - first 10 TB / month data transfer out $0.16 per GB - next 40 TB / month data transfer out $0.13 per GB - data transfer out / month over 50 TB */Requests/ *$0.01 per 1,000 PUT or LIST requests $0.01 per 10,000 GET and all other requests* * No charge for delete requests Fred Holmes wrote: Where do you store your off-site backups? A bare (not in a case) 3.5 hard drive will fit in a small bank safe deposit box, and is conveniently used with one of the many available bare interfaces (no case, just the electronics for data and power), e.g., USB to IDE/EIDE (or SATA). Only the drive is stored. The interface is kept on site and used continually. The nice thing about using a hard drive as backup media is that incremental backups are consolidated (by copying new/newer files) into a directory tree that is current and complete. Copying can be with or without replicating deletions so that old stuff can be preserved in the backup. The backup can be readily tested, since the files appear on an ordinary hard drive. And it is quick to find and restore a single file or two. Fred Holmes At 07:19 AM 12/12/2007, Jeff Wright wrote: I use Mozy at home, of which I haven't had the chance to test the recovery feature yet, and Iron Mountain at work for taking tapes offsite. The Mozy backup is very simple to do. It's a very polished service. I'm considering moving away from tape backups to disk-based with off-site, online vaulting, but I have yet to see the price tag. Needless to say, I expect it to be many, many times that of tape, which could kill the idea. -Original Message- Do you have an off site back up? If you have any critical data on these machines you should rotate backups to a secure location away from the machines in case of flood, fire etc. So that might mean another set of backups or burning an occasional DVD of the most critical stuff and storing it somewhere off site or using a remote backup service. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] External hard drives bkup/ online vaulting
Do you have any average internet transfer throughput figures Tom? While average people have a lot of voluminous but not time critical data such as digital photos, usually the people's critical addressbook, encrypted password list, banking, personal biz data, email etc. isn't that substantial. I would think backing up and restoring such online would be realistically do-able. ? db Tom Piwowar wrote: At some point, I imagine most all backup will be done online because of the obvious advantages. Yes, but not in the near future. The problem is restoring after a major data loss. The data rates we have today would require days to restore most hard drives. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] External hard drives bkup/ online vaulting
On Dec 12, 2007 2:48 PM, db [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While average people have a lot of voluminous but not time critical data such as digital photos, usually the people's critical addressbook, encrypted password list, banking, personal biz data, email etc. isn't that substantial. I would think backing up and restoring such online would be realistically do-able. ? Depends on what you mean. 1. If I, as a careful and meticulous user, have identified the most important data on a day-to-day basis, and have a way of backing up and restoring just that data, then I could probably back it up and restore it across the Internet. 2. If I, as a regular user, just backup all my hard drive and don't really know what is most critical - how many of my PowerPoint files at 10-40 MB each do I really need to restore today? - then I probably need to rely on restoring all of it. Then online restore isn't that practical. 3. If I, as a regular user, had something transparently backing up all my data, and could restore on an as-needed basis - so that when I click on a video file of my wedding, or on a document, it tells me it hasn't restored yet, but could do so in about 20 seconds (or 1 hour for the wedding video maybe) - then I could do an effective restore over the Internet. Of course, this assumes that I can reinstall the OS and all the applications locally. -- John DeCarlo, My Views Are My Own * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] External hard drives bkup/ online vaulting
Good point. I was assuming the users know where their critical data is. A very unrealistic assumption. I think it would take less time to sort out their data into critical and not critical then back up online than to spend time regularly trying to reliably back up everything locally. But that would be a rational approach when the world really only behaves rationally occasionally ... :) db John DeCarlo wrote: On Dec 12, 2007 2:48 PM, db [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While average people have a lot of voluminous but not time critical data such as digital photos, usually the people's critical addressbook, encrypted password list, banking, personal biz data, email etc. isn't that substantial. I would think backing up and restoring such online would be realistically do-able. ? Depends on what you mean. 1. If I, as a careful and meticulous user, have identified the most important data on a day-to-day basis, and have a way of backing up and restoring just that data, then I could probably back it up and restore it across the Internet. 2. If I, as a regular user, just backup all my hard drive and don't really know what is most critical - how many of my PowerPoint files at 10-40 MB each do I really need to restore today? - then I probably need to rely on restoring all of it. Then online restore isn't that practical. 3. If I, as a regular user, had something transparently backing up all my data, and could restore on an as-needed basis - so that when I click on a video file of my wedding, or on a document, it tells me it hasn't restored yet, but could do so in about 20 seconds (or 1 hour for the wedding video maybe) - then I could do an effective restore over the Internet. Of course, this assumes that I can reinstall the OS and all the applications locally. * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
Re: [CGUYS] External hard drives bkup/ online vaulting
At some point, I imagine most all backup will be done online because of the obvious advantages. Currently Amazon's S3 online backup service is one that I am aware of. Below are S3's rates. Can anyone recommend others? Mozy. $4.95/month unlimited storage. Or 2 GB for free, which is what I'm using at this point. I throw my music, about 17 GB, on an external hard drive and keep that at work (my office locks). They were bought by EMC recently, so they should be stable and not going out of business anytime soon. http://www.xconomy.com/2007/11/27/why-emc-bought-mozy-part-2-the-consumer-as -enterprise/ * == QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in == * == the body of an email send 'em to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] == * Join the list: SUBSCRIBE COMPUTERGUYS-L Your Name * Too much mail? Try Daily Digests command: SET COMPUTERGUYS-L DIGEST * Tired of the List? Unsubscribe command: SIGNOFF COMPUTERGUYS-L * New address? From OLD address send: CHANGE COMPUTERGUYS-L YourNewAddress * Need more help? Send mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * List archive at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/ * RSS at www.mail-archive.com/computerguys-l@listserv.aol.com/maillist.xml * Messages bearing the header X-No-Archive: yes will not be archived
