Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On 09/04/2003 10:52:30 PM, Paul Dorman wrote: Hence the benefit of a gui... Audio SETTINGS (advanced) -- JACK settings: As I said, this in now handled by qjackctl. ALSA settings [import] [export] Driver [ ] blah blah Draksound does this, but kinda cryptically. Start JACK automatically for: Ardour [settings] Audacity[settings] Sweep [settings] XMMS[settings] No can do. Drak utilities can only refer to main applicaitons. Ardour, audacity, sweep, etc. are all in contrib. Buchan is writing be a script for ardour, becuase I fixed Zenity for him (with his patch... does that count? :-) ) The 'Start JACK automatically for:' section could be configured so that XMMS would load with JACK when Ardour is running, but not otherwise.. This is the sort of thing ladcca was invented for. Have you tried it? Austin -- Austin Acton Hon.B.Sc. Synthetic Organic Chemist, Teaching Assistant Department of Chemistry, York University, Toronto MandrakeClub Volunteer (www.mandrakeclub.com) homepage: www.groundstate.ca
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On Friday 05 September 2003 11:59, Austin wrote: > On 09/04/2003 07:43:50 PM, Buchan Milne wrote: > > On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Austin wrote: > > > > * Auto start up of JACK. > > > > > > Nobody wants jack running all the time. > > > > No, but it isn't nice for a user to start Ardour from the menu (without > > starting a jackd), and be booted out. One slashdot user thought Ardour > > was buggy/badly packaged because of this, and switched distributions ... > > True. But it IS better than having jack running all the time. It's a > resource hog. And it quits by itself if latency goes too high... then what > are you going to do to restart it transparantly? > > > Can you not have the ardour menu entry run a script that checks if a > > jackd is running (even via pgrep if necessary), and if not, tell the user > > they need to run one? > > I suppose... but what command line options are you going to use? There are > so many. -R (realtime) or not? hw:0 or alsa default? What if the user > wants to use hw:1, like I do? What sampling rate, 44100 or 48000? 24 or > 16 bit? My soundcard requires 24 bit for recoring in full duplex, but > requires 16 bit for recording in half-duplex. > > > (I can write one for you, if you will fix zenity for me ;-)). > > Okay, it's a deal. Although I assumed that when people move my packages to > main and start updating them unbeknownst to be, that I'm no longer > responsible for keeping them functional. How accustomed we've come to > free labour eh? > > Austin > -- > Austin Acton Hon.B.Sc. > Synthetic Organic Chemist, Teaching Assistant >Department of Chemistry, York University, Toronto > MandrakeClub Volunteer (www.mandrakeclub.com) > homepage: www.groundstate.ca Hence the benefit of a gui... Audio SETTINGS (advanced) -- JACK settings: [import] [export] [x] Realtime[settings] sampling rate: [ ] blah blah ALSA settings [import] [export] Driver [ ] blah blah Start JACK automatically for: Ardour [settings] Audacity[settings] Sweep [settings] XMMS[settings] The 'Start JACK automatically for:' section could be configured so that XMMS would load with JACK when Ardour is running, but not otherwise.. As they say, just my 2 cents worth. :o) Ciao, Paul
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On 09/04/2003 07:43:50 PM, Buchan Milne wrote: On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Austin wrote: > > * Auto start up of JACK. > > Nobody wants jack running all the time. No, but it isn't nice for a user to start Ardour from the menu (without starting a jackd), and be booted out. One slashdot user thought Ardour was buggy/badly packaged because of this, and switched distributions ... True. But it IS better than having jack running all the time. It's a resource hog. And it quits by itself if latency goes too high... then what are you going to do to restart it transparantly? Can you not have the ardour menu entry run a script that checks if a jackd is running (even via pgrep if necessary), and if not, tell the user they need to run one? I suppose... but what command line options are you going to use? There are so many. -R (realtime) or not? hw:0 or alsa default? What if the user wants to use hw:1, like I do? What sampling rate, 44100 or 48000? 24 or 16 bit? My soundcard requires 24 bit for recoring in full duplex, but requires 16 bit for recording in half-duplex. (I can write one for you, if you will fix zenity for me ;-)). Okay, it's a deal. Although I assumed that when people move my packages to main and start updating them unbeknownst to be, that I'm no longer responsible for keeping them functional. How accustomed we've come to free labour eh? Austin -- Austin Acton Hon.B.Sc. Synthetic Organic Chemist, Teaching Assistant Department of Chemistry, York University, Toronto MandrakeClub Volunteer (www.mandrakeclub.com) homepage: www.groundstate.ca
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Austin wrote: > > * Auto start up of JACK. > > Nobody wants jack running all the time. No, but it isn't nice for a user to start Ardour from the menu (without starting a jackd), and be booted out. One slashdot user thought Ardour was buggy/badly packaged because of this, and switched distributions ... Can you not have the ardour menu entry run a script that checks if a jackd is running (even via pgrep if necessary), and if not, tell the user they need to run one? (I can write one for you, if you will fix zenity for me ;-)). > Seriously. Unless the computer is > used exclusively for audio production, in which case the user is not likely to > choose Mandrake (which I'm fighting against, but losing). > What do they run, and why? Regards, Buchan -- |Registered Linux User #182071-| Buchan MilneMechanical Engineer, Network Manager Cellphone * Work+27 82 472 2231 * +27 21 8828820x121 Stellenbosch Automotive Engineering http://www.cae.co.za GPG Key http://ranger.dnsalias.com/bgmilne.asc 1024D/60D204A7 2919 E232 5610 A038 87B1 72D6 AC92 BA50 60D2 04A7 * Please click on http://www.cae.co.za/disclaimer.htm to read our e-mail disclaimer or send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] for a copy. *
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On 09.04, Paul Dorman wrote: > Hi all again! > > I am wondering how difficult it would be to add an audio system section to the > Mandrake Control Center. It would: > > * Allow the user to elect OSS or ALSA as the default (configuring the correct > module settings) I would start in a lower level. Why is there an 'alsa' rc file ? Isn't 'sound' supposed to do this ? Currently sound detects what do you want testing for /proc/asound. So it means that you already must have loaded some ALSA module to have 'sound' skip OSS and start ALSA. It would be easier to have an /etc/sysconfig/sound with something like SOUND=ALSA|OSS MODULE0= MODULE1= ala sensors. I suppose a GUI for that is a ton of work: once you have the card, you must guess if it supports MIDI/sequencer, joystick, etc. to let the user say if he wants them active or not. Just ideas... -- J.A. Magallon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> \ Software is like sex: werewolf.able.es \ It's better when it's free Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (Cooker) for i586 Linux 2.4.23-pre2-jam1m (gcc 3.3.1 (Mandrake Linux 9.2 3.3.1-1mdk))
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On 09/04/2003 04:50:24 PM, Paul Dorman wrote: I am wondering how difficult it would be to add an audio system section to the Mandrake Control Center. It would: * Allow the user to elect OSS or ALSA as the default (configuring the correct Yes, this is available, but it not intuitive, not clear, and doesn't always work. It should but doesn't: - tell the user that two sound systems are available - tell the user that alsa drivers are prefixed by snd- - recommend that the user choose an alsa driver since it supports both sound systems - select alsa drivers by defualt (at least for trident and usb drivers, it choses oss by default) * Automatic creation of asoundrc For most generic consumer sound cards you don't need a asoundrc. Most pro- audio linux users would want to make their own. There are no pro-audio GUI- only (Windows/Mac converts) that use linux for audio that I know of, hehe. * Auto start up of JACK. Nobody wants jack running all the time. Seriously. Unless the computer is used exclusively for audio production, in which case the user is not likely to choose Mandrake (which I'm fighting against, but losing). I recently added qjackctl to contribs, which is an amazing GUI for JACK. Try it out. Austin -- Austin Acton Hon.B.Sc. Synthetic Organic Chemist, Teaching Assistant Department of Chemistry, York University, Toronto MandrakeClub Volunteer (www.mandrakeclub.com) homepage: www.groundstate.ca
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Adam Williamson wrote: > > I meant neglected by packager, but no disrespect intended...just hadn't > been updated for a while, it looks a bit forlorn next to 2.4.22 main and > 2.4.22tmb and 2.6.0 contrib kernels :D > Well, it is a damn big patch, and new kernel has a lot of changes. As soon as somebody explains to me why it tries to schedule in the middle of an IRQ it can be fixed. d.
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On Thu, 2003-09-04 at 22:29, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Adam Williamson wrote: > > > > > I agree with your criticism of draksound, but I don't think it's > > actually the cause of the problem identified in those reviews. I had > > several people report the same problem to me without ever having touched > > the settings; it seems some sblives truly were misidentified as needing > > the audigy driver by DrakX. > > > > Ok, but it still doesn't make sense, as the audigy driver is actually just > a newer version of the emu10k1 driver. And it works for sblives as well. > So even if it was misnamed, it should still work. yeah, it seemed odd to me too...I really don't remember the details, and I don't remember if it's been fixed either. I guess we'll find out after release :) -- adamw
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On Thu, 2003-09-04 at 22:16, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Adam Williamson wrote: > > > > > we have kernel-multimedia (though it's sadly neglected)...no need for an > > application to "enable" it, really, you "enable" it by installing it > > with urpmi / rpmdrake and rebooting... > as in: neglected by packager, or neglected by users? > > current 2.4.21 version has a bug in the provides, making it a bit > difficult to install, but my new version based on 2.4.22 kernel won't boot > (I am trying to debug a panic during partition check, but I suck, and I > have little time (hint: help welcome)). I meant neglected by packager, but no disrespect intended...just hadn't been updated for a while, it looks a bit forlorn next to 2.4.22 main and 2.4.22tmb and 2.6.0 contrib kernels :D -- adamw
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Adam Williamson wrote: > > I agree with your criticism of draksound, but I don't think it's > actually the cause of the problem identified in those reviews. I had > several people report the same problem to me without ever having touched > the settings; it seems some sblives truly were misidentified as needing > the audigy driver by DrakX. > Ok, but it still doesn't make sense, as the audigy driver is actually just a newer version of the emu10k1 driver. And it works for sblives as well. So even if it was misnamed, it should still work. d.
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Adam Williamson wrote: > > we have kernel-multimedia (though it's sadly neglected)...no need for an > application to "enable" it, really, you "enable" it by installing it > with urpmi / rpmdrake and rebooting... as in: neglected by packager, or neglected by users? current 2.4.21 version has a bug in the provides, making it a bit difficult to install, but my new version based on 2.4.22 kernel won't boot (I am trying to debug a panic during partition check, but I suck, and I have little time (hint: help welcome)). d.
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On Thu, 2003-09-04 at 22:12, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Adam Williamson wrote: > > > > > > > * Allow the user to elect OSS or ALSA as the default (configuring the correct > > > module settings) > > > > already done by draksound. > > Point of critizism about draksound: some reviews of 9.1 (IIRC) claimed > that audigy driver was incorrectly loaded for their sblives. I think this > was actually due to people not reading very well, and the interface of > draksound being confusing. The text says which driver is the default and > currently loaded, but the selectionbox actually displays another driver > (in case of sblive, one of the 2 drivers possible that are _not_ the > current driver). > > It would be nice if the selection could just include the current driver > and display that one as default, I think this is usually most commonly > used in GUI systems. I agree with your criticism of draksound, but I don't think it's actually the cause of the problem identified in those reviews. I had several people report the same problem to me without ever having touched the settings; it seems some sblives truly were misidentified as needing the audigy driver by DrakX. -- adamw
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On Thu, 4 Sep 2003, Adam Williamson wrote: > > > > * Allow the user to elect OSS or ALSA as the default (configuring the correct > > module settings) > > already done by draksound. Point of critizism about draksound: some reviews of 9.1 (IIRC) claimed that audigy driver was incorrectly loaded for their sblives. I think this was actually due to people not reading very well, and the interface of draksound being confusing. The text says which driver is the default and currently loaded, but the selectionbox actually displays another driver (in case of sblive, one of the 2 drivers possible that are _not_ the current driver). It would be nice if the selection could just include the current driver and display that one as default, I think this is usually most commonly used in GUI systems. d.
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On Thu, 2003-09-04 at 22:08, Paul Dorman wrote: > On Friday 05 September 2003 08:53, Adam Williamson wrote: > > On Thu, 2003-09-04 at 21:50, Paul Dorman wrote: > > > Hi all again! > > > > > > I am wondering how difficult it would be to add an audio system section > > > to the Mandrake Control Center. It would: > > > > > > * Allow the user to elect OSS or ALSA as the default (configuring the > > > correct module settings) > > > > already done by draksound. > > > > > * Automatic creation of asoundrc > > > * Allow the user to specify how the sound card(s) features are used > > > (2,4,5,6-channel operation, digital i/o, etc.) > > > > given the rather dodgy state of surround support for all cards I've seen > > (often implemented in bizarre and undocumented fashion by random mixer > > settings), this doesn't sound like a walk in the park... > > > > > * Allow the user to use an audio-optimized kernel. Say by adding a > > > linux-audio or linux-multimedia entry > > > > we have kernel-multimedia (though it's sadly neglected)...no need for an > > application to "enable" it, really, you "enable" it by installing it > > with urpmi / rpmdrake and rebooting... > > Hi Adam - thanks for the reply. > Didn't know about draksound - cool! > > I personally have no problem with doing kernel installs and the like, but I > understand that things like permissions on /dev/rtc etc. are not > automatically set up for the audio user, yes? Or are the various permissions > issues been dealt to (in normal and devfs mode)? I'm thinking of my audio nut > buddies here... :o) The /dev/rtc thing is more of a general bug which I believe is going to be fixed through pam - there's no need for a GUI, user-interactive application to "fix" it. This should apply to most permission issues, though if you were more specific I guess it'd help :) -- adamw
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On Friday 05 September 2003 08:53, Adam Williamson wrote: > On Thu, 2003-09-04 at 21:50, Paul Dorman wrote: > > Hi all again! > > > > I am wondering how difficult it would be to add an audio system section > > to the Mandrake Control Center. It would: > > > > * Allow the user to elect OSS or ALSA as the default (configuring the > > correct module settings) > > already done by draksound. > > > * Automatic creation of asoundrc > > * Allow the user to specify how the sound card(s) features are used > > (2,4,5,6-channel operation, digital i/o, etc.) > > given the rather dodgy state of surround support for all cards I've seen > (often implemented in bizarre and undocumented fashion by random mixer > settings), this doesn't sound like a walk in the park... > > > * Allow the user to use an audio-optimized kernel. Say by adding a > > linux-audio or linux-multimedia entry > > we have kernel-multimedia (though it's sadly neglected)...no need for an > application to "enable" it, really, you "enable" it by installing it > with urpmi / rpmdrake and rebooting... Hi Adam - thanks for the reply. Didn't know about draksound - cool! I personally have no problem with doing kernel installs and the like, but I understand that things like permissions on /dev/rtc etc. are not automatically set up for the audio user, yes? Or are the various permissions issues been dealt to (in normal and devfs mode)? I'm thinking of my audio nut buddies here... :o) Ciao, Paul.
Re: [Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
On Thu, 2003-09-04 at 21:50, Paul Dorman wrote: > Hi all again! > > I am wondering how difficult it would be to add an audio system section to the > Mandrake Control Center. It would: > > * Allow the user to elect OSS or ALSA as the default (configuring the correct > module settings) already done by draksound. > * Automatic creation of asoundrc > * Allow the user to specify how the sound card(s) features are used > (2,4,5,6-channel operation, digital i/o, etc.) given the rather dodgy state of surround support for all cards I've seen (often implemented in bizarre and undocumented fashion by random mixer settings), this doesn't sound like a walk in the park... > * Allow the user to use an audio-optimized kernel. Say by adding a linux-audio > or linux-multimedia entry we have kernel-multimedia (though it's sadly neglected)...no need for an application to "enable" it, really, you "enable" it by installing it with urpmi / rpmdrake and rebooting... -- adamw
[Cooker] ALSA/OSS selection
Hi all again! I am wondering how difficult it would be to add an audio system section to the Mandrake Control Center. It would: * Allow the user to elect OSS or ALSA as the default (configuring the correct module settings) * Automatic creation of asoundrc * Allow the user to specify how the sound card(s) features are used (2,4,5,6-channel operation, digital i/o, etc.) * Allow the user to use an audio-optimized kernel. Say by adding a linux-audio or linux-multimedia entry * Provide configuration of JACK for the machine's ALSA configuration, auto start up of JACK. * Auto-configuration of audio applications to use JACK, ALSA, OSS, or whatever. How hard would it be to do this? I think it would be very useful for anyone interested in using audio applications on a Mandrake machine, and it seems that it's just a matter of making sure the right packages are installed, and writing to a bunch of config files... Cheers! Paul.
